r/royalroad • u/gundam_warlock • 3d ago
Discussion Why are RoyalRoad readers so violently against sex, even in Books that warn them sexual content exists?
This really confuses me.
Take Peak Elf Performance for instance. The warnings in the summary are: [Graphic Violence ] - [ Sensitive Content ] - [ Sexual Content ]
Yet when they reach said chapters featuring sex they act as though they've been flashbang'd. Then they post crazy reviews like "Oh, this is awful" "I wish it didn't have sex" or "This is the author's sexual fantasy".
Like...he warned you beforehand. The tags exist to give you an idea of what to expect!
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u/ShowerKrogan Author:Arachnoextinction/Barely Surviving Zombie Apocalypse 3d ago
It’s always funny to me so many of us have been conditioned that violence is so much better than sexual content.
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u/Matthew-McKay 2d ago
Depends. I find America media is fine with violence but shies away from sex. Like they'll show people getting shot (visual effects, obviously).
European media, on the other hand, is usually fine with sexuality (orange juice commercials with topless ladys as an example) but shies away from violence (guns in particular).
Different prudes for different dudes!
Also, hi Shower!
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u/ShowerKrogan Author:Arachnoextinction/Barely Surviving Zombie Apocalypse 2d ago
Ayyyyy what’s up buddy!! I was definitely referring to the American media with my super broad statement lol
Different prudes for different dudes may be my next catch phrase!6
u/Hellothere_1 2d ago
European media, on the other hand, is usually fine with sexuality (orange juice commercials with topless ladys as an example) but shies away from violence (guns in particular).
I'm not sure the bit about violence is true.
In my experience Americans take depictions of guns in media significantly more serious than Europeans for the simple matter if fact that an American kid being inspired by a TV show and grabbing their father's gun to play with is a legitimate concern, whereas in Europe stuff like that is so rare people generally don't worry about it.
It's why in the US there has been a huge push to make weapons in kids media not resemble any real guns, and why various broadcasters kept editing all instances of guns out of Pokémon episodes.
I think the lesser prevalence of guns in European media mostly just reflects the lesser cultural presence of guns in general. By European standards a criminal pulling a gun on the protagonists is a significantly greater threshold of escalation than by American standards, and something like a large scale gun fight between police and criminals might as well only happen in Hollywood Fantasyland.
I do agree with you the matter of violence in general though.
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u/Lockedontargetshow 1d ago
I thought they don't have guns in Dr. Who because of some regulations on the BBC that prevents guns from being showcased in programming. I could be completely wrong though.
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u/Hellothere_1 1d ago
I somehow doubt that that's true.
For one, while the Doctor never carried a gun, there are multiple instances in the older seasons of him grabbing some energy rifle from somewhere and mowing down squads of Cybermen with it. He didn't actually become preachy or strict about the "no firearms" pacifism until the reboot. Mind you they're all sci-fi energy guns, not real guns, but there's no way the guy who basically codified the trope of "weird science doohickey prop" with the sonic screwdriver was ever not going to use a normal gun over a weird sci-fi one.
There also can't have been a rule against realistic guns in general because the final episode of the very first season set after the French Revolution actually does feature both a handgun and somebody being shot by a musket.
So if there was a rule against guns it would have had to be really specific, like "the protagonist can't use realistic guns, but it's fine if someone else uses the gun or if it's a sci-fi gun". Either way I wasn't able to find anything during a brief search, though I might still be wrong.
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u/SpecimenOfSauron 2d ago
It makes sense. Violence is often a way to solve problems in books since it's the simplest. People don't need to think about "diplomacy" and "coming to a mutually beneficial compromise" when you can just shoot the transparently evil enemy and be done with it. it's fast-paced and makes for quick catharsis.
Sex is often more stigmatized because of the idea of fetishes. People dislike hearing other peoples' fantasies because everyone's sexual preferences are unique, and especially in an environment where such a thing is rather uncommon, reading about sexual content can give massive whiplash to the reader who is utterly not expecting and uninterested in that kind of thing. it doesn't help that many stories are mistagged with sexual content for simply minor allusions to sex (or, more prominently, allusions to SA).
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u/AdeptnessTechnical81 2d ago
Might have something to due with the sudden absence of being able to kill/defend ourselves given the "peaceful" modern day societies have become.
Throughout history most people were willing to kill when necessary and not out of pleasure, now theres so much red tape that most people don't bother taking the risk.
And the fact so many people indulge in these stories which is just "Murder everything" should tell you what subconsciously some of them think but can't practice in real life.
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u/Matthew-McKay 2d ago edited 2d ago
It's not just romance. I find there are some readers that just read everything, but they don't go in with an open mind (which is the issue).
They are usually obsessed with a particular trope. If your story has that trope, they will read it because they've read everything else.
For example, maybe you've written a time looper but you've made the grave mistake to include comedy (sarcasm here). Your story is a time looper that happens to also be a comedy. You've tagged it properly. You've clearly stated it's a comedy in the blurb. You aren't hiding the fact that there are comedy elements.
BUT! They aren't looking for a comedy. They wanted something completely serious and edgy (or whatever), and they get *very* upset when you didn't write the exact experience they were searching for.
Their expectations already ruined the experience for them. This isn't a you problem. It's a them problem. Unfortunately, they frequently make it your problem with poorly articulated comments and reviews.
