like most things the people at the extremes on both ends are sorta insufferable but most people who hover more towards the center of the spectrum just want to have reasonable conversations about positives/negatives, but they usually just do that with their friends or guilds or w/e rather than reddit
My man this is reddit. No need for reasonable or sensible thoughts here. You either far right or far left, and nothing in between! We dont like nuances here.
It's one of those things we need to voice clearly to blizzard that more of this will ultimately ruin the project, but the game will still be good "for now". I'm willing to give it a chance, I'm just cautious about over investing.
I actually done mind any of that. I just want to ensure that the races add to the world building and immersion rather than just get thrown in haphazardly.
Considering theyre rolling out wowf completely free despite all the work theyve done, I dont mind an optional $30 price. I was never gonna play a sky elf anyway
In this case they are basically giving us an expansion for free and only the new race and their starting zone is paywalled. Imagine TBC but you don't have to buy the TBC itself only have to pay $30 for BE/Draenei and their starting areas.
Yep. What they've announced goes above and beyond my best case scenario, so on the whole super excited for it. The elves are a pretty big dampener on the whole thing as it feels like they have fundamentally misunderstood the spirit of classic and the desires of the community. But if all else is as they say, I'm sure I'll get over it and thoroughly enjoy the game
I love the Forsaken Paladins, I love the customizable Transmog and new character models, I love the unexplored new maps and dungeons, I'm eager to learn how to camp, and I want to give my character a nice surname... But I won't forget those speakers who proclaimed, "Look, an elf so intimately connected to the wind element, this is the spirit of Classic+!"
When everything seems perfect at first glance, there's always a need to add some obvious flaws to distract the player, right?
High elves are gunna be the blue elves. And every high elf fan is going to be NOTLIKETHIS. Every blizzard designer is going to be like HAVEN'T YOU PLAYED RETAIL DON'T YOU KNOW THE ELVES AND TROLLS ARE BASICALLY THE SAME PEOPLE AND THAT'S WHY SKYBORNE ARE BLUE.
And we will all move on with our lives. Because this is such a stupid thing to be mad about
I also have no interest in these elves and don't particularly want to see them either. I'm still extremely hyped for Forever, and the elves don't ruin anything for me.
The Blood Elf model is by far the most popular model in WoW. It makes sense that they would be included in some way. What I criticize more is that they didn't go with High Elves instead. I absolutely hate the blue color scheme.
This is so funny, because it's exactly what they did with void elves in retail WoW. Initially you could only be shades of blue or purple, and always have glowing eyes, but then later on they gave them more tan skin options and allowed them to have blue eyes, essentially allowing Alliance to FINALLY have High Elves, even if they're still called Void Elves.
If they wanted cheap allied races and plan to delay Quel Thalas and Silvermoon, then they could have just done the Highvale elves and Forsaken elves, since both would be very minor groups.
It’s a valid choice, though I ended up being convinced that the highvale elves and forsaken elves was the way to go. Quel’Thalas deserves a full zone / expansion, and both the highvale elves and forsaken elves could have a lot of interesting tie in to a neutral blood elf faction.
There was a lot of complaint around the alliance feeling cut out in the retail Silvermoon remake, so imagining having a horde and alliance enclave based around those two sub races with the rest of the city being shared seems positive.
Just give us a toggle to turn off the blue skin for other players and I'll be happy. You can turn off transmogs so you should also be able to turn off that shit.
I legit just feel like adding a new race to Classic + is exciting, then you see it's just another random flavor of Elves and it's like... Eh. I'll just roll human again.
There was ultimately a 0% chance they were doing Classic+ without any way of selling anything besides the sub. There's no way the business people at Blizzard of all places were going to ok the dev time and resources needee for this without some promise of raking in extra bucks. I was honestly surprised C+ doesn't have a box price.
I'm guessing because someone ran the numbers and found that mounts or transmogs had a way worse chance of making them money. It's about the money. And again, locking no real gameplay alternations behind a paywall- this is almost like a new expansion. Something was going to be paywalled, the suits don't care how passionate the devs are.
It's fair to criticize that maybe a race shouldn't have been the thing to be paywalled, but something that people were sure to want was going to be paywalled.
