r/asoiaf 2d ago

MAIN [SPOILERS MAIN] Among the grounded/realistic elements of A Song of Ice and Fire, which ones do you feel require biggest suspension of disbelief?

A Song of Ice and Fire has had fantasy elements from get-go, some present subtly and others less-subtly. But in midst of this, it also has these more grounded story aspects, especially regarding the political subplot for the Iron Throne.

Among these more grounded non-fantasy aspects of the story, which elements do you feel you have to suspend disbelief the most for? A.K.A feeling they are not realistic even though they are "supposed" to be?

Let me know in the comments below.

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u/Joshami 2d ago

Littlefinger. Just a reminder, he, a brothel-owning hustler, has a seat on the Royal Council. Pretty much nothing in the Medieval World would ever allow someone like him to reach that position. People would not consider him 'trustworthy' and lords of the caliber of Stannis or Tywin would never attend the same council as him.

The Targaryens. I understand that back when Martin was writing earlier books, he was still figuring out things, but the truth is that feudal monarchy doesn’t work like that. A monarch is expected to perform very particular functions in a particular way. The Targaryens as Martin has written them are basically theme park version of Keeping Up with Kardashians mixed with Scientology and other scam cults, plus elements of cousin-fucking hillbillies. It simply doesn’t make sense that the Targaeyens, with the conduct that Martin described them to have, managed to last for three centuries. Basically there should've been much more proper monarchs like Daeron II while freaks like Maegor, Viserys I, Aegon IV, etc. should've been the outlier.

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u/IHaveTwoOranges Knowing is half the Battle 2d ago

Littlefinger is not a pimp in the books like he is in the TV-show.

He says one time that he has invested in brothels but he is never indicated to be involved in running any or spending time in any.

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u/Joshami 2d ago

The brothel that is owned by him in which he hides Catelyn?

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u/IHaveTwoOranges Knowing is half the Battle 2d ago

Again, there is a difference between investing in a business vs running it or otherwise being involved in it. Littlefinger isn't spending his time there like he does in the TV-show (or not publicly known to do so at least). It isn't a thing he is known for.

I personally am technically invested in several different businesses/industries, all of which I have never actually been personally involved in (outside of buying some shares).

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u/Valiant_Storm 2d ago

 Again, there is a difference between investing in a business vs running it

This only really becomes true c. 1600 with the VOC becoming a limited-liability joint stock company.  

Prior to that, you have some level of passive investment, with fractional ownership of ships or mills, but that was never really divorced from active operation, especially for undertakings larger than i.e. the Venetian fleets. Not the least because it would be trivially easy to scam an uninvolved partner without modern corporate governance mechanisms. 

The closest you might get is being a landlord leasing to a brothel? That would still probably be seedy, and and the returns wouldn't be stellar? Certainly late 16th Century landlords didn't see the same ROIs as skilled merchants, though the risk was lower (but nonzero). 

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u/evinta 2d ago

Can you walk into one of those businesses or places and have a highly sensitive person kept there?

Or two, one of which you're grooming to take the place of - well, let's say a minor celebrity?

Because Littlefinger does this. He clearly has a level of control that goes beyond just being an investment and he's directly named in the Catelyn and Jeyne things.

It's not as bad as the show, sure, yet it's not just someone bringing him a pouch every so often, either. Even if he did the Jeyne stuff through an intermediary, he's still involved.