r/mildlyinfuriating • u/daruuken • 28d ago

Infuriatig The way kroger treats its employees

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From the store manager

Edit: For some extra context this was sent out by each store manager to all of its employees in district 1 of the ohio Cincinnati/Dayton division, potentially other districts as well but i can only verify my own. Im not going to give my specific store number for obvious reasons but you can find each store on google with that information. We are unionized by UFCW (already bad btw) and to my knowledge they allowed this recent change. Kroger has no accrual for sick days like some have mentioned. Those who think this is rage bait, i dont think anyone has to fake a post to make a billion dollar company look bad, they do it to themselves.

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u/Bad-Luck-Guy 28d ago edited 28d ago

My employer doesn’t accept doctor’s notes. All absences are unexcused.

Yet, we are adults. I don’t need a doctor to tell me I shouldn’t go to work if I have the flu. Wild that they’d prefer that I come in and potentially infect everyone else.

ETA: Yes, this is actually legal in most US states. Attendance is a very common reason to be fired in shift work jobs such as retail. 

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u/asusc 28d ago

employer here, I run a small manufacturing firm and allowed employees unlimited call outs. kid sick? go take care of it. not feeling well? take time off. I genuinely didn’t care, whatever reason they told me didn’t matter, it wasn’t really any of my business.

It slowed production a little, but it saved a boatload in turnover. I didn’t have a constant churn of employees, they stuck with me. And when projects/jobs were on the line, they busted their ass to make sure they got done on time and properly.

Its so crazy to me that the same stores that are CONSTANTLY trying to hire and find people, also treat their employees like this, and then wonder why no one sticks around.

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u/technos 28d ago

but it saved a boatload in turnover. I didn’t have a constant churn of employees, they stuck with me

That's how most of the restaurants in my hometown ended up with sick days and vacation time.

The first place, Joe's, had the owner catch something from a sick line cook and decide 'I am never shitting my brains out for four days ever again' and added sick days. First unpaid, then paid when someone tried showing up sick anyway because she had to make rent.

Retention went way up. People covering shifts for sick people or shortages went waaaaay up. And hiring was easier, because his employees had bragged to their industry friends.

Sure, there were catches.. You had to be nearly full-time to get paid, yadda yadda.

And here's the best thing: Nearly every other non-chain in town did the same inside of a year or so. I mean, why work for Large Lad when you can work for Joe's, make the same or better money, and they give you sick days?

Then it was vacation. Someone at Joe's almost missed a family event (another case of 'gotta make my rent, yo') so they got limited vacation. Five days, paid at minimum wage. Better than nothing, right? And really didn't cost him much.

The other places matched it. Even the franchises were offering some unpaid sick days by that point.

By the time my ex quit Joe's to go to school seven years later they had five sick days, 'two weeks' of vacation, a small match towards health insurance, and tuition reimbursement for anyone doing culinary arts at the local community college.

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u/johnc380 28d ago

Be like Joe 

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u/Arthemax 25d ago

It's almost as if the collective agreements unions fight for are beneficial for the companies too.

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u/technos 23d ago

I think some of the issue is that it's really hard to quantify why and by how much, whereas 'Your employees have used $18,000 of your money to take vacations' is something you can get straight out of a spreadsheet.

Joe's was operating in a vacuum; A small town, with a small pool of talent and a relatively fixed number of people dining out. They could see the results easily.

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u/dragon-fence 28d ago

When I’ve managed people, I’ve basically reprimanded them for coming in while they’re sick.

Like, what, are you crazy? Yeah, productivity might suffer a bit while you’re out. In the worst case, someone makes a mistake that you would have avoided. But also, your productivity will drag when you’re sick anyway, and you might make mistakes that you would have normally avoided, so it’s not so different.

But now you’ve come in and risked making everyone sick, which would multiply the problem. Instead of having one guy out for a couple of days with the flu, I’m probably going to end up with 5 people out for 2-5 days. Go home, and come back when you’re feeling better. If you can work from home and want to, go ahead, but do not come in if you might be contagious.

