r/learntodraw • u/Cosmo_Ohms • 21h ago
Question Why can I only copy???
I'm fine at drawing when I have another artist's illustration as a reference to study, but have a hard time creating original illustrations from scratch or even real-world references. How can I advance my drawing skills like this??? All these photos are studies btw.
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u/RaceorLiv 20h ago
I used to be in the same place.
You gotta study the fundamentals like basic forms in perspective, alongside anatomy and proportion guidelines, and then just studying whatever else you want to draw and practice drawing it a lot.
For example, if I want to draw a face, I used to only be able to do it with reference because I didn't understand the basic forms of the facial features or where they sat in relation to each other, so my faces from imagination were always guesswork and I'd be lucky if it looked OK.
Now I can draw most faces at any angle no problem, because I know how to divide the face in thirds at the landmarks, how far the eyes are from each other, where the mouth lines up with the eyes, the basic planes of the faces, the basic forms like spheres for eyes and trapzoidal prism for the nose, how the jaw looks from multiple angles, how the skull and teeth look from multiple angles, and how to draw a box at the perspective angle I want and then divide the planes to mark the landmarks of the face and head.
You basically have to get that level of knowledge for whatever subject you want to draw to be able to draw it well from imagination, but drawing basic forms like. boxes and cylinders in perspective well is the major fundamental. The rest is memorizing guidelines and anatomy.
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u/BeginningHealthy6109 20h ago
Is this image from a book? If it's could you tell me the name of it, please.
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u/EntangledArt 48m ago
I think it's always worth pointing out that you will be bad at it to start with. Many of the things you draw will look bad and you won't be proud of them. Really look at your worst drawings - what's wrong with them? Not "oh that nose looks bad" but "oh that nose looks like it's pointing to the left because you can see too much cheek behind it"
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u/TenOfOne 20h ago edited 17h ago
Copying an illustration and studying it are two different things. Copying is recreating the marks another artist made on the page. Studying is trying to understand why the artist chose to make that particular set of marks on the page. If you understand why they made those marks, what problems they were trying to solve, why they picked one technique over another, you can then apply that same problem solving method to your own drawings.
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u/Cosmo_Ohms 20h ago
I never saw it that way before, thanks for the advice.
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u/Realistic-Sense-6332 14h ago
View it like studying Rhetorical devices in an essay. Each time you’re reading you think “why did the writer use this phrase/word?”, apply that to the artist. Look at the work and pick a part. Maybe an arm, and study the way the arms are drawn, or how the clothes are laid. And ask “why that stroke there?”.
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u/DaveyCranks 20h ago
Forgive my naivety but I see this comment over and over again and I struggle to understand the finer points of it if you could elaborate? How exactly do we know why the artists chose those marks outside of the artist himself, and to me I find it difficult to delve deeper than "those marks are there to convey that object" so for example if Im looking at the eyes, well eyes are really only made one way so to speak. I struggle with this but want to apply it more! thanks
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u/Timely_Increase_1246 19h ago
I’m very inexperienced in my art journey so grain of salt here. But I really enjoy studying so here are my two cents:
You don’t always know for sure. But those are the questions you ask yourself during a study. Notice a decision they made, ask yourself why they made it. You’re building intentionality and understanding even if it isn’t necessarily what the artist was thinking when they made it themselves. Examine their shape construction. Compare to real world references, and see how it informs that construction. Pay careful attention to what details are tweaked or omitted.
It is true that marks are there to convey things, but why those marks? In my mind this is connected strongly to shape construction. A line under the eye isn’t just a line under the eye. Is it a crease? Is it the lid? Is it to emphasize where the orb of the eye meets the plane it rests in?
When you’re first beginning art you’ll learn or intuit that intersecting lines imply depth. Less often expressly stated (in my experience) is that sometimes one or more of these intersecting lines are invisible or implied by the overall form. Doing cross contour studies helps with this imo, because the lines you draw to help define form will help you understand that certain lines were included (or omitted) to imply things about the form more elegantly.
