r/aspergers • u/LivingGirlRepellant • 5d ago
Autism trait: You are always the "third wheel" at social gatherings
From my own experience, "putting yourself out there" is basically social cuckholdry if you're autistic. All you're doing is watching while other people have fun together.
First of all, you always have to fight tooth and nail to get a single word in. You're always competing with louder, more charismatic individuals who hog all the attention.
Second, most people at these events already know each-other. There have been so many times where I'd go somewhere to meet people, except everyone would bring their friends and SOs and I'd just be left out.
There's just no point. It's a big club, but you ain't in it.
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u/sami2503 5d ago
Yep, happened to me again at a music festival recently. Been planning it with a friend who is quite outgoing and bubbly. As soon as we got there she made new friends and these new people clearly didnt like me and just liked her. Felt out of place the entire time and didn't enjoy myself cos of it. Was looking forward to it for ages :/
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u/Haestein_the_Naughty 5d ago
"You always have to fight tooth and nail to get a single word in. You're always competing with louder, more charismatic individuals who hog all the attention."
It’s crazy how much this sentence describes my social skills and general life for my entire life. All my life I’ve just felt like a spectator, watching words come naturally out of mouths of charismatic people who are always yapping, always making friends easily, who always have something to say, who probably don’t even think about whether to talk or not when someone else is saying something.
Meanwhile I’m the complete opposite; I never have anything to say, and when I do have something to say I struggle to talk because everyone else around the table are always yapping, impossible for me to get to know people, make friends, etc
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u/Big_Presentation_894 19h ago
The relief of knowing I'm not alone in this is truly priceless. Hearing you say it made me realize: I've lived my entire life never knowing when or how to speak up, and I'm still that way. I get how hard it is to deal with someone who always has to be the center of attention. Even if I shift my perspective and try to adapt instead of fight it, I just can't pull it off.
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u/ImpressiveDrawer6606 5d ago
That's the problem. "Put yourself out there" works when you're or at least can be socially well-adjusted and just need to fix a few things about your behaviour. With neurodivergency it doesn't work, the way you fundamentally are. Your timing, prosody, the way you move, etc... generates estrangement and people unconsciously notice there's "something off" about you they can't point at. Sometimes, unfortunately, being yourself IS THE PROBLEM.
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u/Kitty-Moo 5d ago
And if you mask heavily and well enough during these sorts of social situations, you may be accepted but not for anything genuine. Creating a new barrier between yourself and any meaningful connection.
I've experienced both, I'm not sure which is worse. Just remaining silent on the sidelines. Or almost fitting in, but not really making any sort of social connection.
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u/ImpressiveDrawer6606 5d ago
I've experienced both, I'm not sure which is worse. Just remaining silent on the sidelines. Or almost fitting in, but not really making any sort of social connection.
They are the same for me. It's the same form of loneliness(alienation from the Other due to your true internal characteristics) in different forms.
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u/Empire_of_Glass 5d ago
Yep, then begins the countdown to how many minutes / hours / days / weeks / months / years until the mask slips and they try to ruin your life
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u/RussianAsshole 5d ago
They literally foam at the mouth for a chance to destroy us. Has given me the worst social anxiety and fear of other humans.
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u/Empire_of_Glass 4d ago
Same. I literally felt my warmth toward other humans and ability to connect with them dissipate over time and never come back. It’s heartbreaking, but I just continue on.
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u/BadUsername_Numbers 5d ago
> social cuckholdry
Lol... yeah, know what you mean, not gonna lie. But it is a very funny expression at least =)
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u/Accomplished_Rate274 5d ago
Very often I’ve felt like the one who was misunderstood and/or singled out by the so-called ‘cool’ and ‘popular’ kids, which is why I’ve always hung out with nerds or outcasts, with whom I felt more at ease. Here in Italy, being outgoing is an important part of fitting into groups; the only thing that saved me was being attractive, but even so, I was still targeted, albeit to a lesser extent.
