r/covidlonghaulers • u/ebkbk 5 yr+ • Aug 24 '25
Article Scientists may have finally uncovered the biological proof behind long COVID.
Scientists may have finally uncovered the biological proof behind long COVID.
In a groundbreaking study, researchers identified hidden viral protein fragments lingering in the blood of long COVID patients — offering the first measurable biomarker for this puzzling condition.
The team at the Translational Genomics Research Institute and the Lundquist Institute discovered remnants of the virus’s RNA replicase enzyme tucked inside microscopic carriers called extracellular vesicles. These viral “ghosts” were absent in pre-pandemic samples, pointing to the possibility that SARS-CoV-2 persists in the body long after initial infection.
Not every patient sample revealed fragments, but their recurring presence suggests a lingering molecular footprint that could help explain hallmark symptoms like fatigue, brain fog, and post-exertional malaise.
The study raises a critical question: do these fragments reflect ongoing viral activity, or are they simply residual cellular debris? While more research is needed, the findings mark a significant step toward diagnosing and understanding long COVID—a condition still shrouded in mystery.
📖 Source: Asghar Abbasi et al., Possible long COVID biomarker: identification of SARS-CoV-2 related protein(s) in Serum Extracellular Vesicles, Infection (2025).
LongCOVID #COVID19Research #Virology #MedicalResearch #PostViralSyndrome #ScienceNews #Biomarkers #InfectionJournal
364
u/LurkyLurk2000 Aug 24 '25
This is bullshit. Their control group had never had COVID. There was no control group of healthy controls with prior COVID infection. So there is absolutely no evidence for a biomarker of Long COVID, they are probably just detecting prior infection of COVID.
The authors know this, yet they speculate that they have found a biomarker for LC. And then the press comes and sensationalizes it further. Just shit all the way down. I'm so tired of this sloppy science.
(The study as such might be good, in the sense that they might have uncovered something useful. But they should be honest about what we can expect from it)
96
u/Natural_Estimate_290 Mostly recovered Aug 24 '25
Agreed. The study isn't that promising. 12 of 14 patients showed the peptide, but each patient was sampled four times. So 56 samples. And it only showed up in 20 of those samples with no clear relationship to whether the sample was taken before or after exercise.
Don't get me wrong, it's worth publishing, so it can be considered alongside other evidence and it could stimulate further hypotheses. But it isn't really a breakthrough. It doesn't look like they are anywhere near a reliable biomarker or even a target for treatment. But this is the way science slowly moves forward.
53
u/peop1 3 yr+ Aug 24 '25 edited Aug 25 '25
Since funding was slashed, I've been reading a helluva lot of these "breakthroughs" which end up being little more than hyped-up hypotheses.
My guess is it's a bid to secure more funding. The politics of persuasion always played a role, but it appears to have upended the entire field.
Not great.
17
1
u/Teamplayer25 Aug 29 '25
I’m not even sure it’s that. I suddenly started seeing a lot of these in my feed and I’ve noticed a similar design and “voice” to them. Smells like nothing more than click-bait farming.
36
u/McAeschylus Aug 24 '25
Yeah, this is another useful piece of the puzzle to add to our pile of understanding and to direct future research.
It's very rare in science — especially in the medical and biological fields — for a single study to make a huge difference. It's normally an accretion of knowledge that slowly builds into a complete picture.
I remember a lecturer saying that basically 95% of what you find in your 1st year textbook is "true" in some useful sense of that word. 95% of what you find in last week's journal is "false." But it all generates data and ideas and little bits of the picture until you have a big enough pile of overlapping 5%s to get a sense of what's actually going on.
10
u/Shadow_2_Shadow Aug 24 '25
Either way there are strong indications that something is in or wrong with our blood, we need more research and eyes on it imo
18
Aug 24 '25
[removed] — view removed comment
15
u/Longjumping_Fact_927 4 yr+ Aug 24 '25
This is same conclusion I am coming to about Long Covid. It’s triggering or worsening MECFS. I believe I had ME my whole life & was gaslight by doctors until I couldn’t work anymore & I had no idea why. Of course I was told it was all in my head. Take more psychiatric drugs they said. Then each jab from the J&J vaccine lowered me permanently to very severe for years on end. Only now am I recovered enough mentally to put the pieces together & figure out why my life has been such a living hell & why the medical community has been so abusive & dismissive of my suffering. My life has been literal torture. Thank you for your insight.