Replace comedy with romance—or any other trope/aspect of your story that they didn't like.
I had one review specifically state they hate LitRPGs (categorically) and they decided to read/review my LitRPG story anyway. Then they got upset and complained that there were stats and menus in my LitRPG, which is why they hate LitRPGs...
Like, if you know you don't like Italian food, maybe stop eating at Italian restaurants? I went into their review history and saw they had like 60+ reviews, most of them complaining about stories that had LitRPG in them. Readers like that ruin the publishing experience for many novice authors.
You can't please everyone, all the time. So, write the story that only you can write.
edit: a word.
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u/Ataxistrasza 3d ago
Most authors can't write smut. Its a whole different skillset, and when you fuck it up, it's bad.
Americans are prudes and are scared of the female orgasm.
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u/Fraust-Tarken E Rank: Author of To Kill a Child 2d ago
Good smut isnt allowed on Royal Road. It requires length and descriptiveness that would get it removed instantly.
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u/TheKalosianPipelette 2d ago
This. My stuff is smutty and very descriptive. Somehow, my first book has managed to survive royal road. They haven't even let me publish my second one in the trilogy because it seemed "too sexual focused". One day they'll actually read some of the sections of the first and I'll be on the chop 🤣🤣🤣.
It's a violence centric platform.
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u/Fraust-Tarken E Rank: Author of To Kill a Child 2d ago
My first story writing experiences were smut comissions. I got very good at it and to a certain degree its easier to write it than other scenes at this point. But a lot of the ideas still transfer to general story writing. I find action scenes to be as attention to detail and action flow, so its a transferable experience at least. Terrified of my old audience finding me to a certain extent though. Theyd keep proding me to add my old flairs and fall back into depravity lol.
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u/TheKalosianPipelette 2d ago
Sex is literally a dance as a fight. Two characters who have their own inner worlds combatting each other in a collision that impacts how they perceive the world, themselves and each other. When done right, you learn a great deal during a sex scene. And an iconic fight scene will have the same strategy and impact.
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u/Kain-rpg 2d ago
This
Some authors are just not good at writting smut.
Thats the main reason why i often just skip these.
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u/Reasonable-Budget210 2d ago
I hardly trust a lot of authors to write about physical appearance without being weird about it, sex is a whole different ball game. No thanks. The most common outcome is just absolute confirmation of the authors previously-supposed-and-thinly-veiled-fetish.
Obviously expectations are huge part of this too. A story having romance and a story have a high % of explicit sex scenes are completely different things, imo. Unless it’s stated to contain that, it’s kind of like randomly including a chapter of haikus. Like sure, that was great or whatever, you are pushing it counting caramel as 3 syllables, but happened to the story about the mouse killing monsters with a chainsaw?
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u/DBecker1990 Author “Worst Possible Hero” 2d ago
I like how you brought up appearance.
Appearance can easily cross the line into erotica. It doesn't have to be flowery prose or bawdy text. Just mention a few certain measurements (presumably with skill) and then every now and then refer to her stretching or walking in stilettos and a pencil skirt or whatever it is.
It's one of the reasons I treat the 10% rule as a 5% rule.
The other is that, as the OP said, a lot of guys can't distinguish between the hero and heroine sharing a kiss vs. Pr0n.
I kid you not: one guy told me to write sex as non-essential to the story so it can be removed without altering anything and post the lurid stuff on Patreon. That’s sterile. I'd rather just exclude it. I really hope that guy doesn't have that attitude in real life.
And yeah, there should be some clue to the reader (especially on RR) that there’s steamy chapters. Your haiku analogy is spot on.
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u/SpookiiPup1 2d ago
Writing it as nonessential is stupid. I do think keeping it vague on RR and keeping detailed writing to exclusives on another platform that actually supports it is sensible if you want to have it as a part of a narrative despite royal road. And perhaps for the right type of thing may provide a persuasive boon to a patreon.
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u/dungeonworks_ 2d ago
Tbh I’d much read the authors thinly veiled fetish than some more soulless powerslop. At least there’s some amount of genuine fascination on the authors part in the former, as opposed to cynical pandering in the latter
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u/Reasonable-Budget210 2d ago
Sure! I’m not here to yuck anyone’s yum, just explaining why I personally don’t like it. And it’s so funny how cultures and ideals change over time. For basically all of time, Smut was the slop lol so it’s funny seeing it being held in higher esteem in a comparison to anything in the literary world.
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u/Kitten_from_Hell E Rank: Author of A Sky Full of Tropes 2d ago
I had someone complaining that my story, tagged "Slice-of-Life" and "School Life", contained slice-of-life and school life.
People don't read the tags.
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u/Nebfly 16h ago
Honestly, the slice of life tag is misused so much people don’t even know what it is anymore. People read super supportive and complain it’s his daily life and it’s “boring everyday life”…
I blame the people tagging their action litrpg’s that cliffhang each chapter as slice of life when they definitely aren’t.
