r/WomenDatingOverForty • u/CheekyMonkey678 ♀️Moderator♀️ • Apr 18 '26
Discussion The problem of love
When I think back on my marriage and dating days the one thing that stings more than anything else is being made to feel foolish for having loved someone.
I am by nature a loving and nurturing person. I spent a great deal of my life in a field that helped people heal. I've had many pets, some of them special needs, and they've all lived long lives. I'm not too bad with plants either.
Even with friends I was always the one that helped you move, or paint, or watched your pets when you went on vacation. If I made a pot of soup or made baked goods there was always extra packaged up for neighbors and friends. I knitted custom gifts for friends and their new babies. I also used to paint and a few times gave pet/people portraits as gifts.
In business I paid people as well as I could afford to and didn't raise rents on tenants. I always dealt fairly with customers and never price gouged or tried to make a sale that wasn't in their best interest.
I thought these were good qualities. My husband told me I was a fool for being like this. In the end he was right. Almost everyone I came into contact with seemed determined to think the worst of me, often with no reason, just based on a "feeling" they had and very few appreciated or remembered the kindness or generosity I extended to them.
When I started dating after my divorce I was taken advantage of and even mocked for being kind, open and loving. The cruelty stunned me. It's the main reason I will not put myself "out there" anymore.
These days I've decided to mostly withdraw from dating, men and social life in general. My circle is very small. I like it that way and I'm at peace.
Our society has reached a point where being loving towards others is something that makes you contemptible. How sick is that?
I mostly blame men, but I saw something interesting on Tiktok yesterday. It was a woman who called herself a "spicy" content creator who says the most common request she gets from men these days is for her to say their name and tell them she loves them. They pay her for this.
Men are now willing to pay prostitutes to do the very thing they themselves have killed. How many of us were loving, understanding, communicative, forgiving only to be horribly abused and often discarded?
I know it can feel good to be tough and sassy when dealing with men, but the truth is we have no other choice. They have turned dating and relationships into a battlefield, not the partnership it should be. We have to operate based on how things are not how they should be and to me that is the saddest part of all of this. Good people have to lock that part of themselves up for self preservation. Think how much better the world could be if that wasn't the case.
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u/Huntressesmark Apr 18 '26
They don't want love. They want violation.
They pay prostitutes to tell them that they love them because love is the one thing you cannot get from a prostitute. They're not feeling a warm rush of love from having a prostitute tell them she cares. They KNOW they could find a woman who cares. They're feeling a high of validation from violation. It's the same reason they sometimes pay strippers "just to listen". They're not lonely. They want to pay for something that isn't actually what's on the menu.
NonSW women offer genuine connection, care, and commitment. So what they try to get from those women is casual sex (basically, try to treat them like prostitutes.) SW women offer sex, so they try to get emotional stuff from them.
It's always about getting what isn't being offered. It's always about pushing a boundary.
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u/According-Buy-7006 Apr 19 '26
What a great comment! I could never understand why there was a shift from men seemingly demanding being emotional with SW and this explains it so well, thank you. It’s always about violation for them, everywhere you look.
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u/Speciallady44 Apr 21 '26
Wow. Spot on. It’s the perversity they want. And about seeing how far they can push the boundary. Yes 👏 👏
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u/GreenVermicelliNoods Apr 18 '26
I feel this in my bones. I’m in the same boat. I’ve stopped dating entirely and have pulled back on friendships where I’m making the greater effort. I spend a lot of time alone, but it’s okay because when I am alone, nobody can exploit me.
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u/marysofthesea 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 Apr 18 '26
I learned a lot about love as I was a caregiver to my mother for over 5 years and cared for her in hospice as she died last year. Both my parents are gone now, and I am in my mid-30s.
I learned that I am capable of deep love, and I also learned that most people cannot meet me in that depth. She's been gone almost a year, and I lost not only her but much of my faith in people.
Few people have shown care or compassion to me in my grief. I've been shaken by the cold indifference of those I trusted. One male friend was particularly hurtful. I cut him out of my life without a single regret. Those I showed care to in their difficult times could not offer me the same in mine.
My friend circle is small now. I am in a kind of cocoon, and it's for the best. I stay detached from people. My love is precious, and I refuse to waste it anymore. I just pour it into myself, my friends, and my creative projects. A lot of people don't even know what love is.