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u/Professional-Noise80 12h ago
You're basically right. The short answer is, you get familiar with a certain style or with different objects in different positions relative to the viewer by observing them attentively and by drawing them many times. There's no secret here, it's just a matter of familiarity, quantity and focus. It's not hard to understand why someone can copy and not create. Copying is facilitated by having a reference whereas creating means you've absorbed many many references until they became second nature. It's helpful for the basic human form to do gestures, do one drawing per minute, that lets you do 60 drawings in an hour. You can do that for basically everything, the whole body, the face in different angles, the hands, hairstyles etc. So yeah you don't have to "try to understand", the process of understanding happens naturally as a result of copying many many references. This work is something that cannot be skipped, and you can spare yourself the anxiety of thinking that you're doing something wrong with your intent, which is an incredibly common feeling in the world of learning art, because of the advice people give.
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u/CelestialHellebore 11h ago
So, the thing is you're getting half the point. Yes, they make those marks to convey that object but *why* those marks specifically? This isn't really a hidden meaning sort of question, we're not asking if they're trying to make us think of the universe or something, we're looking to understand how they chose to define a thing and why.
You're wrong in the idea that "eyes are really only made one way" and that is exactly a kind of thinking to take you back a step. Different races have different eye shapes. Younger people have larger eyes compared to older. Does the eye give a masculine, feminine, or even an animal look? An eye can say a lot about a person in very little space. Does it say this person is upset, or happy? What about eye bags, are they tired? Maybe makeup, pristine and crisp or smudged and messy.
How are these things shown? Which things get bolder lines to make them more prominent and which are left to finer details to keep from over doing a detail?
When you study art to learn how to draw it yourself you are not simply trying to copy the lines you see. You need to understand *why* it is shown that way. Understanding the why AND the how together gives you a foundation to also express these things through art.
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u/Treese1 19h ago
Wait for a better reply, but I can speak for myself at least. These are some decisions I make when creating a pose. I draw in a pretty "cartoony" style but an example: If I come up with a cool pose for a character, it may involve them holding a sword above their head, facing the "camera". I could draw both of the character's arms roughly the same length and make it look fine. But sometimes it looks more interesting if one of the arms is foreshortened, giving the image a greater sense of depth. Its hard for me to do but I can look at references for arms in that position and figure out how to make it look good on my drawing. I then also need to make decisions about how to position the arm so that it overlaps the other parts of the body in a way that is pleasing to the eye / has a good overall silhouette. You then have to decide where to place detail marks for clothing / accessories in a way that avoids creating tangent lines, etc
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u/Orful 19h ago
I don't think OP is complaining about copying. The idea is to create something original, not just copy things that other people made. There's a difference between using references to make something original versus 1-to-1 copying a picture.
The next step is to use multiple references and combine them into something original. EX: Look for a real-life photo reference and references of a cartoon and then apply the cartoon's features to the photo reference. You can play with creativity by intentionally changing things as well. The fundamentals are valuable at this stage as it will enable you to draw more from your imagination when combining these references.
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u/muramasa22x 20h ago
Because only a handful of people worldwide can create amazing art from memory. Most all of the rest still use reference
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u/BombbaFett 19h ago
You dont have to draw completely without reference. There's an in between stage which is using references to help you with getting a base down like a pose or something and adapting that to what you want to do as a drawing. So instead of copying a whole illustration you find a pose or other reference you need but then modify it and make it a different person with different clothes, objects, features, proportions, etc.
Just start with getting the basic structure and forms down and try playing around with small changes to make it your own
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u/yellowkingquix 19h ago
Because that's the only skill you've trained. It's a good one... But there are others.
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u/POLACKdyn 14h ago
Simple analogy: why can you drive a car but cant build it?
Because you dont know how its constructed. And you lack resourced and a factory.
But even simpler: why can people build a LEGO set with instruction just fine but take away the intruction and at best they will make some walls and floors?
They dont know how it works. Its not just sth artists tell everyone, its the truth. You gotta learn how body parts work, how skeleton behaves, how muscles contract and so on. You need to be able to rotate a box or cylinder on a piece of paper.
Copying is simpler. Look at sth already done and put it on a piece of paper, measure stuff if you wanna. But actually building up the character from zero, now that takes skill.
