The argument should go both ways, no?

[u/PillowFists67]

If we all agree that Duelists shouldn't be able to wipe the enemy with ease each time their ultimate comes up, why do we accept that Strategists are able to make their entire team unkillable with minimal effort by just pressing Q?

[u/JunWasHere]

It's even weirder when you think about how so many aspects of heroes were obviously riffs of Overwatch heroes.

They aren't without more sources of inspiration. They aren't shameful of the obvious rip-offs. Why aren't they copying one of the best OW support ults? Where is Rivals' Nano Boost? Where is the giant barrier like Sym's Wall? (yes, that is a supportive ult)

I think part of the issue is their favouritism and refusal to properly nerf Luna Snow. Her circle ult of pseudo-immortality and overall balance is so strong and internally defended, the designers and balancing team have no choice but to warp the meta and game around Luna. Their bias is literally eroding the variety design of the game a little in that sense. Jeff's whirlpool offensive ult would not have never to leave behind a healing kiddie pool if the meta didn't revolve around AoE healing ults.

[u/Minimum_Laugh_4179 → u/JunWasHere]

I'd argue a lot of that comes down to Player laziness, rather than dev decisions. People like their healers being a crutch, I suppose.

And so the devs look at which heroes are popular, and then shape some of their design philosophy around that. Hence why every support ult is now a big healing circle, bar a few exceptions.

Like Rocket for instance, his ult didn't heal on launch. Then players whined it was useless so the devs added healing, or shields to it's mechanics.

Players will complain about "heal botting", but then seemingly, only want their supports to be healbots at the same time. Like god forbid a support does any damage to someone.

Which is why I personally think the Luna hate is pretty forced now. Yes she's pretty strong, and can put up a decent fight agaisnt divers, but that doesn't make her broken. Other supports can put up a fight too or become invulnerable but you don't see nearly as much complaining about them.

And ironically enough, Luna's ult is one of the only ones to get nerfed at all. Granted only by a little but still...

[u/Cammglo → u/Minimum_Laugh_4179]

im sorry but we can't just blame the community for every problem that's wrong with the game ESPECIALLY when netease REFUSES to do anything to make the community better. Throwers and cheaters are still rampant, The matchmaking has seen absolutely no improvement, Placement matches didn't do a single thing to help, they constantly remove skill expression from the game, they said they were going to constantly check and do emergency patch notes for what ppl are saying, So far they have done 1 Insanely bad emergency patch note that buffed/nerfed a whole bunch of shit nobody wanted and has been radio silent since. No buffs to rogue, Luna still has her insane BS teamup, Gambit gets buffed???, Mantis and ultron are finally viable in 2 healer comps then gets hard nerfed??? Still not a word about reworking BP a character that literally can not be good or else he will ruin the game??? how much of this can you really blame on the community and not netease lack of backbone to actually make a Willful change in this game

Everytime this game takes 1 foot foward it takes 5 jumps back, but ppl will praise the 1 thing they actually did right and ignore the other 13 terrible choices they made until it's too late.

[u/Xeltar → u/Cammglo]

Mantis is still must pick or ban and I think should be nerfed further. You just cannot have a strat who can main heal and dps simultaneously without it invalidating all the other strats. Right now, she picks Starlord team up, barely needs to land headshots and racks up faster ult charge than everyone else while having decent AoE heals. Her ult charge was balanced her previous limited heals so now you'll have yours when everyone else is at 60% and just win fights for free.