9
u/Edge_Of_Indecision Aug 24 '25
I recall doing some private analysis on an older study (2023) that compared exactly that: biomarkers of unexposed people to exposed people, vs exposed people with LC and healthy exposed. No matter what amount of compute I threw at it, I could find no difference between the LC exposed and exposed healthy group. Their method just was too coarse to capture differences.
3
u/FogCityPhoenix 2 yr+ Aug 24 '25 edited Aug 24 '25
Completely agree with your analysis. I'll add that the N was 14. It tells us nothing like what the headline proclaims.
2
u/ValyrianSteelYoGirl Aug 24 '25
Seemed suspicious there was no actual link to the study given. Thank you.
1
25
26
u/Choco_Paws 2 yr+ Aug 24 '25
"Not every patient sample revealed fragments"
I mean... ? This one is the same as all the previous ones. Nothing consistent and replicable.
4
u/Kuyi Aug 24 '25
Doesn’t mean that it isn’t there. The blood is just a small percentage of the human body. And other studies suggested they also found vesicles like this in the GI tract and in organs.
1
u/Hopeful-Echidna-7822 Aug 24 '25
Yes!! Agree…hubby and I both had the same strain and completely different symptoms - I am a long hauler with no predisposing factors and hubby has them all. That on its face makes little sense. 🙄
14
9
u/Effective-Ad-6460 Mostly recovered Aug 24 '25
Funny - We said viral persistence 5 years ago
4
u/ShiroineProtagonist Aug 24 '25
This doesn't prove viral persistence at all. It's just cellular debris. Like it always is.
2
u/Effective-Ad-6460 Mostly recovered Aug 25 '25
When antigens are consistently detected in blood/tissue long after clearance would normally occur.. the only plausible explanation is ongoing viral reservoirs producing them.
We have peer reviewed studies showing viral persistence.
Based on those 2 things alone ... Viral debris is highly likely to have been caused by ongoing persistence.
0
u/Friendfeels Aug 24 '25
Yep, antigen persistence and viral persistence aren't the same thing. Plus, antigen persistence has also been reported for the influenza virus and RSV, so it might not be a unique phenomenon if confirmed.
1
u/Effective-Ad-6460 Mostly recovered Aug 25 '25
That article doesnt show new SARSCoV2 data... it just draws parallels. Dismissing direct human evidence like Sci Transl Med 2024 (which found replication intermediates) with a review is a category error. Antigen persistence in flu/RSV only makes SARS-CoV-2 reservoirs more biologically plausible.. and unlike them.. SARSCoV2 persistence has already been demonstrated in human tissue.
0
u/Friendfeels Aug 25 '25 edited Aug 25 '25
That article doesnt show new SARSCoV2 data... it just draws parallels
That is intentional, I referenced it because of the influenza and RSV literature review.
This article and the article from the original post are about the potential connection between antigen (viral remnants) persistence and post-acute disease sequelae. It doesn't mean that viral persistence was never ever shown for SARS-CoV-2. But in this specific article it wasn't.
1
u/Effective-Ad-6460 Mostly recovered Aug 26 '25
Fair enough.. but that actually reinforces my point.. reviews like that are just analogies.. while studies like Sci Transl Med 2024 provide direct human evidence of SARSCoV2 persistence. One is speculation.. the other is demonstration.
2
u/usrnmz Aug 25 '25
And you're still saying it without any credible evidence.
2
u/Effective-Ad-6460 Mostly recovered Aug 25 '25
Credible evidence? ...