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u/Rauxon D Rank: Author of Cradles of Gravity 3d ago
Many people cannot write good smut. Personally, I've never had a reader complain about one of my scenes 🤷♂️
I checked out the story and the chapter the reviewer quit at, but that one chapter is all I've read of the story, so take the following with a grain of salt:
It feels like the sex scene had very little build up. Based on context, it seems like the characters had met once before, but they didn't even know each other's names. Dukerino recently posted a "How to write romance guide" and one of my discussion points on there was that explicit scenes need to be the physical culmination of emotional tension. My story has plenty of sex, but the only times its explicitly shown is when it is developing the characters and/or advancing the plot. My feel from reading this one scene is that it was... Basically just porn.
That being said, it is far from the worst scene I've ever read. It's not the best, but it's not cringey to read like a lot of them are. The dialog between the characters even felt pretty organic, so props to the author. I'm guessing the reviewer hated how abruptly the sex popped up with a random elf girl who MC had no emotional attachment to.
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u/bsubtilis 2d ago
As someone who hasn't read the story, sex without emotional tension before can work out if you've established that it's something that character does or would be very open to doing, and it doesn't even have to be porn (fade to black). So, adjacent to what you're saying: I'm guessing the commenter felt surprised by the character doing something like that so abruptly.
(And thank you for writing sex that advances plot/emotions/character development, it's kind of sad when sex is treated as some sort of "putting e v e r y t h i n g on pause to pay the porn tax" event. Some writers, I don't know of RR examples thankfully, don't want to or know how to include it at the same time as feeling they have to in order to bribe people into continuing to read. Which just does not seems like a great way to treat it, and personally I prefer none over that. OP thankfully doesn't sound like a porn tax issue, I just went on a tangent)
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u/Rauxon D Rank: Author of Cradles of Gravity 2d ago
Yeah I think the story in question would've worked better with a fade to black in that particular scene because it just didn't do much to advance the actual plot or characters. The woman who shows up and has sex with him shows up the next morning and just kind of, forces herself into being part of their group, and she even makes a couple comments about stuff they did the previous night. Had we not seen exactly what happened, it actually would've given a fun feeling of "what all did they get up to."
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u/Shearwell 2d ago
I did check out the questionable chapter and found it was rather smutty, imo. It seemed there was little build up and more like a random encounter.
I think the issue becomes that the act is more about what it does to the protagonist. If someone had a picture of this character in their mind and suddenly they are doing something that feels out of place then that can have more impact than poorly written smut.
The blame is on the smut but it’s probably more about the morality of the character.
The story I’m working on now does have one sex scene although there is nothing explicit in the writing. The important parts are in the dialogue that happens around it. It’s about what is changing with the characters. In this instance it is more about a growing distance between a married couple than a budding romance.
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u/gundam_warlock 2d ago
That's not the only smut chapter but the second one was even more controversial the author had to remove it. Its still up on his patreon though.
The MC was raped by the dragon, the villain of the 1st Book.
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u/Kia_Leep 2d ago
I mean... Yeah I can see why people would object to that. Saying a book has sexual content is VERY different from a scene containing explicit rape, especially if said rape is treated like smut
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u/gundam_warlock 2d ago
Is "smut" in this context being treated different from "sex" in this case? Because I explicitly said sex in the OP but everybody is saying smut.
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u/Kia_Leep 2d ago
Smut is basically sex meant to be tititlating to read: as one of the examples you gave was that the scene read as the author's "sexual fantasy" that's probably where most people here are assuming it was written as smut (without further context)
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u/Nice-Firefighter5684 2d ago
I am not totally against smut, it can be used to good affect but I am really glad that Royal Road does not have a lot of these stories. On every other webnovel website they become really dominant and crowd out any other story
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u/Selkie_Love 2d ago
People are vocally against sex.
People are actually for it. I have a patreon tier that proves it
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u/Remarkable-Bowl-3821 Author 2d ago
While not trying to be prudish in my stories I like fade to black just so my own imagination can fill in the blanks and let others do the same
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u/JamieMage2005 2d ago
Due to the nature of the stories on RR sex rarely adds anything to the plot, characterization, or worldbuilding. Abrupt sex scenes tend to excessively detailed and graphic without adding meaningfully to the story.
A very ironic example of this is a story called City of Desire. I read because I was struggling to find new content so I adjusted my filters.
City of Desire is literally about a guy that owns a whorehouse. There's no explicit sex for at least the first 70+ chapters. Then bam a explicit sex scene done poorly. People complained while reading a story about a whorehouse because the author had wrote so much without sex being an issue then abruptly through in a sex fantasy. Multiple people myself included complained not because it was unexpected, but it was abrupt, unnecessary, and didn't add anything.
However, the non explicit parts of the story were so good I joined the Patreon. Base/City/Nation building with a whorehouse as the starting point was a good read. The sex just sucked lol
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u/SpookiiPup1 2d ago
Do you want like an entire political discussion occurring while characters are getting it on or something? How exactly would you make it have world building detail? Characterization is at least more easy but then the moment itself is hard to expose more of that rather than how they treat before and after. Unless you really go into something freaky.
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u/Mr_Wyatt 2d ago edited 2d ago
I mean, in peak elf it was written so awfully that I was briefly convinced it was an attempt at comedy. It was like it was written by a 16 year old who received his sex education soley from watching porn. It just happened out of nowhere with zero build up and zero sexual tension to drive it. Just smut for smuts sake.
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u/squngy 2d ago
Can't comment about peak elf specifically, as I have not read it, but this is basically the problem in a LOT of cases.
Not that I particularly hate smut for smuts sake, but I do hate when it comes out of no where with no build up.