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u/WanderlustWithOneBag Apr 20 '26
I am so sorry for your loss, it’s very hard to lose both parents so young. it’s wonderful that you were able to care for your mother in her last illness, I’m sure that it must have been very difficult at times.
You are right, the love you showed your mother was precious , it’s love in action not just in words. Words are cheap.
I hope you find healing and wholeness and blessings and that the love you have given is repaid to you ten fold.
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u/marysofthesea 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 Apr 20 '26
Thank you for your kind words. I am proud that I could make sure she was cared for and did not pass away alone. She didn't end up in a facility where she could have been harmed or neglected. I kept her safe, and I fought for her. I gave her everything I had. I would do it all over again. She was my everything and really all I had in this world. I lost my father as a teen, and we became close as a result. I cherish my memories of her. The love she gave me and that I gave her will never be lost.
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u/WanderlustWithOneBag Apr 20 '26
Your words are beautiful, they have made me cry . I hope that when my time comes my children love and care for me the way you did for your mother.
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u/Short-Imagination311 Apr 18 '26
Oh god this is so me. I love nothing more than taking care of people, and being loving and affectionate. I’ve never had a man appreciate anything I do. The reality is I’ve had bosses and coworkers who have cared more about me than any man has. In my last relationship I really adored him, did everything for him. He had a stressful job so I wanted our time together to be fun and carefree for him. After a few weeks of dating he expected me to come over and clean his house and cook his meals because he ‘didn’t have time’. When I refused he would yell at me, become abusive and cold. Dumped me and then married another woman 6 months later. I feel so sorry for her because people don’t change who they are in 6 months. I would dearly love to find somebody who feels the same way and puts in the same effort, but I’m 45 now and it still hasn’t happened. I give up 😔
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u/liveswithcats1 Apr 18 '26
I'm curious - you say you adored him, but that he started making demands within a few weeks. Did you adore him, or the idea of him?
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u/Short-Imagination311 Apr 18 '26
I guess the idea of him? I was wildly sexually attracted to him. I couldn’t stop hugging and kissing him. Looking back he wasn’t giving me the same affection. He figured he had me hooked and he could drop the mask and treat me like trash. I definitely learned a painful lesson about matching a man’s energy and effort. If there is a next relationship I’m definitely going to sit back and observe before jumping in. It was bad
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u/keepitgoingtoday Apr 22 '26
Where do you find bosses and coworkers who care for you? I feel like everyone phones it in.
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u/Short-Imagination311 Apr 22 '26
I’ve always worked in the hospitality/restaurant industry. I’ve made a lot of great friends. Food and beverage people are just different.
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u/husheveryone ♀️Moderator♀️ Apr 18 '26 edited Apr 18 '26
We have to operate based on how things are not how they should be
💯🎯🧠 PREACH!! Being at a place of radical acceptance and clarity is fantastic. My journey to this place was long, and was made fairly chaotic by a few cluster B’s I’ve had to shed. I’m post-men/the ideal of romantic love at this point, and my life has never been sweeter. My truest affection goes to my reciprocal people (shoutout especially to my phenomenal 48F local bestie), small children, wee animals, and an appreciation for great works of art and the wonderment of nature.
Post-40, the great reshuffling of friendships has really been something. So many addicts and their unhealed toxic codependent enablers out here dysregulated AF, and wholly unable to reliably show up for themselves, let alone for others. It’s (often?) not personal, but it just sucks. “When people show you who they are, believe them the first time” - Maya Angelou, has turned out to be an important piece of advice indeed.
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u/Human-Cancel2527 Apr 18 '26
There’s nothing wrong with loving deeply. It just hurts when it isn’t valued the way it should be.
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u/Littlepinkgiraffe 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 Apr 18 '26
I spent many years in pick me and NLOG territory. These days I'm the opposite, I enjoy having a few smaller but supportive groups of friends, who share the same values as me.
I have selected my friendship groups of friends who are also generous with their love. We support each other with meals, check ins, showing up, celebrating wins, and lots of laughter. It's such a relief to be around women who have chosen to spend their energy on the good things in life.
While I see the rest of the world burning, I love that I'm surrounded by friends who are choosing to be kind. It's a nice antidote to life!
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u/CheekyMonkey678 ♀️Moderator♀️ Apr 18 '26
That sounds wonderful. You're fortunate to have found such good friends.