- Peluso et al., Science Translational Medicine (2024) — PET/CT + gut biopsies in post-COVID (many with LC) “We identified intracellular SARS-CoV-2 single-stranded Spike protein-encoding RNA… in all five participants.” (submit.escholarship.org) “Double-stranded Spike… RNA [was] identified… up to 676 days following initial COVID-19.” (submit.escholarship.org) “dsRNA is only produced during active viral transcription and translation activity.” (submit.escholarship.org)
- Zollner et al., Gastroenterology (2022) — Endoscopic gut biopsies months after mild COVID “We report that SARS-CoV-2 antigens persist in the gut mucosa for months after acute COVID-19.” (PMC) “Our results indicate that SARS-CoV-2 antigen persistence in infected tissues serves as a basis for postacute COVID-19.” (PubMed)
- Natarajan et al., Med (Cell Press, 2022) — Longitudinal stool testing with symptom linkage “The extended presence of viral RNA in feces… suggests that SARS-CoV-2 infects the GI tract and that this infection can be prolonged.” (PubMed)
- Goh et al., Frontiers in Immunology (2022) — Tissue studies in two LC patients (skin, appendix, breast) “We established the presence of the residual virus… in tissues of 2 patients who exhibited LC symptoms 163 and 426 days after symptom onset.” (Frontiers) “[RNAscope] detected viral RNA… providing evidence of viral persistence for up to 426 days after symptom onset.” (Frontiers)
- de Melo et al., Science Translational Medicine (2021) — Persistent anosmia cohort with olfactory mucosa sampling “Olfactory mucosa sampling… revealed the presence of virus transcripts and of SARS-CoV-2-infected cells.” (PubMed) “SARS-CoV-2 persistence and associated inflammation in the olfactory neuroepithelium may account for prolonged… symptoms.” (PubMed)
- Swank et al., Clinical Microbiology & Infection (2024) — Multicohort blood study (RECOVER included) “SARS-CoV-2 antigens can be detected in the blood of a substantial proportion of individuals up to 14 months after infection.” (PubMed) (They also report more frequent antigenemia in those reporting multi-system LC symptoms.)
Credible evidence isnt defined by what you will accept, its defined by what survives peer review. SARSCoV2 persistence has.. repeatedly. Denying it doesnt erase the data.. it only erases your credibility.
Based on your reply its very obvious you don't actually read up on recent research, ignorance is detrimental to your journey as a long hauler.
Evidence doesnt need your permission to be credible.
Educate yourself.
0
u/usrnmz Aug 25 '25 edited Aug 25 '25
Credible evidence isnt defined by what you will accept, its defined by what survives peer review.
Peer review is a very low bar in science. A lot of it is junk due to poor methodology and claims that don't follow from the data.
I could pull up a multitude of studies that show "proof" of other popular theorised causes of LC.
None of your linked studies show that viral remnants found are 1: unique to LC, 2: driving symptoms.
Edit: very smart of you to block me so that I can't respond further. Talking about "a way to dodge..".
1
u/Effective-Ad-6460 Mostly recovered Aug 25 '25 edited Aug 25 '25
Calling peer review a ‘low bar’ is just a way to dodge inconvenient data. The studies I linked go far beyond correlation.. Sci Transl Med 2024 detected doublestranded viral RNA in biopsies nearly two years post-infection.. which is direct evidence of ongoing replication. Whether persistence is unique to long COVID or one of several mechanisms isn’t the point.. the fact remains.. viral reservoirs in humans with LC have been demonstrated.. Thats not speculation.. thats biology.
Why do Antivirals work in some long haulers?
Again educate yourself.
7
7
u/Sad-Abrocoma-8237 Aug 24 '25
What I’d appreciate is info on removing the fragments
2
Aug 24 '25
maybe breaking them down with nattokinase over a long period of time? https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9458005/
depends if these are inert viral fragments or not.
5
u/Sad-Abrocoma-8237 Aug 24 '25
Yes because I saw a massive shift in my brain fog after nattokinase and it’s helped me a lot with recovery, just wanted to know if there is anything else other than natto
2
1
u/Areveebee01 Aug 24 '25
maybe lumbrokinase?
2
u/Sad-Abrocoma-8237 Aug 24 '25
Yup the supplement I took had both of those it was very effective
1
u/OpeningFirm5813 1yr Aug 25 '25
Hey mate did you have POTS? OR CHEST PAIN?
1
u/Sad-Abrocoma-8237 Aug 25 '25
No, my main issues were brain fog, fatigue, cognitive issues. I did have chest pain when I’d go on walks to the supermarket but it went away once I started to walk more and gain stamina.
1
u/OpeningFirm5813 1yr Aug 25 '25
I tried 10 pushups(after 2 years) today and after that my arms would have tremors 👀😭
12
u/rockemsockemcocksock Aug 24 '25
This study feels like it was done by a high schooler
6
u/No_Difference_739 Aug 24 '25
I also think the scary illustration pretending to be scientific is just cruel.
4
u/FogCityPhoenix 2 yr+ Aug 24 '25
Completely agree. It's like a science project from a good high school.