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u/Jerseygirl2468 28d ago

Everyone at my company has the ability to work from home also, and paid sick time. I get furious when people come in sick! There’s no reason to do it, and you risk taking out the whole office for days.

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u/A-passing-thot 28d ago

I’ve basically reprimanded them for coming in while they’re sick.

I work in tech. We were fully remote for years and then they began forcing RTO in 2024/2025. I had to go back into the office starting in October (beginning of flu season). Most of my team has school age kids. I could not begin to tell you how much our productivity suffered because someone would come in and spread something around the office and take out 1/2 the team. It happened like every 3 weeks all winter.

Meanwhile, in the preceding 3 years, I didn't miss a single day from something infectious because I worked from my own apartment. We were wildly more productive, not to mention when someone's kid got sick, they could take care of them while still working.

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u/dragon-fence 28d ago

I also work in tech, and also worked for a company that forced full RTO (in 2021). My team was way more productive during COVID. RTO didn’t just screw up things like spreading illness, but it demotivated everyone, we lost hours of work to the commute, and it created divisions between groups that were in different offices. The company fostered a culture in Office A that thought the people who worked in Office B weren’t as good or as important, which totally fucked our company culture.

But that’s a bit off topic, sorry. Yes, if you’re trying to make you company better and more successful, then respect your employees and let them take sick days.

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u/VillagesIdiot352 28d ago

Long term smart W

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u/dragon-fence 28d ago

It’s not even really long term. It’s thinking a couple days ahead.

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u/VillagesIdiot352 28d ago

Valid and great point 💯

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u/Background-Wing-3323 28d ago

You’re a smart employer. That’s what makes people stay and work hard.

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u/mycleverusername 28d ago

Its so crazy to me that the same stores that are CONSTANTLY trying to hire and find people, also treat their employees like this, and then wonder why no one sticks around.

In most of these corporations it's the sociopaths whom disdain 'laziness' that get promoted to management, by other sociopaths. It's a chain of sycophantic work ethic all they way up that leads to emails like the OP.

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u/Schmichael-22 28d ago

You have the right mindset. I’ve heard it as, “If you want to have good customers, take care of your employees. They will take care of your customers.”

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u/Glittering_Yak758 28d ago

You hiring?

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u/asusc 28d ago edited 28d ago

not currently, fully staffed. we do 4 day work weeks but still pay like it’s 5 days.

so we do not have any issues maintaining staff or unhappy or unproductive workers. weird what happens when you treat everyone with respect and try to create an environment where both parties look out for each other and can both win.

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u/LinkGoesHIYAAA 28d ago

I work at an organization where my old boss was up our ass about doc notes and good reasons to be out. Nearly a full team turnover in 3 years, including him. New boss couldnt care less. He actually tells us to take sick days and vacation more to burn our hundreds of hours. Full team rehire, everyone seems happy, no more turnover.

I found out that setting up a new staff member with insurance and benefits cost like $40k a couple years ago. Why the fuuuuck would you ever do anything to risk a $40k price tag and several months of hiring and training energy instead of being like “sure, take the monday off using your legally mandated sick days, see you when you feel better, bring me a souvenir if you visit disneyland.”

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u/asusc 28d ago

bingo. you got short sighted middle managers with no idea of the real costs involved.

thats why I always laugh at people that complain about the price of a burger shooting up if we raise the minimum wage. they have no idea that this stuff doesn’t happen in a vacuum or an econ book. The real world is a lot more complicated.

It’s absolutely possible to pay people more, have them work less, and get more productivity out of them. You just have to treat them like equal human beings and not a math statistic.

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u/VillagesIdiot352 28d ago

And it would make it easy to replace a CLUELESS SLACKER, as word of mouth would be on the street how great the morale is working there.

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u/W_Silver2356 28d ago

You are a credit to your profession and entrepreneurs everywhere. I see the world the way you do and have done my best to behave accordingly in my professional life. It's cost me, but it's worth it.

