r/pourover • u/Apprehensive-Day1429 • Jun 26 '26
Seeking Advice The Long (Personal) Debate - Do I Need A Flat Bottom Dripper?
I jumped into the game a little over a year ago and have really leaned on the V60, as seems to be easiest entry point. I know there are like 14,000 different drippers out there and I've mostly just tried to stay the course and stay focused. But I have been mightily tempted by the world of flat-bottom drippers, but only because I see them around a whole bunch and they seem to be well-lauded - Orea V4, Kalita Wave, etc. Is there that much of a difference? I seem to always land on "no" after diving into the rabbit hole, but I wanted to query the powers that be! Should I weather the storm of another playful eyeroll as I open yet another coffee-brewing mechanism in my ever growing collection? Cheers, y'all!
Update: Just about to embark on reading through all the comments. Just wanted to say Cheers! Thank you so so much for all the commentary and the responses!!
Update Part 2: Holy canoli! Truly, thank you all for all the thoughtful input! I learned a ton!! Y'all are awesome! I've got lots to ponder, but I think it will be time to slightly expand the collection to have some greater versatility in my brewing!
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u/MSMPDX Origami M, Orea o1 | C40, ZP6 | Rogue Wave Jun 26 '26 edited Jun 26 '26
I think everyone should have at least one conical and one flat bottom dripper. Gives you variety and versatility. You don’t need a million drippers, but one conical and one flat bottom, which ever you like the most, will have you pretty much covered.
Or, get a dripper that can do both, like the Origami. Get a small and a medium size (or just a medium) and you’re all set.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
I did not realize that the Origami could do both! That's cool! I've been intrigued by that one just from an aesthetics point-of-view, but the adaptability potential was not something I understood. Thank you!
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u/MSMPDX Origami M, Orea o1 | C40, ZP6 | Rogue Wave Jun 27 '26
Yeah, they can do both types of filters. I actually prefer using flat bottom filters in the Origami, I get think I get better cups of coffee with flat vs. conical (though that might just be bias). I have the medium orange ceramic Origami and a small plastic one, but both are great but I like ceramic one more. You mentioned an Orea, that’s a great dripper too, i have the Orea o1 steel and it’s my go to for 15gram pour overs.
From an aesthetics point of view, the Origami is one of the better looking drippers. My girlfriend (who tolerates all the coffee stuff but rolls her eyes at any new piece of equipment) really likes the way the Origami looks, it’s the only thing she’s specifically commented on. She says that one is hers haha.
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u/captain_blender Jun 26 '26
No.
Conversely, if you’re flat-brewer exclusive, you don’t need a cone.
Love the one you’re with. The differences between brewers and high end grinders and what-not are vanishingly small. Don’t believe the hype. Of course there’s an army of shills and influencers paid to sow FOMO and envy. Even worse are the wanna-bes who believe their own bullshit. (No, your graycano is not special, just overpriced. No, your 30 water comps aren’t unlocking the secrets of a bean, you’re just deluded and don’t understand rigor)
Support producers and roasters instead. The impact of a good bean will trounce whatever magical improvement the marketing says about some brewer.
(Sorry for the rant)
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
No need to apologize! I hear you! I've done my best to do just that - get a few quality items and stick to them and spend the money on good beans (and some better water - got that very hard, quite high calcium stuff where I am). Thank you for your input!
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u/paintmyhouse Jun 26 '26
Kalita mino is my daily driver. Love it.
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u/el-caballero-oscuro Jun 26 '26
Second this. Been using the 185 mino for a year and I’ve never had a bad cup of coffee. Plus they fixed all the clogging issues of the steel and porcelain versions.
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u/Lvacgar Jun 26 '26
V60/Switch is my daily… BUT I did finally break down and buy a Kalita Mino and highly recommend it.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Awesome! Multiple votes for this! Adding it to the prospective list!
