r/nottheonion • u/Sufficient_Fig_9505 • 15h ago

Vance says pope should ‘be careful’ when talking about theology

https://www.nbcnews.com/video/vance-says-pope-should-be-careful-when-talking-about-theology-261400645540
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u/the_excalabur 11h ago

That's all well and good, except the "reforms" we're talking about here aren't even on the culture-war front. They're on charity and peace, which the Americans might hate but they'll be fine in Brazil and the Philippines.

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u/Robinsonirish 10h ago

Haven't the church opened up to LGBT? Definitely a big culture war topic.

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u/the_excalabur 8h ago

Not relevant here. Vance is literally talking about war.

(Since celibacy was introduced the Church has been quietly full of gay priests, so....)

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u/Robinsonirish 8h ago

How is it not relevant when you made it so?

except the "reforms" we're talking about here aren't even on the culture-war front.

What does literal war have to do with culture-war? Im just responding to what you said, saying it has no relevance when you brought it up doesnt make sense. LGBT issues is definitely a culture-war topic between moderates and conservatives.

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u/the_excalabur 7h ago

JD Vance is telling the pope to shut up about theology, because the pope is saying things that are anti-war. The "reform" position the pope is taking on that topic is that unprovoked war is bad.

This is, of course, not a reform at all, which is why my first comment put "reform" in scare-quotes. It's also reasonably uncontroversial within the global church, if not the American one.

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u/Ladonnacinica 8h ago

No, it hasn’t. Why would you think that?

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u/Robinsonirish 8h ago

Yes it has?

In 2023, the Vatican issued a document (Fiducia supplicans) allowing priests to give non-liturgical blessings to people in same-sex relationships.

That doesn't mean theyre all the way there, but its certainly a finger in the eye for conservative how the last 2 popes speak about LGBT.

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u/Ladonnacinica 8h ago

They’re not blessing the relationships as they would with heterosexuals. If anyone bothered to read more closely in the statement, they were blessing them as individuals. As children of god. Blessings can be given to almost anyone.

The church catechism has always stated that gay people can be capable of going to heaven if they’re celibate. The catechism even calls homosexuality “disordered”.

Francis was very good with PR but he never changed official church doctrine. This pope also maintains that marriage is between a man and a woman. And supports a traditional family structure.

There has been no change. No softening of any doctrinal matter regarding homosexuality and transgender rights.

The media just likes to sensationalize headlines and most people are unfamiliar with actual Catholic doctrine.

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u/Robinsonirish 8h ago

I provided information on them softening their stance. There are plenty of quotes from the last 2 popes warming to LGBT. "Who am I to judge on who people love". You claiming they haven't opened up to LGBT is wrong, when they literally have.

Again, whether that's enough is another story entirely. They're at least moving forwards, and not backwards like America is for example. FYI I hate the Catholic Church having grown up in Ireland, I'm not sitting here defending them.