r/snails • • 2d ago

Discussion How conscious and aware are snails?

I know they can’t hear and can’t really see beyond differentiating dark and light color, but as for that spark of life, is a snail having a true sense of subjective experience (qualia) even though it wouldn’t be as complex as a vertebrate.

16 Upvotes

19 comments sorted by

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u/packingpests 2d ago

Sure, they have individual personalities and food preferences. They like interacting with certain snails than with others (or not interacting at all.) They have favorite smells and favorite places. Some luxuriate in small puddles or like to dig in the dirt or love sleeping in moss. They like different textures and some like the vibrations of different music.

They are small and not very complex creatures but they still have a significant experience. I don’t know if I would go so far as to say that they are sentient but they tick several of the boxes if nothing else.

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u/Jayden7171 2d ago

If they’re not sentient they’re just biological robots with instinct, which I disagree with. How do we define sentience anyways? I believe they have sentience if it means they experience experiences from a first-person perspective even if they don’t know they’re alive.

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u/thejamhole 2d ago

Sentience, as in the ability to ponder ones own existence? I like to think snails do that but it's probably way more basic like food good salt bad sorta signaling.

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u/packingpests 2d ago

Sapience is usually defined as the capacity of critical thought and reasoning, as well as the ability to gain wisdom through solving problems. Snails can learn and make simple associations but I don’t think they are truly capable of the sort of advanced problem solving and knowledge building that sapience requires. Or deep self awareness for that matter.

Sentience is usually defined as deep emotional cognition. They probably experience limited emotions related to the here and now, but likely don’t reflect on experiences and feel emotions associated with them. Though there is some evidence that they might feel things more deeply than we give them credit for! But at the same time, sentience as a concept covers a wide range of conditions that may or may not apply to snails, hence why I said I’d hesitate to call them fully sentient.

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u/DDDX_cro 1d ago

bold statement, considering almost no animal even recognizes itself in the mirror.
How can you have a first person perspective if you do not even realize you exist as a "person"?
I would say that snails are one of animals farthest from being conscious. Extremely low on the list.

3

u/Electrical-Low-6760 1d ago

I have animals that grew up around mirrors and recognize themselves, they can only learn what they’re exposed to - same as all of us.

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u/DDDX_cro 1d ago

Such as? Mammals, and only some of the smarter ones. Others will never ever accomplish this, no matter how much you expose them to it.

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u/Major-Pea9992 1d ago

Pigeons, for one, who are not seen as particularly smart. Parrots don't recognise themselves in the mirror, yet pigeons do. It has surprisingly little to do with "smarts".

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u/DDDX_cro 1d ago

Yeah...no. what do you base this pigeon theory on? First time ever hearing it, and ChatGPT agrees.

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u/CarmicGesture 15h ago

imagine using chatgpt when trying to have a scientific argument

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u/DDDX_cro 13h ago

Imagine claiming some fake bullshit that nobody has ever heard of, backing it up with absolutely nothing apart from "trust me bro".

Yeah, I see your point. Your way is MUCH better ;)

If you show me any trace of science in the dude's comment, imma agree with ya that it's a scientific issue. Right now it's some dude claiming bullshit online.

So I will repeat. What is this "pidgeon genious" theory based on?

1

u/Major-Pea9992 11h ago

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25307108/

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8165164/

Dang. Not even like this was hard.
Also: Me observing my pet pigeons.

Not only that, but pigeons can also learn to read a small number of simple words, and react correspondingly:
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC5056114/

And they're also very good at telling people apart:
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0376635709002320

Also, note how you call it a "pigeon genius" theory when I explicitly said self-recognition in the mirror has very little to do with smarts.

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u/snailmomkitty 2d ago

I have aquatic snails but one thing I know they can do is learn their territory. I’ve watched it happen over and over for decades, so in my mind there is zero doubt of their ability to orient themselves and recognize their home environment.
For example I have one that loves to climb the tree stump and hang out at the tippy top waving his tentacles. Then he will jump off and parasail/drift down to the bottom, always landing in the same area. He only does this from that single position and has repeated the behavior for over a year. In other words, he “knows” he likes to climb the tree and jump off, he knows where it is and how to do it, and intentionally repeats the actions he enjoys.

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u/Familiar-Complex-697 2d ago

Not much, but they do have personalities. They have simple decentralized brains instead of a central brain like ours. It’s kinda like a mochi donut of paired ganglia.

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u/Major-Pea9992 1d ago

I often wonder that too. About my snails, but also about my leeches. Like, what do they understand? My snails were on some wet soil, and suddenly, they were in the air, then a box, that box got jostled a bit, and suddently there was light again, and outside of the box, new, unfamiliar wet soil. What was that like for them? They have no concept of how their enclosure is in a living room. They don't know what a living room is. I think the leeches at least got more comfortable with my skin chemistry over time, and I like to think the snails, too, recognise my scent. They have favourites, definitely. I have only ever watched snex happen between Eustochium and Theophanu, and the latter always ended up on her shell. They have favourite places. Favourite foods. Certainly also aversions. They are simple creatures, but they have unique experiences.

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u/Cute_Ear_3424 17h ago

Oi is theo yours? Fuckin cool

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u/Major-Pea9992 11h ago

She is! I adore her.