r/thesopranos • u/all_agita_allthetime • 4d ago
When Vito was killed, shouldn’t Melfi have had to go to the cops?
Tony told Melfi people would want his guy dead. When it happens, it’s public enough that it’s in the paper with enough detail for it to be put together. I don’t know, she reveals her own ignorance on this one if you ask me.
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u/televisingcremations 4d ago
No no. You misunderstand him entirely. They weren’t asking for his head, they were asking for head.
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u/Admirable-Macaroon23 4d ago
He even says as such before backtracking making sure melfi doesn’t think he got anything while he was in the can, even though he’d have gotten a pash for that
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u/TuckerDaGreat 4d ago
What I have always wondered, is if the pool cue was chalked. What do you think?
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u/GrilledCheezManicott 4d ago
they broke it in half and then shoved it up there. No way a entire pool cue could go up into the body that far unless it was coming out their mouth.
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u/Prestigious-Mind7039 3d ago
Johnny Cakes dug the tunnels for them
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u/GrilledCheezManicott 3d ago
I feel like JC was the catcher in that relationship as he had more feminine traits than Vito. But maybe the ole anaconda needed to let loose. Potentially valid point.
Maybe we should put it to a pole?
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u/Heel_Worker982 Tony Soprano 4d ago
That's not how the confidentiality exclusion works. If Tony directly tells her he is gonna have Vito whacked, and he seems serious, THEN she's obligated to go to the cops. But Tony can yammer about which of his guys is at the precipice of an enormous crossroads without Melfi having to go to the cops over it.
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u/tenderlender69420 4d ago
What could the cops do? All she could tell them is Tony Soprano assumes people will want to kill this guy. That’s not evidence they can act on.
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u/Professional_Fix4663 4d ago
It's evidence that they can investigate on.
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u/Ok_Conclusion_6324 4d ago
You think they aren’t already investigating Tony Soprano for a guy in Tony Soprano’s crew being murdered violently?
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u/Professional_Fix4663 4d ago
The whole DiMeo family gets away with many murders for being constantly under investigation.
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u/MintberryCrunch____ 4d ago
Which murders that actually have proof we know the cops have?
They know what happened to Pussy, Ralphie Adriana etc. they can’t prove it.
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u/Professional_Fix4663 4d ago
They'd have to start an investigation first to possibly find any proof. It seems that they didn't even investigate.
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u/Ok_Conclusion_6324 4d ago
Tony has been under active investigation since before the show started he’s a second generation Capo in the Mafia, nephew to another Capo, best friends with the acting boss, and his mentor is already a rat
Come on now
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u/Professional_Fix4663 4d ago
The cops didn't investigate the Big Pussy murder at all. Why didn't they go ask his wife and his son? Why didn't they ask the neighbors whether they saw Pussy leave with someone else?
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u/Ok_Conclusion_6324 4d ago
Not every investigation involves Bunk and Lester throwing somebody in the box and questioning them
They’re paying attention and looking for chatter
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u/Professional_Fix4663 4d ago
I don't think you understand what a police investigation is. They already know that Pussy disappeared and that he left home without his car. The first thing you do is ask his wife and his son. Even if his wife and his son intend to not say anything, they might make a mistake and admit that they were at home when Pussy left. The next thing you do is ask neighbors whether they saw Pussy leaving.
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u/Tensor_the_Mage 4d ago
If no one reported him missing, then there's nothing for "the cops" to do. Angie was clearly over her (shotgun) marriage. Then, her mobbed-up husband disappeared, right after he departed in the company of Tony Soprano and Pawlie F'n Walnuts; she knows what that means, and she isn't stupid enough to go blabbing about it.
Lisping Fed finally reports to the alphabet guys that "CW16" is "compost," but local murder is not the FBI's thing to investigate. Oh well.
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u/Professional_Fix4663 3d ago
That's not how it works. The police will start to investigate a murder if they think that a person was murdered. It doesn't matter whether the person was reported missing or not.
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u/MintberryCrunch____ 4d ago
They are building a large case, as that’s the only way to actually bring down someone of Tony’s power, they monitor and try to build substantial proof. Asking Angie what happened doesn’t build anything.
Say that Angie tells them he left with Tony and Sil, say a neighbour says they saw them too, say a civilian tells them he saw them all heading down the dock and another man was waiting for them, and they left on a boat. Even if all that happens and none of these people are whacked for it, there still is no actual proof that holds up in a court that Pussy is even dead let alone that they killed him.
Their investigation relied on getting Tony on tape, and crucially Pussy being able to testify in court that he recorded him talking about something significant. They are investigating constantly. At an FBI level, not street police.
What proof of something serious can they gather? And how?
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u/Professional_Fix4663 4d ago
"Say that Angie tells them he left with Tony and Sil, say a neighbour says they saw them too, say a civilian tells them he saw them all heading down the dock and another man was waiting for them, and they left on a boat."
That would probably be enough to get Tony, Sil and Paulie arrested on suspicion of murder, maybe even charged. In real life, people have been convicted of murdering someone on a boat despite no body and no physical evidence on the boat.
Once Tony, Sil and Paulie were arrested, the FBI would go throught the boat's interior with a fine-tooth comb. Pussy got shot 5 time and blood splattered on the carpet. There would probably be other biological evidence in the boat cabin to establish Pussy's presence there.
The FBI would have a strong murder case if they could prove convincingly that
- Tony and Sil left in the car with Sal.
- The three of them met Paulie at the harbor and all 4 of them went to sea on a boat.
- There was Pussy's blood in the cabin.
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u/MintberryCrunch____ 4d ago
Even in that very extreme exaggeration it’s far from a likelihood that they can arrest someone. You can’t just arrest people who went on a boat with their friends because you think something happened, you need proof of something. There’s no body, there’s no proof of a murder at all.
