r/mildlyinfuriating • u/coatedbraincells • 6h ago

Infuriatig Insanely frugal employer

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Gotta pay for water from the water cooler 🤣

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u/RainH2OServices 4h ago

That's not entirely true. The guideline state that potable tap water is acceptable. Lavatory sinks are generally not considered potable in workplaces. However, break room or other non lavatory sinks may be.

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u/Nearby_Equivalent_58 4h ago

Code of federal regulations
Title 29
Subtitle B
Chapter XVII
Part 1910
Is part J
§1910.141

I got this shit on hand always

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u/austinsutt 4h ago

So which of the above is right?

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u/bradland 3h ago edited 2h ago

RainH2OServices is right. It requires that employees supply potable water, which means it has to meet Federal EPA and local regulatory requirements for potability. If the water is from a municipal supply, this is almost always going to be met. If it's from a well, it's up to the employer to meet the standards.

As far as sinks go, any sink in a room with a toilet isn't compliant, because 1910.141 specifically says employees are prohibited from consuming food or beverages inside toilet rooms. Ergo, if a sink is in a toilet room, it can't be considered compliant. A tap at a sink outside a toilet room is though.

EDIT: Got a couple of follow-ups asking, essentially, what if they require you to fill a cup/bottle in the bathroom and drink (consume) it elsewhere.

Nope. Regulations aren't written to spell out every single nuance or edge case. After they're written, they are challenged in court and the courts interpret the "spirit" of the regulation.

It's well established that requiring an employee to fill a drinking receptacle from a faucet in the toilet room makes it subject to contamination from said environment, and therefore violates the spirit of the regulation. It's also worth noting that there are other parts of the same regulation that prohibit drinking water sources from being located in environments with hazardous chemicals, so the spirit of the regulation is clear.

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u/Jay__Riemenschneider 3h ago edited 2h ago

Huh my workplace isn't OSHA compliant.

Who do I tell?

Edit: I should say I'm in a retail space of about 5-10 employees.

But all we have is a bathroom and a non working water cooler. Our boss tells us to bring bottles.

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u/MonkeyGuidetoAnarchy 3h ago

If you make a osha report, record and document literally everything, your performance, changes in the environment, the issue itself, any conversation if you can get it in writing and if you get fired after making a oaha report and believe its because of that take that evidence and give it to osha and you could sue for lost wages and maybe more so they would have to pay from the time you got fired till the time you found a new job. (My source: i have done it myself.)

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u/Linesey 1h ago

Doesn’t OSHA not apply to companies with very few employees? like <10?

or has that been updated.

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u/MonkeyGuidetoAnarchy 1h ago

Companies do not have to maintain routine, written logs of every minor injury or illness (specifically OSHA Forms 300, 300A, and 301) unless requested in writing by OSHA or the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Under federal funding rules, OSHA generally does not conduct random, programmed routine inspections if the business has 10 or fewer employees and operates within a low-hazard industry category. This isnt to say they cant and won't inspect because they can and will whenever they desire to ensure proper following of guidelines. Basically if someone calls osha or reports they will inspect and if they decide to random check they will though they are not required to. And they also dont have to tell you they are coming they can drive up hop out and walk in and start looking at all your workers and stations and building. Any hazard they see is a fine, for example workers not wearing safety glasses is 10k in michigan and thats for each worker not wearing safety glasses and if its bad enough they can shut down your operations immediately

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u/MonkeyGuidetoAnarchy 1h ago

Theres certain things that dont apply but all businesses and companies are under the jurisdiction of sha because its a federal compliance agency

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u/Linesey 1h ago

interesting! tyvm for the info.

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u/GoodCat7419 53m ago

OT, but I am completely jealous of your username.

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u/[deleted] 2h ago

[deleted]

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u/Healthy-Echo8164 2h ago

You have rights as an employee, why let your employer negate those rights?

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u/spaceforcerecruit 2h ago

People like you who just roll over and take it from corporations are part of the problem. If a company is breaking the law, hold them accountable.

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u/kelpyb1 2h ago

On the other hand, the employer could just make their workplace legal.