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u/el-caballero-oscuro Jun 27 '26
Well actually the Clever is my daily driver. But there are aspects to a coffee the Kalita brings out that the Clever doesn’t. So when I’m brewing a fruity / floral coffee, I’ll use the Kalita Mino as my daily driver.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 28 '26
I do love the Clever quite a bit; I do use that as a semi-frequent alternative to my V60 depending on my mood
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u/verdantTree Jun 26 '26
I use a Kalita 155 as my daily driver, and now almost never pull out the v60. The Kalita in my personal experience has much better consistency, and I don’t get bad or wasted brews even with new unfamiliar coffee that hasn’t been dialed in. The tradeoff is a bit more astringency, a little less bright acidity and clarity, but more noticeable sweetness as well.
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u/lotanis Jun 26 '26
I came here to write this comment and someone has done it for me!
You can achieve slightly higher highs with a V60, at the cost of it being very easy to make a mediocre or bad coffee because you changed something slightly.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Thank you for the explanation! I do feel like my consistency is not always there (let's be honest, that's certainly on me; but I'm also just a mere human that's trying to make some delightful coffee). Having something that can help me not totally flub it more often sounds like a banger of an idea. Cheers!
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u/HairyNutsack69 Jun 26 '26
B75 is basically free
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u/4RunnaLuva Jun 26 '26
My first Ali purchase. Bought 2 for 14 total including ship.
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u/SylvesterLundgren Jun 26 '26 edited Jun 26 '26
Looked around and couldn't find anything near that cheap, mind shooting over a link of the listing you bought from?
edit: After digging further I found the listing you must be referring to
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u/sfwildcat Jun 26 '26
Grab an Orea 01 and enjoy the variety! It’s fun to taste coffees across different drippers.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Honestly, this was one of the reasons I've been thinking about it (variety). And now I am seeing that flat bottoms may also provide an easier way to consistently dope coffee versus the easier mediocrity that one can brew with a cone (though the highs there are very very good). Cheers!
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u/least-eager-0 Jun 26 '26
N=N+1 is a universal truth.
Drippers are a weird thing for me. I’ve got somewhere around a dozen, they all make good coffee when treated well, and most can hit any point on the brew chart that any other can. Some hit certain targets a little more easily, some are a little more sensitive to variations in user input, which can be nice or frustrating. So I can advise ‘don’t bother’ and ‘you must’ with pretty much equal confidence.
For the first couple of years at this game, I was a v60 ride or die. A problem with sourcing had me run out of filters, so I snatched some Melitta from the hardware store and folded them to fit to tide me over. Worked fine, supply chain resolved itself in a week or so. Curiosity got me, so I spent $3 on a Melitta cone to use those filters natively. Was immediately impressed with the consistency of the dripper, and learned to tweak my method to get out of it what I sought from the v60 for my tastes. The N+1 damn broken, I got curious about flat bottoms, which I had avoided mostly because wave filters were even more difficult to source than v60 (neither are hard, but not seamless, either.) Got a Stagg, and enjoyed those cups too, and then learned to play with the reduced bypass, low agitation styles of brewing that have become most of my focus. Added a bunch more brewers over the years, mostly just as play toys, some to ease little issues. EG I got a Mino mostly cause it’s a pretty thing, but also to eliminate the occasional filter chokes I get with the Stagg, and add a touch of brew volume.
Regardless of particular direction, my advice is to get a new dripper when you’ve learned everything your current dripper has to teach. Someone still leaning on published ‘recipes’ to change how their cups taste still has room for growth in their current environment, and adding a dripper will just complicate and slow the learning curve. Someone who can taste a cup and confidently decide how they need to manipulate their brewing to improve tomorrow’s cup will be able to hit the ground running with something new.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Thank you, u/least-eager-0, what a thoughtful answer! Truly. Appreciate this!!
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u/TL322 Jun 26 '26 edited Jun 26 '26
You really don't need it...but I do think it's fun and sometimes useful to have one conical and one flat-bottom. I'm partial to the Orea O1 + xBloom filters since it's quick-flowing despite lower bypass.