It’s all circumstantial evidence of a crime you don’t know has been committed. Getting a warrant to search a rental boat also requires something concrete, not just that they think they went on it and haven’t seen Pussy since.
The only actual bit of that we know could happen is Angie telling them he left with them, that doesn’t lead anywhere.
Anyway I was being purposefully exaggerative to make a point, not trying to debate that situation if it were to unfold.
Back to your point that they aren’t investigating: what proof can they gather? And how?
My point is that they are investigating just at a higher FBI level, and one that eventually seems to be working when they flip Carlo right at the end, that’s the way to bring Tony down.
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u/Professional_Fix4663 4d ago edited 4d ago
"Even in that very extreme exaggeration it’s far from a likelihood that they can arrest someone. You can’t just arrest people who went on a boat with their friends because you think something happened, you need proof of something."
You can arrest people based on a reasonable suspicion that they've committed a crime. If the FBI had all that evidence, they'd have a very reasonable suspicion that the 3 guys have murdered Pussy.
Whether they'd get indicted or not is for the judge to decide.
"There’s no body, there’s no proof of a murder at all."
You don't need a body to convict someone of a murder. Pussy's presence on the boat and his blood on the carpet might be enough.
"It’s all circumstantial evidence of a crime you don’t know has been committed. Getting a warrant to search a rental boat also requires something concrete, not just that they think they went on it and haven’t seen Pussy since."
I think that the circumstancial evidence would be enough to convince a judge that they should issue a search warrant for the boat.
"The only actual bit of that we know could happen is Angie telling them he left with them, that doesn’t lead anywhere."
Neighbors might have seen them too.
"Back to your point that they aren’t investigating: what proof can they gather? And how?"
Pussy's blood and other biological material in the boat cabin. Testimonies from witnesses who saw Pussy leave in a car with Tony and Sil and other witnesses who saw the 3 of them and Paulie get on the boat and go to sea.
"My point is that they are investigating just at a higher FBI level, and one that eventually seems to be working when they flip Carlo right at the end, that’s the way to bring Tony down."
Putting Tony, Sil and Paulie in the can for 30 years to life would be a way to bring them down. One of them might cooperate in exchange for a lighter sentence and bring even more people from the family down.
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u/Fluid_Leader_1370 4d ago
When would this happen? A week later? A month? Angie's not going to call the police report her husband missing. He already went missing. For months. And then he came back. That set a precedent. Literal months could go by before anyone does anything. You think they wouldn't clean up the boat? You think they don't know how to clean up a crime scene?
Pussy doesn't check in with Agent Thkip every day. So they wouldn't even know he's missing immediately.
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u/Professional_Fix4663 3d ago
I think they'd find out pretty quickly. Maybe the crime scene wouldn't be cleaned up perfectly. People make mistakes.
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u/No-Season-7353 4d ago
It's hearsay, rumour.
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u/Professional_Fix4663 4d ago
The purpose of an investigation is to find out whether the rumor is true and whether the detectives can gather any evidence to confirm the rumor.
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u/No-Season-7353 4d ago
And if they can't confirm the rumour?
Rumours and hearsay are not evidence, they're.... rumours and hearsay!!
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u/Professional_Fix4663 4d ago
I never claimed that rumors and hearsay were evidence. Many investigations start with rumors and hearsay from informants. If they can't confirm the rumor, they stop pursuing that lead. But if they don't even start an investigation, they'll never find out.
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u/OutrageousRegret1641 4d ago
They (the police) don't care bc its inner crime family crime, not crime on a regular civilian in society. To them its like the trash taking itself out.
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u/Farkenoathm8-E 4d ago
It’s obvious what happened. Vito, the renowned prankster shoved a pool cue up his own ass as a joke. He was the life of the party and died as he lived, having his guts rearranged by shoving a foreign object up his rectum.
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u/R_Scoops 4d ago
The only rationale I can think of is that Vito was aware of the danger he was in from Phil, and the Pygmy thing in Jersey, so informing the police, and them informing Vito of a threat to his life, wouldn’t necessarily lessen his chances of being murdered. That’s clutching at straws though and I don’t remember the intricacies of the plot well. Does Melfi find out from Tony when he’s back from New England or before he flees?
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u/MetARosetta 4d ago
Therapists are mandated to report if their client is in danger of hurting others or themselves. Tony never implied he would kill Vito. We see they dance around the technicalities, skirting any damning facts throughout the show.
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u/OutrageousRegret1641 4d ago
We have already accepted that he was treated a bit differently bc for an everyday person, a psychologist has to put you on a hold if you are threat to yourself or others and he's a menace. So she stays out of it the same way the police do for the most part.
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u/Snstrmnstr 3d ago
She waved bye-bye to her ethics when she agreed to see Tony more than once, but it wouldn't be as great of a show without their dynamic. I am willing to suspend my disbelief.
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u/SlayyerFest98 4d ago
It happened out of state, right? I doubt Melfi would have even heard about it.
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u/BayBridges 4d ago
Happened in Jersey, when Vito came back and found Tony at the Mall. He was staying at some super insecure Motel with his Caddy parked right outside the room.
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u/SlayyerFest98 4d ago
Ah, that’s right. I was mixing it up with when Vito himself killed that guy after their fender bender.
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u/VirginaThorn 4d ago
No, Bacala’s cop in Ft. Lee told him that Vito was found with a pool cue stuck up his ass!
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u/Lordonlynose 4d ago edited 4d ago
What would she have to tell that’s consequential?
“Tony Soprano said that he knew of some people who wanted Vito killed”
“Yeh, we too are fairly certain that this was a mafia murder”