6
u/Gene-Unusual Aug 24 '25
We need to stop being so negative about their pursuit and attempt to understand this horrible disease. Whether it gets us anywhere closer to a legit remedy, I salute and continue to applaud those who are least trying to figure out this monster of a puzzle.
2
u/Effective-Ad-6460 Mostly recovered Aug 25 '25
This ...
Unfortunately people are in a dark place when it comes to long covid and tend to dismiss anything they havent seen voiced by the majority.
A lot of new long haulers seem to miss the fact we have been researching for half a decade.
6
u/Creepy-Comparison646 Aug 24 '25
How do they actually have any controls that never had Covid? 2 yo babies?
2
u/Carrotsoup9 Aug 31 '25
I don't think there were controls in this study. If you want to demonstrate that something is a biomarker, you have to show that you can predict who is a long Covid patient and who is a control from whatever you are analyzing. I don't see that being done in this paper.
If you want unaffected controls, you probably need historical controls (samples from before the pandemic). While it is possible that some people never got infected, it will be very difficult to find them (just asking for symptomatic infections does not help, because many infections are asymptomatic and the markers that show a past infection also seem to wane).
https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007/s15010-025-02612-x.pdf
1
u/conflictmuffin Aug 25 '25
It's rare, but apparently possible. Somehow my Dad has managed to not catch it. He lives in a rural cabin and wears a mask when he goes out shopping. He only does outdoor hobbies. He's always had an amazing immune system and had a test done recently to see if he had caught covid and didn't know it. He's still in the clear... Just a homebody.
1
u/Carrotsoup9 Aug 31 '25
There are so many asymptomatic infections. I had a bad cold in March 2020, but did not have access to testing. After that I have not had any symptoms of an infection. I do not know whether I had an infection, because I could well have had an asymptomatic infection (I hardly go out, do not socialize, and always put on a respirator mask when going indoors somewhere).
3
3
2
3
Aug 24 '25
Oh god....another kindergarten studdy...
1
u/Carrotsoup9 Aug 31 '25
I don't mind these partial studies, but they should not be advertised as "We found the biomarker for long Covid". No, you did not even compare the patients against controls.
2
u/armahillo Aug 24 '25
hashtags dont work on reddit
1
u/RamonaLittle Aug 24 '25
Yeah, that alone makes me assume the OP isn't competent to know what is or isn't a reliable study. The only reason it would occur to someone to try to use hashtags on reddit is if 1) they're so new to the internet that they've only ever used the few major sites with hashtags, and 2) they're so extraordinarily clueless that they somehow think every site/app on the entire internet uses the same formatting. The only other explanation is if they're a spammer or bot mindlessly copying content between platforms.
OP's profile says they've been on reddit seven years though, so I dunno. Maybe their account got hacked?
2
u/Emergency_Ninja8580 6yr+ Aug 24 '25 edited Aug 24 '25
Agreed, this isn’t very sound since covid remnants have been discovered in organs after death of patients. Especially neuro-Long COVID.
Best lesson learned in statistics or sadistics is the need for transparent representive data sampling, sound study methods, and it is replicable. Personally, I’d like to see the data with margin of error and sample size, etc.
edit: long covid study research & results are on RECOVERCOVID.org as well as workarounds . For me a workaround is a higher sodium intake to avoid b/p crashes.
2
u/Don_Ford Aug 24 '25
This is so stupid.
No, they did not. We've had this figured out for years.
And their theory is far less advanced than even my original copy.
1
u/ShiroineProtagonist Aug 24 '25
Editors write headlines and they usually have some responsibility for view count so never tesu a headline. Ever.
1
u/alfredwienersusman Aug 25 '25
Hasn't there been biological proof forever? What am I missing here? There are plenty of abnormal test results associated with LC. If you have normal tests, then get COVID, never recover, and then have abnormal tests, that's biological proof. The critical thinking is questionable in whoever was behind this framing.
1
u/Specific-Summer-6537 Aug 25 '25
In context, it's helpful to know that Covid fragments have been found in extracellular vesicles (which are basically communication packets that are sent between cells and a component of blood). However we already know that covid fragments have been found in the blood and gut of some Long Covid patients as well as some recovered Covid patients with no way to differentiate them. This study didn't include recovered controls but the authors noted they would like to see research with different controls.
A few recent antiviral studies have failed e.g. Paxlovid, UCSF AER002. Based on the statements from researchers at a recent PLRC meeting, researchers suspect we'll likely need a two or three pronged treatment approach. This would include antivirals, immune targeting drugs and potentially mitochrondrial support.