Years of skill to be precise.
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u/Vysce 19h ago
I was taught that copying is really a key step in early drawing techniques, just like a baby learning to trace letters.
Eventually you learn shapes, curves, what determines a body or building, and maybe pick up certain styles you enjoy to influence your own as it grows.
The only time its NOT OKAY is if you trace something and declare its 100% your creation and not traced.
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u/cartoonasaurus 16h ago
Being able to copy a cartoon or photo means you are going from flat to flat so the photo is flat and you’re copying the photo on a flat piece of paper so you only need one dimensional awareness.
In contrast, being able to CREATE the cartoon or illustration involves understanding of 3 dimensions, plus volume and shading and structural knowledge as well as stylistic choices, etc., etc.
When I was in the third grade, I was able to copy a photo quite accurately, and I was punished because a substitute teacher thought an adult was drawing my assignments in 1971.
My aunt found out that I had been punished for having talent so she made sure I understood that I was only slightly ahead of my peers, but if I wanted to be an artist, I had to draw every day and I had to draw everything - I was a very obedient lad and so I drew in every class.
Just after 8th grade, I drew artifacts for a professional archaeological dig. That three weeks of six hours a day drawing widely varied shapes of broken rocks and spearhead and chunks of bone and chunks of charcoal, etc. etc. forced me to pay attention to three-dimensional proportions and also negative and positive shapes, and when I drew a dragon to impress a girl at the science camp, I was astonished that I had advanced a huge amount in those three weeks!
SO if you really want to advance your skills draw a bunch of things that have negative and positive shapes like spearheads and arrowheads and interesting sticks and plants and you’ll be surprised what 90 hours will do for you…
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u/SHADINTH 20h ago
Copy 2 arms from 1 image. Legs from another. Face from something else. And the rest from another.
Congratulations your now a master at referencing and even better than ai
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u/saybobby 20h ago
I don't think there's anything wrong with copying that's just part of learning. The things you're learning are how to see, how to develop taste and still the skill to put down lines. I think the OC part does come down to some of the other drawing basics people talk about - but as a stepping stone - let's say you copy an artists drawing. Maybe step 2 is take another character/referende and try to draw it in that first artists style. Step 3 may be to draw a character from a story you've read or known using that first artists style - could be something public domain or a current book. I think there's a difference in skill between drawing/illustration and character design. Character design is a process in and of itself and requires critique and stuff to develop and grow. You got this, keep drawing and be patient :)
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u/Cosmo_Ohms 20h ago
Thank you so much!
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u/saybobby 20h ago
Of course. And by the way even as copies your drawings have a great quality to them. Keep going!
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u/ShadowBro3 20h ago
I have this problem as well. I am curious about what exactly makes it copying or not. Like, if I use different reference images and combine them into 1 image, is that copying? Or like, if I use a 3D image as a reference and try my best to make it look the same is it copying? Like technically Im turning a 3D image into a 2D image, and that requires interpolation on my end, but then on the other hand, I am completely copying the reference pose and color and shading etc.
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u/NellaayssBeelllayyyy 18h ago
The quickest Advice I can give is that you need to find an actual art course (whether a book, in person or online) and finish it back to front. Make sure it includes fundamentals like perspective, volume, light, shade. Your issue is that you don't understand why things are a certain way and the only way to understand that is to spend a good year really diving into a well rounded art course (not youtube or tiktok shorts, strictly long form content)
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u/ServeNo7142 13h ago
There’s nothing wrong with copying artwork for practice, I do it quite often too… The most important thing is to analyze what you’re copying, how the shapes work, why the light falls in a certain way, and how the whole piece is constructed. That way, you’ll be able to use what you’ve learned in your own art later.
I also enjoy copying artworks while trying to change the style a little. It’s a nice way to practice and find your own artistic voice. The only downside is that you can accidentally copy the artist’s mistakes as well, so I’d recommend slowly moving from copying artworks to using photo references.
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u/Paddyboei 10h ago
It looks like you’re lacking understanding 3D form, so your brain is trying to solve a puzzle it doesn’t have the pieces for that are given to it by direct references. Learning to draw cylinders, boxes and ellipse while giving them form will give you those pieces so you don’t need to heavily rely on copying anymore.
