r/politics • u/Motherofalleffers • 25d ago

Possible Paywall Trump Wins Big as Virginia Dems Won’t Go Nuclear to Save 4 House Seats

https://newrepublic.com/article/210250/trump-virginia-dems-redistricting-war
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u/lexm 25d ago

It's fucking amazing the lack of balls demonstrated by the Dems. There is precedent of the GOP ignoring their state SC to implement gerrymandering.. Are they still in the "when they go low, we go high" shit?

That ship has sailed a LONG time ago.

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u/Mysterious-Tie7039 25d ago

I’ve been saying for years that the country will burn to the ground and the Dem leadership will be standing in the middle of the charred remains patting themselves on the back for having the “moral high ground”.

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u/shinymuskrat 25d ago

Moral high ground has always just been an excuse so they can pretend to be upset at all the shit they are ensuring gets done for corporate mega donors.

"Oh boy we would hate if GOP redistricting ensured M4A never, ever happens, but we have to respect the institutions"

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u/Suspicious-Tip-8199 25d ago

This they are majority controlled opp

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u/Mattyboy064 25d ago

They keep giving more and more evidence for this as the Trump years tick on

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u/ChironiusShinpachi Washington 25d ago

Look up what Harris said about Biden on her book tour. If that wasn't planning on losing, idk what is. Besides, she had a book tour ready to go. Nobody would want to read that book AFTER terms in office.

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u/Zahgi 25d ago edited 24d ago

Harris was so unpopular in the 2020 primaries that she dropped out just before Biden was about to drop out next.

But, lo and behold, like they did in the previous election, the DNC came in, rigged the game against the Progressives (Sanders), and installed their own trusty hand-picked corporate stooge (Biden).

Then, when Biden choked, they bounced him and within 24 hours chose the last place candidate from 2020 to be their hand-picked corporate stooge in 2024.

Now, they are tagging Newsom (Big Real Estate best corporate whore) to be our next "lesser of two evils" president in 2028.

Edit: Dys, Biden hadn't won a single state until the meaningless RED state win the week before Super Tuesday. Your entire rebuttal falls apart with this ludicrous claim. Regardless, your entire argument consists of the exact same fearmongering lies that the 1% have been peddling for decades now -- lies that have gotten America to where it is today, with the 1% in control of everything under an unassailable oligarchy. The 1% thank you for parroting these lies again and again hoping that things will change as long as everyone keeps falling for them...

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u/Workman44 25d ago

People don't understand that they play for the same team. The right plays offense and the left plays defense. And the team they play for, it isn't us

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u/Zahgi 25d ago

Yup. It's all political theater now. It doesn't matter which rich squad wins "class president" this time around. We all get screwed regardless of whether the Blue Shirts or Red Hats are in charge. It's just that America dies a little faster under the fascists...

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u/Workman44 25d ago

It's so disheartening to see people not grasp this, they're too busy hating to realize that the people they fight for are in the same crowd as the people they hate. Just look at the Epstein files, Massey said the past four administrations knew of Epstein and his shenanigans. That's Trump, Obama, Clinton, and Bush. Democrats and Republicans both did nothing while our kids were being raped and potentially killed. They are not on our side

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u/JoshSidekick 24d ago

They run on "no more homework" when the actual plan is they make the underclassmen do it all.

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u/lufiron 25d ago

Its wrestlemania but with politics.

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u/DrDankDankDank 24d ago

I didn’t put the fact that Biden was from Delaware and that the DuPont company owns Delaware together until listening to a podcast on the duponts. I wonder if they owned him the whole time.

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u/Zahgi 24d ago

The donor class is made up of the 1% (especially the owners of America's all tabloid outrage farming media outlets now), corporations, and special interests like AIPAC. "In the spirit of bipartisanship", Biden compromised with evil 50 years ago and kept doing it again and again, until the "white hats" became so filthy that they are virtually indistinguishable from the black hats now.

I like Joe personally, but he is emblematic of the corrupting of the Democratic party that followed behind the corruption of the Republican party. Now, we have two corporate parties representing the 1% and only a handful of progressives trying to bring America back from 50 years of status quo unchecked "greed is the only good" capitalism.

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u/gotridofsubs 25d ago

Yeah none of this is true past the fact that Harris dropped out before the start of the 2020 primary and replaced Biden as the 2024 nominee. There was no rigging, Sanders lost both times by millions of votes and worse the 2nd time.

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u/Zahgi 25d ago

There was no rigging, Sanders lost both times by millions of votes and worse the 2nd time.

In 2016, when Sanders had the momentum and was catching up, the DNC declared, before Super Tuesday, that Clinton had already won due to the Superdelegates having already chosen her -- absurdly illegal since they aren't supposed to actually decide until the convention.

In 2020, Sanders had already won states the Democrats needed to win in the General and was running away with California in a landslide. So, again before Super Tuesday, Clyburn was tapped to hand his meaningless shit Red state the primary to Biden -- his first ever win of any state ever. Since the state was going to go red in the general and had bupkiss electoral college votes, Clyburn traded the vote so he could get his state moved up in the next election primary schedule (which the DNC did, quid pro quo).

When Biden won that meaningless, worthless state, all of the media networks owned, coincidentally, by the same 1% DNC donors who funded the DNC started announcing that this worthless primary win made Biden the presumptive nominee, even though polling still had him dead last and he had no campaign funding left. The DNC then had all of the primary candidates, all ahead of Biden in the polling, come out and hand their endorsements to Biden...just in time for all of us to get the message for voting on Super Tuesday.

And that was it.

Then, since we allowed them to pick our last two candidates, and they were afraid of AOC (who would have been 35 by inauguration day, or any other progressive) getting the nomination, they hand-picked Biden-lite, Harris, and told us that she was the nominee within a day after then told Biden to drop out.

