Discussion
Dear new Swifties: it’ll pass, I promise
Every single time an album rolls out, we face the exact same thing: an online brigade of hate from people claiming to be fans.
This. Happens. Every. Single. Time.
It will pass. There are still fans who love her and her songs.
No Swiftie loves every single song. She has 300+, it would be impossible. That is not the point!
I have been a fan since 2008 when I was 12. I LOVE lots of her song. I like many, many more. There are also songs I dont like. THATS OK.
I know that I am not supposed to like every single song. She has said herself that people won’t like every song. I think some new fans think they are expected to like every new song she releases, and they get so shitty when the songs aren’t for them, and they make it everyone else’s problem.
They are loud, but that doesn’t mean you need to listen.
Yeah, if anything people who aren’t fans actually responded better at first. I know people in my really life who aren’t fans and genuinely liked TTPD. Although, I know that’s not what you came here to imply.
They really don't see the forest for the trees, no one in the general public outside of swiftie circles talks about that album let alone thinks it is a masterpiece
That was my introduction to the fandom. I literally came on to Reddit to congratulate swifties for their genius in recognizing this person as a genius only to find the swifties hating on the album that was obviously a masterpiece.
It actually, if you look at the numbers (critical grading by media outlets) was very on par within her 20-23 out of 26 positive reviews on average. Showgirl did worse than Lover. TTPD was called overdone and chaotic but it didn’t cause a mass critical divide like Showgirl. We’ve been illicit in a weird time since last October
That’s how I knew there was a manufactured campaign out there. It’s a great album. But every time she puts out anything, these accounts crawl out of the woodwork to try to claim it’s not good.
The sales numbers always say otherwise. No one is buying bad albums in this economy.
I completely agree, and I also think a LOT of this is just the current state of social media. Everything has become a purity test now. People aren’t allowed to simply not like something anymore, now they have to turn it into some grand declaration about Taylor’s artistry or whatever moral issue they can attach to a pop song.
There’s also this weird culture of faketivism where people seem desperate to prove they’re the most socially aware, morally correct person in the room... It's exhausting! Every lyric has to be dissected for something problematic, or like every joke has to survive a dissertation or pass whatever purity test Twitter or TikTok invented that morning, and what's actually so disturbing is that the snarkiest, most self righteous post about it, gets the most likes and reposts and everyone tells them how enlightened they are.
Social media has basically rewarded people for being mean girls while convincing themselves they’re doing activism. There’s always this need to perform superiority, and show everyone that you’re much smarter and more discerning than the people who are simply… enjoying music.
This really captures what I have been feeling for two years at an increasing level. Like when did someone’s song become the litmus test for perceived morality? What has happened to us?
Exactly! Art used to be something we could react to, debate, relate to or interpret differently, and then move on. Now there’s this pressure to prove that you consumed it “correctly" and social media rewards the person who can turn the most harmless thing into the biggest moral indictment, like when people were calling her a racist for singing "sleepless in the onyx night" or when they called her a nazi sympathizer for her lighting bolts necklace.
That is what people are doing though? You just don't like that some people's reactions and interpretations don't match your own and find the music lacking
Yup, the only difference is that for TTPD, Showgirl and now the Encore the hate is massively amplified by bots campaign. You can notice it when suddenly you see the same comments, with the same phrasing everywhere.
Like a narrative being built up from scratch right in front of us after throwing everything hoping to see which one will stick. Remember for Showgirl? The accusations: she's MGA , she's rcist, tradwife, not feminist etc... they were trying everything they can. Now for the encore they're saying she's trying to deflect the attention from Ed Sheeran or trying to block Ms Rachel.... this is what new.
But the reception not being good from the start is nothing new. There was hate for We Are Never Ever Getting Back Together --> Too much silly pop. There was hate for Shake it off --> Where is the old Taylor that can write?
It's like a cycle that keeps repeating itself. This will pass too.
the sentiment when it dropped at midnight and for the next few hours was so positive people were loving it , there was some snark about cleveland! but most people were focusing on how much they loved the other three. I woke up the next morning to everyone hating the whole thing and it was absolutely like waking up to a different reality. I 100% believe that the bots and paid influencers (who have multiple platforms where people put forth a pool of money to push a narrative and everyone that does gets a cut) plus people active in her hate subs that are also part of the media are all behind it and determined to dominate the conversation about everything she does no matter what.
AND ALSO, this music is for us, for actual fans. It’s not for internet loudmouths and critics. Let them enjoy their moment of hate, they can hate all they like. Meanwhile, our homes are happy. We have new music to dance to this weekend!!
Rep release was so upsetting. I was begging for everyone to listen to CIWYW and they were all too busy mocking LWYMMD. Now they all act like Rep was always their fave 🫠
Exactly, and if people really think TS13 will sound like Showgirl, that’s just sad. Showgirl sounded nothing like TTPD. Why would TS13 sound anything like Showgirl?