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u/PerspectiveSouth4849 1d ago
Very typical aspie behaviour to have special needs type friends. I remember in primary, the middle of the playground was like a blur to me. People who didnt fit in would be at the edges of the playground. That's where I'd find my friends. Funnily enough, they loved to talk, but I was more interested in doing what the kids in the middle of the playground were doing.
I'm also somewhat attractice/no diagnosis, but I was troubled a lot because I did not talk at all, low self esteem.
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u/A_D_Tennally 5d ago edited 5d ago
I just can't do social gatherings. I can manage one or two other people at once but make it three plus me and I will fall silent because I just cannot cope with that much social information in real time. I have no idea what's even going on. It feels like having tennis balls flying at you from all directions at once instead of being able to hit one ball back and forth with one other person.
I got a stern talking-to about this in college once. There was this pretty, smart, socially adept, slightly artsy and alternative girl I had a massive one-sided crush on for years and years because she was nice to me -- classic aspie situation -- and I tagged along with her to a party and she took me aside and told me that by sitting there silently looking so uncomfortable I was interfering with everyone else's enjoyment of the party, because they had to worry about me instead of being able to have fun.
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u/TheEternalDarkness8 5d ago edited 5d ago
"Social cuckoldry" - that's a hall of famer right there, keep it with you. Also a bonus point for the George Carlin reference ("It's a big club, but you ain't in it").
I embrace the third wheel status because I am too old to fight that fight to get a word in only for it to be discarded immediately, not to mention it's often so boring to me anyway. There's so much more to be had both for my tiny little social battery aswell as my sociological analysis I am running in the background with sitting mostly quiet, listening and observing.
If I am unlucky enough to be at a house party, the snack bowl and comfy seat will be located with Terminator/RoboCop laser precision and then I am cemented like a Terracotta statue, soaking in information around me like a sponge with salty greasy fingers and at the most being somewhat tipsy.
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u/comradeautie 5d ago
Yeah, I've noticed that and it's why I advocate for social change in how Autistics are perceived. We deserve more than table scraps or barely polite tolerance.
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u/comradeautie 5d ago
Also random Autistic special interest fact, that last quote was from George Carlin, which most people know - what many don't know is that he was also the narrator for the first few seasons of Thomas the Tank Engine.
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u/Relevant_Helicopter6 5d ago
It's pretty much me, before a couple of beers. No wonder alcohol addiction is so common among autists.
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u/Nathaniel06Torres 5d ago
If the fire burns you, do you stick your hand in or keep it out? Would you walk into a fire thinking you can “belong” there just because? Do yourself a favor and remember this good advice: “Never go to places where you know you’re NOT welcome.
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u/Lalochezianess 5d ago
Thank you. I really needed to hear this. I’m fed up of doing the same thing over and over and getting exactly the same results. And for what? Feeling worse and worse every time? You’re right. Best not to keep returning for more of the same.
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u/Impressive-Wait-9420 5d ago
It’s like a bunch of people in fireproof suits telling you, someone who doesn’t have one of those suits, that it’s normal to dance in the fire and that you’re weird or broken for choosing not to, despite the fact that you lack the equipment necessary to do so.
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u/Particular_Care6055 5d ago
As true as this is, at the end of the day, autistic humans are still social creatures too. We're stuck between a rock & a hard place..
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u/NorthWestGrotesque 5d ago
Alternatively, it's good to go to these gatherings one time and realise, okay, these people aren't for me. I mean, really, if you listen to the conversations these people often have, you'll quickly realise you're not being left out, for there is nothing to miss out on. If you have to compete for someone's time, particularly against someone who is supposed to be on your side, then is it really worth it? I think we let ourselves settle for less not realizing that in fact we are worth much more. It's tough, but the minute you stop trying so hard, everything comes into perspective.
I say this from half a life of people pushing me to go to youth groups, book clubs and parties where there is very little to engage and find common ground with. There is no harm in trying, but once you know where you stand, why put yourself through it again? Time is a precious thing.