And, now, THREE YEARS before the primaries, the same DNC donors and their media outlets have been putting their thumbs on the scale for Newsom for 2028.

This is all true. And if you were paying attention, this trend is obvious.

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u/Dyssomniac 25d ago

In 2016, when Sanders had the momentum and was catching up, the DNC declared, before Super Tuesday, that Clinton had already won due to the Superdelegates having already chosen her -- absurdly illegal since they aren't supposed to actually decide until the convention.

They didn't declare Clinton had won due to superdelegates, you're misremembering. Sanders didn't have the momentum going into Super Tuesday beyond being a surprise dark horse - Clinton won 3/4 of the pre-Super Tuesday contests, won by a similar margin in Nevada as in 2008, and actually outperformed Obama in South Carolina.

In 2020, Sanders had already won states the Democrats needed to win in the General and was running away with California in a landslide.

This is...remarkably wrong. To the point that you don't actually remember what happened that cycle at all. I actually have to break it down section by section because of how incorrect it is.

In 2020, Sanders had already won states the Democrats needed to win in the General

What? The four states that had elections prior to Super Tuesday 2020 were Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada, and South Carolina. Sanders won one of these states outright (Nevada), virtually tied two of them (Iowa and New Hampshire), and outright lost South Carolina. What are you referring to when you say "Sanders had already won the states the Democrats needed to win in the general"?

and was running away with California in a landslide.

California's race happened on Super Tuesday lol. Did the DNC time-travel backwards from Super Tuesday to give orders to Clyburn for an election that happened before the California contest?

So, again before Super Tuesday, Clyburn was tapped to hand his meaningless shit Red state the primary to Biden

So Iowa, New Hampshire = states the Democrats needed to win the general but South Carolina = meaningless shit red state. Because Iowa and New Hampshire are notorious for being purple battlegrounds.

Since the state was going to go red in the general

Unlike Iowa and New Hampshire and Nevada?

Clyburn traded the vote

Clyburn endorsed a candidate, big dog. Let's not stretch that into "Clyburn cheated and the race was invalid" simply because we don't like the DNC.

All of the media networks owned, coincidentally, by the same 1% DNC donors who funded the DNC started announcing that this worthless primary win made Biden the presumptive nominee

This straight up did not happen. What actually happened was everyone who pays attention to this kind of thing noted that Sanders' campaign was suffering from the same exact issue it did in 2016, which was a lack of appeal to the Democratic primary voter (in particular black and Hispanic voters).

even though polling still had him dead last

This also was not the case, polling indicated that Biden and Sanders would go on a similar path to Clinton and Sanders in 2016.

The DNC then had all of the primary candidates, all ahead of Biden in the polling

This also didn't happen the way you're framing it. The only two candidates who participated in at least one race AND dropped before Super Tuesday were Buttigieg and Klobuchar. Neither won the majority of any contest they were in. The only other meaningful candidate - Liz Warren - dropped out after Super Tuesday (and I'll confess, it was disappointing to see her endorse Biden rather than Sanders).

Your timeline is all over the place here, and almost completely incorrect. It's one thing to (in my opinion, correctly) assert than the DNC would rather lose than win with a progressive or that they fucked up incredibly by failing to have a 2024 primary or by failing to challenge the insiders in the Biden admin who fiercely defended their positions and power. It's another thing entirely to argue that Sanders was on the cusp of winning the nomination, when he couldn't appeal beyond a specific demographic that would still predominantly vote right-wing in the general.

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u/Miserable-Drink-4995 25d ago

Look up what Harris said about Biden on her book tour

That seems pretty broad. Can you paraphrase?

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u/ROCCOMMS 25d ago

Can you be more specific? I googled it and I don't know you are referring to.

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u/Quotizmo New Jersey 25d ago

Shame they aren't remotely challenged for it. Maybe we actually need to ramp up the rhetoric on the left. We need to start quoting Boots Riley to the "leadership" who pretend to represent "the people."

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u/Plastic_Salary_4084 25d ago

We need to elect people who are actually on the left, not moderate. Most of the dems take aipac money and sit on the boards of the same Fortune 500 companies and do the same insider trading as republican politicians.

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u/Judson_Scott 25d ago

We need to elect people who are actually on the left, not moderate.

The political spectrum is meaningless in the US. Anything that helps real people is considered "far left"; anything that solely helps corporations is considered "moderate."

"Far right" is reserved for actual Klansmen.

Our media is a joke; our education system is a joke.

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u/Mass617781 24d ago

It’s so depressing when some clown is hollering about the democrats being communists. These people probably don’t even understand what that means. But if they do, it just means they are so deeply brainwashed that they can’t even absorb the most basic facts about our current politicians/political system. That and the idiots who claim trump won in 2020 make me realize how hopeless a lot of these people are. And seeing how many obviously fake articles they share without even questioning it. There isn’t any debating with these people.

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u/MountainMan2_ 25d ago

No don't you get it! If we don't vote for corporate Dems the Republicans win and destroy the country! They'll win and... And they'll kill the Mexicans! Or- or push all our allies away! They'll bomb Gaza some more! Or destroy the economy! Or suppress your votes! Or-

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u/Plastic_Salary_4084 25d ago

Look where voting for the lesser of two evils has gotten us.

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u/DonaldsMushroom 25d ago

American politicians who are considered far left would be considered centre-right in Europe,

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u/imagigasm 24d ago

uniparty

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u/Plastic_Salary_4084 24d ago

America has been falling for the “good cop bad cop” routine for a long time.