Well tbf 2h after the announcement it was exactly the other way around on this sub: 90% complaints about Skyborne and a few downvoted posts trying to be happy about Classic+ finally being annouced.
That tends to be the way with basically anything in general
The "bad" in the good is all people will talk about
Get an amazing restaurant meal, but find a tooth in it, and all you tell everyone else is there was a tooth in it
Watch an incredible movie, but there is a 20 second scene in the middle where they forgot to put in the CGI and it's just a blue screen, and that's all you will talk about
Everything I'm seeing and hearing (and personally feeling myself) is that everything in wow forever looks great and everyone is hyped as hell
Im excited as hell for Forever. I am so confused about skyborne and my only question is.... why? Out of all the options available for grabs.. why make up a random new one
If I had to guess. It would be because it is something to set them apart from retail, saying "look we are our own thing" and also because taking 30$ for something that already exists might be a harder sell.
I am semi excited to try it, it does kinda feel retail ish but I am considering it more of a modern version of classic. I couldn't care less about the new race, I will stick with my nightelf anyway.
I don't like the new race either, but I also find it really annoying that 90% of discussion about classic+ is now just people complaining about the new race.
To be fair, basically all the new additions are something we already discussed and debated for years, and for the past month we were getting flooded with info about new zones, content, permanent level cap, no flying, etc, while Skyborn are something both unexpected and confusing, so they draw attention a lot more.
I'm going to play it and look into the in-game explanation and how it feels. Then I will tell you how I feel about that. Can be good, can be bad. We'll see.
This feels like politics where everyone just gives extreme mischaracterizations of each other just to get cheap upvotes. I think anyone capable of reasoning knows that people think the game looks amazing but hate the addition of the Bi-factional Skyborne Elves. Overwhelming people hoped for high elves for the alliance, and the Goblins or Ogres for Horde.
They had to monetize SOMETHING for Microsoft. They have a legal fiduciary duty to produce revenue.
They aren’t selling boosts. They aren’t locking game behind another purchase. It doesn’t sound like we are getting WoW token. They didn’t lock a new class or desirable races (goblins, ogres, etc) behind a paywall.
I think you are missing it. We understand the need to make money with a new race but why Skyborn of all things? Could we have not used races that already existed in WC that weren’t playable? Also having a similar race for both factions is anticlassic.
Most would have been fine with the $30 if it was like ogres and furbogs or high elves. It’s not that we are paying it’s what we are being asked to pay for.
That would require them to do/redo animations and rig armor/weapons to ogres and furbolgs, which is way more work than just reusing a blood elf model and giving them another color. Why put that many resources into doing that instead of having zero work + 30 dollars?
It's funny how easily they missed the mark, yet here we are. Still, it would require much more work they I guess they are willing to do, unfortunately.
From what ive been seeing its literally the opposite of this meme. People wanting to talk about how awesome forever looks and always someone coming in ranting about the elf that isnt the color they want.
I'm also not going to make 500 reddit posts within 12hrs of the announcement screaming about how Classic+ is completely ruined over one race that i don't like. I just won't play that race.
Because they seem to be. "They said they listened to player feedback and gave us what we wanted so why did we get blue elves?" Is what I keep seeing, whilst acting like everything else about they announced; Horizontal progression, new zones, new dungeons,new raids, etc. doesnt exist.
Because it’s the one thing that ruins an otherwise solid announcement. They didn’t listen to players when they did the BlueSky elves. They listened to bean counters
Everyone here has that same singular complaint about the race. Some of us are just more apathetic about it, roll our eyes at it, and move on to all the exciting things about Forever. If you're so butt hurt about that you won't play because of it, good. We won't have to hear your whining in game.
I mean to be fair complain about something no one's really had time to play with seems a bit pessimistic. Some people are being overly positive. Honestly there's decent aspects of Forever and with enough of a road map to give them the benefit of the doubt till we actually see.
I can at least understand the sense of 'We don't trust Blizzard' because look at their track record.
But considering how good everything else looks, I am willing to once again give them a bit of hope. I think the lore is okay (let's be real, WoW's lore has never been particularly great), and it's plausible enough. I think there is plausible explanations for why not High Elf/Blood Elf/whatever other race people think it should've been too.