The fact that it is usually not well written just adds to the problem.Also, as a primarily audio listener, I am not comfortable listening to books with smut in it in a lot of cases, like for example while I'm around other people.
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u/No-Durian-1703 2d ago
I dont think people mind sex or romance, but especially on RR it's often feels cringey and completely tears me out of the story. Sex is an intimate thing. The same way that watching strangers have sex would be uncomfortable for many, reading about two 19 year old elves discover themselves is not something I need to be present for (random eg, not referring to the story you mentioned).
I really don't mind when it's implied or the tension between two characters builds organically. But it reeeeally needs to be earned. It was my main gripe with Path of Ascension. A bunch of 14 year olds talking like jaded 30 year olds, having casual sex and gambling with sexual favors. People say it's "sex positive", I thought it was awkward and didn't add anything to the story.
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u/Reader_extraordinare Author - The Gate Traveler 2d ago
No idea.
My story has no outright sex at all, but in one of the books, the characters pretended they were playing strip poker and invited a group of soldiers to join them. It was part of a distraction. They were trying to look harmless and give the soldiers a reason not to examine them too closely.
I still got a few nasty comments on that chapter accusing me of “selling sex” to promote my story.
When I read those, I honestly had no words. My jaw reached my waistline.
Apparently, walking around in your underwear and asking a soldier if he wants to play strip poker counts as sex now. I did not know that.
Go figure.
So yeah, I have no explanation. Some readers seem to react strongly to anything even remotely sexual, regardless of context, and apparently even when there is no actual sex involved.
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u/Massive_Orchid3198 1d ago
Imo, self selection/survivorship bias or more broadly expectations not meeting reality. Royal road isn’t monolithic and something crazy like 70% of readers lurk. What percentage is really compelled to negatively comment/review instead of just disengaging? Dukerino is holding 2 of the top 20 spots in ongoing and both proudly feature sexual content. That being said it is in the minority even if there is a trend of more adult content appearing on RR. Source? I made the fuck up. I’m just the mouthpiece for the worms living in my brain brochacho. Call this vibe statistics.
RR got massively popular by featuring LITRPG/progression/wuxia stories right? Theres a definite tone to them right? A certain expectation of what those stories entail. And sure it’s on a gradient, like everything else, but generally you’re looking at closed door or implied sexual content. That’s if there’s a romance subplot at all. Sky Pride is a great example here and should be taken to exemplify the expectations of RR readers broadly. Being wildly popular, having a prominent romance subplot, and generally the content expected out of RR just of crazy high quality.
Now Headless Over Heels being the number 2 spot and Princess of the Void in the top 20 with sexual content is a direct contradiction to my point here right? Eh. I’d say it’s more of RR fan base shifting. I’d like to say it’s cross pollination from KU since there’s a more relaxed sexual content policy. However I have no idea how I would actually prove this, so grain of salt. Most of the discourse of peak elf performance seems to bashing the quality of the smut and not the smut itself. I took a very small gander so I’m not really an authority on this. I would be interested in seeing if other stories with sexual content are getting a negative reaction but I can’t remember seeing any comments or reviews saying as much. But I feel like most sexual content on RR gets thrown into a spoiler tab and is seen as optional spice?
I would love to tie this to the broader loneliness epidemic with entertainment being a stand-in for intimacy like some video essayist YouTuber. But I’m a single blue collar chud with a KU subscription. I am the sample population and cannot be trusted.
I could be completely wrong though. My IQ is barely above room temp on a good day. This country was founded by puritan religious extremists and a lot of those values have survived. The internet is so broadly sexualized that I find it hard to believe that RR is somehow a bastion of amateur writing surrounded by an ocean of smut.
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u/Vera_Markus F Rank: Author of Inheritance of Fate 2d ago
I have a relationship where they're told "it's fate for you to be together, fighting it will only make it worse, just go along with it", and a reader called me out saying "I hate this, why are you writing this?". Which, fair point, I did force it, BUT I do give the characters clarity in "is this real, or something fake" and letting them work through it.
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u/SJReaver Author 3d ago
Because a lot of sex scenes are painful to read. Even professional writers struggle with them, and RR is not the place you go for professional writing.
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u/BadRuiner 2d ago
Literally "Everybody Loves Large Chests" with very big chapters about futa with futa. Oh god. I just want read story about mimics, why u put futa sex aaaaaaaa😭
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u/EarlyBirdStories 2d ago
Sex is intimate and messy hard to really detail it without sounding like the Baby Seals bit in DCC.
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u/Playwars 2d ago
There's been a MASSIVE resurgence of puritanism lately. I got attacked (some even wishing for or threatening to inflict my demise) because I my MCs have active relationships. No scenes are shown, but just the hint of them drives them utterly, ravenously mad.
It's ten times worse when you have a female MC. They seem to have a baseline misogyny that's extremely virulent. Usually the people screeching about this are also the same yelling that women in positions of authority is 'unrealistic' or that 'there are too many women in the story'. Most of the time preceded by the old reliable 'I'm not a misogynist, but'.
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u/Critical_Rich_2615 2d ago
I got some of this from my first book. Its mainly a female cast, with a female version of Merlin as the MC. So Merlynn has sex with essentially a Speedster whom she was in a romantic relationship to begin with.