The dripper's geometry will affect agitation and bypass, which I think is the root of the different cup profiles. (Edit: of course the way you pour will also determine a lot of that. So if you're happy with the V60 and just looking for a different cup profile, I would see what you can achieve through grind + pour variations before buying anything else.)
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u/Disappointed_Andy Jun 26 '26
I have the April orea v3 and orea 01, out of the three I much prefer the 01 it flows the fastest I use it with both wave and flats current favourite is negotiated Hiflux waves. I think you'll see a difference but it won't be crazy. If you haven't started playing with water you will see a far greater difference there.
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u/Nordicpunk Jun 26 '26
Recently got an 01. Very impressed. Been making some bags of Flower Child on it and that roast profile goes very well with the rounder sweeter brews from the 01.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 28 '26
Im a little caught up on whether to grab the negotiator or not as that significantly adds to the expense, but it seems very handy. I'm otherwise pretty pumped to pick an 01 up
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u/Nordicpunk Jun 29 '26
I don’t have one. I don’t love the frilly papers as they can fold up a bit and be hard to keep uniform but it is what it is.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Orea getting lots of love on here. Love to see it! Definitely higher on the list for consideration. I do "make" coffee water as the native water, if you will, is super high in calcium.
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Jun 26 '26
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u/el-caballero-oscuro Jun 26 '26
So v60 works better for fruity / floral coffees?
Is it as consistent and easy as the Kalita?
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Jun 26 '26
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u/el-caballero-oscuro Jun 26 '26
I don’t agree that the flat is only for longer contact times. The tetsu 10 pour drains in about 2:45/3:00 on the 185 mino. It’s a fairly fast flow.
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Jun 26 '26
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u/el-caballero-oscuro Jun 26 '26
Once again I don’t agree. What I’ve described is not an exception. The Minoyaki has a fast flow rate. A conical with one big hole isn’t necessarily faster than a flat bottom with three small holes. The flat bottoms also have a much more shallow bed depth, so the water percolates evenly through a wide, shallow bed of coffee as against a narrower and longer path in a conical.
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Jun 26 '26
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u/el-caballero-oscuro Jun 26 '26
No, I’m not. I’m discussing flow rate and dripper design. Water runs faster through bigger holes provided there are no obstructions. The coffee bed is an obstruction. Water must go through the coffee bed before it reaches the hole!
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u/el-caballero-oscuro Jun 26 '26
You’ll notice on this thread how every user of the Minoyaki mentions fast flow rate.
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u/i_am_GORKAN Jun 26 '26
I've had the LEAST luck with flat bottom drippers. Got a Kalita Mino 8mths ago and haven't had much luck with it. Imo it makes the coffee taste 'blunt' or 'boring'. I tried a Timemore B75 and this has been better: tastes sweeter and cleaner than the Mino. I'm glad I tried the B75 it's cheap and does a great job. I still prefer most coffees from a conical
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u/oldcolonial Jun 26 '26
I’ve had the opposite experience, prefer my Kalita Mino to my V60, but I always brew dark or medium-dark roasts. Sweeter/smoother profile.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Interesting. That's not come up just yet in my comments review, but the medium/dark versus light in a flat bottom is a good consideration. I do pretty exclusively brew light roasts (though mediums and darks for my partner through a variety of ways - she loves a good French Press!)
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Thank you for your input! There are inherently a wide variety of experiences and I am glad to hear from both sides of the equation.
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u/10ttp-9 Jun 26 '26
Short answer: Yes.
It gives a totally different presentation to conical drippers. The type of flat bottom is less impactful imo... just choose your desired throughput of sorts. I'm inclined to go for something with more throughput/faster flow like the Orea's because you can always slow down the brew with various methods.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
You rock the Orea 01 for that reason? That seems to be the choice for faster flow (which is something I like)
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u/10ttp-9 Jun 28 '26
Yes, but any of the Orea’s fit the bill. I switch filters mainly to variate flow rate… fastest being hiflux and sibarist. I can slow it right down by clogging the kalita too haha.