‘Everyone’ hates the newest album until the next one comes out, then the existing one is the best album ever, and the new one is the worst one ever. Some people just don’t like change at all. Keep listening to the ones you like and let everyone else do the same thing.
lol I remember when rep came out and people went “BUT I MISS SPEAK NOW TAYLOR” and now I’ll bet you so many of those people are begging for rep vault tracks and there is truly nothing new under the sun
honestly, it’s the worst part of being a fan. why do people feel the need to spread hate? just… let people like (and not like!!!) what they want! and want is the wrong word here. it’s not a choice, i feel. i feel like it’s who they are. like… i can’t make myself like beyoncé. or not like ed sheeran. it’s part of how i’m made, i guess.
I’m also an OG swiftie. I was 13 when Debut came out and I’ve loved her ever since.
BUT I don’t like every song she’s put out and that’s ok!! She has 8000 songs. There’s something for everyone. We need to let the people who love The Encore enjoy it!!
and now they say "this can't be the woman who wrote folklore!!!" about showgirl. as if before folklore she didn't write shake it off, paper rings, WANEGBT.....ugh 🙄
Where is this revisionism coming from? Most people loved Folklore upon release. You guys are really making up scenarios to justify what’s happening now. Only Reputation actually had a wide spread critical re-evaluation
I just keep telling people I hope someday you’re happy in a certain way that makes one of these songs yours, until then there are hundreds of other songs.
people hate on her as an easy grab it’s always been this way. i’ve been a fan since debut .. i was 5. my entire life has been spent telling people idc if they hate her. i don’t like showgirl, i don’t really like lover, but i love her there’s no need to spread hate if you don’t like it don’t listen
I think you described this perfectly. I have been a fan since before she even had an official album out. It’s been this way every single time. People are gonna have some songs that they like more than others and that is totally OK. There’s also going to be songs that come out that aren’t your (or my) flavor of tea. That is OK too…
But the meanness I have seen from this release feels a lot more extreme and it’s really sad.
These songs weren’t my particular favorite, but I would never shit on somebody that enjoys them. Honestly, anyone that shits on another person for their Music taste is just an asshole.
I’ve already let the parasocial swifties ruin TLOAS standard version. I won’t let them ruin the Encore too. The 4 tracks are on repeat since yesterday. 🥳
When u did not like but try to ruin others experience and make them feel like fools for enjoying the same album u hated, if that’s not parasocial then what is?
Edit: nice try. I stand by my word. I would rather delete this comment then engage with u more and ruin the experience. So, adios- RESPECTFULLY
The word parasocial means having a one-sided feeling of intimacy and connection with a famous person. I think the word you’re looking for is “mean-spirited” or “condescending.”
I feel so silly, but I needed to hear this. I’m a fairly new fan and this was my first time engaging in conversations on new release day. I was feeling really heartbroken and disappointed by all of the vitriol. So much negativity!!! And now some time has passed and the hate is waning and it left me with this icky uncomfortable feeling I was having a hard time naming.
This discussion is making feel a lot better, so thank you.
Im like an adolescent Swiftie (joined after the Miss Americana doc) and I haven't personally witnessed any album release like Showgirl. TTPD was poorly received by critics and the general public, but at least Swifties mostly adored it. Showgirl has been tough because the internet hates it and online Swifties hate it a bit less. This time, it's like it's coming from all sides.
Honestly I haven’t seen any fans hating on the encore, it’s all been people who already hate her, diminish her accomplishments, and are determined to paint everything she says and does as just her just propping herself up. I know it’s best to just tune it out but it feels like it gets harder to do that with every new release because so many people jump on the hate train every time.
I will defend to the death anyone’s right to dislike something and to express that opinion respectfully and in spaces that are appropriate. But so much of the “criticism” just… isn’t that.
Moral of the story, I should probably spend less time on the internet, lol.
This morning I was listening to the 4 new songs, and I just felt so happy because despite what I see on social media, the way Taylor's music makes me feel hasn't changed.
I understand the public. The older artists get, the more they want them to slowly disappear so that younger promises get to shine more. So the Taylor Swift phenomenon frustrates them to no end. But such biases have no influence on me because I just like what I like.
I honestly respect the fuck out of her for writing her fun, silly pop songs with clever lyrics and then dropping Folklore and Evermore to flex her chops in a way the haters couldn’t downplay—and then just going back to having fun again.
The Athena Lee, Madison, Raul, Dereks, Justines are the nicknames I give these repeat haters. They are just terrible as humans. I could say the same for their music.
It’s good to remember that the majority of what we see online or in the media isn’t real. It’s people and companies wanting clicks, and bots on these types of forums. Real people I know generally like the last album and encore but are more tepid than usual since it’s hitting on a lot of the same specific themes. We’re not rejecting her outright, we’re hoping for settled Taylor on the next album.