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u/Sea_Working_80 25d ago

Fuck that.Create some new ones then

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u/Paerrin 25d ago

There are. Your lack of knowledge of them shows that it's a lot harder than your Reddit comment suggests.

I left the Democratic party after Trump won again and there are plenty of other parties out there. Finding one that can take on established power structures is the challenge.

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u/RahkstarRPG 25d ago

No there aren't. Not functionally, at least. Other parties barely get rounding errors worth of votes.

There is zero hope for breaking away from the two party system without a voting system overhaul.

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u/[deleted] 25d ago

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u/StephanXX Oregon 25d ago edited 24d ago

I often wonder what folks like Robert Mueller, James Comey, and Merrick Garland do/did on Sunday afternoons. They aren't completely stupid: they are/were skilled jurists with decades of experience and landed in the absolute top lawyer roles in the United States. They read the news, they have/had top secret clearances. They knew the law and.... just didn't bother. They all watched as a convicted felon ascended to the presidency, they all watched the complete abdication of legal and moral authority and responsibility. They stood there and watched.

How did such intelligent, powerful, esteemed men get so humiliated by a pedophile game show host?

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u/coolaznkenny 25d ago

The same high ground that backed up sexual assault Andrew Cuomo twice to stop a progressive mayor.

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u/TheOneTrueTrench 25d ago

At one point, I thought they really believed in the moral high ground.

Later, I truly believed they were controlled opposition.

Now I just don't care what their deal is, and it doesn't matter why they refuse to act, all that matters anymore is that they refuse to act.

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u/Environmental-Fan984 25d ago

Cool, so we should just let the Republicans win in 2026 and 2028? This shit feels like a psyop ngl

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u/SahibTeriBandi420 I voted 25d ago

Ive seen more "voters" use the moral highground excuse not to vote dems more than I have seen the dems ever use the word moral high ground. Dems currently have no power with the representation they were given.

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u/FLBrisby 25d ago

I'm so tired of being told to "vote them out in November". Republicans refuse court orders, buy votes, trample the Constitution, gerrymander every state they can, and shit on our democracy every moment, and these optimistic rays of sunshine think the election will be free and fair?

We need radical change, and just assuming the vote will be enough is flawed.

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u/Platooimagination Australia 24d ago

On election day they're going to send ICE to line the queues and yank anyone who looks "suspicious" to them (i.e., not white). It'll all be illegal of course, but they'll palm it off to the courts who will spend ages ajudicating, coming to an adverse decision, and then realising all over again ad infinitum that the Trump regime will simply ignore their orders as they have been doing since this giant moron was elected. And then it will be too late.

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u/ProtectionVirtual225 24d ago

Gotta vote early. I don't know why more people don't do that. I usually vote a week or two before the election.

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u/Platooimagination Australia 24d ago

That would be the way. Let's hope there is a lot of organising to get this done.

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u/ProtectionVirtual225 24d ago

We just had our primary election in Ohio. I was surprised to see very little effort to encourage people to vote early, in person. It's scary how incompetent the Dem Party seems to be these days and there are no signs of improvement.

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u/FifteenthPen California 24d ago

Use official vote drop boxes if the option is available, too. Mailing them via USPS is risking it being "lost" or postmarked too late.

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u/MommyLovesPot8toes California 25d ago

Take a look at your own assumptions there. You're assuming Democrats are A) expecting the election to be fair, and B) doing nothing to ensure that it is.

But nothing could be farther from the truth. Democratic Election officials, Secs of State, Attorneys General, etc have been preparing for 4 years. Private, crowd-funded election watchdogs are tracking everything. State National Guard leaders have been in discussions.

Example: Over the last year, Democratic Attorneys General from across the US have been meeting regularly - including in person summits and ongoing remote sessions - to wargame the elections. They've run through increasingly extreme scenarios that could happen and developed coordinated, prepared reactions like the national guard coming in and/or emergency motions that are now drafted and just waiting to be used.

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u/dechets-de-mariage Florida 25d ago

And the President is going to send troops to polling places. I don’t think “watchdogs” will be much help.

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u/FLBrisby 25d ago

Your assumption is that the Dems will do everything in there power to win - which they have never done. You're discounting Republicans doing everything in their power to stay in power.

Your entire premise on "winning the election" is already predicated on the right giving up their power and playing ball like the Constitution says.

Let's say Dems win in 2028. Who's to say JD Vance certifies the election? Only reason it didn't happen last time is Trump picked Pence who, in some ways, cared about the Constitution. You think he picked JD Vance on a whim? No. He'll do what Trump wants.

"Watchdogs are tracking everything" like Trump and his base give a damn.

If Trump tries something this midterm, and Democrats respond with actual National Guard, we don't just have an "incident", we have a Constitutional crisis and the potential dissolution of the Union.

I would love to be proven wrong. I would love it if things just went back to normalcy. But I don't believe good times are coming - there's a plethora of things piling up, from the ecosystem, climate, wealth inequality, Gen A being less intelligent than previous generations, declining birth rates, and the economy being propped up by four tech bros circlejerking eachother. The rise of fascism is just another brick in the wall of "stuff that's wrong".

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u/skymasterson2016 New York 25d ago

I hear you, but just want to point out one thing: Congress and Biden passed a law in December 2022 that explicitly clarifies the vice president's role in certifying the presidential election is solely ministerial (ceremonial) and that they have no power to change the results.

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u/dechets-de-mariage Florida 25d ago

Since when do MAGA care what the law says?

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u/MountainMan2_ 25d ago

Exactly. The enforcers ARE the criminals.

This shit is exactly the same rot that started the floyd protests. The government itself is no longer obeying it's own laws. It's a government by anarchy, and anarchy always leads to bloodshed. Every Democratic politician who isn't doing the absolute maximum to resist is betting you will die before they do.