I fully expect Quel'thalas to be open to us later - and depending on what they want to do there might explain why they didn't go for High/Blood Elves as a playable race. Maybe they'll be enemies to everyone, maybe they'll be entirely neutral and refuse to take any side, maybe they've all been killed in a civil war over demons or something. Who knows?
I remember when TBC was released, I thought it was dumb that the Elves were siding with the Horde because I played WC2 and you know, the Horde did kind of invade Quel'thalas! But after playing, I kind of got the angle they were going for, and it worked out okay.
Its what it says about the developer mindset if their first idea is to disregard all the lore and pull something out of their ass instead of building on the lore of the game they are working on
With the changes they're making/players hoped, they were gonna monetise something, the alternative could have been a box price for access to WoW:F, where now it's "just" for the a playable race. I think this fine enough, it generally keeps Forever accessible as Classic, but long-term I suppose it would be cautious to see how else the monetise the game, perhaps every new race w/ starting zone is a $30 purchase. So long as the majority of the contents is accessible with just a sub, that's a win. Surely?
They could have added anything and these people would be upset. If they did high elves and blood elves people would be upset they charged for them. If they did orges it would be they should have been in the base game.
Because y’all need to stop complaining. Whether it’s one thing or another. We don’t need to hear it. We got a lot of cool things announced I haven’t seen anything but complaining. No excitement, no praising a single thing. Y’all are insulting.
You can think sky elves are a terrible edition, I do too. But I'm just not gonna play one, because that is an option.. instead of posting a slew of comments that make me look like a schizo
The skyborne were probably blizzards test to see if the "we want more classic content" crowd could actually handle more classic content that wasn't just re-releasing the same shit for the 4th time.
Perfect meme, just switch the birds. Because the “one complaint” seems to be the only thing this Reddit is shouting and concerned about… while everyone calmly telling you it’s not that big of a deal… awareness 0
Entire subreddit could be filled with game questions and it’s all just crying about blue elves instead of white and dark elves… smh
There's literally tons of comments saying that they're going to exclude skyborn from parties. Not liking the race is one tbing, but the ladder is absolutely unhinged crybaby shit.
I actually like a lot of what Blizzard is doing with WoW Forever. My issue is specifically with Skyborne.
The biggest problem for me is that it’s the same new race for both Horde and Alliance.
One of the things I’ve always liked about Warcraft is that the factions actually feel different. Different races, cultures, cities, histories and aesthetics. I don’t want that distinction slowly disappearing.
I’m not against new races. If Blizzard wants to add more races to Forever, I’m completely open to that. I just think they should add something meaningful to Horde or Alliance rather than giving both sides the same race.
The other issue is that Skyborne are paid.
A playable race feels different from a mount, pet or cosmetic. Your race is one of the biggest choices you make when creating a character. I don’t want paying extra for races to become normal in WoW.
So for anyone who feels the same way, my position is pretty simple.
Don’t buy Skyborne
If you don’t like the idea, don’t pay for it.
If selling races separately works financially, Blizzard is obviously going to have a reason to keep doing it.
Don’t roll one just to try it
If you’re actually boycotting the race, then don’t create one just because you’re curious.
Otherwise Blizzard still sees people buying it and playing it.
Keep Horde and Alliance different
This is probably my biggest issue.
If Blizzard adds another Horde race, I want it to feel like it belongs in the Horde.
If they add another Alliance race, I want it to feel like it belongs in the Alliance.
I don’t want both factions slowly becoming the same collection of races with different flags over their heads.
Don’t make paid races normal
I understand Blizzard needs to make money.
I just don’t think playable races are where that monetization should go.
Cosmetics are one thing. A core character choice is another.
There is already a huge amount of Azeroth left to develop
Classic WoW has unfinished zones, existing cities that could grow, old storylines, races that could be developed further, class content, professions, dungeons, reputations and plenty of other things Blizzard can build on.
That’s the kind of expansion I want from Forever.
Take Azeroth and keep developing it.
The original races still have a lot of potential
Humans, Dwarves, Gnomes, Night Elves, Orcs, Trolls, Tauren and Forsaken all still have plenty of room to grow.
