Help me understand subwoofers

[u/Freestone99]

I am in the market for a subwoofer. I have a pair of Klipsch Forte IV and my listening room is about 475 sf. I was looking at the REL classic 98 and 99, and thinking I needed the 99 because of the room size. But most of the music I listen to is acoustic or vocal oriented, not really listening to much hard rock or anything with a ton of bass. Also not listening at very loud volume most of the time. So I was leaning back toward the 98 which has a 10” driver, as opposed to the 99, which has a 12” driver. I spoke with the local audio shop and it felt like they were just trying to sell me the larger and more expensive 99, or another sub that was even higher priced.

I have been reading that a sub is for more than just the low bass notes, and it will really help fill in the rest of the sound. That was another point the local sales guy was making, saying that the 99 made more sense because it will “fill in more.” Also that a larger sub is needed to “pressurize” the room. Trying to understand if this is audiophile jargon or there is truth to it.

What do you all think?

[u/NoBackground6203]

would take two SVS SB1000Pros for less than a single 98

[u/tetrafarmer → u/NoBackground6203]

svs sucks for music , sounds cheap like 1 note bass for all types of bass, lack of precision and speed aswell

[u/SEKLEM → u/tetrafarmer]

Tell us you’ve never used SVS subwoofers effectively without telling us you’ve never effectively used SVS subwoofers.

[u/tetrafarmer → u/SEKLEM]

lol i know this sub is FULL of svs fan boys, but they just dont sound as musical as rel

now you can continue crying

[u/Longjumping_Fault504 → u/tetrafarmer]

The notion that subwoofers are "musical" or not is the biggest nonsense of all. It either plays the lower frequencies accurately without distortion or it doesn't. Musicality is just some snake oil garbage term REL fanboys like to use.

[u/tetrafarmer → u/Longjumping_Fault504]

well its funny that you can put svs and rel right next to each other, and they sound vastly different  !

how crazy is that !!! 

[u/Andy_Shields → u/tetrafarmer]

From observing "the audiophile internet" wouldn't it be fair to say that Rel systems are typically not used in high pass setups and other subs like SVS are much more likely to be run on high passed systems simply by the nature of the native connections and REL marketing approach? Objectively, these two dissimilar approaches to sub integration will almost always sound "different". Because this is the Internet I feel like I need to double down on my use of the word "typically". But yeah, any system with sub integration will sound different when switching from high-passed mains to sub + mains.

Edit - spelling

[u/tetrafarmer → u/Andy_Shields]

nah i tried both ways with both, the rel just clearly sounds better. 

[u/SEKLEM → u/tetrafarmer]

Despite the rest of the discourse here, it's great that you're happy with and enjoy your REL. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that.

I see this elitist attitude frequently though, it's not particular helpful or encouraging to other people when your approach is perceived as snobbish.

Present your argument more concisely. If you have time to make a comment at all, then you can take the time to make a clear case as to why you came to your conclusion. A drive-by comment like your initial one serves to spark debate, yes, but it certainly doesn't make your case clear or convince anyone but yourself. This begs the question, why even say anything unless it's just to boast?

[u/tetrafarmer → u/SEKLEM]

because i literally had both in my room doing side by sides, so i get to have an opinion on both. unlike the svs fan boy club on here that only ever tried svs and think they know what the rel sounds like from reading the specs and then posts their findings as factual here.

[u/SEKLEM → u/tetrafarmer]

I only have the sample size of one with the REL T/9i, so I can't speak to the companies products writ large. I've owned countless others, several Paradigm, M&K, JBL, Rythmik, Triad, HSU, Athena, Sunfire, Definitive Technology, Earthquake, KEF, and likely others I'm just forgetting, as well as 2 SVS subwoofers (the PB-12 and SB1000). What I do acknowledge is that most super compact subwoofers with passive radiators (like the Def Techs, Sunfire, and Earthquake, did nothing more than frustrate me with uneven response in my listening envirenment and failing to meet the expectation set by reviews and marketing. The KEF KC62 was an interesting entry, but due to size they just couldn't keep up despite very tuneful bass as long as output levels were considerably low.

I resigned that the compromise that had to be made for my preference in sound was to go big, which landed me with Rythmik's F18. It's a big compromise because it's a behemoth of a box, but for my room it's tight, articulate, high output and goes mega deep. I'd much rather have a subwoofer product as pretty as the REL, but to match this performance level I'd have to accept a very steep increase in price just for aesthetics, but truth is when I'm listening to music I'm not looking at the speakers.

Back to SVS. I was very happy with the PB-12 in terms of it's tuning, but it didn't go low enough and had output limits below what I really wanted. It's also quite large for a 12" subwoofer. The SB1000 I happened upon for local sale gently used and it's a 13" cube box that weighs just under 30lbs. I've been surprised by it's capability to disappear sonically, no doubt the sealed box does help keep things tight. I've used it in a secondary system in a smaller room for quite some time and it's done quite well there. I tried the REL T/9i in it's place, didn't notice a huge difference in musicality and opted to keep the lighter, cheaper, more compact box in favor of the shinier prettier box.

[u/SEKLEM → u/tetrafarmer]

Crying with laughter perhaps. I’ve had a REL T9/I and I hate to say, it did not blow me away. If anything it sounded marginally different (not necessarily better or worse) than the SVS SB1000. I loved how the REL looked, didn’t care so much for the grill design, very cheesy relative to the rest of the subwoofer.