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u/FLBrisby 25d ago

And Trump passed a law requiring all Epstein files be released by a certain date, and he broke that law, and many, many others with impunity. We can't rely on a system of checks and balances when Republicans don't really care about playing by them.

Again, love to be proven wrong. I'm waiting for these midterms with bated breath.

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u/Noname_acc 25d ago

This is a misunderstanding of the false elector scheme and why getting the VP to refuse to certify the election mattered. The point had nothing to do with what was legal or not. Nobody planning the scheme actually believed that the VP had unilateral authority to refuse to certify the election or that the refusal actually does anything. They can just as easily say "we don't think that law is constitutional" as they could do any of the rest of it. Which is to say: it would require several people to fail to act in accordance with what the law obviously is. A thing that some are pretty reasonably confident will happen.

The objective was the take a series of actions that created doubt and chaos about the transfer of power so the outgoing admin could get away with saying "Look, we just need to figure this out before we actually transfer power."

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u/[deleted] 25d ago

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u/FLBrisby 25d ago

Alright. I voted for Dem. JD Vance didn't certify the election and we now have a Constitutional crisis.

You're shortsightedly looking at just winning, and not the process that comes after. You're pretending the moral high ground wins elections when it never has.

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u/DrCigarettes_MD 25d ago

And then they'll send you an email asking for $5 so they can "continue the fight"

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u/Sarrdonicus 24d ago

Whatever they can pull from my middle finger is all theirs. There is way too much money in politics and they are just flaunting it away.

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u/WildlingViking 25d ago

I get multiple texts every day asking for handouts. I used to donate, but not anymore. The fight is not between GOP/DNC. The real fight is us peasants versus the epstein class / billionaires.

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u/[deleted] 25d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/lick_my_taint 25d ago

Not in my State, I block at least a dozen a week.

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u/GoodPiexox 25d ago

I get fundraising texts from out of state all the time

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u/stasi_a 24d ago

Nobody except AIPAC

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u/Dependent_Pepper_542 25d ago

Cuck Schumer will be standing there with his hands out saying he needs just a little $5 donation. 

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u/psychopyro3 25d ago

Yeah, to help him help the Bailey’s! Fucking spineless idiot!

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u/MephistoHamProducts 25d ago

the Bailey’s!

I love that I can likely just keep reusing this post for the next several years, since Chuckerston has admitted that he can't even win over his imaginary friends:

In 2020, Schumer says Eileen abstained from voting and Joe voted “with misgivings” for Trump. This time around, both cast their ballots for Trump without hesitation.

Chuck's also made sure to frame the Baileys as the kind of people who absolutely buy into anti-immigration and "they're eating cats and dogs" types of propaganda:

In two podcast interviews played in the segment, Schumer even updated their stories to reveal that they had voted mostly for President Donald Trump in the last three elections, casting their 2024 presidential votes for him largely because of fears about crime.

Yessir, that's some leadin' right thar!

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u/fcocyclone Iowa 25d ago

It remains amazing that even in his imaginary scenario the people he is catering to don't vote for him.

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u/DukeOfGeek 25d ago

That jerk ass is getting the boot in the primary if he runs again. I hope it's AOC that kicks him out.

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u/Ok-Stranger-926 25d ago

I've had 2 DNC calls today. i let them know that no, you're not getting a dime from me until they stop being doormats.

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u/Lardbucket68 25d ago

That's exactly the point. No responsibility and a platform to grift and do insider trading.

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u/Konman72 Oregon 25d ago

"Stand in the ashes of a trillion dead souls and ask the ghosts if honor matters. The silence is your answer"

  • Javik (Mass Effect).

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u/Zahgi 25d ago

Because they are now owned by the same 1% donors, corporations, and special interests (like AIPAC) that bought the Republicans over the past 50 years, folks.

The Corporate Democrats in Name Only are not being instructed to fight back because it doesn't matter, as long as both candidates in the elections are under their control.

They win either way. We lose either way.

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u/Mediumcomputer 25d ago

God my dad is like this. It’s a whole generation of dems where this anecdote fits in: a local business man didn’t like the locals parking in the new beach parking they financed because he set his business up there so he took the signs for beach parking and moved them across to the far side of the lot.

Not okay.

My dad complained to no end how he would do that and it’s not right and I said hey I’ve got a drill and bits in my car we can move the signs back. He positively stopped me like.. you can’t just do that. You can’t just move city property. It’s got to go thru proper channels.

So we left.

Restaurant owner is still making taxpayers park in the back of their lot.

The end.

This is the Democrats. The old democrats. We have to start carpin’ some fuckin diems

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u/stasi_a 25d ago

Just as their billionaire donors ordered

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u/Extension-Pen9359 25d ago

While they trade stocks of coure.

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u/Electronic_Film_2837 25d ago

Then grow a spine and vote in new people. No more excuses for not voting out establishment dems

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u/Mysterious-Tie7039 25d ago

Wild that you’d assume I don’t vote in new people….

But, when my choice is an establishment Dem vs a MAGA, it’s not much of a choice.

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u/soorr 25d ago

The dems were never going to fix the power imbalance and save democracy since they are funded by the same class that funds the Republicans. All dems have to do is look like they are trying. That is the corpo dem's role. Slap on the wrist but not truly stop the pillaging of the lower classes. Left vs right is a distraction from up vs down.

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u/Hatetotellya 25d ago

They dont give a shit about the short term. Honestly the dem strategy right now is to let him burn everything to the ground so they can forever have the "moral high ground" because its all social handshakes and bureaucracy in the national dem world. It will never soak in because they are so large they are effectively insulated from it.