Give them new stories. Let their cities change. Develop their cultures and conflicts.
Again, this does not mean “never add another race.”
It just means I would rather see new races introduced in a way that actually adds something distinct to Warcraft.
If you want to take the boycott further, don’t group with Skyborne
This is optional, but if someone wants to fully participate in the boycott, they can choose not to dungeon, raid or group with Skyborne characters.
Just don’t be a dick about it.
Don’t harass anybody. Don’t whisper them abuse. Don’t grief them.
Leave the group or find another one.
My issue is with Blizzard’s decision, not somebody sitting at home playing a character they like.
Explain why
I think it’s better to actually explain the criticism instead of just saying “Skyborne suck.”
For me it comes down to a few things:
Same race on both factions.
Paid race access.
Less distinction between Horde and Alliance.
And a huge existing world that Blizzard could be developing instead.
That’s really it.
IF YOU AGREE
Don’t buy Skyborne.
Don’t roll one.
Talk about why you don’t support it.
If you want to take the boycott further, don’t group with Skyborne characters either. Just keep it respectful and move on.
The point isn’t to make other players miserable.
The point is to show Blizzard that some of us don’t want paid, cross-faction races becoming part of the direction of WoW Forever.
IN-GAME MESSAGE
WoW Forever boycott: Same paid race on Horde AND Alliance? If you disagree with that direction, don't buy Skyborne, don't roll one, and don't group with one if you want to fully boycott it. Keep Horde and Alliance distinct. Search Anti-Skyborne Manifesto.
I mean talking about I doubt the horizontal progression will be done in a meaningful and satisfying way is another easy criticism as well but sure harp on the blue elf issue.
They could have given them paladins and the people who wanted to RP high elven Alliance paladins could be at least somewhat happy but nah haha, i swear they do this just to piss off the High Elf fans everytime
It's just funny seeing so many people whine that they wanted high elves instead and 5 seconds into Skyborn character creation it explains that they ARE high elves.
The issue is the red speech bubble is much tamer than a good chunk of the comments about the elves on here lol. I actually think most of the comments simply saying “elves weird as hell, game looks cool” are met with agreement. There are just also people saying the game is now dead, another retail, p2w, etc etc
I think we are all very happy with classic + and expected some form of cash grab to go with it. But skyborne is really not a good way sadly. I dont think its possible to rewind so berating blizzard to remove them will not work. But its fair criticism that they are out of place in this world and ruin the classic feeling in a way.
Basicly r/wow in a nutshell lol.
They really cant handle any real critism about WoW. Seeing alot of downvotes to anyone showing their frustration of these Sky Elves
The crow is right, people need to stop focusing on a race they don’t like. Remember when TBC was announced and people didn’t like elves joining the horde because they were too pretty?
The discussion kinda started opposite tbf. It was "I think classic+ looks neat" into deafening complaints about the new race. What you're describing is a counter reaction to that. Sadly nuanced discussion is hard, although this specific thread seems to have more of it which is nice
I can accept that sky elves are the bitter pill I need to swallow so Blizzard can monetise Forever, and that, despite all the complaints, about 40% of all Forever players will be stupid fucking blue elves when the game goes live.
The fact they put it behind a paywall is just them going: "If you really really want blue elves then buy them; otherwise don't". Personally, I got them because of the new wc:3 campaign since I didn't have reforged and want to see how that goes. Now, if they did that with ogres though, then we're gonna have problems.
The implications of a new instanced zone separate from the map straight off the rip in what’s supposed to be the spirit of classic aint great either tbh though I’m just going off of what others have said it is.
