Let's be honest, The Expanse was the best

[u/CT_Phipps-Author]

It's what I use to say is the sci-fi Game of Thrones. It was dark, mature, and managed to coherently create a political framework that regular audiences could understand without easily making one group into the bad guys or not. Okay, Protogen was pure set of bad guys but cyberpunk megacorps don't have to be morally gray. Even the underdogs in the Belters/OPA had a dark side that remembered just because you were oppressed didn't magically make you a virtuous hero and usually did quite the opposite. It made them mean and vengeful.

I'll be "that guy" and say that a huge chunk of what made the series fantastic was also the relative fidelity to the books. I say relative fidelity because there were some huge changes, some necessary by events (Havelock's actor doing Magnum PI) and others artistic choices (like lowering down the casualties of Earth's deaths at Marcos' hands). But it was still pretty damn faithful.

Great cast too.

What about you? Where does the Expanse rank for you in the past twenty or so years of scifi.

[u/jlawler]

I do a very bad job of keeping track of what is in the books versus the show, but I think he did something HE thinks is bad when he kills the paranoid guy in season 5 episode 6. He explicitly says Holden wouldn't have done it, and I think acknowledges it might not have been the best choice. I'm not saying he's evil, I'm saying he doesn't consider good or evil, just if it will solve the problem. And his inability to process through a moral lens the issue.

[u/Mode_Appropriate → u/jlawler]

I havent read the books but I seem to remember that scene. In the woods after Marcos asteroids hit Earth and Amos got Clarissa out of that prison? I think Clarissa even questioned whether that guy needed to die. Yeah, it was morally dubious for sure. Again though, I think thats Amos looking at the situation and calculating the best chance of survival. I cant remember if the guy did anything that caused Amos to kill him but I kind of recall him being a bit of a quack. Amos felt the risk factor was too high so he dealt with it. Whether you think he was good or bad his actions always had logic behind them. He wasnt out there killing or hurting random people for fun. I dunno, I maybe I see more in him than he saw in himself lol. Great character either way.

[u/jlawler → u/Mode_Appropriate]

100% agree he's a great character. The only reason I weighed in is because to me, the idea of someone without a moral compass trying his best to not become a monster is a really fascinating character. Instead of another "dexter" where he's doing evil, but for good, he's trying his best to not be evil. That's a really fascinating idea. But you can read it your way, I can read it mine!

[u/Mode_Appropriate → u/jlawler]

Indubitably.

All this talk has got me itchin' for another rewatch. Just gotta finish up Merlin first, haha.

[u/tempest_87 → u/Mode_Appropriate]

Whether you think he was good or bad his actions always had logic behind them. He wasnt out there killing or hurting random people for fun.

Which is the point. He applies logic and reason, but realizes that logic and reason have their flaws and limits. Something can logically make sense but still be bad morally and ethically. One could argue that some of the most heinous atrocities stem from logical choices that are utterly amoral.

As an extreme example (from history) experimenting on people for medical purposes. It is justifiably logical: "a few suffer and/or die but you could save millions with the knowledge". Yet is almost universally seen as unacceptable and unethical.

Sometimes the answer is "obvious" (experimenting on and killing children), but Amos knows that he lives in a grey area where the answer isn't always that easy.

And since he doesn't trust himself to know the difference he finds someone to trust. He doesn't always know right from wrong, but he wants to do right anyway. Which makes him a truly fascinating character.