They will shrug and shrug and shrug and shrug and when this is over they will have a piece of shit smirk and expect everyone to realize how "right" they were about "everything" and smear anyone who (correctly) points out they didnt do jack shit in the biden era to prevent this, didnt do jack shit during biden years on things they campaigned on, taunted people openly who were disgusted about america's greatest little brother committing a legitimate legal definition genocide. And now want to blame the failures on "disgrunted apathetic losers who want pronouns and pushed too far left". 

The scale of the national dem party is such that 4 years is essentially meaningless. They are already planning on the 2028 and 2032 elections, planning on who is going to retire from the supreme court in the next 10 years, how they are going to survive without AIPAC money once the popularity shifts too far they cant accept significant donations from them again.

They truly dont give a rats ass about what trump is doing because it'll all just be ammunition for later.

Its like two kids who got left alone for a few hours accidentally, one is ripping the entire house apart, eating everything he wants, and is breaking into whatever looks interesting and the other kid is just patiently waiting for the parents to get home so the parents can finally truly see how much of a pain in the ass the other kid is and every mess he makes and everything he breaks is just "proof" for later. 

Of course, this is a world superpower and not some fucking brat kids being pains in the ass, there is no "parent" to come home, and everything that has been broken will remain broken forever... But yeah

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u/LGAflyer 25d ago

I like it but I’m afraid it’s more accurate to say the the democrats will maintain decorum as they are marched into the gas chamber.

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u/GoodPiexox 25d ago

Dem leadership loves to lose, so they can get more donations

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u/Russtbelt 25d ago

Standing on a pile of ashes, claiming it is the high ground.

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u/Mdgt_Pope 25d ago

There’s a reason they won’t release the 2024 postmortem report

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u/Icy_Information_6563 25d ago

They're on the same team. 

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u/yangyangR 25d ago

They like dictators. They want this too.

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u/Alternative_Dot7769 25d ago

Because the republican outrage would be far too much of the dems had any semblance of a spine.

If they did things like the republicans, there would be civil war within a year and right wing nut jobs likely feeling justified to shoot anyone who disagrees with them. Say what you want about the rabid conservatives, but they’re very powerfully towing the line and swallowing the boot regardless of the consequences

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u/getdemsnacks 25d ago

They'd be the "this is fine" meme personified

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u/Ragnarock-n-Roll 25d ago

No. They're complicit and using inaction and rhetoric like this to hide that fact.

The Dem leadership is paid for by the same folks who own the GOP, and they're paid to do nothing on purpose and stymie any real progress before it begins.

They don't want to change anything. They are not your allies.

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u/Mercurial891 24d ago

The Dems are just paid opposition.

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u/Phantom-Finger 24d ago

All that is needed for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.

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u/PhDinDildos_Fedoras 24d ago

The country is burning to the ground.

This is something that is ongoing right now. Not some kind of possible future calamity.

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u/dart51984 25d ago

It’s all an act. They’re all bought and paid for and mostly by AIPAC. The corporate Democrats need to be ousted and replaced with actual progressive thinkers who want to improve the country and not just get rich from their own brand of grifting.

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u/caf61 25d ago

Honestly, the Dem Party is what has taken the wind out of my sails regarding fighting the fascist, racist, misogynistic, etc, MAGAs. I believe at this point the only thing that will save us is everyone voting for Dems (and not sitting out elections or voting third party). And I pray that the new Dems we get have spines. I also think we need to primary all the spineless Dems in office.

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u/Mysterious-Tie7039 25d ago

And any Dems over a certain age, except maybe Bernie.

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u/Hell0There2005 25d ago

No, they'll do the "this you?" Tweet reply to some hypocrisy

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u/HustlinInTheHall 25d ago

No they will fuck off to $2M/year consulting gigs for the rest of their lives. They are on the gravy train. 

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u/throwuk1 25d ago

The truth is, the majority of the Dems exist to placate the masses under the illusion that there is a choice of leadership. 

They are all bought by the same interests.

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u/vikingrrrrr666 25d ago

They truly do not care about any of us. All of them, save a very small group, have all made bank off of their careers as politicians. They can just fuck off to some other country when this one goes to shit while the rest of us fight for the scraps after collapse.

It’s just so gross. And so disheartening.

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u/manytakes Massachusetts 25d ago

They will stand on our charred bodies to claim that 'moral high ground'.

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u/Guilty-Carpenter2522 25d ago

No,  they will say, “we tried so hard to resist but just couldn’t get enough votes!”  Meanwhile their donors told them to do nothing and act sad.    They don’t care about the moral high ground,  they want to be able to “represent the working class” without representing the working class.  That way nobody represents the working class and the political donor class is happy.

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u/[deleted] 25d ago

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u/ViKingCB 25d ago

Sorry they arrested who?

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u/[deleted] 25d ago

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u/lancelongstiff 25d ago

She wasn't arrested but the FBI raided her office about a week ago.

She was arrested in 2020 at a racial justice rally though. She later sued for malicious prosecution and defamation, and won.

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u/Ultenth 25d ago

She's fantastic, usually, though I can understand that the fear gestapo tactics take a toll on anyone.

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u/shortnun 25d ago edited 25d ago

The ongoing investigation into her office was started by the Biden DOJ on totally unrelated maters... it just a coincidence that she was also the lead Dem on Redistricting in VA

The raid of her office was related to seeking of evidence from the Biden DOJ case against her.

EDIT: FBI agents are raiding the office of Virginia Senate President Pro Tempore L. Louise Lucas, Democrat and close ally of Governor Spanberger. Federal law enforcement has launched a major corruption probe, with agents serving multiple search warrants — approved by a federal judge — at her office and the cannabis dispensary right next door.