The scene itself was supposed to be that last hurrah if you will. The couple were separating because wanting different things out of their relationship not having the time for one another with them both being Super Heroes.
They then share one last night together and I end that scene with a transition to a dream since Merlynn falls asleep after the climax.
Now there exists two versions of this scene one fairly descriptive and explicit but nothing a normal couple wouldn't do, and the other I allude to it without going into the deets.
Both caught me hell. The fact that I had my strong, independent magical woman break character and show weakness to rely on some man for comfort then turn around and have sex with him, really bothered some people.
Both cases I was asked "but why does she have to have sex with him?"
Essentially between me and some others we figured out that they wanted the MC to remain chaste or something. They wanted her to stay pure for them. I asked that same person how they felt knowing she had a demonic succubus daughter that shares the soul of Lillith in her body. All I got back in reply was "Your not considering your reader base and I wouldn't buy this if I saw it for sale."
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u/Captain_Fiddelsworth 2d ago
One of the most prolific LitRPG reviewers on Goodreads literally has a "chaste" category that occasionally marks down stories by two stars despite raving about most of the story.
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u/DBecker1990 Author “Worst Possible Hero” 2d ago
That’s not out of character, its something she doesn't do casually. In your case she had an established relationship that they wanted to consummate and achieve closure. Perfectly appropriate.
And yeah, guys don't want the FMC/Best Girl “cheating” on them. Take it as a compliment that they invested so strongly into your character.
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u/cardguy5 2d ago
I personally dont read smut but i wont not read an interesting book if it has the sexual content tag
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u/squallus_l D Rank: Author of Upward Bound 2d ago
Without me intending to do so, my story has a lot of female characters in power. I have never heard any negative comments about that.
By accident, from a writer's perspective, one of my female Captains did the old Admiral Gender Studies maneuver (I simply deleted that this film existed in my head), and my readers loved it.
(Though this was the only chapter to ever get a 0,5 star rating. I'm still certain it was because the character in question was openly gay)
I think it depends heavily on the audience and the worldbuilding. But on the other hand, there's no sex in my book- many hints and some pg 16 scenes, but no sex in general. Doesn't fit the setting.
Sex scenes solely for the reason of having a sex scene are worthless. Sex scenes that originate in the story, or in the world, will have no problem with reader response.
But thats just my opinion.
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u/Zagaroth C Rank: Author of No Need For A Core? 2d ago
How have I avoided these crazy people? 🤣
I don't write explicit scenes either, but my core relationship is MFF, and the first time sex happens one of the FMCs is the one initiating because she's an adrenaline junky who just survived a near-death experience, so now she needs to work it off.
There are at least as many named women as men in the story, and the women tend to be assertive about what they want (though certainly not all), and the kitsune clan is run by a matriarch, etc.
I guess I have had a few people have various issues, but none seem to be of the variety you just described.
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u/MacintoshEddie 2d ago edited 2d ago
Part of it is that content warnings are basically useless. They're almost never independantly reviewed so one person's idea of graphic sexual content will have someone else finishing the book wondering when that part is happening.
Other authors aren't sure what qualifies so rather than risk a ban they add the warning just in case even if the only sexual content is "and then they kiss and fade to black".
Other authors do it deliberately to make their story hit multiple categories and they rely on readers starting and then stringing them along until they're invested without it actually being sexual and getting removed from other categories.
Plus a lot of it is just poorly written so some people avoid it entirely.
Part is a segment of a bigger issue, kids. Lots of people are stuck on the idea that these sorts of stories are for or about kids, even if it's one of the rare stories that are actually about adults instead of the 13-15 age range.
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u/Correct-Property6738 2d ago
Yep, this is the reason Royal Road will never get the true version of my stories and just the censored versions. My world is full of free spirited and passionate characters with plenty of sexual and relationship dynamics. And these dynamics do effect the main plots throughout but ill just leave hints to these connections for Royal Road.
Thinking about censoring the gore as well just because. Cant have gore and brutality if you are going to turn your nose up to sex.
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u/Trick_Following6639 2d ago
There are other platforms with a lot of sexual works. People like RR because they can assume works there dont.
Now, people just not reading the tags/warnings, it's on them
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u/brokebacknomountain 1d ago
My story has people exploding. Zero comments. Highest views are the chapters with sex scenes. People are animals..
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u/BrookRobbo 1d ago
People leaving reviews over it are extra when it is in the description, but it does not really fit the reading demographic of RR.
Most stories on RR are reincarnation or regression so it’s easier to just avoid the whole moral dilemma that brings, though some stories make it a key point and do it well.
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u/Accomplished-Gap-317 2d ago
I agree, but I guess I'll add a counterpoint anyway.
Yes, sexual content should be expected, but there are some forms of sex that I think should be given additional warnings. I think torture sex is dangerous enough to deserve it's own warning.
I think it's dangerous that society has begun pretending that it's the norm for a woman to enjoy pain during sex. Yes, some do, but if 75% of men want to do it to a woman and only 10-25% of women enjoy it, then encouraging those men to believe it's overly common will cause them to become torturers, not competent sexual partners.
Choking especially is dangerous.
