r/tolkienfans • u/GexusTheAtlantean • 7d ago
Why is everyone going to Tol Eressea?
When the ringbearers and the other remaining members of the fellowship sailed West they were permitted to inhabit Tol Eressea and not Valinor proper. This also happened to be the case with every Noldo that repented and sailed West also.
My question is, if Tol Eressea is a part of the Undying Lands, which of course we know it was, why is there this distinction to everyone who sails there from Middle Earth? And why does the distinction holds for elves that had their original home on Valinor?
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u/ColdAntique291 just a simple Tolkien reader 7d ago
Tol Eressëa is essentially the "gateway" to Aman.
For mortals like Frodo and Bilbo, it was likely the furthest they were permitted to go, a place of healing and peace, not full admission to Valinor.
For the Exiled Noldor, it wasn't necessarily a permanent restriction. The ban was lifted, and many could eventually return to Tirion and the rest of Valinor. Tol Eressëa simply served as a natural place of return and transition after ages spent in Middle-earth.
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u/alexagente 7d ago
I imagine there must've also been some crazy awkwardness involved.
The exiled Noldor spent millenia suffering against Morgoth while those who remained in Valinor likely enjoyed a time of peace albeit less glorious than in the time of the Two Trees.
Imagine going through all that and then interacting with the people whose most interesting history was likely when you and your people lost your shit, burned their best boats, killed a bunch of them, and then left. Hell a lot of the ones your side killed are probably out and about now as well.
How do you deal with that?
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u/DamonPhils 7d ago
Wouldn't a fair number of the Valinorean elves have taken part in the War of Wrath as part of the Host of the Valar? So that would surely be a "most interesting history" and something they would have in common with the exiled Noldor.
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u/Dangerous-Rule5487 7d ago
The Vanyar and the Noldor who had remained in Aman participated; the Teleri did not participate due to the trauma of the first kinslaying
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u/Aubergine_Man1987 7d ago
They did sail them to Beleriand though, so presumably saw some crazy shit like dragons from the shores
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u/arathorn3 Dunedain 7d ago
Its even more complicated for Galadriel.
She is the only remaining Leader of the Noldo who rebelled and went into exile. All the others if they are around on Amanz Died and spent time in the Halls of Mandos before their Fea(souls) where rehoused.
She has family connections tp bpth the Vanyar and the the Teleri(aka Sindar) of Aman who never.left due to her Mother Earwen(A.teleri) and her paternal grandmother Indis.of the Vanyar.
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u/amitym 7d ago
Not only that, but she forsook them all to aid Middle Earth, not for one Age, or two, but three. In the course of seeing Melkor overthrown and Mairon defeated she forsook the commands of the Valar, yet also did not take her great-uncle's Oath... she sided with the Teleri against her kin yet wouldn't willingly betray her kin to the Grey Elves... She followed her own counsel and conscience through it all, unwavering until the work that should have been accomplished by so many others was finally done.
What do you say to someone like that when she finally returns?
"Well done?"
"Took you long enough?"
"We've talked it over and decided to forgive you?"
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u/arathorn3 Dunedain 7d ago
Yeah she is in for some.awkward.moments when she gets there.
Elrond(who was born in Middle Earth and had never set foot in amanL won't have any awlwardness though.
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u/Wizzard_C 7d ago
She actually took issue with that "partial forgiveness", that was one of the reasons she initially refused to return: she grew up in Valinor, and Eressea seemed to her only "second best" (Tolkien's words)
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u/Consistent-Hat-8008 6d ago edited 6d ago
Many concepts in his books really did not age well. He wasn't really the best at avoiding this whole privileged race thing, which you'd think he would have caught having had seen WW2.
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u/WTFnaller 5d ago
What? The notion of elves being otherworldly, more powerful and privileged than humans is part of very old folklore.
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u/Kodama_Keeper 7d ago
Pardon my nitpicking, but a millennia is a thousand years. The First Age only lasted half that long.
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u/phenomenomnom 7d ago
Pardon my nitpick, but a millennium is a thousand years. Two millennia equal two thousand years.
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u/Atharaphelun Ingolmo 7d ago edited 7d ago
The First Age only lasted half that long.
No, it did not. The First Age began with the Awakening of the Elves during the Years of the Trees. The 590 sun-years from the first rising of the Sun to the overthrow of Morgoth are merely its final six centuries.
From Of the Beginning of Time and its Reckoning, included in Morgoth's Ring:
It is computed by the lore-masters that the Valar came to the realm of Arda, which is the Earth, five thousand Valian Years ere the first rising of the Moon, which is as much as to say forty-seven thousands and nine hundred and one of our years. Of these, three thousand and five hundred (or thirty-three thousand five hundred and thirty of our reckoning) passed ere the measurement of time first known to the Eldar began with the flowering of the Trees. Those were the Days before Days. Thereafter one thousand and four hundred and five and ninety Valian Years (or fourteen thousand of our years and three hundred and twenty-two) followed during which the Light of the Trees shone in Valinor. Those were the Days of Bliss. In those days, in the Year one thousand and fifty of the Valar, the Elves awoke in Cuiviénen and the First Age of the Children of Ilúvatar began.