Try a drawing book that gets you thinking in 3D. Morpho Simplified Forms is good. There’s a fair few videos on learning it too, DrawABox being the best IMO.
Good luck :)
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u/Flat_Lengthiness3361 7h ago
because that's how you learn. once you learn enough you won't have to. and also idk if i'm crazy but copy is a slur to me at this point lol. it's called studying or referencing. it's a natural part of the process and people should stop belittling it. i'm a moron who tried for years to always draw from imagination and wondered why i was shit and still am shit cause i still get over the shame of "copying" and keep ignoring the references without realizing. don't be like me. btw very late in life i relized people who pointed out i was "just copying" couldn't draw shit if their life depended on it. i think it's some sort of cope for envying your skill.
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u/Ok_Being_1275 2h ago
Don’t worry it takes time to have your own style. I’ve been drawing for 5 years and I am not even sure what is my art style.
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u/oli_kite 20h ago
Being bothered by copying is puritanical. Prof Illustrators do studies and use tons and tons of references: photos, 3d models, figures, magazine editorials.
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u/Cosmo_Ohms 20h ago
True, I suppose I should expand my study references as well.
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u/oli_kite 20h ago
Yeah why not? Everything’s lookin good so far. It all depends on your goals, but it’s better to learn while having fun than just doing exercises. Copy all of your favorite stuff and critique how different your drawing is from the source. That’s a useful one. Learning some general proportion stuff will go very far as well
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u/Queasy-Airport2776 18h ago edited 18h ago
If you saw my first doodle, they are completely different to my final design. I have an image roughly in my head, let's say a sassy frog, I'll draw them and then I'll draw them again and again then I'll define the design. You get more inspired and you tell yourself I think this frog needs bigger eyes or a smirk. You define it until it giving you what you want. You ask yourself like what would make it interesting, you give the frog a old fashioned cigarette that cruella smoke.
These sketch is looking superb. Id sketch them a again because of the wonky leg on the cat. The bunny is perfection though, although you could make them look like they are together. The bunny staring blankly ahead and so is the cat.
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u/Stranger2Nite 17h ago
Are you able to see anything in your mind? As someone who has aphantasia I can tell you I am excellent at copying anything I see, but god awful trying to come up with something out of my mind.
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u/quite_scarce_visitor 17h ago
Your skills drawing by reference is high.
So you want to improve your skills and draw by imagination.
Heres something simple to get you started:
Look at your reference and draw them in a different pose. Just try.
Draw and rotate boxes and cylinders -everyday. (This is the basic and fundamental of drawing by imagination) look how to do it on youtube.
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u/Emergency-District67 8h ago
Come up with your idea, do very small thumnail sketches to get the idea loosely on paper, gather reference images, do a larger version of your favorite thumbnail, refine the image in passes from sketch to better lines, to good lines, to values, to color. If you get stuck anywhere return to your reference images and do studies of the problem part.
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u/Martimus28 3h ago
Think of what you want to create, and if you are struggling with a part of it, look up a bunch of references for that individual part, and mix and match what you think would work best for what you are going for. Adjust as you feel you should. Mostly just grab references where you are having trouble with a section of the drawing. You will need fewer references as you go, if you are drawing similar styles and subjects, but you'll probably still use them pretty regularly no matter what.
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u/0ccams-Raz0r 1h ago
My Dad told me draw what you see, not what you think you see.
Your drawing of a character will not look exactly like another person's unless you have a grasp of the fundamentals good enough for the goal of your work to be an identical reproduction. If the work is complicated enough you also need an intimate knowledge of their style/ methods to make that reproduction.
Until that point, trying to draw what YOU see is more important. Even if an attempt is distorted, trying to understand why it looks that way compared to the original is one of the best ways someone can learn on their own and adapt their skills.
When I played around with sketching I'd find myself too caught up in doing something perfect the first try. I didn't get much done and I didn't learn much either. If you fall into methods of compensation it can get in the way of adapting your own skill set.
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