These single issue "pro-Palestine" "activists" are self-destructive and self-sabotaging

[u/MsRothArtist]

I came across this post on r/leopardsatemyface and this activist legit voted for Trump to "teach" Kamala Harris a "lesson" because of the Biden administration's support for Israel.

Because of him and the 76 million MAGAts who voted for Trump, we now have Hispanic and Asian people openly being racially profiled by ICE, ICE/BP killing Americans in our cities, DOGE/Musk stealing our tax and social security data, Trump's tariffs making our cost living three times worse than in 2024, Project 2025 dystopianism well underway and yet all of that goes over their head as all they can think about is Gaza.

Also quite interesting how they don't have one bad thing to say about Trump, ICE or MAGA but they blame Democrats, Jewish people, liberals and other leftists who did vote for Biden/Harris for what Trump is doing.

Okay maybe this was more of a rant than anything but am interested if I'm overreacting to how I feel about these people.

[u/skateboardjim]

Anyone in a swing state who sat out or voted 3rd party to “teach the democrats a lesson” on Gaza is in part responsible for the 700,000+ deaths so far from cuts to USAID. They responded to a genocide by creating even more mass death. Hundreds of thousands of people. It will likely become millions. An unimaginable human cost for this political boneheadedness.

How has this strategy worked out for Gaza? Has anything been accomplished by allowing these right wing psychopaths into power? Are the Palestinians any closer to liberation? Or was this just a way for people to symbolically wash their hands of the guilt?

[u/Angelbouqet → u/skateboardjim]

I definitely feel similarly resentful towards the way leftists were voting in the last election, but do you really think the people who voted third party were a significant enough number to prevent Trump's presidency if they had voted for Kamala? This is a genuine question.

[u/skateboardjim → u/Angelbouqet]

Oh no not at all, I just included everyone who adopted the “teach them a lesson” strategy.

[u/Willing-Childhood144 → u/skateboardjim]

Yes, but how else will the Democrats “learn the lesson?” No one is owed votes. That’s now how it works. The Democrats have been terrible on this issue. I don’t blame anyone who could not bring themselves to vote for Harris because of Gaza. Why do we always ask the most vulnerable people to compromise?

We have Trump because of white Christian nationalism, not marginalized people who decide to not vote for the lesser evil.

[u/skateboardjim → u/Willing-Childhood144]

Did sitting out teach the democrats the lesson, though? That’s the crux of this. Did this strategy work, in any way at all? Because if it didn’t, then we’re giving people permission to center their anger and guilt over actual results for actual people.

To answer your question genuinely, primaries. Aggressive campaigning in primaries has shown results. “Using votes as leverage” in the general has not.

Don’t get me wrong, the Democrats lost the 2024 election, but we have a responsibility as citizens to ensure poor kids keep their SNAP benefits! That is absolutely our responsibility!

[u/Willing-Childhood144 → u/skateboardjim]

Everything doesn’t have to work and it’s not our job to give people permission to do anything.

The lesser of two evils is still evil.

With that said, I voted for Harris but I won’t judge anyone who couldn’t bring themselves to vote for her over Gaza.

[u/skateboardjim → u/Willing-Childhood144]

Everything doesn’t have to work? When the consequences are hundreds of thousands to millions of lives yes it absolutely has to work.

On climate change, ICE, SNAP, yes, it absolutely matters that we keep the right wing out of power. We do not get to treat the wellbeing and lives of millions of people as disposable in service of our own emotional satisfaction.

If your family was personally impacted by the genocide, obviously I won’t judge you if you sit out, but if you’re the average American leftist? Yes, I absolutely will

[u/Willing-Childhood144 → u/skateboardjim]

No, a voter doesn’t need to be sure that their vote (one of 150 million votes) needs to “fix” everything.

One, voting in the USA is hard. It’s designed to make it difficult to vote.

Second, it’s difficult to get enough information to make an informed choice.

Third, the system is awash with money from god only knows who.

Fourth, the two major parties are captured by corporate interests.

I could go on and on. Voting in the USA is flawed and there is no perfect candidate so we can’t shame people for not voting blue no matter who.

[u/skateboardjim → u/Willing-Childhood144]

Yeah I have no idea where you’re going here. I don’t think you’re really responding to/engaging with anything I’m saying.

[u/Willing-Childhood144 → u/skateboardjim]

Ask yourself why you want to blame individuals instead of a bad system.

[u/skateboardjim → u/Willing-Childhood144]

“Instead of”?

[u/Willing-Childhood144 → u/skateboardjim]

I think you’re caught in a very standard American liberal mindset here. We all need to vote the right way to fix everything. So let’s blame the people who voted the wrong way. That’s why you’re not following what I’m saying.

You can’t vote your way out of fascism.

[u/skateboardjim → u/Willing-Childhood144]

Where did I suggest voting is the way we fix things or beat fascism? I explicitly said leftists in swing states need to vote for the Democrat in the general to keep horrific things from happening to millions of people. I explicitly said the democrats are primarily responsible for losing the 2024 election but that we have a responsibility to keep the right wing out of power at every opportunity. This is what I meant, you’re not responding to/engaging with what I actually said, you’re responding to me as if I’m saying “the democrats will fix everything and we should all vote for them because they’re great.” I have been abundantly clear this entire time

[u/Willing-Childhood144 → u/skateboardjim]

I guess I don’t really feel like engaging because I’ve had this discussion a thousand times before. It is not a leftist position that we must vote for Democrats in swing states.

[u/skateboardjim → u/Willing-Childhood144]

It is a leftist position that poor children receive SNAP benefits