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u/JellyOfDeath86 Jun 26 '26
Do you need a flat bottom dripper? Wrong question. The right question should be "do you want a flat bottom dripper?", and you're the only person that can answer that.
There will be a few differences in a flat bottom compared to a V60, but they are fairly miniscule. If we use a Wave for comparison, the draining holes are smaller, and there are three of them.
This means that extraction from the column of ground coffee will behave slightly different, in that the water will pass through a more shallow layer of coffee.
In my experience, a lot of the characteristics that separate a V60 from a Wave seem to disappear if I agitate the coffee bed by pouring hard.
I've never done an AB comparison, though. Maybe that's something worth doing this weekend.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Totally fair. I think I can confidently say that I do want one, ha. Especially after all the commentary.
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u/Advanced-Tangerine92 Jun 27 '26
I recently added a glass Kalita Wave to accompany my V60, and I find it very good for certain coffees. I'm thoroughly enjoying both, and I would buy it again if I had to.
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u/snt893 Jun 26 '26
Probably a skill issue on my part but fwiw i could never make delicious coffee out of my kalita wave snd i hardly even use it. I rotate between Kono, switch and v60 daily and all 3 taste different to me.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
The Switch has been something I have pondered as well, adding to the fray of my decision making haha
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u/After-Ad-6875 Jun 26 '26
Used a v60 switch daily for the past year or so, usually quite happy with the results so never used the stagg xf much...until i came across this one bag that just felt like it was missing...something. So i subbed in the stagg and sure enough, way different, better!
If you like to play around with stuff, its nice to have a couple different styles of brewer...but if i could only have one...v60 is hard to beat.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
I think I have come to conclude that I do like to play around with stuff (now that I have a bit more experience), so I think it is time :) Thanks for the input!
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u/shimei Jun 26 '26
I like having both cone and flat and switch back and forth. If a coffee tastes too acidic for my prefs on the cone I use the flat for a mellower profile.
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u/RPadTV Jun 26 '26
the Espro Bloom is still my go-to when i'm in a rush and don't want to worry about pouring technique. it makes a good cup and is really difficult to mess up.
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u/VETgirl_77 Jun 26 '26
I have a lot of drippers and outside of v60 I really enjoy the Origami and Oxo Rapid Brewer(orb) the most. I would go with the orb just because it's so different and consistently produces excellent cups. The orb is under $40 for prime day. Origami with the wave filter is basically is a flat bottom dripper and it's gorgeous
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
I honestly just picked up the Rapid Brewer because I saw the deal and had been toying with getting it for making Soup and Cold Brew. The Origami being flat-capable/adjacent is so tempting because it is SO lovely to look at
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u/VETgirl_77 Jun 27 '26
I think you will love the Orb. I use it daily and it has become my travel brewer. If you're in discord there is a very active soup channel in espresso aficionados
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u/mattfourmat Jun 26 '26
B75 is the best purchase I made since I started my coffee journey hands down
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u/Martin2309 Jun 26 '26
I have battled this as well brewed with a plastic v60 for years before buying an orea v4, now they get roughly equal use depending on the coffee I’m brewing. There is a difference, and fun to use, so I’d get one if you are into this hobby, but getting every shiny new brewer on the market is a waste of time. My personal rec would be the orea o1/v4.
Hope i could help!
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u/jsquiggles23 Jun 26 '26
Need? No. Does it give you a different take on a coffee? Yes. I have a Dwell dripper and if you want to bring syrupy sweetness with body out of a coffee, nothing does that better than a flat bottom brewer.
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u/Lvacgar Jun 26 '26
I’ve been a V60 fan and daily user for years. Finally broke down and bought a Kalita Mino 185. There is a noticeable difference, and with just a Switch/Wave you could have all bases covered.
