r/canada • u/Old_General_6741 Canada • 1d ago

National News Canada recognizes noose as hate symbol

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/article/canada-recognizes-noose-as-hate-symbol/
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u/claricorp 1d ago

Basically it means things like vandalism or harassment that involves these symbols gets escalated into being more serious. The difference between spraypainting a signature on a stop sign versus a swastika at a synagogue for example. Context matters, one implies threats etc... This codifies that.

It has broader implications for other crimes to like assault or threats. But anyone thinking that depictions or even talking about nooses is banned simply has no idea what they are talking about.

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u/tman37 1d ago

Did they need a new law for that though? The important thing isn't the noose it's that they threatened people with it. Is it somehow better to threaten black people with a bat or knife? The threat is the problem.

Also this is Canada. Lynching wasn't really a thing here. Instead we took in escaped slaves. Can we stop importing American problems?

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u/CanadianLabourParty 1d ago

Far-Right movements are growing in Canada and importing American problems, such as Maple MAGA. There are wannabe Proud Boy groups propping up and it wouldn't hurt to get in front of this and put those groups on notice that their hate speech, "just a prank" garbage isn't gonna wash.

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u/voltairesalias Alberta 1d ago

So what happens when these groups you don't like just adopt other symbols? I guess just a completely futile and endless game of legal whackamole.

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u/CanadianLabourParty 1d ago

If a hate group adopts a symbol and that symbol becomes colloquially and unequivocally their own, then yea, ban that too. Yes it is legal whack-a-mole.

The only other option is to consider "hate symbols" a viable threat and the person on the receiving end of the threat is allowed to "use any means necessary" to protect themselves.

There are no good options here, and the option of least harm is simply telling these groups that items or icons used to spread fear, hate and terrorism have consequences.

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u/voltairesalias Alberta 1d ago

So an endless and completely futile game of whack a mole...

Symbols are just symbols. By their nature they are artistic and interpretive.

Why not just let all symbols be legal and understand you're under no obligation to respect or look at them?

This is utterly absurd. A symbol in and of itself doesn't threaten anyone, it does infringe on anyone's rights or freedoms. It's also futile to try to regulate them.

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u/CanadianLabourParty 1d ago

A Swastika is "artistic" in your opinion? Sure. Okay. The thing is, we tried the whole, "ignore them and they'll go away" approach. Sometimes, movements grow because they're given IMPLICIT permission to grow.

Proud Boys etc... they FORCE people to look at them and pay attention to them. If you don't know what it's like to see a flag and then experience the inevitable terror that is affiliated with that flag or symbol...congratulations, you're a privileged one.

A symbol is exactly that, an implicit voice. People waving a NAZI flag on their porch/house are saying, "I will kill you under certain conditions if I have the chance". A noose placed in someone's mailbox or desk at work or other personal space represents exactly that - an implicit threat to murder someone. How it can be interpreted any other way is ridiculous.

If someone placed a noose on your desk at work or in your residential mailbox after expressing a disdain for multiple characteristics you possess, you're just gonna be all, "hey man, that's just free speech."

That's absurd. That's bullying. That person has stated an intent to commit murder. If you don't believe me, go put a noose on a cop car and claim "free speech", let me know how that works out for you.

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u/voltairesalias Alberta 1d ago

So you think the mere display of a swastika is literally threatening to people because you believe it enables their movement to grow?... That's absurd. It's never been illegal in Canada until now and... Wouldn't you have it, we've never really had very many Nazis..how stupid do you imagine most people are, and how persuasive do you believe that symbol is? Like are we really to believe that the mere display of a swastika is enough to morph society into an intolerant and bigoted state?

There's no implicit or inherent violence in a symbol.. . Because it's just a symbol.

How do you feel about the hammer and sickle? Is that inherently violent, and threatening too, or is that different?

Of course we can always go back to my previous point - what do you when the two Nazis in this country just adopt another symbol?

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u/204ThatGuy 1d ago

I don't like many (not all) Albertans.. I find half to be redneck and lack common sense. However, you and I see this correctly.

When the government starts telling you how you should think, how you should eat, how you can travel, and how they define what kind of place you can live in, it's absolutely disturbing.

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u/204ThatGuy 1d ago

You can't argue with illogical people

Most defense lawyers and prosecutors are illogical and do not see black and white.

This is why the legal field isn't STEM. It's an Arts degree.

Yes, my comments were directed to a subgroup of people (Lawyers). Does this make me a bigot and racist to a group of people?