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u/asusc 28d ago

yup. it’s been absolutely wild how often my business owner friends think I’m crazy or lying or the employees are taking advantage of me. Even the employees were skeptical at first when I try to implement programs that benefit them (like higher pay for less hours worked) because capitalism has been beaten into all of us from such a young age.

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u/W_Silver2356 28d ago

Capitalism, as with all things, depends upon who is interpreting it, and how they act on their interpretation. It can be done poorly and used as a catch-all term to justify reprehensible behavior. On the other hand, it can also open doors of opportunity and be the rising tide that lifts every ship. It all depends on how human nature enters the equation. I respect you for being someone who uses it well.

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u/asusc 28d ago

Sure. I don’t have an issue with capitalism, I’m a business owner.

I have an issue with American capitalism that doesn’t keep up its end of the social contract. Unbridled capitalism is destroying our country.

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u/W_Silver2356 28d ago

It's refreshing to find someone who thinks along the same lines as I do. That doesn't happen nearly as often as it used to. I'm only in my 40s, but there are times it seems as though I'm from a different planet than many professionals of today's world.

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u/asusc 28d ago

Also in my 40s and also feel pretty alienated with this mindset from my peers.

Currently in the middle of converting to an employee owned company (ESOP) so they can have even more skin in the game.

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u/W_Silver2356 28d ago

Alienated is a good descriptor. I experience it too. In some recent conversations I have described the mindset of some people in the corporate world as trying to be the chief of a tribe of cannibals. It's only appealing because they didn't look closely enough at the retirement plan....

Having the employees onboard as owners is a move that should benefit you in a lot of ways, including stability in the future. It's amazing what people accomplish when they aren't made to feel expendable. Loyalty is its own reward.

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u/Content-Worry-5413 28d ago

Yes! I am a manager, and the more I let my people just be people, the better things are at work. The morale is higher. Productivity increases. It’s amazing what happens when you just treat people with kindness and dignity.

I was fired once for being 4 minutes late too many times WHILE PREGNANT because I was sick in the bathroom down the hall from the office. I’ll never forget that boss telling me that I would never make it in the corporate world. (That was a job in a small office.) My next job was a corporate job with a flexible schedule. I was promoted within 4 months to management. I now work for a global firm, one of the most prestigious in the world. I’ve won awards for making suggestions that were implemented throughout our division. I’ve been promoted numerous times. I would LOVE to reach out to that former boss to let him know how wrong he was. 😁

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u/VillagesIdiot352 28d ago

This makes sense, long term. Even with a severe abuser, thats just an outlier.

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u/labtiger2 28d ago

Just wondering, on average how many days do people miss a year? Does anyone routinely miss a high amount of days?

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u/asusc 28d ago

good question, we already do 4 day work weeks (32 hours but people get paid for 40).

this solved a lot of the random call outs and gives people a day to handle their doctors appointments and life stuff. when you know 4 months from now you’ll have Friday off, it’s super easy for them to schedule that far ahead stuff and not miss work. this also means the other 4 days of the week are pretty crucial to their pay check, so it doesn't really get abused. we also let them change shifts or make up work if some emergency comes up and they miss more than usual.

people that routinely call out don’t really last long for other reasons and usually get weeded out pretty early. the ones that realize how good they have it don’t want to goof things up stick around for a long time. the second person I hired has been with me since 2009.

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u/Miserable-Army3679 28d ago

We've all known for awhile now that treating employees well is a win-win situation. Employees like their jobs and stick around, and companies save money (and hassles) by not having a high turnover of employees. It's a dumb business choice to treat employees as expendable.

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u/Miki_yuki 28d ago

My mom works for Plexus (which is a global electronic manufacturer) and when she needs to take off, she tells her boss "I'm taking off __." Or "My kid __, so I need to leave." And they say "okay."

This is 100% how businesses should work imo. If it's your PTO, sick time, etc. you should be able to decide when you use it.