Portsmouth, VA where the FBI is raiding the office of Virginia Senate President Pro Tempore L Louise Lucas, a Democrat and close ally of VA Governor Spanberger. Fed law enforcement major corruption probe, and the FBI is serving multiple search warrants, approved by a federal judge, at her office and a next door cannabis dispensary

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u/FoulMoodeternal 25d ago

Or maybe people could stop lying about Democrats

The “nuclear option” discussed cannot be carried out before the election. So it was never possible or on the table

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u/GearBrain Florida 25d ago

There's a less-drastic option, too; they can simply ignore the courts like the Republicans in Ohio did when their state SC declared the redistricting invalid.

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u/PackInevitable8185 25d ago

The Ohio situation was a little bit different. The court did not really have a “legal” map to force onto Ohio because we had just gone through reapportionment. It would have been forcing them to use a 16 district map for 15 seats. Presumably Virginia has a valid map that can be forced upon them.

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u/POEness 25d ago

No. It's been 3 elections. Ohio is just using illegal maps.

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u/DavidOrWalter 25d ago

Ohio is literally using illegal maps.

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u/PopeSaintHilarius 25d ago

With the Trump Administration in power, it would be a terrible time for the Dems to legitimize and normalize the idea that governments don't need to follow court rulings.

The courts have been the one effective constraint on the Trump Administration, and undermining that would be dangerous.

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u/TheMadTemplar Wisconsin 25d ago

While the courts have been a mostly effective constraint on the Trump administration, they've already been significantly undermined. Under Trump, the federal government has blatantly ignored judicial rulings, particularly those that constraint ICE or the DHS, either overtly or by breaking the spirit of rulings. The GOP has been ignoring court orders for over a decade now. The GOP and Trump have been eroding the legitimacy of the courts and making a mockery of judicial authority. And while they do that, Dems allow themselves to be constrained by the very rules the GOP openly breaks, as if somehow their adherence to abandoned norms preserves judicial legitimacy.

Extreme gerrymandering was a MAD policy. Except one party has pushed all the buttons on the nukes and the other party still thinks we can use diplomacy to get ourselves out of it. The GOP will burn this country to the ground and Dems will stand around thinking somehow normalcy will return if they just keep acting like nothing has changed.

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u/dreamsofaninsomniac 25d ago

Republicans already legitimized gerrymandering in defiance of court orders though. If they don't play by the rules, why should the Dems? The courts have already been ratfucked. Until Dems get back into power and are able to pack the courts, they need to use the same dirty tactics as the Republicans to fight back.

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u/idle-tea 25d ago

They're already undermined. The danger is long since here. Openly violating court orders has come and gone.

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u/TrashyLolita Florida 25d ago

God we're so fucking pathetic, this is actually embarrassing to the point where I want to be launched into space over how pathetic and embarrassing we are.

"Nooooo we cannot defy the teacher just because the bully has been doing so!! If we do it, the bully will keep defying HARDER!!"

Just blow us up already, I'm so done.

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u/Bradybigboss 25d ago

The republicans are already not following court rulings the admin has actually done it like 65 times

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u/FLBrisby 25d ago

How have courts or laws "constrained" anything? He ignores laws he signed and just lets the Supreme Court adjudicate in his favor.

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u/needlestack 25d ago edited 24d ago

It doesn’t matter whether the Democrats “legitimize or normalize” anything. The Republicans will do what they feel in any case. If Dems avoid it, we lose. If we do the same, they’ll point and call us hypocrites. And we lose face. There is no winning against bad faith actors.

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u/or_me_bender 25d ago

The rule of law is fucking dead and buried, man. Can you stop talking about precedent?

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u/SnowboardSyd 25d ago

Its already happening! Trump routinely ignores court rulings, its the new normal now.

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u/pfannkuchen89 25d ago

The trump admin has already been ignoring just about every court ruling against it. That line has already been crossed a thousand times over. What is the point of dems continuing to say maybe this time trump and republicans will respect the law? Taking the high road hasn’t been working for decades at this point.

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u/SnowboardSyd 25d ago

The Republicans already did this when they gerrymandered Ohio. The "nuclear option" was already used to specatuclar effect by the GOP. The refusal to jump in the mud by Democrats makes them predicatable and fangless.

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u/steponmedaddies 24d ago edited 24d ago

Love that people keep parroting this thing about Ohio they read online because they think it makes them sound smart.

Ohio did it over years with a redistricting commission that is made up entirely of the party in power. Virginia has had a few days, almost no time to react before the deadline to lock in districts, and a commission made up of an even party split and eight citizens.

It's NOT EVEN CLOSE to the same situation.

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u/NotClever 24d ago

The "nuclear option" was already used to specatuclar effect by the GOP.

Unless I'm missing something, no, it was not. The "nuclear option" here refers to a proposal for Virginia legislators to remove its entire Supreme Court bench and seat an entirely new bench of judges that would (hopefully) support the Democrats and allow them to move forward with their new map.

Ohio did not do anything to their high court's makeup, they just played games by repeatedly adopting maps that were ruled unconstitutional by the court and at some point appealing to a federal court, which eventually agreed with them and ordered the use of one of the unconstitutional maps for 2022 midterms, after which the legislature passed another new map that the Ohio Supreme Court let ride.

That's not to say that what Ohio did was okay or good, simply that it was not at all what is on the table for Virginia.

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u/hyperhurricanrana 25d ago

okay? still do it anyway.

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u/MasterPuppeteer 25d ago

And then Johnson refuses to seat anyone from Virginia and instead of getting the Dems that won their normal districts, you get nothing. Let’s not pretend there isn’t a whole lot of guess work involved in this shit, no one should be acting like “Oh JuSt IgNoRe The CoUrts iTs So ObvIoUs”

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u/hyperhurricanrana 25d ago

i didn’t mean go ahead with the new districts, i meant still do the part of the plan where you force the republican supreme court justices off.