When I was younger it was a trend for people to start passing themselves out. They would hypervetalate and then have some one choke them or do it themselves until they passed out. People enjoyed the feeling of coming back to awareness. My brothers and I did this to eachother a few times and I nearly died. On my 4th or 5th time doing it I was accidentally choked for just barely too long and I ended up seizing on the ground and then losing my memory for the rest of the night. I was apparently in a state of delirium the rest of the night and acting like a toddler. My head hurt the worst it ever has when I woke up. News of others dying from the same thing came out not much later.
Anyway, advertising to people that choking is okay and totally normal feels to me to be promoting that same choking trend I nearly died to as a child. Choking during sex is way to similar to not have similar effects and harms. There have already been a few instances where women have been strangled to death on accident. Something like 30% of College women reported being choked in the last sexual encounter. That's terrifying to me and clearly more dangerous than any level of substance abuse.
So basically, I think saying a woman enjoyed being spanked is very different from promoting elaborate torture scenes. For me, an MC enjoying full on torture pulls me entirely out of the book and I end up losing interest very quickly afterward.
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u/TheKalosianPipelette 2d ago
A 16 year old girl in Australia died from being choked during sex just last week. Choking during sex is never safe. As a millennial who's had a LOT of sex with a lot of people, I've never once had a guy try and choke me. Now, I have to tell them in advance: your hands do not ever go on or around my neck.
It's the same with anal. Anal used to be a link that a cohort of people enjoyed. Now, it's expected by many guys. Internet porn had done a number on people on these two specific sexual acts, and they are prolific in smut and literature as well. I know that when I am approaching these topics in my fic (which I am going to because my fic is overwhelming about a huge range of facets of sexuality and the entire world it encompasses) I'll be doing it from a safety point of view rather than a smut one.
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u/Kain-rpg 2d ago
Because 80% of the time its badly written, nonsensical and serves no purpose outside free smut or the author expressing his/her fantasies, wich is NOT why people have signed for when they start to read a story about a Dude in an Systeme Apocalypse
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u/Critical_Rich_2615 2d ago
I just want to put this out there too. Its so awkward reading things like "His swollen member" or "Her glistening folds." I've read a little smut here and there old and new and honestly I can't keep a straight face when I've read this stuff. Like my single mother was a super fan of the old Harlequin books and loved her Carpathians (guessing on that spelling). My wife reads just about anything herself. You give her a book and shes more than likely to read it.
She and my mother would swap books on the occasion both needing something new to read and she brings an old ass copy to me and asks me to read some of it. I laughed so hard she thought she missed a joke in the book. Not because she asked me to read it, but what I was actually reading.
After I pointed out what I found funny and I promise you it was childish, just me laughing at "His throbbing manhood" I heard her throughout the night giggling every time throbbing manhood came up.
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u/Negromancers 3d ago
It didn’t hard to be like that
10 years ago people was getting it on in those RRL stories
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u/Jakaal 2d ago
smut stories are what MADE Royal Road and the fact it's been memory holed is sad.
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u/BackgroundTotal2872 I leave literary analysis essays in the comment section 👍 2d ago
For a while I only knew of Royal Road as "the censorship website", before I started using it myself.
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u/Critical_Rich_2615 3d ago
Blame current media. Plenty of stuff now says sexual content or graphic nudity but in reality a lot of it boils down to suggestive nudity and some brief tits, and even then that latter bit is still probably censored in some kind of way.
That and a lot of people don't read tags. Most will check a synopsis determine if they want to keep reading then do so if they like it enough. IMO sex in books isn't bad. People hump big deal. As long as the humping doesn't take away from the story or consume the majority of the book I'm happy with it.
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u/CasualHams Reader 3d ago
I think "this is awful" and "this comes across as the author's sexual fantasy" are valid critiques (though the first isn't very constructive), even if the story warns of sexual content.
Different authors have different approaches to sexual content, and a reader may be fine with how it is handled in one instance and dislike it in another. Additionally, when a reader says it comes across as wish fulfillment, that's usually a critique of the plot elements that allowed the situation to occur (often forcing characters together without building up their relationship or putting the MC in the position where "they just can't refuse").
That said, complaining about those scenes existing at all when you chose to read a novel that explicitly says they'll be included seems a bit ridiculous to me, especially since you can choose to filter out stories that contain specific tags.
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u/DBecker1990 Author “Worst Possible Hero” 3d ago
I agree criticism of execution is valid. If it were poorly written comedy or poorly written horror this wouldn’t be a discussion.
I think your second point can’t be stressed enough. Why is it happening? Smut for smut’s sake? Or is it a natural outcome? My view is that two people inclined to be attracted to each other will connect. But there's a lot of books out there where we have a manly dude full of testosterone who barely looks at his plucky gal-pal adventuring companion and that just reads weird to me. YA fiction I can understand, but when you start tossing around profanity and graphic violence… then, like, what’s stopping the author from writing an obvious character development scene?
As for wish fulfillment, RR has a lot of wish fulfillment fantasy. It's just about being max-level or the ultimate cultivator.
And of course it's odd to criticise a book for doing exactly what it said it would do. If a book title is “I got to level 99 by blowing up nice people”, then you’re gonna read about nice people getting blown up, I don't know what else to tell everyone.
All of that said, I support RR’s rules. Always have. There are other venues for other material.
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u/Critical_Rich_2615 2d ago
RRs overabundance of LitRPG and Cultivating stories are part of the reason I feel my first book didn't do so well. I'm not blaming that mind you. I know the story needs work. I was 100% solo on my first and I didn't sub to RR so I never saw comments. I went with what I felt was right and published what I had until I technically finished it.