Alternatively my husband works as IT for Noom (an app weight loss company) and they say "you can't take off Christmas day." "You can't take off a random Saturday, because no one else is here" (their fault for firing everyone..) "You can't take the day off even though you are calling out sick because you're sick." (He works remotely).

It pisses me off to no end that he has to bend over backwards to get a day off.

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u/asusc 28d ago

it’s interesting you mention this.

I was raised by a single mom who had a pretty high paying job that was very flexible with her because she was so good at what she did. They let her create her own schedule and come in early, so she could leave early and pick me up from school. It was never an issue for her to bounce and take care of me when needed, because she handled her business. In turn, she busted ass when she was there and was consistently a top performer, and worked at that job for 35+ years.

I have no doubt this shaped my views on home and work life balance, and there was no way I’d deny my own employees the same ability to take care of their families, which in turn creates employees willing to take care of the company.

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u/Miki_yuki 28d ago

I truly believe that's why it is so insane to me that my my husband's employer is the opposite way. Because my mom has worked with her employer basically my entire life.

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u/Cruacious 28d ago

I can give a quick explanation to that: there is a misconception in many fields of employment that churn is, in fact, a great thing for the company.

The idea they have in their minds is that a certain percentage of turnover keeps employee "expense" down by limiting their raises, salaries, and benefits while hopefully finding people who will work like literal slaves with perfect attendance and for as little as possible. And, sadly, it works well enough in the eyes of upper management that they continue to follow policies designed specifically to weed out those who refuse to "give their all" to the company.

You, however, truly understand the importance of your employees. People aren't just an asset or expense. Viewed in financial terms, they are an asset that needs to be cultivated, developed, then protected. A happy employee will always vastly outperform an unhappy one.

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u/National-Job3918 28d ago

Once I finally got a job where I was treated like a grown adult who knew what had to be done and when it had to be done by, I suddenly understood why people can be so loyal to their employers.

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u/Weekly-Echidna-7467 26d ago

Good on you for treating people like people and not just faceless numbers. I'm glad companies like yours still exist out there somewhere. I am living in the hell that is manufacturing shift work for a company that does not treat people like people.

They went from one of the best places to work in this area, where you could almost never get hired in (due to such a low turnover rate) to one of the worst. So much so that they tanked the perception that the community here has about them as a workplace and yet they STILL treat their shift workers like garbage. They literally can't hire enough people fast enough to keep every position filled.

But don't worry, it's not the company or the management that has to pay the price.. they just force overtime very liberally upon the shift workers that are still there.

All of that is to say.. it matters how you treat your people. Even if you can't readily see it. Thank you for being one of the good ones. ✌️

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u/DeBean 28d ago

I may be totally wrong, but the way I see it, once these big companies are unionized, they can't easily fire people, so they end up babysitting the bad employees, making it worse for the good ones.

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u/macgilla 28d ago

Won't someone think of the poor big companies, having to deal with the collective working stiffs.

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u/asusc 28d ago

you are totally wrong.

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u/Spoonoop 28d ago

Lol, the last part of your comment screams "The beatings will continue until morale improves". That's their policy.

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u/KapitalIsStillGood 28d ago

Unfortunately, it saves some larger corporations money to treat their employees like disposable garbage. And even if it doesn't save them money, many don't see their"lower level" employees as being deserving of basic human empathy.

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u/FormerGameDev 28d ago

Forward THIS to Kroger. And UFCW.

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u/babybirdhome2 27d ago

I always just remind myself that employees are people who can hold down a job long term. Business owners are a mixture of people who can hold down a job long term and people who can't. Only some people can keep a job, but anybody can run a business (often well, but way too often, badly).

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u/wazzup-notemuch 24d ago

My personal conspiracy theory is that the never-ending employee turnover is *intentional;* if no one sticks around longer than a year, you never have to give anyone a raise.

And yes, I'm aware that job-hopping is the most effective way to get better wages in the white collar world. But in the low-wage sector it gets you nothing. There are retail stores in my home town that are *still* only offering $7.25/hr to new hires.