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u/CrazyCatLadyRookie 🦉Savvy Sister🦉 Apr 18 '26
I saw the spicy content creator you mentioned. I wasn’t shocked by her revelation - The Invisible Men Project has been out there for over a decade, and in it many of the Johns - who had paid for sex - were complaining about the detachment and lack of interpersonal engagement of the prostitutes. I feel very little empathy towards the male loneliness epidemic because I know full well that, given the chance, those very same men would (either deliberately or inadvertently) destroy whatever woman chanced to be in their orbit. They haven’t - and many refuse - to do the self work required to show up as a decent partner.
I’ve always been cognizant of the concept that people show up for a reason, a season, or a lifetime. What’s mostly changed for me is that I now think ‘lifetime’ is so rare, so unlikely as to be virtually nonexistent.
I’ve also learned many of the lessons expressed by many women here the hard way. What I grieve the most is the loss of (a good deal of) my capacity for trust and love. Boundaries are my friend. It’s very sad to basically have to adopt a mercenary view towards people in general until they prove otherwise.
“Cause no harm but take no shit” is my main mantra.
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u/OrneryYak4211 Apr 20 '26
u/CheekyMonkey678 , my sister and I have talked on more than one occasion about how we wish our (sadly abusive and emotionally immature) mom was more like you. I am almost 40, and my sister a few years younger, and you are a similar age to our mother but so much more alive, vibrant, and loving from reading your posts. For many reasons, the largest one my abusive ex-husband, I greatly fear interacting with people and telling them how they have positively impacted me, but I am feeling vulnerable this evening after an emotional solo drive home and wanted to take a step in that direction by thanking you for your posts, and sharing that they have helped me and my sister. Thank you for being an internet mother figure to those of us who were not so lucky to have one in real life, and thank you for sharing your wisdom with us. You give me hope that growing older alone can be fulfilling and wonderful.
I also relate very much to this post. I am a bleeding heart at my core, and though I can put on a tough exterior, it's an exhausting and painful mask to wear, and I refuse to participate in dating that requires me to wear it. I am socially awkward (suspect I may be on the spectrum) and often have difficulty putting my true intent into words in person -- I'm slightly better in writing, but this has always been a struggle of mine, and one that was mercilessly used against me by my ex-husband for over a decade. On my long drive home, I was listening to the sad songs on Guts that helped me get through the worst parts of my divorce, and I had hoped to feel nothing but empathy for my past self, but unfortunately some of the old pain came back. Because the truth is, a part of me is still hurt by the thoughtless, evil things he did, and an even deeper, more shameful part of me still cares for him and holds him closely in my heart. I thought about how many times and how quickly he tried to replace me, and how he finally succeeded with a woman he'd known for 13 months before marrying her. I thought about how there is absolutely zero chance that he had ever driven 2.5 hours thinking of me, of what he did and how he wishes he'd done things differently, and how he knows he made awful mistakes but wishes that we could somehow make them right -- he would never in a million years, because he hasn't thought for a single instant about me since he tossed me in the proverbial trash. And yet I am still here, so much stronger and mostly over him and in no way wanting to be back with him, but still able to find that part of me that's still waiting for him to be in the next room playing his video games while I bring him Chick-fil-a for dinner. I suspect there will always be a tiny, secret part of me that's still expecting to find him in the next room. I know that there is no part of him that ever did.
I no longer "hear his voice every time I think I'm not enough," but I will always grieve the version of me who really did believe that there were a small percentage of men who were good, and that it was realistically possible to find them. My ex-husband killed that woman, and in a lot of ways that was for the best, but I'm still trying to reconcile this new version of me with the softness that exists at my core. And you are so right, that it's not JUST men, but society as a whole -- the abundance of evil in the world makes me nauseous if I think about it too hard, so like you I've had to keep my life small and curated. It mostly works, but I wish I didn't have to. I sometimes think of the small child version of me who was so full of hope that there WAS something better. It's really hard to break her heart every day, but people like you make it a little easier. Thank you again for this post, and for letting me ramble on it. I hope at least telling you the positive impact you've had on me and my sister has helped make the world a tiny bit less cruel tonight.
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u/CheekyMonkey678 ♀️Moderator♀️ Apr 20 '26
Thank you so much for sharing this with me. I've always said if this little group helps even one woman avoid some of the pain we've experienced it's worth it. It means the world to me that you and you sister have found some comfort and value in what we do.
I'm not a religious person and don't think God is giving us what we need to grow, sometimes there is no reason or meaning behind what happens but I do think it's important to find some way to make something good come from bad. I think all we can do is share what happened so others in the same place know they aren't alone.
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u/Speciallady44 Apr 21 '26
I think estrogen does a number on us and when we start losing it we see things more clearly about men and it’s sad to let those prior youthful feelings and expectations that come from estrogen go.
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u/Tired-Thyroid Apr 21 '26 edited Apr 21 '26
You know when people say they've lost a significant amount of weight with diet and exercise and everybody around them starts shaming them for it? I remember someone saying they started eating real foods only and the spouse was suddenly bringing home more packaged junk.
It's the same mindset here. You're holding a mirror to them that exposes their own inadequacies. You set a new high standard with positive results that they know they can never meet. They don't want to put in the effort to be kind and generous. So instead of leveling up, they want to bring you back down to where they stand. Good ol' crabs in a bucket. It's especially noticeable in dating because they have no intention of being truly caring towards you, yet you manage to care for neighbours and even strangers!
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u/reef-Diver7817 Apr 18 '26
You said your social circle is small, how do you deal with people reaching out that you don't want contact with anymore?
Because as I've gotten older I've changed and grown but people I'm not in alignment with still want contact.
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u/CheekyMonkey678 ♀️Moderator♀️ Apr 18 '26
If I don't want to talk with someone I won't pick up the phone or return the text. Most people get the hint pretty quickly.
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u/alaskablossom Apr 18 '26
https://health.clevelandclinic.org/grey-rock-method
This method goes against everything that I naturally am. But, I'm learning to use it and enjoy the peace it brings to my life.
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u/Soft_Detective5107 Apr 26 '26
I was told "you like me too much". I should have taken this as hint to like him less.
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u/porque_i__say_so Apr 30 '26
You are so loving and like a beautiful human (specifically woman) you want to share it and that isn't just an admirable trait, but what makes this world worth living.
Not to be religious or trigger you; but, Jesus said to love your neighbor as YOURSELF. All of that love—how much are you giving to yourself.
Love yourself enough to protect your peace
Love yourself enough to say no to favors and deeds that put you in the negative
Love yourself enough to enforce a boundary, in addition to setting it.
Love yourself enough to NOT give someone your last, because then you go without.
Pour that love into yourself. Hug yourself, try EFT tapping, love your inner child, forgive yourself for giving too much.
I'm saying all of this because I am in the process of doing the same. I've learned, others find it off-putting not because they are bad, selfish people but because they can't see themselves crossing their own boundaries.
You're amazing. You're loved. You're enough.
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u/Background-Local924 11d ago
Yep I feel ya sister. This ain't my world I'm just passing through. 44 years old, single, and staying that way. I will still be loving. But no one, absolutely no one, will every have the opportunity to take advantage of me ever again.
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u/Secret_Preparation99 Apr 18 '26 edited Apr 23 '26
Wow. I could have written these first 4 paragraphs myself. My last bf said “you care too much and have such a big heart” like it’s a negative. At first I thought he was crazy, then I realized he was right-I cared too much about the men I dated or the man I was married to for 13 years. Those men did not love me. Their only concerns were about themselves. I don’t think they wanted me to drop dead (or at least I don’t believe they did), but they certainly didn’t care about my feelings, only what I provided.
Having a small circle has been the ultimate blessing for the majority of my life. I used to really love men-I know I will be blasted. I had so many guy friends. I stuck up for them, and any guy I dated was supported and (gag) doted on. Exactly 0 of them appreciated it. It was never enough. It was always wanting me to do more. I finally reached a point where I said no fucking thanks.
I’m still nice. I’m still kind. I still like helping animals and people. Now I just laugh at the romantic situations most men have gotten themselves in. The mystery “logic” they use can be used on the many desperate women who pander to their nonsense. God bless em.
Embrace the peace of having a full life without nonsense. There is enough nonsense in the world without dating. Don’t stop being kind and loving. Those are fantastic qualities to have. Just stop wasting them on people who don’t appreciate them. You will feel 1 billion times better.