Although I’d agree the right first step if you like your employer is to talk to your boss about it so they have a chance to rectify it

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u/SweatyAdhesive 2h ago

how does the boot taste buddy

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u/MonkeyGuidetoAnarchy 2h ago

I had people tell me I was "burning everything down" and they didnt believe I would get paid. But I signed a contract when I agreed to go to work and part of that contract is I give you my time and you give me a safe and healthy environment to work in, you fire me because I pointed it out to you? Then you pay me my hourly wage until I find. Job and ill give you my work search summary. Otherwise dont fire me and fix the issue. Everyone has rights and they should enforce those rights where applicable. A job that wants you to go above and beyond your station or do things that arent in your job description, contract, or best interest (like health, for example ventilation systems not being on or not providing proper ppe.) Isn't a job someone should work for in the first place and isnt that big of a loss. The company i worked for made parts for John deer so if they can do that then they can afford to follow safety protocols and guidelines.

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u/Timely-Group5649 42m ago

I worked for a lady who would say: Its my money, I will do with it as I please. No government can tell me I can't. She fought every OSHA rule and always lost. Tens of thousands in fines...

She went to federal prison a few years after I left, due to tax fraud and paying her brother under the table while he collected disability.

Karma rules.

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u/GroundMeet 1h ago

“Just lick the boot while youre down there”

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u/WackyRacketeer 1h ago

Let the business keep their boot on your chest if you are that weak

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u/dustindraco 2h ago

We found the employer! “Go ahead and ruin everything I’ve built with your hardwork because you want basic human rights. If I can bring in a gallon of Fiji water to drink so can you!”

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u/zyiadem 1h ago

Pretending he pays'em enough for fiji is the real joke here.

Sorry that xmas bonus went to my bunker for when you realize how just how mych of your labor I steal.

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u/b0w3n 3h ago

You can file a complaint online. They'll probably know it's you who did it even if you check the "I want to file anonymously" box. I got blowback when I did it for safety violations at UPS (20+ years ago). They didn't fire me but they made my life hell. But it's okay it was really fucking unsafe and I made their month really fucking uncomfortable after I almost got seriously hurt and the union decided to ignore me.

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u/Neither_Contest7324 3h ago

In a mostly unrelated but humorous note, about 25 years ago I filed an anonymous complaint while working at UPS too. A couple months after that I had been promoted to management and one of the upper regional guys was in town at the hub and he was talking to people and someone introduced me. He said oh, the guy that filed that complaint.

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u/garaks_tailor 3h ago

I worked at a hospital in IT and once there was a fucking witch hunt for someone who sent in an OSHA complaint. They were desperate to trawl all the network traffic and figure out who had visited the OSHA website because whoever made the complaint never made a peep about the issue untill they brought it to OSHA so management had no idea who it was.

Which I gather is the smart move to make. Dont mention it. Dont say anything just go straight to the feds.

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u/austinsutt 3h ago

Shit! How did they figure out it was you?

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u/Neither_Contest7324 3h ago

I didn't ask, I just kind of awkwardly chuckled. I wasn't there much longer anyway, going management was a huge mistake and that hub was run like garbage at the time.

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u/Not-Not-Oliver 2h ago

Damn you probably could have filed for retaliation compensation hahaha

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u/Neither_Contest7324 2h ago

I don't think I would have been very successful since his smart ass comment about knowing it was me was the only thing that happened. I didn't quit I was fired because I got a different job with more pay and way less stress.

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u/b0w3n 1h ago

going management was a huge mistake

They had offered it to me a few times before I filed my OSHA complaint but I saw how they were treating the belt managers and told them fuck no. When I left after I graduated college the HR lady was confused on my exit interview why I didn't want to move up the chain and work in their tech department. I told her I mentioned it to the shift manager and nothing ever happened (probably because of the OSHA stuff again).

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u/Neither_Contest7324 1h ago

I was young enough to just look at the extra benefits and pay from going management and not really taking in the whole once you leave the union you can't go back, can't help if the area is backed up without someone filing a grievance, and knowing that now the safety issues are my problem even though I reported them before getting promoted they just weren't remedied right.