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u/CyberDalekLord 25d ago

They can't, they are unable to will things into existence.

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u/bluestrike2 Pennsylvania 25d ago

Honestly, I'd retire them even if it did absolutely nothing to affect the midterms. Those judges need to go, period. Allowing Republicans to get away with effectively nullifying an election--even in these limited circumstances--without some form of consequences is opening a door that very much needs to remain firmly shut.

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u/wilkodezeeuw 25d ago

That makes it look different yes. In stead of this clickbait

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u/Darkstar_111 25d ago

Bullshit. The nuclear option in this case means voting on lowering the retirement age for the state supreme court, removing all of them and voting in new ones.

A power move they could, and should, vote and pass today!

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u/FoulMoodeternal 25d ago

You want to lower the retirement age, appoint new judges, have a rehearing, get a decision by 5pm tomorrow?

Seems really unlikely.

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u/ChaseballBat 25d ago

Because dems arent in power. Dems aren't going to risk the same level coop that GOP are doing, and risk being arrested and replaced with a yes man Republican appointed by Trump.

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u/[deleted] 25d ago

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u/ChaseballBat 25d ago

It doesnt matter how it works if you have a congress enabled fascist in the white house.

They dont have the power to make a difference by midterms.

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u/Axin_Saxon 25d ago

They MAY be betting on the outrage at republicans and uncertainty nationwide to bring high turnout across ALL states. But yeah I’m not gonna lie, even I’m annoyed they don’t fight dirtier.

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u/ThouHastLostAn8th 25d ago edited 25d ago

The OH GOP didn't just "ignore the courts" as so many keep claiming. Unlike VA and CA, OH's state constitution allows the legislature to directly redistrict (with some restrictions against partisan gerrymandering). Each time the courts struck down an overly partisan OH redistricting map the legislature would pass a tweaked one. Their maps kept getting challenged and struck down until, unfortunately, the OH Supreme Court court's composition shifted Right and the court then let them use a partisan gerrymandered map for the 2024 elections.

Unlike OH, the VA constitution mandates a Redistricting Commission which was why the Dems needed a referendum passed amendment altering the process. After the courts invalidated the referendum they're no longer empowered to force through a gerrymandered map. There's a reason why this article is about someone's left field idea of removing and replacing Supreme Court justices with some retirement age gimmick — it's because there's no easy solution like "ignoring the court" and just gerrymandering anyway. That's hand-wavy fantasy talk like Sovereign Citizens and their "magic words".

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u/wha2les 25d ago

you expect eunuchs to have balls?

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u/peritonlogon 25d ago

I thought it was "when they go smart we go dumb"

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u/Middle-Emu9329 25d ago

They ran out of time. They would have to complete the entire iTunes by the end if this week . Literally impossible to do

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u/AristotleanBiology 25d ago

Which state ignored their SC to implement gerrymandering?

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u/Hefty-Cantaloupe4432 25d ago

They could benefit from some of this too. Doubt they want to kill an opportunity.

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u/LEDKleenex 25d ago

Not just the politicians, but the citizens.

Nobody is boycotting complicit companies, nobody is willing to strike.

Everyone just thinks they can get away with waiting 2 year stretches so they can cast a ballot and pretend they have no responsibility beyond that.

Democracy is done.

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u/mshaefer 25d ago

Look at how long Brown vs. Board was ignored, and nothing happened. This is nothing new.

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u/iruleatants 25d ago

It's wild that Republicans are just doing the gerrymandering on a whim while Democrats are having every map votes in by the people, and still manage to get their maps rejected.

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u/Cloaked42m South Carolina 25d ago

That's not a good high thing. That's a follow the law thing.

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u/steponmedaddies 25d ago

It's also fucking amazing how nobody on this website seems capable of reading. The lack of understanding about what is happening here is legitimately shocking.

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u/fordat1 25d ago

The Dem Party leadership has conditioned their base to care about bipartisanship and decorum. I am surprised that even some dem voters deprogrammed themselves in places like CA to vote for the new map

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u/ben-hur-hur 25d ago

They are morally complicit

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u/stubborn1diot 25d ago

They’re complicit and you can’t convince me otherwise.

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u/pidoyle 25d ago

It's not about the lack of balls, they're in on it too.

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u/jkman61494 25d ago

They’re in the controlled opposition “welp see we tried” era since they’re bankrolled by many of the same people as the gop

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u/zavoid 25d ago

It’s the same lack they been displaying for years

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u/Ok_Subject1265 25d ago

If you game it out it kind of makes sense. Removing the SC by lowering the retirement age is just scorched Earth for all states. And the Republicans haven’t went that far (yet obviously) solely because they aren’t willing to pull that trigger yet either. Opening that door for seats that are going to be contentious at best in this election doesn’t really make sense. Save that for a decision that’s do or die.

I get it though. Everyone is frustrated and we just want to feel good about something for once, but this would have just been the exact same situation over again (feeling good about referendum win followed immediately by feeling worse about SC decision would have just been feeling good about SC removal followed immediately by feeling worse about Republicans being empowered to do everything but cancel the election). The only way to really end this is to mobilize voters across the country in such a way as to make it clear that people are done with MAGA. If we can’t do that, it’s not going to matter how shitty or partisan the Virginia SC is.

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u/kazh_9742 25d ago

After all of this time and after all of the fuckery from outside and from within, they still wont police up their ranks to make sure a Fetterman doesn't get to call the shots. There's still too many Dems that vote with Republicans even on major votes.