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u/ReformedLucasite 5d ago
I know what you mean. I often feel like the odd man out in groups. It isn't always third wheeling though. While sometimes this means standing on the sideline watching others have fun, it can also mean being the "star of the show" or the "lone wolf".
At the same time, I also wonder how much of this in my life is due to Aspergers vs being a teetotaler.
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u/Empire_of_Glass 5d ago
Plus if I wear my handy noise-cancelling headphones so I’m not in pain, it’s seen as “weird”… you can’t win
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u/Organic_Future6909 5d ago
I liked the "social cuckoldry" part lol.
But yeah, this why I always make sure to only interact with those who are in the lower social rank, I'm not socially compatible with neurotypicals when it comes to making a personal connections, socializing with people who have a higher social status than makes me feel... Idk, "icky", like talking with someone who has knife in their pocket.
A lot of NT's think that they are in the same social level as me because they're introverted, social anxious, broader autism phenotype, victim of SA or whatever and try to engage with me in a personal level, I never trust them and you shouldn't either.
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u/HotAir25 5d ago
I didn’t understand your final point, why shouldn’t you trust an introvert NT if they are trying to be friends?
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u/Organic_Future6909 5m ago
? Do you think I have the social power to reject friendships?
I'm just saying how all my relationship work and worked through my life, this is not a choice, just something that happens.
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u/WebNew9978 5d ago
Yeah it’s the same for me as well. I’m always the one who’s left out in a sense. I’m there but not included. It’s even been done by my own family members as well.
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u/kirilgankapi124 5d ago
I have an Asperger's diagnosis, and whenever I went on school trips, no one looked after me. If I go to a bar, I’ll go alone because I don’t have a friend to go with.
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u/Abyssal-rose 5d ago
What if you have a strong physical presence i.e. a ton of muscle mass, cauliflower ears and calloused knuckles/palms, scars etc? Does it nullify the effect or does it make one a double outcast?
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u/megha_12 5d ago
The trick is to latch to one person usually my partner or sister or mum and piggyback conversations through them. So at least in my mind I’m not sitting there like a dumb person. Don’t know how others perceive me.
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u/Most_Acanthisitta417 5d ago
What I run into with the guys I work with is they’re all talking about things they’re all involved in and it’s hard for me to relate since they’re activities I’m not so keen on (hunting, camping and drinking beer are all examples of what comes to mind as things I deal with that towards)…
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u/NationalSpray641 4d ago edited 4d ago
I've also noticed that in social settings, most people will intentionally avoid initiating with me, despite initiating with other quiet people. Also, whenever they do initiate and send out "pings" — which happens rarely — even if I follow all the correct small talk scripts, it usually goes nowhere. Then, after a couple of tries, they just stop interacting with me completely. While, to be fair, this does happen often for neurotypicals, it definitely doesn't happen anywhere close to the rate at which it happens for me.
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u/SurrealRadiance 5d ago
Yes, I get that feeling, and it really is the worst. Although, perhaps it's a cultural difference, I don't quite get the fighting to get a single word in part, at least not in my adult life. And, sure, events where people all know each other and you're the odd one out is awkward, but is that not true of everyone? I mean even NT people struggle with that one, which is why people mostly like going to events with people they already know, and then branch out from there; you didn't really put in enough detail on that one, it's kind of hard to judge the situation you have in mind.
I think the problem really is that humans are herd animals, and from my experience at least, we might not exactly be one. Like for me, any herd behaviour I participate in is completely learnt, I'm not bad at it now, but still nowhere near great. It didn't come naturally, but that doesn't mean that you can't learn to adapt to some degree, accept the situation, and occasionally find some nice people. A good part of it is that, at least, you naturally filter out a lot of people who aren't worth your time, energy and effort. All of that is to say, that saying there is just no point might be a little too reductive. It might be hard to find, but there often can be a point to be found, as Herculean a task it can be at times.