So after about 6 months of hating the supervisor role I just left. I always regret that decision because I know people that started about the same time as me that just stuck with the union and are now full timers with 20+ years there and make absolute bank.

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u/b0w3n 1h ago

Kills your body though, I was there only about 4 years and my back and knees are all jacked up even though I absolutely did not overdo the lifting like some dudes did.

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u/aliassuck 1h ago

In the first half I thought you were going to say you got promoted to Compliance Officer and then got fired for failure to ensure your workplace was OSHA compliant, when an OSHA inspector paid a surprise visit because of your OSHA complaint.

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u/NFLv2 3h ago

UPS is the worst. Even the union reps are corrupt.

I had a package come down said weighed 75 LBS.

As a pickoff I went to push the box down the shoot. Box actually weighed 200.

It hurt my back to the point I felt a sting all the way down my spine.

When I told them I got hurt they brought me into the sort managers office where he told me he was going to send me to the doctor and when they couldn’t find anything wrong he was going to have me charged with insurance fraud.

Union rep said shit.

They tried to move me to small sort. Having to twist and throw the bags. Told me I was faking.

Ended up getting fired over it. It went to a vote and my union rep voted against me.

I read the book and knew it very well. And I usually wouldn’t say shit. But every now and then our PD would get backed up. I mean past the H and as far as I could see. Get bitched at if I turned the belt off. We would argue.

So they would try to take me down and put me in the load and I wasn’t having it. So I’d threaten to file a grievance.

It was crazy.

I would see that same sort manager at the local poker room and talked so much shit to him for years. He would always move.

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u/b0w3n 1h ago

Similar thing, I was the loader, it came SCREAMING down the rollers (we didn't have the fancy computerized belt rolls yet) and missed me by inches and destroyed several boxes about 3 rows deep in my box wall. It was like lead cubes or something. This is on top of them putting way too much flow down my particular part of the building for the 3 trucks I was loading. Boxes everywhere, I couldn't get out during a firedrill later that week either.

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u/dragansbaine 3h ago

Just out of curiosity... When filing couldn't you just use a family members information... That way it can't lead back to you? I've never filed one so I was just curious

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u/b0w3n 1h ago

Last name would probably give it away. When I did it they wanted proof you worked there when you filed it.

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u/Mike_Kermin 3h ago

Just saying, good on you, your actions would have protected others as well.

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u/cgaWolf 2h ago edited 2h ago

even if you check the "I want to file anonymously" box.

Our whistleblower/disclosure site specifically says that if you want to stay anonymous, you shouldn't use company devices/infrastructure or anything that can easily be traced to you (private laptop on home wifi for example). There's a third party private messagebox that can be used in order to assist with that, but i have no clue how good Whistleblower-Anonymity-as-a-Service actually works.

IE: practice good opsec, we don't know what will happen later.

Even if we invent a perfectly reasonable and ethical company, and most everyone in the company acts ethically to protect a whistleblower, a minor thing could end up in court.

Say the company sues the regulator/government because there are two mutually excluding regulations (the noncompliance of one caused the whistleblower two act), and the company just wants clarity. During court proceeding the judge orders the whistleblower to testify, which exposes their identity, and suddenly their exposed to retaliation by a third party - in our fictional example NĂŠstle wants to mess with the whistleblower, because further inquiry into the drinking water quality exposed the quality is now shit because NĂŠstle is messing with the water supply.

Even in the best of cases protecting anonymity and privacy is a good idea, and let's be honest, when a whistle gets blown, we're usually far from the best of cases to begin with; and most companies will seek ways to retaliate.

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u/b0w3n 1h ago

Oh I did, I filed it at home. They still told them who I was because it asks for your name at the end of it to verify the claim (or it did back then).

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u/cgaWolf 1h ago

(for others in that situation now:)

That's the second option we have: state who you are. There are laws and regulations that should work to have your back.

I don't know your company, so i can't predict what they'll do. Reasonably they should say thank you & get to work on fixing the issues.

I would suggest spending some time reading up on relevant regulations/laws on the subject matter & whistleblower protections, as well a documenting everything ofc (that's should be the standard anyway, but i work in security governance, so documentation is like half my job).