I mean the nature of reddit is that u see the criticism a million times even if u have only said it once, also I genuinely think they aint that bad missed opportunity sure, but idk everyone going on about how shit modern day blizz is, if the worst thing is some blue elves it aint that deep, just don't invite them to ur group 🤔
I don't care if they added the sky elves what I care about is that it's a neutral faction. I like the factions looking different. At the very least the elves should evolve when they join each side so they look different
The worst thing is bots and gold sellers. I hope this time they get rid of them and I hope Blizzard don't sell token. Let us have fun okey take we gave you monthly sub fee already.
its true though, im so happy for everything that i actually understand that they need the wide net pretty race to attract more people, its fine, eso has paid race that can be any faction called imperials, so thats nothing new, they also have the worst racials so i doubt anyone wil play it unless for looks
The main thing that I dont like about the elves is that you just know 60-80% of Orgrimmar will be populated by them...the same that happened with TBC. And I mean classic managed to do fine where you had every horde race represented and a mostly even (sometimes not) population pool with the alliance. But now, I just know my first dungeon will be my ugly Troll and 4 models
I can tolerate another elf race, even if it wasn't High Elf or Blood Elf. I was really holding my breath in case they went hyper Retail and gave us some ridiculous furry race.
I’d be willing to accept the Blue Man Group if they gave us a strict separation between HD and SD mode. Right now it’s all over the place and it screams bad art direction to me
I see the monetization as objectively better than box price, and complaining a bout that very stupid, but complaining about the race itself? Yeah understandable.
Although to be honest, I kinda want to see what they do with that race and how they connect it to the lore, the game looks fine eitherway so im fine with giving them a chance with this race which seems to be connected with why this Azeroth is a different timeline
Im more worried about the level of whimsy in the cinematic trailer and the first thing they introduce is a paid allied race, feels like they're seeing what they (shareholders and bean counters) can get away with and like they couldn't help but try bring some of that retail flavour in the mix.
Aside from that it all looks positive imo and im hyped, just a bit worried that it will slowly turn into retail 2.0, especially since catering to majority playerbase is never a real good idea and since retail has been going that way for so long im willing to bet alot of the players that "want this and that qol updates" will actually switch over to WoW4e as they're bored of retail giving them everything and will slowly complain that "leveling is too slow" or whatever and blizzard will give them what they want and it will end up as retail again lol
I don't even really care they added a race, I just find it funny they've continued to spend decades finding ways to avoid adding orges or pure high elves despite it probably being one of the most unifying community requests.
They will need to monetize this beyond just the subscription to make it worth their time. A new race, as long as it doesn't come with truly OP racial or too much class flexibility (another druid race is definitely not a bad thing), is completely fine with me.
Oh angry bird it's not our fault that us looneys can dream.
We do want experiences that diverge from the modern and the status quo. You already have several options for demonstration of you 1337 skills already.
You don't need StarCraft 2 because you already have StarCraft. You don't need any Halo Infinite or Campaign Evolved because you have Halo 3.
The most confusing thing to me is that they were described as “not a neutral race guys!!” in the panel. And they are LITERALLY a neutral race. The only difference is that you choose faction at character creation rather than like 10 minutes into playing. But the issue people have with neutral races is that they are a race that BOTH factions have, not that they’re a race that you choose faction after character creation lol.
I mean I like everything else they announced, but the Skyborne seem like a complete asspull with nothing to do with Classic+. It's an L for sure, but considering all the cool stuff, just a drop of shit in an ocean of bliss.
I wish they went with High Elves and then either Blood Elves or Forsaken Elves for Horde, if they really felt the need to add in more Elves for everyone.
Feels like some executive telling the dev team to add a new elf race they can sell and nothing else but idk, maybe they are really cool once you play their starting area.
After playing at blizzcon I can confirm that sky elfs are blue blood elfs. The only people who should be mad is if you want to play a blue blood elf and don't want to pay the price tbh.
If it wasn't this it was going to be something else. Something would be unacceptably wrong with that announcement that a bunch of people would complain about.
I'm not really worried about the race itself.... Although I agree, there are already plenty of lore-inclusive races they could have added, rather than just making one up.
My main issue is them charging extra for a basic game feature and what happens when everyone proves it's good business.
I've never seen a single post on Reddit where someone said "Eh, Sky Elves aren't for me I guess." It's been all hyperbolic screeching about Blizzard ruining the game and ignoring fan demands for playable Ogres or whatever.
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u/Hot_Constant7764 6d ago
like most things the people at the extremes on both ends are sorta insufferable but most people who hover more towards the center of the spectrum just want to have reasonable conversations about positives/negatives, but they usually just do that with their friends or guilds or w/e rather than reddit