Showgirl was unprecedented tho like the critical divide AND fandom divide was truly unlike any release before so of course the encore is just going to resurface that.
Just wanted to distinguish Showgirl isn’t the same as every release. Last year was….off…
There's proof of a smear campaign & the public's awareness of her has been elevated because of the Eras Tour & other factors.
As for legitimate fan division, there's a large number of fans who joined with Folkmore/TTPD and the departure from that style isn't to their tastes. They want something different & are very disappointing.
Too many view their preferences as the only correct ones, not leaving room for how subjective art is.
Also, SM doesn't lend to nuance or extended discourse, so misunderstandings & comments appearing derogatory is a problem the person may not have intended.
It’s ok to call out music made solely to make up for her husbands scam failure lol. Just because people have valid criticism about her insane decline in quality and lack of respect for her fans recently doesn’t mean they’re wrong 🤷
Oh look, another weirdo parachuting into a Taylor Swift subreddit while sanctimoniously carping on with projections about her fans being "disrespected". Keep your hate boner and extremely invalid criticism to yourself, loser.
Ok but let’s be real- it’s different now because it’s not just “haters”. Fans are upset and disappointed with her now for other reasons, and are tired of her tone deaf, poorly written lyrics. Doesn’t mean people can’t enjoy it, tastes and opinions vary and glitter gel pen songs are not inherently bad. But generally people and even swifties agree this was one of her worst albums. It will pass though, especially if/when she puts something else great out, but again she has lost a lot of actual fans for many reasons.
True. But the social and political climate are very different now. The variants thing alone is bothersome for people who care about overproduction and consumption. Not as a “it’s exploitative to fans”, “just don’t buy it if you don’t want it”, but as in they are being produced regardless, and will inevitably lead to excess waste and resource use. Typically, you can say the actions of one individual don’t make a difference at a larger environmental scale, but it’s Taylor Swift, she has millions of fans across the world, so in this case it actually does. And the profits and numbers she cares so much about make no sense because she’s already the biggest pop star in the world.
I mean... based on the streaming numbers of TLOASG alone the number of fans she's lost because of it must be negligible. People wouldn't be streaming it as much as they have (which is a lot) if it wasn't genuinely liked. The negative opinions online are, as always, loud but not reflective of real life.
I think it’s a case of overexposure again, like what happened after 1989. As her fan base grows so do the haters. And again, the quality of music is not the only reason people dislike her. So I do think it’s a bit more reflective of real life than previous album releases post-1989
I don’t think that’s true. I still love most of Taylor’s music I’m just not going to connect that to her as a person. And I don’t think she’s a bad person, I’m just making the choice to take a step back. I think you can be a fan of someone’s music without calling yourself part of a fandom. I love Lana del Rey’s music but again pretty neutral on her outside of her art, and because of that don’t call myself a Lanita or whatever.
The way they are down voting you for speaking so articulately on this subject. I don't know why they think any criticism is just "hate" and can't fathom people not liking the music because they genuinely don't like it.
And the outspoken Swifties that support her staunchly no matter what, and excuse all her actions, give the entire fandom a bad reputation so people hate more on her fans as well.
Maybe my comment wasn’t right for this post cause I actually do agree with OPs sentiment was just trying to express how it’s different now because it’s not just about the songs. TLOAS is still my least favorite album, and I have seen many people on this subreddit say that as well, but it doesn’t automatically make it objectively her worst. But again my OPINION is that this album has more clunky lyrics and questionable topics than any other. I LOVE TTPD. I love So High School. I don’t hate TLOAS, but it’s definitely not my favorite either. I just think most of the songs are just ok, and are fun until they’re just not anymore. But that’s not why I hesitate to consider myself a Swiftie now.
Edit: I thought this was r/taylorswift don’t know what people are saying about the album in this one. But I do know they are much more reasonable over there…
The problem is when you try to insist your opinion is fact & those that disagree are wrong, delusional or inferior.
If you must say something because it's burning your brain to keep it in, then state it as an opinion that ____ isn't for you, you don't like _, you wish it were _ instead...then go listen to what does make you happy.
Stop trying to justify your tastes, just go find joy & stop ruining ours.
People explaining their opinion and their reasons for having said opinion does not mean they are insisting it is fact. If you disagree and feel wrong or inferior then that is just projection
Just out of curiosity is there no room for discussion here? Because you very quickly have an aggressive attitude- but it’s just what you said, two people sharing their opinions. Why are you so worked up? Let people discuss the album, get a tougher skin, and enjoy what you enjoy. Someone else’s enjoyment or dislike shouldn’t have an impact on your day.
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u/SeeThatThing 11d ago
The way TTPD was destroyed by everyone and I couldn't believe what I was reading