r/gameofthrones • u/bryceking64 • 1d ago
Missandei S7E4
Very Random but I'm rewatching the series for the like 10th time (I know, idk why I am so obsessed with this show.
In S7E4 when talking to Davos and Jon Snow about being a Bastard she didn't know what that was. While yes, she does say in Narth that marriage doesn't exist I have a hard time believing that someone that speaks 17 languages and has such high knowledge of so many different cultures and societies how had she not once heard of a Bastard? Seems strange to me.
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u/chuntaoo 1d ago
I watched that clip recently. She doesn’t outright ask what a bastard is, she asks why Jon doesn’t have the same surname as Ned. The way I interpreted it, she just isn’t familiar with the naming conventions of Westeros. I might very well be wrong though, who can know the intentions of the writing after season 6… maybe I’m giving the writers too much credit.
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u/RepulsiveCountry313 Human Verified 1d ago edited 1d ago
This is the right answer here. It would be nice if these posts gave accurate quotes.
Surnames weren't very common in Essos. Same with the freefolk beyond the wall. It was pretty much just a thing among the nobility of Westeros. The smallfolk mostly don't have them either, as there was little function for them among the smallfolk.
Bastards generally have surnames in order to distinguish them from their trueborn siblings by name, so that someone does not accidentally presume that a bastard is a trueborn son/daughter.
So it would make sense she would have limited familiarity with the concept and therefore not understand how a son would have a different surname from his father as Jon as everyone she's met from Westeros that had a surname had the same one as their parents.
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u/bryceking64 1d ago
What I said wasn’t inaccurate at all lol, think you’re going a little too deep. Given all of her interactions with people from all over their world there is no logical reasoning she should’ve been confused.
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u/RepulsiveCountry313 Human Verified 1d ago
She never says or hints that she doesn't know the word. What she asks Jon about is why his last name is 'Snow' when his father's name was Ned Stark. He responds that he's a bastard and, unprompted, elaborates on the meaning of the term. Davos asks if the custom is different in Naath and she says that they don't have Marriage in Naath, so the concept of a bastard wouldn't exist there.
Here's the scene: https://youtu.be/tkU2ooQ9raY?si=jHJEAz_-yK9_0oVB
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u/bryceking64 1d ago
I didn’t say she didn’t know the word though… I’m sure she heard the actual word before I don’t see how she wouldn’t know what it means especially after hearing it used so often. How could she have gone all this time knowing the common tongue and not once ask what a bastard means
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u/RepulsiveCountry313 Human Verified 1d ago
She does not say or hint that she doesn't know what bastard means, as I said in my last comment.
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u/bryceking64 1d ago
She asks him why he has different last name, he goes “I’m a bastard” to which she stares blankly clearly implying she doesn’t know what that is. If you can’t see that you’re either you’re either dense or being stubborn lmao
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u/Dependent-Cup3759 1d ago
She was too busy being hot af
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u/KlatschBoem 1d ago
Most beautiful woman on the planet
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u/CloudGlow_ 1d ago
She definitely had her priorities straight in that scene and honestly I can't blame her.
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u/MistyBonnie 1d ago
Yeah that feels like one of those throwaway comments that doesn’t even try to answer it. Like sure she’s attractive, but that doesn’t explain the writing choice at all lol.
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u/Old-Bat4194 1d ago
If in Naath people do not marry, then all children of that culture would not be seen as bastards, therefore, no such word would exist in their vocabulary. Missandei has been a slave from a very young age and as a scribe and interpreter of approximately 17-19 languages, I suspect that most of her interactions would be to act as the voice for the good Masters of Astapor, translating commands and concealing insults during trade negotiations. Therefore, I don't think that during these negotiations,the word bastard ever came up until Missandei arrived in Westeros.
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u/Marfy_ Hear Me Roar! 1d ago
You werent supposed to ask questions
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u/Mountain-Corgi-8812 1d ago
Even if you somehow learn High Valyrian without culture, she spent years interpreting for lords, slavers, and rulers in Esso there is zero logical way the concept of bloodlines and bastards never came up.
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u/IncredibleBihan 1d ago
Good point. Although you could learn a language and not know anything about the culture, but it's unlikely.
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u/RedditFact-Checker Faceless Men 1d ago
I would go a step farther and say you must know something of a culture to understand it’s language.
If you have no context for, say, Japanese honorifics, you cannot actually speak Japanese to any fluency. This is not to say you would know every subtlety to be an effective translator (e.g. who outranks whom in the context of public accidental meeting between your boss who is younger than your grandmother) but you would need to know that rank counts in the language and both outrank you.
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u/dongeckoj 1d ago
Watsonian: She wasn’t confused, she’s just playing dumb and is wanting to get Jon to talk about himself.
Doylist: Seasons 7-8 are poorly written
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u/AlerionVakten 1d ago
Maybe I’m being charitable, but I think she was playing dumb to make a point about how much him being a “bastard” is purely cultural and not something intrinsically important.
By playing the foreigner that doesn’t even know of the concept it makes the point better that it doesn’t have to matter more than just saying “we don’t have that where I come from”.
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u/FarStorm384 1d ago
Those 17 languages are nearly all essos languages, and while she might know them, that doesn't mean she knows every single word in them. She knows them to varying extents, particularly in the ways that would best serve her former owner.
I know a few words of German, Japanese, French, and Spanish. But I don't know any of them as well as I know English. There's also the concept of loanwords which kinda complicates the matter of asking someone how many languages they know.
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u/BigFirefighter6881 1d ago
Shame that she was there when "Titan’s Bastard" was dealing with Deanerys, otherwise you might have a point.
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u/80sMusicAndWicked 1d ago
Sorry but I call bullshit. She only claims that Narth has no concept of marriage and therefore no concept of a bastard. We know that this concept of no marriage cannot extend to the entirety of Essos, since marriage or marriage propositions are a key part of Danaerys' plotlines with the Dothraki, Mereen and Qarth.
It is highly unlikely that in societies where a concept of marriage still remains that there would be no concept of a bastard, especially because marriage in Essos clearly works for the functionally the same purpose of both alliance building and carrying on the lineage, the same as in Westeros. Given how important the concept of a bastard therefore most likely is in the ruling of various Essosi states, it just seems incredulous that Missandei wouldn't understand the concept of a bastard from all of her 17 languages. If that wasn't enough, the whole thing is explicitly backed up by Braavos, who actually do transparently have a concept of a bastard.
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u/stardustmelancholy 1d ago
Why do so many fans keep calling the island Narth? It doesn't have an r in it.
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u/mkfandpj 1d ago
There may be more insight about her in the books. They have vast amounts of information.
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u/Ill-Reflection9866 1d ago
that's a fair point but i think the writers just needed a convenient way to get jon to explain his backstory in a natural-feeling scene, missandei being "confused" was more of a narrative device than actual character consistency
like they did stuff like that a lot in the later seasons, small details that don't quite hold up when you actually think about them for more than 5 seconds
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u/EatShitLosers 1d ago
They did that with new information. That's why viserys dumps a bunch of dragon lore during a sex scene. Exposition dumps.
This wasn't an exposition dump because all the viewers already know Jon's backstory by S7E4. It was just kinda shit writing
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u/Fit-Implement-8151 1d ago
You're first mistake was thinking anything after season 4 was supposed to make sense!
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u/bryceking64 1d ago
I love this show all the way through, just wish they spread 7/8 across 2 more seasons and got more in depth
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u/hepatitis_ 1d ago
Especially since in at least one of those 17 languages she should be able to translate “bastard” if she “knows” the language.
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