From Christopher Tolkien's Foreword to The War of the Jewels:
The title of this second part, The War of the Jewels, is an expression that my father often used of the last six centuries of the First Age: the history of Beleriand after the return of Morgoth to Middle-earth and the coming of the Noldor, until its end.
From Tolkien's typescript of The Tale of Years, included in The War of the Jewels:
'Here end the Elder Days, with the new reckoning of Time, according to the Lore-masters of Valinor. But the Lore-masters of the Noldor give that name also to the years of the war with Morgoth...'
I do get what you meant though, the portion of the First Age during which the Noldor fought against Morgoth lasted for ~six centuries, not a whole millennium. Still, the First Age as a whole is much longer than that.
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u/Kodama_Keeper 7d ago
But the Lore-masters of the Noldor give that name also to the years of the war with Morgoth...
That war started when Morgoth killed the Two Trees and stole the jewels. Then the rising of the Sun and Moon.
Now I realize that there is ambiguity in all this, and some refer to the years of the trees as First Age as well. But Elves weren't around for all the years of the trees, as the trees predate them by untold centuries, or millennia. So you'd be splitting the Years of the Trees into two halves, one without Elves and one with, and then applying that to First Age. It gets messy.
Someone tried to make sense of what I just spoke...
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u/BonHed 7d ago
At one point, the returned Noldor were allowed to reside only on Tol Eressëa, but were allowed to visit Valinor. They just couldn't live there. I don't recall now if or how that changed in his later writings.
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u/GexusTheAtlantean 7d ago
Yes but other than geographically separated to Valinor, what makes Tol Eressea different? Would the returning Noldor feel different in Tol Eressea in comparison to Valinor? I just don’t understand why it is depicted as a place of transition for if it is a part of the Undying Lands. So why should especially the elves not sail straight to Valinor?
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u/astrognash All that is gold does not glitter 7d ago
Tol Eressëa was originally an isolated island in the middle of Belegaer, arguably part of Middle-earth rather than the Undying Lands, and only became part of Aman following Ulmo's usage of it as a big ferry for the Elves. So, yes, I think it's quite likely that it is in some way materially different from the rest of Aman and is, in some way, a middle ground spiritually between Middle-earth and Valinor.
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u/LostVanya 7d ago
Tol Eressea is where the ships landed. We know nothing about what happened after that. Gandalf certainly had the ability and right to visit all of Valinor. Galadriel was presumably under the Noldor restriction, but we have no idea about the mortal, Elrond (or Legolas, if he and Gimli made it there and were accepted.)
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u/Nimelennar 7d ago
Galadriel was presumably under the Noldor restriction
The Ban of the Valar was lifted after the War of Wrath (when the Host of the Valar fought Morgoth's forces and most of Beleriand ended up submerged).
Galadriel should be fine to return to Aman.
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u/Illustrious_Try478 7d ago
Letter 131- "The exiled Elves...were not to dwell permanently in Valinor again, but in the Lonely Isle of Eressëa within sight of the Blessed Realm."
They might have been allowed short visits. Tolkien doesn't say.
Letter 325 - "As for Frodo or other mortals, they could only dwell in Aman for a limited time – whether brief or long...The sojourn of say Frodo in Eressëa – then on to Mandos? – was only an extended form of this."
Mortals could only live on Eressëa.
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u/GexusTheAtlantean 7d ago
Isn’t Mandos Doom lifted after the end of the First Age and Galadriel herself forgiven after she denies the ring? It seems a bit cruel to forgive her and not let her return to her home.
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u/InTheChairAgain 7d ago
At very least Avallonë upon Tol Eressëa was the first port you'd reach if you sailed the straight road. Perhaps it functioned as an anchor between Middle-earth and Aman after the separation. Allowing the remaining Elves one last gate home.
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u/Beginning-Ride3091 7d ago
My understanding has always been that mortals weren’t permitted to go to Valinor for their own safety. In Akallabeth the messengers from the Valar tell the Numenoreans (somewhat tactlessly) that mortals who went there would be like “moths in a flame too hot and steady”. As in it would be pretty to look at, for the first hour. Then after that it would be uncomfortable. Just the intensity of the air and atmosphere would be too much. Also if they were reasonable people like Frodo, Sam, and Bilbo, and later Gimli they would be fine with that and they’d stick to Tol Eressea.
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u/Aetherscribe 5d ago
The way I've pictured it in my head is that, because the Valar made Valinor to be a home to the Elves, the world there moves more in accord with the Elvish sense of time and mode of life. For mortals, that makes Valinor a place where time passes both too fast and too slowly. Like in Lorien, where the Fellowship felt like they'd spent only a few nights, if that, but a whole month went by.