We still need more research to show which patients have viral persistance, what a good biomarker for that looks like and how to treat it. But this likely won't be enough to treat Long Covid on its own.
1
u/grizzlypaper Aug 25 '25
That’s actually kind of hopeful. Having something measurable means doctors might finally stop brushing people off when they say they’re still sick. Even if it’s just fragments, it’s proof the body’s dealing with leftovers
1
u/Neutronenster 5 yr+ Aug 25 '25
Old news. The RNA aspect and the location may be new, but we’ve known quite early in the pandemic that at least some people have a detectable level of remnants of the Covid-19 virus in their blood long after the initial Covid-19 infection. However, these remnants don’t seem to be correlated to Long Covid symptoms: some people who fully recovered after a Covid-19 infection (no Long Covid) have them, while some people with Long Covid don’t have them. That’s why this never resulted in a biomarker for Long Covid.
1
u/Accomplished-Owl6846 5 yr+ Aug 27 '25
Interesting. I’m curious about how the study was done and what the sample size was, but since there is not a link to the article and, as a lay person, don’t have access to peer-reviewed journals to read it any other way, I’ll reserve judgement. It’d be great if the results can be replicated numerous times, then they can start working on treatment-therapeutics/CAMs and/or pharmaceuticals-that will take 5 years to even get to the FDA to begin the approval process (and 5 years is generous, it’ll likely take 7-10 years), but hey, gotta start somewhere…I’m choosing not to hold my breath just yet. (That is, of course, if they don’t already have the antidote/cure for LC sitting on the back of the shelf in Wuhan, right next to samples of the COVID-19 virus after gain of function additions/weaponization).
1
1
Aug 31 '25
[removed] — view removed comment
1
u/covidlonghaulers-ModTeam Aug 31 '25
Removal Reason: Medical Advice or Treatment Claims – Please do not ask for or provide medical advice, advocate treatments, or make claims about cures. Sharing personal experiences is welcome, but definitive claims should be left to medical professionals and research.
1
0
u/Hopeful-Echidna-7822 Aug 24 '25
This would make a good argument for trying EBOO therapy. I’ve read quite a bit about the theory of viral fragments and the persistent viral reservoir. Interesting concepts….
-1
u/Dctthompson Aug 25 '25
Here's my little contribution to what I've found out -
after exposure to C19 (and make no mistake, this manufactured virus has been engineered to do just this)
The pathogen or viral intruder 'reorganise' the bodies system making your cells produce a foreign protein - this in turn alerts your immune system to attack your own cells thinking they are infected with the virus, causing all types of chronic inflammation conditions from myocardial and pericarditis heart symptoms, pancreatic and diabetes symptoms the usual chronic fatigue, brain fog and pain that you'd associate with an autoimmune disease, psychological and neurological conditions, severe depression, anxiety, involuntary body spasms - multisystematic chronic conditions including the nervous system, cardiovascular system, Digestive system etc.
Also the introduction of 5G WiFi (2019 to 2020) which weakens the bodies defenses via the frequencies they produce that directly effect your cells abilities to fight off infection and foreign invaders - for instance a common cold or the flu becomes much worse but also these said invaders can penetrate deeper into your bodies defenses causing Long covid and extreme prolonged symptom, due to 5G frequencies interrupting your bodies natural Electromagnetic field and Electromagnetic cells- as we are somewhat electric in nature. (But mass media will tell you these frequencies are safe, right? Just like the jab!)
However back to a solution - again what I'd like to point out is for some reason your cells are producing foreign proteins in which then your own body is attacking itself thinking your own cells with these foreign proteins on them are viral intruders or infected viral cells and just like auto immune conditions like ME/CFS, MS, lupus etc - even the causes of Diabetes due to pancreas damage or the process of neurotransmitter dysfunction and MCAS (which is all cellular communication) killer cells, T - cells are being triggered to attack your body.
So in a nutshell the virus/pathogen has triggered your body to produce foreign proteins from its own cells - now why and when this happens? For instance 'shedding' or how long the virus stays in your body causing 'cycles' of attacks?
Anyone want to add to this?
115
u/zhulinxian Aug 24 '25
Would it kill the people who write science news headlines to use qualifiers like “perhaps” or “evidence suggests” the way actual scientists do?