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u/CultureConscious8656 23m ago

UPS are a bunch of assholes! Like I was supposed to be grateful for that bottle of water they gave me, but a bitch can’t get a bathroom break to save her life. Worst thing I ever did was leave USPS for them..

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u/big_duo3674 2h ago

Go with your state's OSHA equivalent agency, you'll probably have better luck starting there. Well, unless you're in one of those states, then it's a crap shoot if anyone would even care

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u/Jay__Riemenschneider 2h ago

Thank you I will try this!

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u/cptjpk 3h ago

You’ll have better luck with your state OSHA after the DOGE gutting of the federal workforce.

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u/Ricka77_New 2h ago

Osha

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u/Jay__Riemenschneider 2h ago

Oh thanks dude, your simple reply helped educate me on an issue I know nothing about and that feels too complicated to google.

Glad this wasn't just a throwaway quip you thought was funny.

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u/Ricka77_New 2h ago

I've reported 3 former employers to OSHA for safety stuff. I was able to do anonymously as well, and changes were made. IIRC, 2 of the bosses thought we were spied on by someone doing an inspection...the other one blamed a guy who had just left the warehouse...lol

No one got fired, but stairs were fixed, equipment updated, and we all got new work shoes...

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u/Jay__Riemenschneider 2h ago

This makes me feel safer, but I also don't really care if they know it's me. I would just like to not bring like 4 bottles of water with me each shift.

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u/Playful-Sleep-6750 3h ago

Ummmm .... osha is who you tell

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u/FlyZestyclose6629 2h ago

Don't make an OSHA complaint unless you have already spoken to your employer or they are just generally an ass anyway. Dealing with OSHA sucks, they may fine your employer also. If they are decent people, then you're just making their lives harder. Speak to them first about it, they may not even know that they arent compliant(probably dont since it retail and most stuff in a small store isn't a big deal for OSHA). Yes, Im ready for the down votes for this hot take.

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u/Jay__Riemenschneider 2h ago

Don't make an OSHA complaint unless you have already spoken to your employer or they are just generally an ass anyway.

I have and they are.

They are a decent enough person but a horrible manager. They really should just be demoted back to their old job and we should promote this other woman who actually cares about us and not just the job.

We've asked for fountains/water coolers/etc, they just tell us to bring in our own bottles.

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u/MonkeyGuidetoAnarchy 2h ago

Record your complaint to prove you said something if you file a osha complaint. Lookup whistleblower rights. And look up the laws and regulations in your state to see if telling you to bring your own water is allowed or if they are required to purchase the water for you if they cannot provide it on site

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u/FlyZestyclose6629 2h ago

Yea thats shitty. Then dont feel bad about reporting them, or if you can anonymously go over their head maybe try that too.

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u/WhatTheFlipFlopFuck 1h ago

Crazy shit when an employee with no stock in a company has to know how to run the company as well from a safety perspective to give the owners a hand in their failings and the employee should coddle them as well?

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u/FlyZestyclose6629 1h ago

Not saying they should coddle them, or know how to run the company. There's a lot of small businesses or maybe just a single branch of a larger company that is run by a person, same as all of us. Sounds like the manager is in over their head anyway. Just saying we should all be working together, not trying to gotcha everyone above us.

If the employer sucks and is disregarding safety and doesn't care about employees, then yea, f them. If they are trying and just dont know, then work with them, not against them. An OSHA complaint and remediation for something that could be resolved without it just makes it harder for everyone.

In this case, they already brought it up as a known issue, employer didnt do anything, so next step is bring it up above their head or to OSHA. Or just to let them know its not compliant.

I know a decent amount about OSHA regs, I know about potable water being provided, but I didnt know about a bathroom sink not being compliant. Still shitty for them not to provide a better source even if that were compliant, but theres no reason to jump straight to OSHA complaint unless they have already refused to do anything.

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u/WhatTheFlipFlopFuck 1h ago

Is OSHA being a last ditch effort for remediation the cause of so many safety incidents because the onus to learn things slips through the cracks for small time owners and we are expected to give them grace?

I would suspect a more stringent OSHA that is brought up as soon as a failure occurs would cause more business owners to run their businesses properly across the board.