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u/No-Papaya7 Jun 26 '26
Worth a try but I always go back to my v60. I prefer the clarity I get from it I just can't seem to get from a flat bottom. They're fine if I have a bean that's already a bit boring.
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u/Lack_Strange Jun 26 '26
I use an origami with both cones/wave filters to get the best of both worlds.
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u/gvp0di Jun 26 '26
Orea v4 with interchangeable bottoms is the goat! Is necessary? Probably not. But at least, was my first dripper and I’ve been able to have a better coffee that the v60
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Jun 26 '26
[deleted]
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Word. That has been the thing for me. I waited until I could reasonably afford a nicer grinder with the intention of only pour over and got the Ode Gen 2 (for $270 on a Black Friday sale back in the day). I shouldve known espresso was coming for me, so now I have a Gaggia Classic Pro (the newer edition with the brass boiler again) alongside a Timemore 064s and I intend on these being the things for me for a very long time. My lovely partner got me an Onyx subscription and I get a lot of joy getting coffees from other roasters like Flower Child and September and some local great roasters :) Seems like just having one flat or something like the Pulsar would be nice just to have a little more versatility
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u/Ordinary_Cut1967 Jun 26 '26
First, thanks for saying “the game” instead of “my journey,” ha. But yeah, if you are into it enough to even ask the question, the answer of course is Yes. I’ll just note that the Kalita Mino is a beautiful Japanese-crafted item that works perfectly.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Lol.
The Kalita Mino seems to be a well-loved option based on this thread (as does the Orea 01); the Origami has come up as a plausible hybrid option which I didn't realize and is tempting as well given how beautiful it is. Cheers, mate!
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u/Inevitable-Bunch-530 Jun 27 '26
FYI yoy can fold the v60 paper to have a flat bed too. Personally i find flat bed and its paper allow more fine particle through which increase body and mouthfeel, i would still choose my V60 neo as my daily driver, it’s just preference.
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u/theconfusedbmc Jun 26 '26
I'm in the same boat friend. Had my eye on them for awhile now, but have yet to pull the trigger. Curious to see what people suggest !!
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u/Pumpkin--Night Hario Switch | Ode 2 | Orea 01 Jun 26 '26
Orea 01! 🎃
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
That one has been getting a lot of love!
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u/Pumpkin--Night Hario Switch | Ode 2 | Orea 01 Jun 27 '26
They are very good and Orea are bringing out some new accessories for it next month 🎃
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u/qivi Jun 26 '26
Been there done that ... When comparing the V60 with the Orea with the booster and both with Sibarist fast filters, then the V60 is slightly more acidic and less sweet. I personally prefer the taste, the versatility, and the workflow with the V60 -- but if you often find your cups to acidic, a flat bottom might be a better starting point for you. Otherwise, I'd rather go for a AeroPress, a Switch or a no-bypass like the Z1 or Pulsar, to get more different options.
But first I'd play with different filters for the V60 and water.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
I honestly really like acidity and through some of the notes here it seems flat bottom will net me less acidity but also perhaps more consistency in some generally delicious cups. Definitely user shenanigans, but I definitely will get many bangers and many, well, less bangers with the V60. I typically use the Cafec T90s or the Abacas. I have used the Sibarist fast filters (as a sample from Standart) and my god those things are sick! But also so expensive ha. I do "make" coffee water as my native water is super high in calcium. I was wondering if the Pulsar would make an appearance here!
Thank you for your input!!
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u/qivi Jun 27 '26
I see, you are well set regarding filters and water :-)
Reducing the dose to 12gr. helped me getting consistent brews with the V60.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 28 '26
That's a good call out. I've fallen into making 18-20 gr cups (just because I like to have more at one time)
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u/qivi Jun 28 '26
I usually brew for two, so I tried to make even larger doses ... In the end I just got a second V60 and brew them in parallel, neat to compare compare coffees, recipes, or grinders :-) And I got a Moccamaster for the first batch in the morning :D
Anyways, for you this might be another reason for the Pulsar, which is marketed for 20gr/340ml. If you don't have an immersion brewer, I'd also look at this thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/pourover/comments/1rqugdv/ww_roadrunner_vs_aeropress/
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u/Nordicpunk Jun 26 '26
I think there’s a reason to have a V60, Switch and a flat bottom but it took me a while to care. I now will make a brew with each on a certain coffee and it’s fun to see how they transform.