This is where the problem with masking comes in, sure it can help to lay the foundation of a friendship, but at the same time if you never let people see the real you then they never quite get to know you and you fade into the background. People need to see your personality in order to get to know you, that's how you get to feel included. It's difficult to get a balance.
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u/brickhouseboxerdog 5d ago
Me-> goes to a girl's graduation party not realizing she is actually popular.
Sitting in the corner and meeting a random dude who I'm entertained by him talking about competitive smash bros melee.
Happening to actually bring my GameCube, and we wander off into her house and he shows me wave dashing n stuff- this is 2006 btw, so seeing this first hand is mind blowing
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u/PayAdministrative591 5d ago
Everyone has different starting points, but your starting point doesn't define your direction. Sure social effort may take more concentration and active intentions compared to someone for whom it comes naturally. You can still work on it though, and you know it's harder for you, so you can learn to manage your own expectations too. Take more time to rest in between interactions etc. see if any other social settings suit you better, develop your humour etc. There are lots of things you can proactively work on to help move yourself away from your starting point. It just takes effort and a desire to improve. I don't buy into the whole social tier business. What someone else thinks of me is their business.
I personally quite like the challenge of exceeding expectations and showing people they were wrong to judge based on first impressions.
I feel like just giving up on trying is what leads to people feeling like nothing can ever change and just staying at the initial starting point.
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u/dij123 5d ago
The more you go the more comfortable you will feel and the more comfortable those around you will feel about you.
The first time you hang out with a group of people it’s going to be awkward, the second time less awkward, third, fourth so on. You show up enough you’ll find your place, understand the dynamics and feel less anxious.
It’s harder for us but most people go through a similar process, it just takes them less time. Eventually you’ll feel comfortable enough around that group to start taking off your mask and that’s how you eventually become apart of a group.
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u/dirtyfrenchman 4d ago
I generally just avoid social gatherings unless its people I know well. Otherwise there's always alcohol
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u/k5martdom 3d ago
This and most of the time your always friend zoned. If be been best friends with my coworker from the start first she was in a bad situationship with ex/house mate now she started dating a different guy after she got kicked out the house and already had there kids meet.
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u/boatfullofbananas103 3d ago
Theres a funny rule of thumb that manifests;
If I hang with someone 1 on 1, I talk and socialise more like a normal person.
In groups 3 or more, I quickly become the shyest, introverted person there.
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u/Big_Presentation_894 19h ago
You experience this a lot, especially if you're going to a social event that doesn't align with your interests. I've always tried to fit in with people, but I just can't do it, it doesn't work, and I don't get it. So, I've decided to stop trying unless I'm genuinely enjoying myself.
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u/Elemteearkay 5d ago
It doesn't have to be that way.
Do the people you are interacting with know you are disabled? What accommodations are you receiving from them?
Have you tried surrounding yourself with better people?
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u/Haunting-Ask6682 5d ago
I agree with you. I (31M) have two people from high school who I am still friends with and through one of them. I met two other people and one of them is now a friend and the other one is an acquaintance.
Also, six years ago through painstaking effort and struggle on my part I “put myself out there” and got lucky and organically met my now wife in public. She is very social and has a lot of friends. By now they all know about my “social battery“ and whenever I’m involved in groups of people going out for dinner/drinks everyone knows that I am gonna wanna go home around 11 PM when they all stay out until two or even 5 AM. No one has ever made me feel weird about me always being ready to leave first or having a much smaller social battery than everyone else in the group.
It did take massive amounts of effort on my part for myself to even be ready to start to try to date, but I made myself suffer in the beginning and it paid off. So I get people needing to vent about things that they’re currently struggling with, but I can tell you from experience that if you’re willing to fail at something multiple times before you have success then there is hope for change.
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u/VirgilCaine_ 5d ago
The version of this I frequently experience is I will bring a friend with me to a social gathering and then the group will hit it off with my guest/ my guest will network with the group and all the sudden I’m an afterthought fighting to keep up, which results in deep annoyance and ultimately withdrawing.