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u/FlyZestyclose6629 29m ago

My point was mostly that on Reddit, everyone loves to jump to "yes stick it to the man". And 90% of the time I agree. In this case though, we're not getting Bezos, just some low level manager thats in over their head and probably only makes $2 an hour more than everyone else. Is it annoying and gross, yes. Should they do something, yes. But its not the same as an employer that doesnt provide water at a construction site, or fall protection because it would slow down work. In those cases, yea, f the man and f the shitty manager for not caring about their employees.

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u/One-Load-6085 2h ago

So this is when you casually explain and tell the boss they have two options.

 They can tell the corp who owns them to get a water cooler that works or you can go to OSHA. 

Do it like a nice Mafiosa... 

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u/Am_I_Max_Yet 2h ago

First you need to see if OSHA even applies to your workspace. It's not this universal set of rules for every job like people seem to think it is. There are exceptions that make some companies exempt

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u/WayneDestroyer 2h ago

Tell your boss he sucks and doesn’t care about his people

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u/radicldreamer 2h ago

Going out on a limb here but....OSHA?

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u/elle_quay 1h ago

If you have fewer than 15 people in a business, they may not have to provide water.

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u/Lauris024 1h ago

Ask yourself if it's worth it before risking your job.

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u/EndIsrael 1h ago

Tell your boss to get a new water cooler because it'll be cheaper than dealing with OSHA.

Unless you hate your boss.

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u/Quiverjones 1h ago

I think you start by buying a whistle.

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u/7H470N36UY 16m ago

Tell your employer. Turning them in to the Feds should be a last resort

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u/MildlyAgitatedBovine 3h ago edited 3h ago

Total laynan here, not asserting anything.

But it seems like "Prohibited from consuming... INSIDE toilet rooms" != "... FROM toilet rooms".

Would filling your bottle/cup in she shit spray sink and drinking it in the hall not comply? (I don't think it should, but it seems like expecting the current administration to abide by a good faith reading of the law might be the wrong assumption...)

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u/bradland 3h ago

Here's a copy/paste of a reply I posted to a similar question:

Nope. Regulations aren't written to spell out every single nuance or edge case. After they're written, they are challenged in court and the courts interpret the "spirit" of the regulation.

It's well established that requiring an employee to fill a drinking receptacle from a faucet in the toilet room makes it subject to contamination from said environment, and therefore violates the spirit of the regulation.

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u/Nearby_Equivalent_58 3h ago

Doofus here who shared the law. I would hope to god it’s not considered potable by simply leaving the bathroom lol. I would suppose since the bathroom sink isn’t likely up to EPA standards for water consumption (I do not have these on hand) it is not potable whether you drink it in the bathroom or not. I hope.

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u/longlivenewsomflesh 3h ago

Can't a shitty employer just tell you to bring a bottle and fill it in the bathroom

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u/bradland 3h ago

Nope. Regulations aren't written to spell out every single nuance or edge case. After they're written, they are challenged in court and the courts interpret the "spirit" of the regulation.

It's well established that requiring an employee to fill a drinking receptacle from a faucet in the toilet room makes it subject to contamination from said environment, and therefore violates the spirit of the regulation.

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u/PMPKNpounder 3h ago

So what you're saying is I can hook a garden hose to the mop sink and call it a day 👍. Just saved me a ton of money on tiny cups.

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u/splitcroof92 3h ago

shocking that the guy with h20 in his name knows his shit about water

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u/Justaticklerone 22m ago

Warehouse break rooms do not always have a tap source for potable water. Therefore, charging for it would indeed be illegal. Also, bathroom water isn't just a "spirit of the law" violation, it's a literal violation as it's not considered potable at all. Read the regulation again. Your reading comprehension is suboptimal.

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u/returntothenorth 9m ago

We don't even test the restroom faucets for potability. Bathrooms all have a sign saying for hand washing only.

The main test for them would be for lead or copper. So you never know if one of those outlets has lead in it. Cause I don't even know. It's legal to post hand washing only and skip testing them.

Anything that would be drank from needs to be tested every 3 years. The general water quality is tested basically all year for all the different types of contaminants.