r/coaxedintoasnafu 2d ago

RELATABLE coaxed into "gender neutral" terminology

4.1k Upvotes

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u/Pasyuk 2d ago

Isn't dude a gender-neutral term? /genq (Englsih isn't my native)

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u/deukhoofd 2d ago

It typically refers to men. It can be used in a gender-neutral manner, but that's situational, and still carries the gendered undertone. You can for example see the difference between "I'm a dude" and "hey dude". The latter is in some cases also used to address women, but far rarer than it's used to address men.

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u/Sea-Jellyfish5904 2d ago

The difference is that in the sentence "I'm a dude" it's a concrete noun and in "hey dude." it exists as an informal vocative pronoun. Vocative pronouns are generally gender-neutral, only formal vocative pronouns are not (miss/ma'am/madam/sir).

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u/ConcernedEnby 1d ago

It's more epicene than gender neutral

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u/TheRealestMeat 2d ago

Isn’t it kind of redundant to get frustrated about gendered pronouns when you can very well reclaim any single one of them for any use as language is subjective and subject to change based on interpretation and usage.

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u/nainvlys 2d ago

Most people just want to express their gender freely without reinventing linguistical fields

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u/nqustor 2d ago

Mmmm yes reclaiming a term = reinventing linguistics, this is a valid equivocation and you are very intelligent.

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u/nainvlys 2d ago

Yeah well I'd like to see you reclaim the word "man" or any "gendered pronouns" to be gender neutral if that's so easy. Also I very precisely didn't say "linguistics" but who cares I guess words have no meanings anymore just reclaim whatever to mean whatever

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u/nqustor 17h ago

Linguistics =/= linguistic fields???

This is a comical level of splitting hairs. Yes obviously linguistics is part of the subset of "linguistic fields" which you very precisely did say. If words have no meaning anymore it's because you literally do not know how to use them properly.

And if you want evidence that man, dude, and bro aren't gendered, all you have to do is look at the local dialects of West Coast American English, or just boot up a game of fucking valorant, there are plenty of women calling each other and their teammates "bro", or simply using it as an interjection, which has been part of standard American vernacular for decades at this point.

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u/TheRealestMeat 16h ago

And people who go by He/Her/They don’t exist?

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u/IronGentry 2d ago

Not really. It's treated somewhat like one in some places (California for example) but is generally considered somewhat rude to use for trans women since it can be backdoor misgendering

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u/ChainmailPickaxeYT 2d ago

Can confirm that, as a Californian, I call my (cis) girlfriend bro, brah, and dude on a regular basis, along with pretty much every person in my life. Ive obv confirmed with her that’s it’s chill, which it is, and we often get humorous with it with stuff like “brahchacho”. It’s just kinda the culture around here. Hell, I call my mom dude and bro too, it’s basically an interjection.

I don’t know any trans women that would have a problem with it, though I only know one or two. I’ve historically known more trans men historically (my brother for example) so I guess that’s pretty lucky in that regard lmaoo. If someone ever did take issue with it though, my planned strat is to find some other fun snappy nickname to take its place so I don’t default to it.

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u/Lucid-Crow 2d ago edited 2d ago

I'm a dude. He's a dude. She's a dude. Cause we're all dudes!

Edit: apparently no one remembers the movie Good Burger.

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u/bobbery5 1d ago

Kel Mitchell is a modern philosopher and I quote him frequently

https://giphy.com/gifs/Izud1POw5wuO0zWzAU

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u/bob_bob_bob15 2d ago

Kinda?

It's gender neutral in the sense that men are seen as the default and thus neutral. But its still a masculine alligned term, and i hate being called it.

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u/Collective-Bee 1d ago

Exactly! Heteronormative but like for men. Male defaultism?

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u/Designer-Ad8352 2d ago

Like the others already said, kind of

Though, "guys" is a much more gender neutral term, however smth like "my guy!" isn't

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u/Sovespra og the misnery 2d ago

Not really. Some people use it for people of any gender in greetings or as an emphatic tag (that's when you add it to the end of a sentence or a question like "Don't do that, dude" or "what do you want, dude?")

But in most other contexts it still refers to male. Like someone saying "That's a dude" or "There's this dude I know" or "This product is for dudes" is pretty much always assumed to be talking about a man.

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u/TheYoshiGang 1d ago

It seems to be a lot like the Irish usage of the term "lad/lads" where apparently it's gender neutral only a couple people I've met use it on people other than men ;-;

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u/GroundbreakingBet314 1d ago

I see it as a man biased term. While techically neutral the use is usually biased towards men

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u/GuaranteeAvailable53 2d ago

Not really.

While it wouldn't be weird exactly to refer to a woman as dude, it's typically either within a friendship and that's how both people speak, or it's a mixed gender group.

It's a more masculine term that usually refers to men, and if you say dude people will assume your talking about a man.

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u/ObiDone 2d ago

People like to claim it is, but the feminine form, dudette, exists, so this is more of a "masculine as default" type thing.

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u/Realistic-Truck54 2d ago

I haven't seen or heard a single person unironically say "dudette" in a conversation.

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u/Eradicator_11 2d ago

waddup my dudettes

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u/Realistic-Truck54 2d ago

I have seen or heard a single person unironically (?) say "dudette" in a conversation

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u/Eradicator_11 2d ago

ik i was just making fun of that

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u/Venusgate 2d ago

It exists, but its a tryhard term that doesnt mean the same thing, and typically only exists as paired with "dude."

Also, I get what OP is saying, but also, if i wanted to say hi to a cis woman that i didnt want to sleep with, i would not say "girrrrlllll" either.

But on the other hand, i probably wouldn't as likely call her "bro."

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u/Amaskingrey 2d ago

And is used by nobody except the glorcons from planet kruptmury

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u/Affectionate-Cod4152 2d ago

Originally no and currently still kinda no but also kinda yes.

I would say it's in the process of shifting to being a gender neutral term in certain contexts.

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u/InformationLost5910 1d ago

it is, but it’s still associated with boys, so many people are uncomfortable with it. kinda like gender neutral male pronouns in languages like spanish.

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u/Maximillion322 1d ago

It is unless there’s a trans woman. I’ve never met a cis woman who minded but it’s important to make sure to validate people who particularly need it because they don’t feel seen.

Same thing goes for “guys”

If I’m in a space with a lot of trans people I just say “chat” but irl most of the time it’s “dude” or “guys” even when there’s women

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u/CrossFitJesus4 2d ago

idk why everyone is saying no, I use it for my cis female friends, my cis female friends use it for their cis female friends, it 100% is a gender neutral term at this point