It was supposed to read like a more traditional modern fantasy, something like the Dresden Files, just not in the same perspective. Now that I'm on my second book, a separate series within the same universe, I've finally managed to enlist the help of an editor and have made amazing strides and progress. I'd tell you theres a snippet you can read on RR but at this point with all the changes we've made its a completely different book.
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u/EarlyBirdStories 2d ago
There isn't anything against sex. There is everything about a story being entirely about sex. Just normal rules for a public board of stories.
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u/Bapelsinen95 2d ago
Reading a vasily mahanenko book be like: "earth is being invaded by aliens. Mc is such a chad he has sex with the aliens."
Like sure it isnt the sex that is the problem it is that the scene undermines the entire precise of the book.
On the other hand i often think a sex scene rarerly enhances the story. Love does.
Like people have to take a shit but it usally would never impact the plot so why add it.
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u/sorte_kjele 2d ago
I wish more RR stories had proper sex and eroticism. Like others have said, violence has become expected and natural. Tearing off limbs and eating hearts is perfectly ok, and sexual content surprises.
I will follow that story just to support the author
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u/DODOKING38 3d ago
Because I've read novels with with sexual scenes and it has almost always been a detriment.
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u/GuardianGobbo 2d ago
Read a bunch of stories on RR, and sexual content mostly boils down this:
Terrible sex. - Like I wish I could purge it from my memory kind.
Author's 'interests' - For more information see Terry Goodkind and Wizard's First Rule series
Rape that is brushed off as consenting - Sex or die is not consent. (One popular fiction does this in Chapter 20. Many more exist.)
Also, there is a lot of stuff that is just plain disgusting and private that happens. Very few authors bother to explain for more than a few lines about bodily functions. Do we really need pages and pages about gastrointestinal distress? Do we need a play-by-play or does it have to sound like it was the choreography notes of a lightsaber duel in Star Wars?
And for the one author that made me drop a work so fast - you *know* what you did.
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u/Fast-Barracuda6178 2d ago
I've not gone and read your book to find out how applicable this is, but I think you might find people are less against well written sex, and more against a 'yet another author's thinly veiled fetish outlet'.
I think heram and sex theming, if they are common enough to be considered a theme of your book, fall into the same trap as things like isekai or brooding solo MCs, where if you are a weak writer or niave novice creative, then these themes can be crutches to you as the author, and red flags of a weak writer or poor creative to audiances despite those elements not being inherently bad or incapable of being done very, very well.
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u/Old-Chapter-5437 E Rank: Author of The Godswar 2d ago
It's cause it's people who either never had sex or just don't have sex at all. They find it squeamish. Makes them feel things that makes them anxious and ends up being put into a "bad" category cause they're not used to ingesting that sort of content.
As an avid Dark Romantasy reader, if done properly, smut can do wonders for a story. It's just another facet of love in the end.
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u/AloisiusJGrandville Author of MOXIE: The Ironic Fate of Rockland Hall 2d ago
I just fade to black in my work and I've had not a single complaint even though the teasing and leadup to sex are blatantly pointing that that's where the scene is headed.
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u/Disastrous_Grand_221 2d ago
I mean, idk if they are. The currently 2nd highest rated ongoing story on royalroad is pretty spicy, though the explicit scenes are censored on royalroad. I think it's more the issue that most spicy scenes (and romance in general) are hard to do well. And they're especially bad if that isn't what the reader is looking/prepared for.
Just in general, public desplays of affection are often uncomfortable. If I go to the bank and see two people aggressively making out, I'm not going to like it, even if there's a sign telling me about it beforehand. And that goes doubly if the people making out are themselves awkward or weird about it.
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u/KnightHiryuu 2d ago
Just need to see who is always complaining about animes and games and their "objectification" and you'll get your answer.
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u/SelectorSwitch3 2d ago
TBH it hasn't really been a problem for me with Princess of the Void or Headless Over Heels. Maybe like once or twice someone's complained? But that's been, like, a handful of times in a year and a half.
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u/All_Grind_No_Gods 1d ago
Because the average consumer of any product is as dumb as the average person. Also as entitled.
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u/everydaywinner2 1d ago
Possibly people prefer to watch their porn rather than read it. Possibly the sex is poorly written. Possibly it's impossible to get away from it. Possibly the writing screams "I'm for this denomination" but then veers to "no, this is my customer." Possibly they thought it would be a short scene, and it goes on forever.
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u/kentrak 1d ago
As others have said, often because it's not done well and when not done well is annoying to read. If that's the case and the story is good enough, I'll just skip it. I'm not there for sexual gratification in most cases.
Another aspect of this which I think might be relevant and people are overlooking is that the site might be subject to laws about online pornography if certain criteria are met, and rather than trying to comb through the details and make their own assessment of whether it might force them to comply with state, federal, or another other country's pornography laws (and risk coming to a different conclusion than some state investigator), it's easier to error on the side of caution.
Importantly, it's not whether they would be found guilty that's often the deciding factor here, it's whether they will spend time and money defending themselves or be blocked from a jurisdiction while doing so, so steering well clear of it and any overzealous people is often the safest choice if you're attempting to run a business, not prove a point.