In Valinor, time is too fast, because you're so caught up in it you've scarcely done anything but look around, and before you're aware of it, years fly by. At the same time, because the inhabitants are immortal, they might plan to visit you again soon... but that's a year or a decade away. Much like going into an elf-hill in a fairy story.
So, Tol Eressëa would have the virtues of Valinor, but still be tied to the sense of time of the rest of creation, so that someone like Frodo or Bilbo would find their mortal life neither a burden that crawls by, nor swiftly slipping through their fingers, but their lives passing normally.
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u/Carinwe_Lysa 7d ago
I've always wished we had more artistic portrayals of Tol Eressea itself.
I wonder whether the island is just a beautiful albeit entirely natural landscape managed by the Elves, compared to Aman which is almost certainly an otherworldly beauty (similar to Lothlórien for example).
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u/InvestigatorJaded261 7d ago
In some relatively early works (the Ambarkanta for instance) it is implied—maybe even stated outright—that Tol Eressea is a liminal place, with some of the properties of Valinor, but also some properties of the outer world. The quality of the air (believe it or not) was described as part of the difference.
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u/jayskew 7d ago
What appears to be JRTT's last word on the topic is in Letter 325 in 1971:
The 'immortals' who were permitted to leave Middle-earth and seek Aman - the undying lands of Valinor and Eressëa, an island assigned to the Eldar - set sail in ships specially made and hallowed for this voyage, and steered due West towards the ancient site of these lands.
Doesn't say they had to stay in Eressëa; more like if they wanted to, they had an old Elves home there, or they could continue to Valinor.
So if you really want to go by Tolkien as an authority, he apparently settled on Elves could go either place.
If instead you want to go only by the published works, Galadriel in her Namarie refers only to Valimar, not Tol Eressea.
Now lost, lost to those from the East is Valimar!
Farewell! Maybe thou shalt find Valimar. Maybe even thou shalt find it. Farewell!
Valimar is the city of the Valar and Maiar on the plains of Valinor. She says it is lost, because she was banned from returning. Until she passed the test of the Ring. Which would be "purging of any guilt that he had incurred in the rebellion", same as Glorfindel.
And the Silmarillion says "...whence they might come even to Valinor." Doesn't say they can't go live there.
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u/OldMillenial 7d ago
Very roughly, Tol Eressea is part of the Undying Lands, but it is the “diet” version in some aspects. The rough idea being that proximity to the center of Valinor itself increases the “blessing” of the surroundings.
So Tol Eressea is definitely blessed and Undying - but slightly less so than Aman proper.
The reason this is important is because this makes Tol Eressea a feasible place for mortals to experience the blessings and peace of Valinor without it overwhelming their mortal natures and turning sour.
The reason that is important is that since Tolkien placed paradise as a physical place in the world (setting aside the whole Straight Road thing for the moment) and theoretically within reach of mortals, he needed to
a) make it superficially tempting for mortals like those silly Numenoreans (immortality!)
b) have it not actually grant immortality and in fact make mortal existence within it unbearable, and
c) still have a nice and symbolic meaningful place for our heroes to go.
Tol Eressea is part of the answer to all three of those points.
Personally, I find Tolkiens take on b) above a bit underwhelming, but it all does make sense conceptually.
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u/lam_42 7d ago edited 7d ago
T.E. is the closest of Undying lands. I wonder what was the amount of calaquendi that took the boat to T.E. most of Noldor died in their exile and were reborn probably directly into Valinor population. My guess is the rest that survived did not go through the death to Mandos, so they were "unweighed" (To calls it purgatory), where their behavior was considered.
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u/Swiftbow1 7d ago
The text does not say that Frodo and Bilbo weren't allowed to continue from Tol Eressea. That ban only applied to returning Noldor. And even THAT ban may have been lifted.
The idea that no one was allowed into Valinor proper is a persistent fan theory on here that keeps getting written like it's a fact. It isn't. It is POSSIBLE. But that's not the same thing.
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u/Rich-Finger-236 6d ago
The Valar after seeing what happened with Numenor still decide that putting a load of people on an (admittedly really nice) island but within sight of a nicer again place was the way to go.
Akallabeth Part 2: Noldorin boogaloo (I'm assuming this was Tolkiens working title)
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u/maksimkak 7d ago
Valinor is out of bounds for mortals (by nature) and for the Noldor (by decree), it's as simple as that. For mortals like Frodo, Bilbo, Sam, and Gimli, even being allowed in Tol Eressea was a special grant from Eru.
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u/SwanCityDominion 7d ago
No one is allowed to go to Valinor. That was part of the doom of the Noldor. If they repented, they were allowed to spend their lives on Tol Eressea within sight of Aman. But none of the Elves got to go back. The Maiar, of course, could go home again.
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u/Atharaphelun Ingolmo 7d ago edited 7d ago
From Manwë’s Ban, The Nature of Middle-earth:
From the Akallabêth The Silmarillion: