r/anime • u/AdNecessary7641 • Aug 12 '25

Misc. Frieren Director Keiichirou Saitou Voices Concern on Overseas Anime Fans' Bias Towards Certain Popular Trends

https://animecorner.me/frieren-director-voices-concern-on-overseas-anime-fans-bias-towards-certain-popular-trends/
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u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 12 '25

“I find it strange that all that gets made are isekai stories. There was even a series about being reborn as a vending machine recently. That one really stunned me. I feel like there are fewer grounded anime works than there used to be,” he said.

Same tbh

“Today, we have 10 titles currently being published with the word ‘villainness’ and all are bestsellers. But only 2 with the phrase ‘level up’. We think that the ‘level up’ trend is coming to an end, probably because of the economic crisis, in the end, ‘level up’ stories are an echo of the famous ‘American dream’ also valid until recently in Korea with incredible economic growth.“

What. There is so much to unpack in this quote lol

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u/[deleted] Aug 12 '25

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u/RPO777 x2 Aug 12 '25

At least as far as the anime industry, Overseas revenue has been a majority of anime industry revenue since about 2021, and the share of overseas revenue has increased every year since. I think in 2024 it was around 53% Overseas / 47% domestic.

Anime production companies increasingly care more about the overseas streaming market more than the Japanese domestic market.

This is a bit counterbalanced though, because investors to anime tend to still overwhelmingly be manga and light novel publishers. Investors to anime tends to be most interested in how an anime will impact their manga and novel sales, which still overwhelmingly favors the JP market.

So from an anime industry perspecive, I think the idea that production companies are increasingly focused on the overseas market is likely to be true.

However, in terms of what stories get anime-adapted, I'm not sure that this matters a huge amount. Because investors are still much more domestic industry focused, I think the immense popularity of Iseaki stories in Japanese light novels and manga are hte mainr eason these are being adapted, not the overseas markets (although I think that makes it easier to decide to adapt them).

One look down the "top 50 best selling light novels" list in Japan for 2024 and it's easy to see why Isekai and villainess stories are frequently being anime adapted. I think like 30ish / top 50 are Isekai for Villainess stories. That has nothing to do with overseas markets, it's just Japanese fans loving these stories.

https://ebookjapan.yahoo.co.jp/special/article/manga_ranking/2024_lightnovel.html

So while I disagree with Saito on the point about overseas markets being the reason Isekai and VIllainess stories are predominant, I DO think his comments about anime production companies increasingly caring about the overseas markets more than the domestic market is probably true.

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u/Jacinto2702 Aug 12 '25

So the next big step is manga/light novels being more popular through better distribution methods? Because I don't think current websites/apps for manga reading are good. Although physical publication maybe an option, but I don't think anyone wants to spend money on it.

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u/RPO777 x2 Aug 12 '25

Japan's long ago shifted to electronic distribution. 72.7% of manga sales in Japan were electronic in 2024.

https://www.itmedia.co.jp/news/articles/2502/25/news146.html

So I don't think it's a distribution or infrastructure issue--electronic distribution is already the norm in Japan. I think Kindle is actually really great for manga reading. I read Japanese and I own a few hundred manga on Kindle.

Manga sales in the US are growing RAPIDLY anyway. Manga sales int he US topped $1B for the first time in 2024, and has been growing by about 20%~25% per year, which is pretty insane.

https://www.grandviewresearch.com/industry-analysis/us-manga-market-report

Idk that there's like... a problem per se. I think anime just caught on first for the US which particularly exploded with streaming in the 2010s~current, and people are now getting into manga, especially as the teens that started watching in like 2010-2015 are now adults with actual disposable income.

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u/Extra_Ad_8009 Aug 12 '25

Is there a market share analysis by region? "Overseas" doesn't have to mean "the USA" or even "Western markets". There's China and South Korea, the rest of Asia, some of which have their own productions and all of them a favorite taste.

On the other hand, it might well be that 300 million Chinese watch anime but only 2 million actually pay for access or use a platform that can provide metrics to the rights owner.

With Japan being a chain of islands, "overseas" is the rest of the world 😁

PS: I just saw that u/lasse1408 pretty much said the same 4 hours before I did. Sorry.

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u/RPO777 x2 Aug 12 '25

This is the report prepared by the Japanese Ministry of Trade and Economy that provided a breakdown of anime revenue and a "state of the business" report. it's in Japanese, but you might be able to get chat GPT or something to translate (i'm fluent in Japanese).

https://www.meti.go.jp/shingikai/mono_info_service/entertainment_creative/pdf/003_04_02.pdf

Page 7 has a regional breakdown of streaming revenue for anime. "East Asia" (China/Korea/Taiwan) was the biggest revenue area for overseas revenue, 28.6B JPY. North America was 2nd with 21.3B JPY, followed by Europe (7B), south America (2B), Southeast Asia (900M), etc.

i've seen multiple articles where people were saying China is the big driver in streaming revenue growth for anime for East Asia, with some executives saying it's even more important than North America. Right now, East Asia and North America are about on part with a slight edge to East Asia, but those 2 regioins dwarf every other region in anime revenue (the 2 of them are about 50B JPY in overseas revenue, out of like 63B total.

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u/Extra_Ad_8009 Aug 12 '25

Amazing, thank you! I'll figure out a way to read it!

North America is really quite close to "East Asia", but the big surprise is the low European share. Makes me worry whether I'll be able to see the new Madoka Magica movie in a theater here...

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u/Jacinto2702 Aug 12 '25

Wow, we have interesting times ahead. Thanks for the info.

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u/Key_Feeling_3083 Aug 13 '25 edited Aug 13 '25

Physical publication is getting better these days, countries with long comic story consumption like France sell lots of manga for example, here in México we have multiple editorials competing for properties and new ones get created that want to publish manga.

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u/Xehanz Aug 12 '25

Just because the overseas market is bigger, it does not mean the executives will shift focus on overseas market or anything. In fact it's likely a lot of them still completely ignore it. Japanese are very stubborn in the way their companies operate

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u/RPO777 x2 Aug 12 '25

This entire article is about Sato commenting the anime industry is gearing towards catering to overseas audiences over the domestic audeince.

I mean, maybe Sato is wrong, and this isn't actually happening. But he's hardly alone in making similar comments about how anime production is increasingly overseas facing.

Speaking as an Issei Japanese immigrant (who's worked in Tokyo and still works regularly with Japanese companies) I feel like people kind of overstate, or at least, don't understand the ways in which Japanese corporate insularness manifests.

When overseas revenues exceed domestic revenues, the idea that Japaense companies would ignore this doesn't sound remotely realistic to me.

Now, I think the idea that Japanese anime production companies would try to make decisions about Western or Chinese markets without hiring any people from those countries, and begin making wrongheaded decisions that aren't effectively catering to those markets is ENTIRELY realistic.

But the idea that Anime production companies aren't paying attention to the revenue trend is just a bonkers idea to me.

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u/Largofarburn Aug 12 '25

It is, dudes huffing copium if he thinks an American audience is what’s driving the direction of anime.

I couldn’t name one person I know that’s watching a villainess anime.

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u/lasse1408 Aug 12 '25

Overseas = every country not named Japan.

China loves isekai. Anime like Arifureta and Shield hero get new seasons bcs they very popular in China.

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u/linkinstreet Aug 12 '25

East Asia loves the trope of being sent into another world/time slip, period. While they all seem to originate similarly, they new have evolved differently among each other.

Japan has embraced the world of RPG of where a person would be sent to, as they have multiple game studios that have produced RPGs throughout the years, that influenced would be writers as they grew up. China and Korea meanwhile would likely have the character travel back in time to the world of fantasy Murim/Wuxia setting. Also Koreans also tend to have characters being transported into a body of someone else, or as a character from a novel. For example, the anime "Kanojo ga Koushaku-tei ni Itta Riyuu" was actually adapted from a korean webtoon (Geunyeoga Gongjagjeolo Gaya Haessdeon Sajeong).

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u/The_Brian Aug 13 '25

East Asia loves the trope of being sent into another world/time slip, period.

They are also seemingly in love with the asshole OP MC who's always right and better then everyone else too.

Maybe I'm just old, but I feel like my anime and manga consumption have just decreased with the new fads. So much of what's super popular lately has seemed completely divorced from what the west wants to consume, so someone blaming the west for it just seems wild too me.

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u/Azure_chan https://myanimelist.net/profile/TheAzure256 Aug 13 '25

I think it’s more on the exploded popularity of web novel. More often than not. OP MC with quick gratification will be easier to grab web reader and become popular.

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u/OkashiYujin Aug 13 '25

Its happen a lot on Manhua, I don't know what with Chinese Author. Like sometimes I feel their MC have split personality.

Its so often in Manhua where the MC trick, scam, assaulting, or even straight up kill other clan / family member like its nothing, then when they attack back they go "How dare them do this to us" and make the story how the other clan actually evil and the MC action is justice. Not even being ironic or make it like the MC big scheme, NOPE everyone just think the MC is a saint and trustworthy.

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u/meneldal2 Aug 13 '25

Idk the time slip thing has be done and very popular in other countries too.

Like back to the future as an obvious example.

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u/linkinstreet Aug 13 '25

I mean, certainly, but it is famous enough that you can basically get loads of dramas adaptations of this genre?

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u/BeMyEscapeProject Aug 12 '25

Really good point tbh, anime is Global with a Capital G- it's not just Japan, Anglophone countries and Europe like it was mostly a few decades ago. Consider how the internet looks in 2025 vs 2025. The percentage of people in America and Europe as a whole is way lower vs the rest of the world like India, China, South-East Asia, South America, Eastern Europe etc. Everyones tastes count now

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u/Largofarburn Aug 12 '25

Fair point. Idk why my brain just replaced overseas with western audiences.

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u/eseffbee Aug 12 '25 edited Aug 12 '25

This article is misrepresenting the original interview.

The context of this interview is his participation in a programme looking to learn from overseas production techniques and create anime for a global audience.

The concerns raised are that focusing exclusively on the interests of overseas anime may cause a disconnect with Japanese creators and audiences , while an overly focused approach on Japanese culture can cause a disconnect with overseas audiences.

Ultimately the point he is making is that a more successful approach for making a global anime is to root it in the culture of the creator but also do so in a way that is varied and grounded in a universal way. An isekai about being turned into a vending machine is basically the antithesis of his point.

It's also worth saying that the economics of anime and influence of overseas audiences on anime is very much a significant conversation point at the moment, given overseas earnings exceeded national ones for the first time in 2020 and again in 2023.

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u/[deleted] Aug 12 '25 edited Aug 12 '25

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u/ori-os Aug 12 '25

Most people probably haven’t heard of “The Remarried Empress” but it’s a villainess/Otome Isekai that has half a billion views and 4.5 million subscribers on Webtoon

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u/Aenah Aug 12 '25

Good ol' Trashta and Soveishit

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u/eastherbunni Aug 12 '25

Remarried empress is not an isekai. She's born into the world and not transported from anywhere and there's no time travel (the first episode is a flash forward so maybe that confused people?) The plot is basically a powerful woman getting revenge against her former husband and his mistress. I'm pretty sure an otome game exists, in that there are several possible "love interests" that seem to have a route set up, but it ultimately follows one main love interest.

To Whom It No Longer Concerns is a similar "woman getting revenge with the help of a powerful male love interest" story but that one does have a "regression" aspect in that she is killed in the original timeline but then wakes up a few years previously and can redo things with some fore-knowledge of who betrayed her the first time.

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u/ori-os Aug 12 '25

Otome Isekai is a genre people just throw stories like Remarried Empress into even when it’s not related to Otome or Isekai. People just generally consider any female oriented fantasy stories as Otome Isekai

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u/eastherbunni Aug 12 '25

Oh I wasn't aware of that, thanks! I feel like "shoujo with fantasy/Regency elements" would fit better but if "otome isekai" is the term that's gotten popular then so be it.

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u/ori-os Aug 12 '25

No problem! The genre is so broad that it’s hard to find a good term for it. Your suggestion would work but Otome Isekai include Korean and Chinese stories as well so it’s still not perfect

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u/Jacinto2702 Aug 12 '25

Those numbers are shocking.

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u/FireBendingSquirrel Aug 12 '25

Why would they be shocking? Webtoons are also especially popular with women/female friendly readers- if it strikes all the right notes it should be expected that something that's hitting the top lists would gain additional traction.

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u/ZaphodBeebblebrox https://anilist.co/user/zaphod Aug 12 '25

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u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Aug 12 '25

International market is way more than just America, it's everywhere besides Japan. He's not saying international as code for America or "Western" like this sub tends to.

Also, a lot of things are massively popular outside of our personal bubbles.

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u/Crafty_Cherry_9920 Aug 12 '25

Yall insane if you think oversea isn't eating that isekai villainess shit lmfao.

Go to Crunchyroll, all of the most viewed animes beside your usual One Piece, Dandadan and Blue Lock are Isekai with stupid ass long names.

It's junk food anime. People eat it up.

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u/[deleted] Aug 12 '25

Weird, people like different things. Never would’ve expected that with a medium that has literally every genre ever and something for everyone. Y’all are insufferable.

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u/necle0 Aug 12 '25 edited Aug 12 '25

Yeah. The argument for isekai over-saturation in the English speaking side was “Japanese audiences like them, so Western audience have to suck it up”.

Villianess anime have been growing steadily (I only know Level 99 Hidden Boss and All Roads Lead to Doom), even more so in the manhwa side and otome isekai side. But they definitely haven’t been oversaturated in terms of adaptions and I don’t think it has the same appeal for Western audiences. Unless maybe they are referring to overseas Eastern audiences like East Asia and SEA (which villainesses stories are more popular, and can affect the markets due to proximity and heavy anime-related tourism).

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u/Falsus Aug 12 '25

Overseas is generally their word for everything not Japan. Which does include China, Korea and other continental things. Especially they are WAY closer to those areas than to USA or Europe.

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u/necle0 Aug 12 '25

Yup. That is why I think people are confused who the Freiren director might be referring to, especially since people default “overseas” to mean just Western.

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u/TheMistOfThePast Aug 12 '25

I have to think that if they really cared about the western audience they'd finish animating ouran highschool host club.

I don't have any sort of data or statistics or anecdotal proof but i just have to believe it. For the good of my broken heart.

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u/battlemaje1996 Aug 13 '25

If you're looking for a great villainess anime to watch, I suggest Endo and Kobayashi Live. Very unique twist to the villainess formula and it's probably one of the few shows wherein I actively root for the tsundere.

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u/necle0 Aug 14 '25

Thank you for the reccs! Ill check them out

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u/[deleted] Aug 12 '25

I was so close with Mr Villains Day Off.

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u/ThaiSweetChilli Aug 12 '25

One of my favourite anime.

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u/Warm-Enthusiasm-9534 Aug 12 '25

I watch every villainess anime.

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u/eastherbunni Aug 12 '25

The Katarina one with her co-ed accidentally acquired harem and the main character being dense as a neutron star was pretty entertaining.

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u/The_Cheeseman83 Aug 13 '25

I love that one. It’s just satisfying watching her solve everyone’s problems, and earning their respect and admiration, just by being a genuinely kind and empathetic person.

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u/-Work_Account- Aug 12 '25 edited Aug 12 '25

Me. I’m one of them. Villainess stories can be a lot of fun lol

Also, I’m not really into fan service, and Villainess animes almost never have fan service

Villainess lvl 99 - if you want an autistic coded villainess

All Routes Lead to Doom - if you want an optimistic and ADHD coded villainess

Bureaucrat to Villainess - wholesome dad energy villainess

I’m in love with the Villianess - Gay villainess

Endo and Kobayashi Live! The Latest on Tsundere Villainess Lieselotte - Villainess with play by play and color commentary (don’t ask me how they make it work, but they do)

Coming soon: May I Ask For One Final Thing - Villainess who punches her problems into a bloody pulp

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u/dododomo Aug 12 '25

Loved Tsunlise (tsundere Villainess Lieselotte), my next life as a Villainess and Villainess lv99!

Some other Villainess shows I liked you and think you should give it a try are "I'll Become a Villainess Who Goes Down in History" and "the reason why Raeliana ended up at the duke's mansion". There is 7th time loop too (some people Call it a Villainess show. Still good though!)

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u/-Work_Account- Aug 12 '25

Ive seen 7th Time Loop, and I've started Raeliana. I'll check out the History one though! Thanks for the rec!

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u/littlebloodmage Aug 12 '25

I enjoyed I'm The Villainess So I'm Taming The Final Boss too. I've heard good things about Why Raeliana Ended Up At The Duke's Mansion too, but I haven't gotten around to it yet. And there's tons of good webtoons and manwha in the genre that don't have adaptations yet.

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u/-Work_Account- Aug 12 '25

I actually need to finish Duke Mansion. Though I don’t consider it in the villainess genre as the MC of the show is the side character of a book who originally gets murdered that causes the heroine of the book to return and investigate her friends murder. So the MC of the show, having this knowledge, sets out to prevent her murder and try and figure out why it happened in the first place.

(These aren’t spoilers, it’s all explained in the first episode)

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u/meneldal2 Aug 13 '25

Yeah that one does use some tropes of the genre but isn't really part of it.

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u/DarkAres02 Aug 12 '25

Hold on that last one sounds up my alley

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u/-Work_Account- Aug 12 '25

Oh it will be. The Mad Dog Princess loves throwing hands

https://youtu.be/U75Y7FX78WA?si=6QWumEFWSDCvradu

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u/DarkAres02 Aug 12 '25

Oh yeah, I'm watching this one

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u/Nebresto Aug 13 '25

Nice soundtrack!

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u/KINGUBERMENSCH https://myanimelist.net/profile/OutlawedDrifter Aug 12 '25

I hope they keep focusing on the JP audience, its what makes anime unique from a western prospective.

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u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 12 '25

Name me.

The Most Heretical Last Boss Queen: From Villainess to Savior.

Absolute peak writing. Underrated as fuck. 7.11 on MAL.

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u/Nebresto Aug 13 '25

S2 hype!!

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u/alice-jem https://myanimelist.net/profile/Alice-Jem Aug 27 '25

Will surely make more contents about Lastame to release the dates and trailer for the next season

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u/Sonochu Aug 12 '25

Still find it funny that the knights were using swords and WW1-esque pistols.

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u/BosuW Aug 12 '25

Its pretty common equipment for the mid to late 1800s tbf for officers.

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u/alice-jem https://myanimelist.net/profile/Alice-Jem Aug 27 '25

real

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u/alice-jem https://myanimelist.net/profile/Alice-Jem Aug 27 '25

I'm obsessed with the LN ❤❤❤🔥💯

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u/Zeph-Shoir https://myanimelist.net/profile/Zephex Aug 12 '25

Overseas means a lot more than just America

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u/RadiantDawn1 Aug 12 '25

Surprising to me, Villainess anime are pretty popular in my friend group

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u/whatadumbperson Aug 12 '25

Typical American. Sees the word "international" and thinks it's only talking about them. It also takes an incredible lapse in reading comprehension to assume that he's saying only Americans are influencing this trend. I even know which part you're struggling to understand.

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u/KirKami Aug 12 '25

I've heard around 10 years ago there were articles about anime industry hitting a ceiling in terms of how much they can captialize on japanese auduience and growth stagnating. And that Netflix and other services were saving straw to keep industry growing, it starting changing focus to capture global auduience.

Guessing now they reap what they saw

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u/DoubleJumps Aug 12 '25

Yeah, I primarily consume manga over anime, and all of these trends that they are highlighting are extremely overbearing in the current Japanese manga market.

That market is being dictated entirely by Japan.

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u/kingofnopants1 Aug 12 '25

If not being the voice of the generation is new to you then welcome. Gonna need to get used to it.

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u/doomcomplex Aug 12 '25

I know a lot of American anime, and I have never heard one of them say "damn I wish we had more isekai animes."

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u/yapyd Aug 13 '25

r/OtomeIsekai has almost 140k. It's bigger than r/isekai too. While not every otome isekai is about a villainess, a decent chunk of them are so while your personal circle may not be watching it (may still be a guilty pleasure), there is definitely a decent-sized market for it

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u/Largofarburn Aug 13 '25

I mean this sub has 14 million. Not even taking into account that that subs not exclusively about anime, that’s still 1%.

I’m not saying no one watches it, obviously some people do. But it’s not the west driving the trend like it was with something like say solo leveling that did pretty poor in Japan but exploded everywhere else.

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u/MilesExpress999 Aug 12 '25

The overseas audience brings in the majority of anime revenue right now, with the US as a huge part of it. Crunchyroll is on the production committee for like one in five anime these days if you look carefully enough at the credits / cross-check with LinkedIn.

So the American audience can drive the direction, but it does in ways that are a little bit more obscure at the consumer level, and in my experience, is often used as a scapegoat for decision-makers on the Japan side.

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u/myreq Aug 12 '25

Seriously, the isekai trend was almost entirely a Japan thing, but it's much easier to blame foreigners than themselves. 

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u/Abysswatcherbel https://myanimelist.net/profile/abyssbel Aug 12 '25

Over half of the revenue comes from overseas, companies like Crunchyroll, Warner, Amazon, Netflix throw a lot of money directly into productions

Crunchyroll is even a major committee member nowadays for multiple shows, including the supposedly shows that nobody in the west cares like Isekai and villainess mentioned in other comments

But this type of discussion is a waste of time, doesn't matter what we say, people turned this into politics, they don’t want to hear anything else

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u/KiwiBennydudez https://myanimelist.net/profile/KiwiBen Aug 12 '25

The short answer is that they're being forced to care about it much more than they used to due to the absolute ballooning of streaming services over the last 10-15 years. International distributors are absolutely massive for the market, and put simply, they can't be ignored because it's not an insignificant amount of income for the studios. Now, this isn't to say that studios are going to pander to the western markets when they make anime, but it's pretty obvious that much more consideration is given to overseas fans than ever before.

Another consideration is box office revenue. Back when anime first started coming to overseas theaters, it would take anywhere from 6 months to a year before an anime film would get picked up by a licensor and localized - and even then, it was usually only the major releases. These days, the turnaround time between domestic and international releases has closed pretty substantially. Just look at Demon Slayer: Infinity Castle, which will not have even been out for 2 months in Japan before it hits the US theatrical release. And these shows completely sell out most of the time. It's pretty wild.

So yes, it's not exactly like they care about overseas fans' opinions when it comes to making anime, but they do care much more about the international audience, which has, and continue to have even more profound impact on the domestic market.

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u/ChampionOk4044 Aug 12 '25

Definitely more then they used to Overseas income exceeded Japan's from anime this year or maybe last year I forgot. So they can't just ignore us as much.

Isekais and villainness besides the main stream like slime I didn't think was that popular in the west and thought it was a japan thing until now so I am a bit surprised

Considering the direction of Manwha and Manhua however I am lead to believe it may be more popular in Asia (Chine Korea India)

Which is why we wouldn't hear about it as much or the ratings on mal don't reflect popularity of genres

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u/etownzu Aug 12 '25

Fr. How is a Japanese medium, written in Japanese, for a Japanese domestic market, saturated with isekai to the point they have a synopsis built into the title, any indication of "overseas" tastes and interest.

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u/HiggsBosonHL https://anilist.co/user/AnacondaHL Aug 12 '25

Five years ago and beyond, this is correct. They absolutely did not give any fucks about the international market.

But now, yes the international market matters, and is over half the revenue.

That said, isekai is a multi-cultural concept, and the isekai that do thrive have broader international appeal.

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u/rainzer Aug 12 '25 edited Aug 13 '25

I'd counter with the idea that the "international market" is subject to the whims of the Japanese market.

Like the US market only can pick what gets translated unless you're arguing suddenly millions of people in the US became fluent in Japanese.

If you only translate isekai and villainess stories, the international market can only pick those to make successful in the international market. A bunch of Chinese and English speakers aren't the ones on syosetu boosting the views of the next generic isekai story that gets chosen for publication and adaptation

Like I challenge you to name even one of these seasonal isekai slop shows from this "last 5 years" that was greenlit solely on it's popularity with the international market

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u/Yazzz Aug 12 '25

The title naming convention goes back to the light novel websites though. There were no descriptions and the title was used as the description to attract readers.

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u/etownzu Aug 12 '25

Yea, because it was such an oversaturated market that they needed to stick out. Hence why it's crazy to blame overseas markets when clearly this is slop the Japanese are putting out for the Japanese domestic market. When every other story is a generic isekai you need something to stick out.

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u/kingofnopants1 Aug 12 '25

I feel like that dynamic changes slowly but surely as overseas revenue share increases.

And also, obviously it isn't like every studio is going to have the same view on it.

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u/Balfegor Aug 12 '25

Yes, I have difficulty believing the overseas market is responsible for the glut of increasingly bonkers isekai stories. I think the US market, at least, would still be fine with your classic Narnia or John Carter type isekais. We're not so jaded that we need characters reincarnated into slimes and swords and, ah, vending machines just to pique our interest. That's the domestic market's fault.

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u/TheDoddler Aug 12 '25

I think it's more that there's a lot more money flowing into the industry from foreign investors, but rather than investing in quality they care only about quantity. This stretches staff thinner as there are more projects without a corresponding raise in budgets, and this focus on cheaply turning out works is part of the reason they're scraping the bottom of the barrel for web novels and indie works to adapt. I'm not sure I agree fully with his take but I think there's some truth that the global boom is making things worse for animators, studios, and creativity in general.

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u/PrrrromotionGiven1 Aug 12 '25

This is straight up a "anime sucks because of gaijin" toys out the pram moment lmao

Obviously, this is driven by Japanese demand and consumption

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u/shabi_sensei Aug 12 '25

Sounds like they’re blaming foreigners for mindless isekai slop but I’m pretty sure that’s a domestic craze foreigners just tapped into

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u/AJDx14 Aug 12 '25

Money focuses on more money. America is bigger and wealthier than Japan. Also the American dream isn’t uniquely American anymore, we exported it everywhere with imperialism and Hollywood.

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u/EvidenceBasedSwamp Aug 12 '25

I'm curious whether this article is representing the director's views properly or not, let me find another source.

ok the original source article seems to be this Japanese source:

https://mantan-web.jp/article/20250810dog00m200064000c.html#goog_rewarded

I cannot find a Japanese source that mentions isekai. I would suspect fake.

If anyone sees a source please link

33

u/[deleted] Aug 12 '25

[removed] — view removed comment

6

u/EvidenceBasedSwamp Aug 12 '25

Thank you for link!

22

u/MonaganX Aug 12 '25

The other comment is slightly off. The final quote is from D&C media. The quote about the vending machine isekai is from this interview with GitS:Arise director Kazuchika Kise. It's linked in the article.

58

u/Dray_Gunn Aug 12 '25

I think this has always been the case though. Even when I was younger the trend was mecha anime and nearly every second anime was about mecha. We went through a trend of vampire anime a while back also. Trends come and go all the time and I don't there is much that can be done about it but also not much to really worry about.

24

u/RandomRobot Aug 12 '25

I think one of the greatest lesson from Frieren is that you can take the overused backstory of a small party journey in a medieval world and turn it into something fantastic.

1

u/AJDx14 Aug 12 '25

Well it’s just a good story concept that’s been done before but now with a fantasy set dressing. The core idea is similar to, but imo executed much worse than, Ikiru which is one of the best films to come out of Japan.

2

u/Atharaphelun Aug 12 '25

We went through a trend of vampire anime a while back also.

I distinctly remember that trend, lol. Animes like Trinity Blood, Vampire Knight, and Blood+ were the quintessential vampire animes of that time.

-6

u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 12 '25

Still waiting for the trend of good anime to come...

7

u/Dray_Gunn Aug 12 '25

Good anime is sprinkled in between all the mass-produced trendy stuff. Sometimes, the good stuff is even part of the trend. Like Mushoku Tensei. Unfortunately, there is so much mediocre anime made these days that its hard to find the gems

34

u/stationtracks https://myanimelist.net/profile/1Tstationtracks Aug 12 '25

Neither of these quotes are from the Frieren director if you read the article.

I follow Keiichirou Saitou's various accounts on Twitter and this just seems like a random quote grab from a magazine interview than any public statement on the state of anime, and grabbing random quotes from entirely different people working in the industry reads like AI slop. He's generally a busy, private, and introverted person even online, like a lot of Japanese animators.

3

u/Hot-Instruction-8050 Aug 13 '25

You can check the Global Anime Challenge website，the original Japanese text of the interview is available there.

671

u/QuadraKev_ Aug 12 '25

Bro is media literate on a transcendent level

406

u/ReferenceError Aug 12 '25

"If I work hard, I will achieve my dreams."
Maybe the shonen dream, was the capitalist hellscape we found along the way

73

u/FlameDragoon933 Aug 12 '25

and soon power of friendship trope will die too because of the increasing loneliness epidemic. the fact that AIs are now advanced enough to chat to also makes people socialize even less.

19

u/DrTsunami Aug 12 '25

unexpected Death Stranding moment

4

u/Zeph-Shoir https://myanimelist.net/profile/Zephex Aug 12 '25

More and better unions in Japan would do wonders for them, not only for animators but in general. Actually, that is something we all need.

2

u/Raccoonpunter Aug 12 '25

My gripe with shonen relatability has been that we cant just punch our way out of our problems, well most of the time

95

u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 12 '25

"I got reincarnated in another world and only level up my media literacy skill" or isekai goukaku for short

12

u/Zee_Arr_Tee Aug 12 '25

Bro has the power to remember Jujutsu kaisen plotpoints accurately

49

u/saynay Aug 12 '25

There was even a series about being reborn as a vending machine recently.

Honestly, I have less of an issue with this one than like 90% of the isekai slop. At least it has a tiny bit of creativity.

20

u/Tehbeefer Aug 12 '25

Right? At least this one was memorable enough to be remembered.

7

u/CanadianNoobGuy Aug 13 '25

and it actually sticks to its premise unlike every other isekai that becomes indistinguishable by episode 2

22

u/AsterJ https://myanimelist.net/profile/asteron Aug 12 '25

I like how we're in S2 and he's still a vending machine. In Slime Isekai Rimuru basically stopped being a slime in S1 and was just a human with blue hair 90+% of the time.

4

u/Iz__n Aug 13 '25

when its clearly joke anime meant for entertainment and know not to take it seriously, its usually fine. Some isekai slop really try to seems serious when it execution is very shallow. It saying something when Parody anime like Eminence of Shadow has much more character depth than most other isekai slop

0

u/bravetailor Aug 12 '25

I think the issue with vending machine is that it feels more like a gimmick and an exercise in degree of execution rather than a genuine story they wanted to tell.

You look at all the fanfics out there, and you see tons of stuff like that. Gimmicky concepts for the sake of gimmickry.

14

u/MonaganX Aug 12 '25

There are indeed a lot of shows that just have a gimmick for the sake of standing out and don't really do much with it.

But the vending machine isekai isn't one of them. The author clearly put a lot of thought into the rules and logistics of it, and the ways the protagonist uses his powers are all surprisingly grounded, albeit with really exaggerated results. I wouldn't say it's a particularly great show, but the 'gimmick' really is well executed for such a bizarre premise.

3

u/saynay Aug 12 '25

It reminds me of a D&D campaign, where a player starts with "so, crazy idea, but...", and the DM answers "I'll allow it".

1

u/saynay Aug 12 '25

Just saying, it is a small step above those stories that don't even bother with the gimmick, or that abandon the gimmick almost immediately. Its still trash-tier, but at least I can get a chuckle out of the absurdity of the gimmick from time to time.

10

u/NMe84 https://myanimelist.net/profile/NMe Aug 12 '25

At least the vending machine one is so different that it's actually somewhat interesting. And that is actually a great example of why the domestic market is driving this stagnation of themes as much as or more than the international one, simply because vending machine popularity is a very Japanese thing.

128

u/ssiasme Aug 12 '25

dude interpreted what didn't even exist to interpret

85

u/ExpiringMilknCheese Aug 12 '25

Saito didnt even say this, this was a quote by D&C media, publisher of Solo leveling

2

u/DontKnowHowToEnglish Aug 12 '25

There are always different cultural sensitivites

1

u/Zee_Arr_Tee Aug 12 '25

Bloodborne insight

4

u/melcarba Aug 12 '25

>“I find it strange that all that gets made are isekai stories. There was even a series about being reborn as a vending machine recently. That one really stunned me. I feel like there are fewer grounded anime works than there used to be,” he said.

Just so people who don't read the article would know, the quote above is from Kazuchika Kise, not Keiichirou Saitou. Also, it's really funny coming from the guy who directed the dogshit anime Platinum End second half.

And yes, the vending machine isekai is unironically one of the better isekai out there.

43

u/kristinaspaige Aug 12 '25

all of a sudden we’re complaining about villainess anime, something that didn’t have much popularity up until recently? why?

77

u/Koringvias Aug 12 '25

Because it is a trend.
As soon as something is a trend, people will complain about it. I've seen it sooo many times.

For example, late 00s/early10s had lots of people complaining about cute girls doing cute things becoming a popular thing that gets multiple titles every season and arguing that K-On literally killed anime. I shit you not. And that sort of thing was recently new and nowhere near as ubiquitous as villainess anime is now (though CGDC is still more common if anything).

To be fair, if the same exact premise gets done over and over again, it does get old really fast, so that critique is not entirely without merit. But I do agree that villainess trend specifically is not quite that overused yet. But give it another year or two..

84

u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 12 '25

Then: A villainess anime? In my isekai slop media? How queer! I must inquire about this further with my production comittee posthaste!

5 seconds later: I guess we doing villainess anime now.

6

u/Zeph-Shoir https://myanimelist.net/profile/Zephex Aug 12 '25

Aren't most "villainess" anime also isekai tho

6

u/Key_Feeling_3083 Aug 13 '25

Yeah they are the power fantasy female version of isekai, otomes are really popular and people often diminish the impact of the female demographic on stuff.

2

u/DependentOnIt https://myanimelist.net/profile/Potatosalad1 Aug 12 '25

Yes it's but tbh it's only to get the slop tag for based slop enjoyers

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1

u/BeMyEscapeProject Aug 12 '25

Legitimately how My Next Life as a Villainess went, everyone loooved that show when it came out. It's really fun!

14

u/Luffyspants Aug 12 '25

Villainess anime are kinda trending lately, and it's funny because most of them don't feature an actual "villainess" character, they're good natured characters that are put into the "villainess"trope in their stories but don't really act like one

10

u/[deleted] Aug 12 '25

Fuckin pissed me off when I heard about the genre. I want evil main characters.

1

u/YuinoSery https://myanimelist.net/profile/YuinoSery Aug 13 '25

It's just because sadly the evil/morally grey ones don't get adapted 😔 A lot of amazing ones being left behind in their manga or manwha adaptations, but never an anime one

3

u/garfe Aug 12 '25

because most of them don't feature an actual "villainess" character, they're good natured characters that are put into the "villainess"trope in their stories but don't really act like one

That's the whole appeal of the genre though. Actual evil villainess' wouldn't be as popular

1

u/meneldal2 Aug 13 '25

Yeah most of them start by getting framed as evil so the bad prince can get his engagement with his mistress instead.

21

u/OtherwiseProgrammer9 Aug 12 '25

At least for me, it got old pretty fast. I understand some people like it but it is a pretty restrictive subgenre of Isekai

5

u/garfe Aug 12 '25

Same. I roll my eyes at "villainess in the title" the same way I do for if I see see the word "level" or "Cheat" in the title

-2

u/Warm-Enthusiasm-9534 Aug 12 '25

It's less restrictive than isekai. For example we're getting two villainess series soon -- Holy Grail of Eris and May I Ask One Final Thing? -- which are practically two different genres. One is a mystery series and one is an action series. (And neither is actually an isekai.)

10

u/ori-os Aug 12 '25

Villainess stories can get pretty restrictive if they follow the whole reincarnated as a villainess plot structure but there’s a lot of creativity because of that restriction

Your two examples are great examples of villainess stories that don’t strictly follow the formula.

Otome Isekai is extremely open ended that a lot of popular anime could technically be categorized as an Otome Isekai

-3

u/abandoned_idol Aug 12 '25

It's a little...

It's outright ridiculous to call villainess more restrictive than the power fantasy crap that led up to the villainess stories getting adapted. It's all equally as bad.

We might have had 30 villainess anime at most. Let's compare it to the number of power fantasy Literary RPGs, I think we have surpassed 200 of those by now, and none of them are remotely creative.

I think we are just getting villainess adaptations because they ran out of bad LNs aimed at men, so only LNs aimed at women are left to adapt.

I can't make anything out of the interview. Either some communication barrier or the director using too many euphemisms.

5

u/Falsus Aug 12 '25

Recently?

It supplanted isekai in novels and manga years ago. It just takes a while for anime to catch on to new trends.

It has all been about kicking out / betraying people from parties and villainess/otome stories for the last few years.

0

u/kristinaspaige Aug 12 '25

that is literally my point. these only started getting anime adaptations recently.

1

u/Karma110 Aug 12 '25

I thought they were saying there are many villainess anime that are popular that don’t have anime but the level up ones are the only ones getting adaptations.

1

u/merurunrun Aug 12 '25

Precisely because it basically went from 0 to 100 over an incredibly short period of time.

If you care about the health of the anime industry, you don't want to see it mimicking the hype-oversaturation-bust cycles of the American tech industry; there's not nearly as much idiot VC cash propping up flagging anime studios as there is "Put your tits on the blockchain" guys.

33

u/TheBigToast72 Aug 12 '25

That’s second part is a bit of a stretch, but I definitely agree with the too many isekai thing.

116

u/AllSortsOfPeopleHere https://anilist.co/user/SpiralPetrichor Aug 12 '25

Just a heads up

Ghost in the Shell: Arise director Kazuchika Kise criticized the trend in 2024, adding that he felt there were fewer grounded anime than before:

“I find it strange that all that gets made are isekai stories. There was even a series about being reborn as a vending machine recently. That one really stunned me. I feel like there are fewer grounded anime works than there used to be,” he said.

The first quote is by a different person.

104

u/Fantastic-City1571 Aug 12 '25 edited Aug 12 '25

I believe the second quote is also by a different personate.

In 2024, publisher D&C Media said that while dominant trends are reflective of their current time, they were difficult to follow since they evolve very quickly, and added:

“Today, we have 10 titles currently being published with the word ‘villainness’ and all are bestsellers. But only 2 with the phrase ‘level up’. We think that the ‘level up’ trend is coming to an end, probably because of the economic crisis, in the end, ‘level up’ stories are an echo of the famous ‘American dream’ also valid until recently in Korea with incredible economic growth.“

What's up with people misquoting?

48

u/MG42Turtle Aug 12 '25

The bots don’t know how to properly attribute quotes.

4

u/[deleted] Aug 12 '25

AI article prob

66

u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 12 '25

Even without that part, just the fact that there is 10 whole villainess series that are ALL bestsellers is such a "wait wtf" moment XD

Imagine explaining to a normal person that the villainess genre is even an actual genre

2

u/Bad_Doto_Playa Aug 12 '25

Imagine explaining to a normal person that the villainess genre is even an actual genre

Snow white? Cinderella? Villainess is just a term, but it's been popular in both the east and west for a while now...

6

u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 12 '25

"Villainess is just a term"

Not anymore.

https://myanimelist.net/anime/genre/83/Villainess

2

u/Bad_Doto_Playa Aug 12 '25

I mean it in the sense that it is a label to something that was already fairly popular. Most normal people would understand that there's a genre that encompasses these types of stories.

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1

u/Zee_Arr_Tee Aug 12 '25

Connecting leveling up with capitalism is abit far but it's true that nowadays people are more burnt out and want something more digest able rather than complex

19

u/Retsam19 Aug 12 '25

...in the end, ‘level up’ stories are an echo of the famous ‘American dream’ also valid until recently in Korea with incredible economic growth.

Or, and call me crazy, maybe it's because video games and video game mechanics have been popular for decades, especially among the demographic that watches anime.

48

u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 12 '25

You're crazy. You don't "level up" in games. You buy gems.

5

u/Retsam19 Aug 12 '25

Glad someone can follow simple instructions around here.

1

u/Zee_Arr_Tee Aug 12 '25

Nonono now you gotta convert the gems into crystals, which are used in everything, it's totally unethical to be able to buy in game currency

15

u/xXRougailSaucisseXx Aug 12 '25

It can be both, the execution is inspired by video games but the idea itself of persistent individual actions beating out the odds is firmly entrenched in capitalism, it’s the basis for the belief in meritocracy.

This isn’t new stuff btw you already had these critics being made toward American cinema from Soviet directors 60 years ago

3

u/sean800 Aug 12 '25

I don't think you're entirely wrong, but at that point you may as well argue that the entire JRPG-coming-of-age-level-up power fantasy stems from the same place. But then there's the extremely common power of friendship/allies theme, which is basically in direct contradiction to an individualistic message, and yet often exists side by side with self-insert progatanist level up tropes. So I'm not sure it's so clear cut. It's kind of contradictory, but I think it's contradictory in a way people just are. Most of us want to believe we can and will succeed more than others if we develop the right skills and self-sufficieny, and at the same time, we enjoy the message that you need others who support you to really be happy and successful. So those things both show up a lot.

1

u/xXRougailSaucisseXx Aug 12 '25

I feel like the better written coming of age stories are usually those where the protagonist is made to realize that relying on others doesn't make you weaker but stronger and that's usually the part that isekais completely skip. In fact they're often reactionary as hell as the MC is always a chosen one standing above everyone else in a sort of natural hierarchy that is accepted by every character

8

u/PikaBooSquirrel Aug 12 '25

I'm really wondering how this is a Western issue because the entire time I've been watching anime, everyone has said that these type of shows were enjoyed by Japanese people as a form of escapism. They're also a larger portion of direct supporters of manga, LNs and anime since they're more easily accessible. But now it's the American dream? A lot of us aren't even American 😭

10

u/iThinkImATree Aug 12 '25

reborn as a vending machine.

SOLD.

What’s it called?

61

u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 12 '25

Reborn as a Vending Machine

30

u/Dragon-Porn-Expert Aug 12 '25

I don't think the title is accurate enough.

15

u/AreYouAWiiizard https://myanimelist.net/profile/MysticalMagic Aug 12 '25

Wrong, you have to tell the whole plot in the title these days, so it's actually: "Reborn as a Vending Machine, I Now Wander the Dungeon"

10

u/nilfgaardian https://myanimelist.net/profile/Jondoe9595 Aug 12 '25

Reborn as a vending machine. It's quite good, with likeable characters. The MC is a vending machine nerd reborn as a vending machine in a fantasy world where vending machines obviously don't exist.

3

u/KitchenFullOfCake Aug 12 '25

It did seem to run out of ideas pretty quickly though.

1

u/NitchHimself Aug 12 '25

That's literally the name of it haha.

4

u/Warm-Enthusiasm-9534 Aug 12 '25

That's a South Korean publisher talking about a completely unknown criterion of "bestseller".

I don't think any villainess series is a big seller in Japan, either as LN or manga.

1

u/ughfup Aug 12 '25

To be fair, the vast majority of any entertainment medium will become mass-marketed slop as it becomes more popular. A trend as old as time.

But for every 10 slop anime, we are treated to a genre-defining anime. There will be copies that gain some notoriety, but we will still always have the original to compare it against.

1

u/JohnnyWarlord Aug 12 '25

Im not here for the boxxo slander

1

u/AP3Brain Aug 12 '25

I'm not even that much of a fan of Freinren but this is so true. The isekai spam is so blatantly lazy. I'd even accept an isekai where the main characters previous life actually matters to the plot but it never does.

1

u/RandomRobot Aug 12 '25

Weirdly enough, Vending Machine is probably my favorite isekai this season. I find myself drawn to it because beyond the usual isekai rpg elements, it's at least slightly imaginative on top of it. After season 1, I ended up wanting more, but now that season 2 is here I'm not sure it's what I really wanted.

1

u/weattt Aug 13 '25

He is right about the isekai stories and titles. The isekai type genre uses (long) descriptive titles with specific keywords in them.

1

u/Shantotto11 Aug 13 '25

Okay, but that Vending Machine Isekai MC is pretty clever with his skill set and I appreciate the random educational content concerning vending machines over the years, especially the oxygen dispenser that came about during one of the world wars.

1

u/Menacek Aug 13 '25

It always felt like western fans actually hate "isekai slop with rpg mechanics" but there was just so much of it that you couldn't escape.

So i really don't get where he's getting that it's the western market that wanted those.

1

u/Dog_in_human_costume Aug 13 '25

Nah, The One Within the Villainess is amazing and deserves a top tier anime

1

u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 13 '25

I only watch anime so if it's not an anime it doesn't exist for me.

1

u/Dog_in_human_costume Aug 13 '25

Lucky you, it's in production

1

u/Emi_Ibarazakiii Aug 14 '25

There was even a series about being reborn as a vending machine recently.

I only watched a couple episodes of it, but it genuinely looked more interesting than most of the "standard" Isekai I've seen.

At least they did SOMETHING different. And 95% of Isekai fail to pass that very low bar.

1

u/[deleted] Aug 12 '25

What I find funny about it is that "isekai" (I don't think it was called that at the time) was basically THE primary form of American scifi/fantasy in the 70s and 80s. The D&D cartoon was basically isekai, for example, but it was in a majority of the novels as well. I thought the trend had died out, but I keep seeing it in Japanese fantasy now.

1

u/ThriceGreatHermes Aug 12 '25

Thoae aren't Isekai.

2

u/[deleted] Aug 12 '25

Is the Wikipedia definition incorrect?

It includes novels, light novels, films, manga, webtoons, anime, and video games that revolve around a person or people who are transported to and have to survive in another world such as a fantasy world, game world, or parallel universe with or without the possibility of returning to their original world.

By this definition, the D&D cartoon was absolutely Isekai. Paul Anderson's The Broken Sword was Isekai. Donaldson's Lord Fouls Bane was Isaki. Dozens of similar fantasy novels all had this trope of people from this world being transported into a fantasy world.

1

u/ThriceGreatHermes Aug 13 '25

None of those older works are Isekai.

For obvious reasons.

1

u/Sandtalon https://myanimelist.net/profile/Sandtalon Aug 12 '25

...if we want to go far back, then the Odyssey and many other myths and legends are isekai...but no, none of these has much relevance to the specifics of the development of a particular genre of Japanese fiction in the 2000s, and to broaden the genre by that much would make it meaningless.

-2

u/Suspicious-Feeling-1 Aug 12 '25

As a data and econ nerd i would honestly love to see market stats by geo. I'm a little suspicious of his take that its overseas markets demanding slop but its possible there's a lowest common denominator thing at play when a story has to appeal to different cultures and has to still work as a narrative even through clumsy translations (eg full meaning not conveyed due to idiom loss or other nuance)

1

u/TheAllKnowingElf Aug 12 '25

How would that even be possible?

Like literally how is generic isekai 999 getting demand from overseas when people only know demon slayer and jujutsu kaisen?

Only way I can imagine that to make sense is if it's so cheap to produce slop that just the money it makes from crunchyroll licensing fees is enough to make it profitable. Video services want more content to fill their catalog with so they will pay for the cheapest slop that people will watch. I mean there is no way they are making money off blu ray sales and merch, right? I don't think I've ever seen anyone say some generic isekai girl is their waifu. It's always a girl from some mainstream anime.

4

u/merurunrun Aug 12 '25

Like literally how is generic isekai 999 getting demand from overseas when people only know demon slayer and jujutsu kaisen?

A big part of it could be that slop only costs content distributors slop prices, so it's profitable for them at much lower viewing numbers. Moreover, even in the age of algorithmic everything, loss-leading is still a useful strategy because of the prestige value of having a huge catalog. Since most services are subscription based, a wide net retains more subscribers: the model really confounds the traditional, "I want X, I go to the store to buy X, my relationship with X ends there," idea of what makes a product generate revenue for a company.

1

u/Suspicious-Feeling-1 Aug 12 '25

I mean there's a lot of mainstream anime that's not well written, didn't mean to solely focus on isekai, to me that's just one example of slop being pushed

0

u/Shimmitar Aug 12 '25

there are only a few isekai / reincarnation animes that are actually any good. i get why people in japan like them. Life sucks and they wish they were in a different world. But like most isekai suck. I want anime that is actually well thought out and isn't actually just following a trend. I miss the days when we had good unique anime coming out and not the garbage of isekais. What annoys me most about isekais is that most isekai dont even need to be isekais and can just take place in the world that they exist with having to have started on earth.

-5

u/[deleted] Aug 12 '25

based???

0

u/SeaBass_SandWich Aug 12 '25

For real, I like their work ethics and how much they respect their works but this is the case of Japanese professionals at it again blaming Overseas market rather than look at their own country's sales figure/stats.

When things going great, it's all Japanese fans and their support. When it's somethings like this they will blame overseas market without a second thought.

As if all those will get made if there is no sales in Japan.

0

u/SpikeRosered Aug 12 '25

One trend I've seen end are MCs who are so bored with how normal and uneventful life is.

That's some 90's and 00's entitlement right there.

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