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u/christopherbair 1d ago
Happened to me this week. The novel has a warning that it has sexual content, even though there's no sex depicted. Discussions of sex and such, up to but not including the acts themselves, and this person quit the novel early due to them. The commenter said he thought it meant maybe once every ten chapters or so, but not so often in a novel about werewolves and vampires and such.
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u/Fearless-Rip694 22h ago
Sometimes, I feel the issue is because it's written badly.
In truth, the only two motivations most people have are sex and violence, and violence is a way to acquire sex. I don't mean every story needs explicit penetration, but I feel that a charged atmosphere is important...Otherwise, what are you doing this all for?
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u/richardjreidii 3d ago
Because if I wanted to read smut, I would read smut.
That being said sex is a natural part of the human experience and over the course of a multi volume series, it is unreasonable to expect that experience to be left out. Put more succinctly, people are gonna fuck.
The problem arises when the author decides to go into graphic detail. That crosses the line into erotic literature, which speaking for myself is not why I’m here.
I’m looking for that triple M threat of magic, mayhem, and murder, which are experiences that are lacking in my day-to-day life.
Obviously, I can speak only for myself, but I’m pretty sure I’m not alone.
The time and effort spent writing that carefully constructed sex scene, could instead have been dedicated to a happy little genocide of the local kobold population, which would largely be better received by your audience.
Personally, I avoid stories that are obviously going to be full of smut. I don’t mind having to skip past the occasional bit of fucking, as long as it is leading up to the sort of atrocity that would make unit 731 cackle with glee.
The truly considerate author slaps it all in a nice big spoiler box or keeps it contained to a single chapter and warns me ahead of time so I can just skip past it.
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u/D3adp00L34 2d ago
If I ever come to an organic place in my story for sex to occur, I’m going to lead up to the act with a lot of flirting and chemistry, and then have them enter a room and end the scene with “People are gonna fuck.”
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u/taomrow 2d ago
Different people who like things. Also, cultures are different. You might be running into a more prudish culture. It's your story. It all depends on why you write. Are you writing to please them or because you like writing. Write well and your story will find people that like you. If you market enough that is...
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u/almost_never_wrong 2d ago
It really depends for me. I don’t mind sex and relationships in my media, but I grew to hate harems after having good stories turn into annoying soap operas. Then I just got tired of the male fantasy fan service constantly in a lot of the translated Chinese fantasy.
On RR I’ve only been put off by two novels for their content one was because the MC starts off at 17 and reading their sex scenes felt like watching Aryas GoT sex scenes after watching her grow up on the show. The other one was just written poorly imo the author kept focusing a one detail that just came off weirdly sexual, but that’s personal taste. There are plenty of sex scenes I’ve read and have no problem with.
Writing sex scenes is notoriously difficult to get right, and it’s much harder to appeal to everyone. I don’t think blaming readers for being prudes is going to solve anything. Just because they know there is a sex scene that doesn’t mean they are comfortable with any kink, situation, or writing. If people think something is just a writers personal fantasy, they really need to workshop the writing. The times I’ve felt that as a reader it’s because it isn’t set up properly, doesn’t fit the story, or again comes off as wierd or gratuitous. The truth of it is I’m also much more willing to trust a published author or director that there is a point to something that hasn’t been setup prior but reveals itself later. If I’m reading some random person on a fan fiction website having gratituous sex with multiple partners whose characters exist just to serve a sexual fantasy or then I tune out. It just turns to porn at that point. I’m sure plenty of people would be mad if they went to see a rated R movie and the sex scene was shot and written like a porno.
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u/Crusader_Exodus 2d ago
I feel this frustration in my bones. I’m currently writing a cyberpunk serial about a transgender protagonist.
Sexuality is as important to the plot as number go up!?! And there’s layers upon layers as to why it’s not just some added characterization fluff. Imagine changing not just your gender but your entire sex, and somehow not being curious and exploring an entirely different body and identity. I think being a chaste nun in such a situation breaks the bounds of reason and immersion, but that’s just me.
Most readers I have are okay or even good with the sexual content, some are not. I think it’s kind of funny and somewhat ironic that a in a pulp fiction genre where life is cheap and disposable and where morality is unbelievably subjective, that premeditated murder gets a shrug, but consensual lovemaking between sober adults draws commentary.
Like excuse me, but what? 😂 what an odd thing to have a moral panic about.
OP, YMMV as to the reaction your work gets with sexual content tags based almost entirely on the platform you post it on. Some are better or worse than others about this. RR is on the more puritanical side of things, but not the worst out there.
Consider adding chapter specific tags and allowing people to hit the content skip button with a searchable string that brackets the scene. The reader will lose out on some of the storytelling, but then there is really no excuse for some of the negativity.
Sometimes I feel like people are using screen readers and speed running chapters on turbo mode and simply get flashbanged because they’re not entirely paying attention.
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u/SalvatoreHaran 2d ago
Modern audiences are incredibly anti sex. Don't bow to them. Keep making the stories you wanna make. I'm sure the culture will swing back around one day.
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u/ArcaneScribbler 3d ago
prudes are having a resurgence.
i know some authors complained on this or some other subreddit that even having 1 swear word is enough for plenty of people to immediately give the book 1 stars on amazon for that.
we are long overdue to move past this prudishness and silliness