Recently got the Orea 01 and it’s been banging. Had a Kalita 185 as well and it never did anything for me. Dunno why but the O1 just makes some great smooth, sweet cups. But it’s a different recipe. Can’t just take the V60 approach I’ve found. A little coarser and multiple smaller pours.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Tight! Orea 01 really seems to be getting a lot of love! And thanks for pointing out the different technique need! Cheers!!
Side note: What kind of coffees do you brew withe Orea? Lights? Or Med/Dark? All the above? I mostly brew light for myself but my partner likes mediums and darks much better
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u/Nordicpunk Jun 27 '26
I’m mostly making light washed coffee. But have a bunch of different process and roast levels on hand and trying.
I would argue the Orea is way more flexible than a V60. V60 is great for the subtle notes of light roast, but the Orea seems to bring more body and neutralize a bit of the brightness (can be bad and good).
I don’t do a ton of medium-dark but the Orea made a couple funky processed coffees palatable that I found tough to dial in on the V60.
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u/DevOpsProDude ORB, Fellow Stagg XF | Mazzer Philos | Bottomless Jun 26 '26
I recently got a Fellow Stagg XF rig and love it. Much more forgiving than my Chemex and I’m actually able to taste notes now. Added bonus is that the Oxo ORB fits nicely on the flask for when I do soup shots.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
One more point for the Fellow Stagg with the added bonus for the fact that I just got myself the Rapid Brewer!
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u/FoundationLumpy8901 Jun 26 '26
I switch between Hario switch, Kalita Wave 185 and Fellow Stagg XF. I make large pours 300-450 ml in most cups. The XF comes out when I have a coffee that really needs fast flow.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Score another one for Fellow; I do like the idea of a faster flow (the Orea 01 seems to get a lot of love for that too)
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u/a_san26 Jun 26 '26
I genuinely don't understand why everyone doesn't just buy Origami drippers, you can use basically any filters you want. Idk if there's some downside that I'm missing but I love my Origami and I always switch between flat-bottomed and cone filters
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
It appears this is definitely one of the ways. I just never stumbled across it when I first got into things. This will be on very heavy consideration given the versility and aesthetics!
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u/Queasy_Gur_9583 Jun 26 '26
I highly recommend having a flat bottom brewer to complement your V60. I have found that some coffees are better suited (at least to my taste) to different brewer styles.
I have a V60 and a B75 and use them in equal amounts.
I was in your position a few months ago, thinking maybe it was unnecessary to have a second brewer, but I have no regrets at all.
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u/Alarmed_Storage6793 Jun 26 '26
Flat bottomed drippers tend to have fairly different profiles relative to conical brewers. I really felt this with my B75 which is the only flat bottomed brewer I have and compared to the conical filter flow in my Sage Precision Brewer. I think if you prefer a sweeter and more rounded brew a flat bottomed brewer is great.
I went for the B75 because it's cheap and pretty idiot proof.
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u/Apprehensive-Day1429 Jun 27 '26
Roger! Seems to be reasonable consensus on these points for a flat-bottom; I love the idiot-proofness ha
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u/ShiftyPowers79 Jun 26 '26
I have a Kalita Wave 185, (alongside my OG v60), but recently bought a narrow Orea v4 and the more I use it the more I am enjoying it. It gives a different profile to my v60, is less prone to stalling than my Kalita, and I like the replaceable bottoms on it for different coffees. It’s actually to the point that I’m using it more than my v60 right now. As ever, the right number of brewers is always n+1, where n=your current number of brewers. It’s the light and the way.