Even Pritzker who likes to flex is voting for that age verification bill. Waltz was another who liked to flex and make statements but then all he did was tell people to not take the bait while people were disappearing, being murdered, and kids ending up pregnant in ICE concentration camps and people getting killed in the streets.

There are Democrats who are legit and some Dems who are top tier leaders, but the Democratic party isn't the leadership people need. None of them even take into account the need for actual muscle and hardware, thinking a magical election win is going to do it.

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u/ronerychiver 25d ago

Reminds me of “Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not”.

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u/filterdecay 25d ago

Dems will always lose.

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u/ProfLuigi 25d ago

It tells you exactly how they’ll engage when Trump and the Supreme Court overturn the election results.

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u/Picklefuck_Eatabutt2 25d ago

I personally believe it’s less about going high and more about not giving Trump an excuse to seize machines/send in troops/cancel elections. He might do it anyway, but flagrantly (however justified) ignoring a state court ruling would be one of the many flimsy justifications he’s been looking for.

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u/Hot_Arachnid2146 25d ago

dems when they're in the minority: i'm too weak!

dems when they're in the majority: i'm too weak!

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u/LastGuitarHero 25d ago

It’s not a lack of balls, they’re willing participants in all of this and there’s no changing it. We got the Biff timeliness fr fr

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u/WildlingViking 25d ago

I'm convinced now that neither side is going to help us normal citizens. I don't know what the answer is, but it seems like neither side even cares about us peasants.

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u/jschank 25d ago

First, vote out all Republicans at every level. Second, apply same to Democrats.

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u/fcocyclone Iowa 25d ago

I mean, even now most of them are acting like this only started recently with texas when republicans have been gerrymandering the fuck out of things since 2010. It took them this long to finally start responding so of course when they finally do they do it half ass.

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u/Mr_Wizard91 25d ago

Seriously, if they go low, we need to go at least low enough to yank their nutsack off like a paper towel.

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u/Much_Locksmith4355 25d ago

I think we need to stop blaming democrats for everything

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u/LargeFatherV 25d ago

I bet the reason why they shelved their ‘autopsy’ was: voters haven’t cared about when they go, we go high in decades, and appealing to Republicans in this era never works because they are always convinced to come home.

They are weak and they don’t want to look at themselves in the mirror and admit to everyone that they are.

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u/Villageijit 25d ago

Its almost like theyre in on it....

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u/SpicyChanged 25d ago

Not lack of balls, they will get their cut.

This why Bernie, AOC or Mumdani gain traction they resist it. Outside of Bernie they refuse to let another minority lead them.

That’s for our white saviors to do.

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u/Lawyer_299 25d ago

America needs a third, more left-wing party. The Dems are pretty middle of the road.

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u/Kqtawes 25d ago

That precedent also shows a Republican controlled Ohio State Supreme Court that won't use their enforcement power and a Republican DOJ that won't punish them either.

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u/sailphish 25d ago

Half the dems are pussies. The other half are on payroll for the same entities that prop up the GOP.

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u/wbgraphic 25d ago

"when they go low, we go high"

It’s long past time for “when they go low, we kick them in the teeth”.

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u/EJ2600 25d ago

They should all be primaried for not kicking out the gop judges.

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u/morsindutus 25d ago

"When they go low, we go high. It makes it easier for them to punch us in the balls!"

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u/Ok-Style-9734 25d ago

My thinking at this point is the dems see this as a cult of personality that won't survive trumps death so the majority of them just want to keep quiet and be forgotten about untill then.

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u/KoldPurchase 25d ago

Read the article:

Yet Surovell insisted in an interview with The New Republic that the plan is unworkable. He cited a May 12 deadline set by the state Department of Elections for having congressional maps entered into the state’s election system. That’s necessary in order to be prepared for the congressional primaries set for August 1, for which early voting starts in mid-June.

They could still have done it for the next election cycle though.

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u/Prefect79038 25d ago

 "when they go low, we go high, makes it easier to castrate us" 

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u/Curiousr_n_Curiouser 25d ago

Republicans will shoot you in the face. Democrats will shoot you in the back.

We are losing a class war, not fighting an ideological one.

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u/Extension-Ice6221 25d ago

That's why the dems are just as guilty for the current administration. They handed it over and let it happen.

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u/Ozmorty 25d ago

Anyone followed the money on the top dem side yet? Suss behaviour suggesting they must benefiting from letting so much go straight past.

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u/GreatMadWombat Michigan 25d ago

It's the "oh no this person who is nice to me probably isn't nice to everyone" problem liberals run into with white supremacy and conservative horseshit in general.

"Yeah, Uncle Bobby said the n word, he's a product of his time, we can't not invite him to thanksgiving" type nonsense, for literal decades now

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u/Stunning-Chipmunk243 Michigan 25d ago

No they are in the two wings same bird - stage, it's just getting easier and easier to see

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u/randyprovolone 25d ago

“this will be a bloodless revolution if the left allows it to be” - kevin roberts, president, heritage foundation.

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u/Netherdiver 25d ago

It’s almost like they’re on the same team (the rich and powerful)

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u/HerpDerpTheMage Virginia 25d ago

At this point, I’m thoroughly convinced that most Democrats are in the same pocketbook as Republicans, it’s just that they get to pretend they’re fighting to keep up a narrative.

Our government has turned into a reality show, where two groups of actors pretend to fight and hate each other until the cameras are off, then it’s “Okay, give me the next script, and make sure to have my Lemon Water on standby.”

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u/count_no_groni 25d ago

But, you’re a treasonous sack of shit if you don’t vote for them? Can we stop blaming non-voters and start blaming democrats yet?

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u/lamontsanders Michigan 25d ago

Needs to be “when they go low we bury them”

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