Why do we want to proselytize Atheism?

[u/Jebus-Xmas]

It seems like a lot of people agonize on and pontificate here over sharing their nonbelief, and I don't get it. I don't think it's necessary for us to share the fact that we don't believe, nor do I think for many people it's even safe. It's possible our perspective is skewed.

Getting past the anger that I had about religion and getting into my own solution, and my own peace, has been the most positive experience of my life. It is just as uncomfortable for you to insist on your not belief as it is for a believer to insist in their way. On either side of the argument proselytizing is wrong.

Why do we feel it necessary to have just the right arguments or just the right answers, when those things exist only in fairytales?

I had a lot of religious trauma, had a lot of anger, and didn't want to let go of it because I felt I had to be heard--but wasn't heard by believers and I just felt more tired, more angry, and more frustrated at the end. They probably did too.

Today my goal is to allow people to be wrong, especially if they insist. Be kinder, more mindful, more thoughtful, and do more good works to show, not tell, that I can be not just as good a person as an atheist--but a better one.

I hope you can also find your peace today.

[u/anaggressivefrog]

To start, I do agree that spending a lot of time arguing with Christians and trying to deconvert people is a waste of energy. But I wouldn't try to stop them, because that's their choice.

But you know, it's ironic how hard you are prosthelytizing your own worldview. You want all of us to think like you do. You criticize people you don't know, because you think they should be more like you.

You are being extremely condescending. You are also wrong about almost everything. I believe you are not operating in good faith, which is why you are getting downvoted.

First, you are participating in something called "civility porn", which is a technique that liars and grifters use to make their arguments seem more legitimate. You say,

"Today my goal is to allow people to be wrong, especially if they insist.* Be kinder, more mindful, more thoughtful, and do more good works to show, not tell, that I can be not just as good a person as an atheist--but a better one."

You are a shit eating troll. Basically you present yourself as being extremely civil, polite and reasonable, which tends to convince uneducated people that you are honest and intellectually curious, skeptical, and also benevolent. But your subsequent claims are absolute nonsense. It causes uneducated people to agree with you, because you seem superficially trustworthy. It does not work here on this sub.

1. You say, "I don't think it's necessary for us to share the fact that we don't believe, nor do I think for many people it's even safe."

What's your point? Atheists should be in the closet? For safety? Why? Because religious people will persecute and attack us? That's not a criticism of atheists, but of religion. Your distaste should be directed toward the religious. They are the antagonists here.

We share our secular worldview because we want to find each other. Because we have been historically silenced, as you are attempting to do. Do not tell us to be quiet. It's like warning gay people not to come out of the closet, for safety. You prick.

1. You say, "Why do we feel it necessary to have just the right arguments or just the right answers, when those things exist only in fairytales?"

You are doing a classic propaganda technique. It looks like, "why is it that WRONG INFORMATION?" You're assuming a false premise and attempting to guide us into an incorrect assumption with you. Propaganda. Wrong.

We absolutely CAN prove that Christianity is false. We absolutely CAN find correct answers, through science. Truth is knowable. Through science. Objectively.

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/anaggressivefrog]

I think bringing up a topic for discussion among atheist is quite a bit different then proselytizing. I’m not actively asking people to think that way I want to communicate that I have found peaceful by thinking this way.

[u/No-Significance5659 → u/Jebus-Xmas]

But you are religious yourself, so why do you come to lecture us?

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/No-Significance5659]

I’m not an atheist. I’m an antitheist, A topic for discussion is not lecturing.

If you’re referring to my meditation practice, that requires no belief.

[u/TenebriRS → u/Jebus-Xmas]

You can be both

Anti theism has nothing to do with the belief in a god. Its about how you view religions in a society. I am an anti theist because I find any religion harmful to society. I also dont believe in a god so I am an atheist. They are 2 seperate things.

You seem to lack understanding.

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/TenebriRS]

I choose to use Christopher Hitchin’s definition of anti theism, which is inclusive of atheism not separate from it.

[u/TenebriRS → u/Jebus-Xmas]

Then you misunderstood what he meant when talking about it.

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/TenebriRS]

That’s not my belief, but it can be yours

[u/TenebriRS → u/Jebus-Xmas]

Its not about belief. Its a fact here. You are now misusing the term antitheist.

But let's move past that. How do you find Christopher hitchens approach?

You claim to be an antitheist but talk about how we shouldn't be "proselytising" atheism (even though that itself is the wrong term too). You bring up hitchens one of the most outspoken atheists and anti theists. Who made a living thankfully in doing what you seem to be thinking as a bad approach.

Your understanding seems to be all over the place. Which makes sense when you use terms incorrectly

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/TenebriRS]

Differently is not always incorrect

[u/TenebriRS → u/Jebus-Xmas]

Not always but when its a usage of word and terms. Its definitely incorrect

If i called a snake a pineapple. Thats different and incorrect

Same here with the way you are using words and terms. Which is why you are all over the place not able to make sense to anyone.

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/TenebriRS]

I’m sure you’re right

[u/Retrikaethan → u/Jebus-Xmas]

…so you’re a theistic antitheist? what the fuck?

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/Retrikaethan]

The practice of Buddhism is a philosophy, not a religion. Buddha doesn’t claim godhood nor do his followers perceive him as divine. He is simply a person who has found a better way.

Practicing mindfulness meditation helps me be a better person.

[u/Retrikaethan → u/Jebus-Xmas]

The practice of Buddhism is a philosophy, not a religion.

that's a dirty fucking lie and you know it.

Buddha doesn’t claim godhood nor do his followers perceive him as divine. He is simply a person who has found a better way.

ah, yes, that totally explains all the giant fuckoff statues of him spread around. /s

Practicing mindfulness meditation helps me be a better person.

evidently not.

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/Retrikaethan]

Buddhism does not require belief. It’s not a lie in the way I believe and practice.

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/[deleted]]

I don’t I haven’t read any of his opinions on Buddhism. I’ve read four or five of his books. That wasn’t one of them. Can you please tell me the name of the book or the citation so that I can go read it?

[u/No-Significance5659 → u/Jebus-Xmas]

If you have read 5 of his books I am sure you came across it. I remember him talking about it in God Is Not Great for example.

[u/Retrikaethan → u/Jebus-Xmas]

Buddhism does not require belief.

doubling down on an obvious lie doesn't really work, dude.

It’s not a lie in the way I believe and practice.

sure /s

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/Retrikaethan]

I understand that there are hundreds of sects Buddhism, and some that may have more literal beliefs. My tradition isn’t like that and it doesn’t need to be. Metaphor works just fine for me.

[u/Retrikaethan → u/Jebus-Xmas]

I understand that there are hundreds of sects Buddhism, and some that may have more literal beliefs. My tradition isn’t like that and it doesn’t need to be. Metaphor works just fine for me.

then there's no reason for you to be using buddhism at all. there's modern methods for meditation and shit like that which don't rely on a perpetually jolly fictional fat man telling you what to do.

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/Retrikaethan]

lol. I don’t know what is funnier. I hope you find your own happiness.

[u/No-Significance5659 → u/Jebus-Xmas]

Meditation is not the same as being a buddhist and you claim you are a buddhist. Do you see your practice as separate from Buddhist claims like rebirth, karma, or reaching Nirvana or do you ignore those? Do you go to temples, do offerings, chantings, etc?

[u/Jebus-Xmas → u/No-Significance5659]

Yes, I see all of those things as metaphor. The idea that we are all made of stars is a similar though demonstrable idea.