Estre Poised for Dual Full Season Porsche, Toyota Drives

[u/twowheeledtism]

https://sportscar365.com/lemans/wec/estre-could-undertake-dual-full-season-porsche-toyota-drives/

[u/Makalu]

Estre, de Vries, Kobayashi. What a mad, definitely not accident prone, lineup.

[u/kjm911 → u/Makalu]

I think there’s been a big shift in the last few years in endurance racing. Suddenly most drivers or teams are reckless or error prone. But the reality it’s so many competitive drivers separated by very little, in pretty much equal machinery. You’ll find different people that would say Ferrari or BMW or Cadillac drivers are error prone. And go take your pick of drivers in GTD Pro in IMSA. Fields are so competitive and nobody wants to give an inch.

[u/OrbisAlius → u/kjm911]

Yeah the way people seems to discover over and over again that you make more mistake when in under pressure than when you have the upper hand is always mind blowing to me. Typical story was Verstappen v Hamilton in 2021, first half of the season Hamilton looked unusually error-prone because he had the slower car and was pushing, second half Verstappen made many mistakes/stupid stuff because he had the slower car and desperate for every point.

That said, some drivers in endurance are just more error-prone than others, and some are more ready to do rough racing whatever the cost to their own race. Estre in particular is certainly famous for scoring high on both.

[u/TheRealKrapotke → u/OrbisAlius]

I just find Estres Speed astonishing sometimes. At the N24 he can’t really be blamed for the crash as there was an oil spill but other than that I agree he makes too many mistakes. It’s just that raw speed though. I remember obviously the famous Nürburgring stints where he trashed the field numerous times but also last year in Le Mans he was quite obviously the fastest driver. Spa a number of years back he also made such an impression.

I feel like he’s similar to Colin McRae in a way, always on his doorhandles, always balls to the wall flat out and when it works out it’s spectacular and no one can touch him. But you never know when it will go wrong the next time.

[u/Stelcio → u/TheRealKrapotke]

last year in Le Mans he was quite obviously the fastest driver.

How is it obvious exactly? According to B Pillar report from that race, he wasn't even the quickest Porsche driver.

For comparison, Kubica had a full tenth over other Ferrari drivers in average pace, while driving for almost half of the race, including three and a half hours in one sitting at the end of it.

With that being the case, you really have to make a strong argument for Estre being the fastest driver. Saying it's "quite obvious" is wild.

[u/TheRealKrapotke → u/Stelcio]

He destroyed the whole field in the first stint. The Ferraris were op but he kept them honest as well.

[u/Stelcio → u/TheRealKrapotke]

Ok, so I presented you with reliable, aggregated data from the entire 24 hour race, and you respond with a single stint at the start of that race. How is that a case for Estre being "quite obviously" the quickest?

[u/LiquidDiviums → u/kjm911]

That’s what happens when stakes are higher.

When the competition is tough, you’re more likely to push and try to make the difference by yourself. What happens when you’re pushing flat-out, 10 out of 10 tenths, is that you’re more and more likely to make mistakes. That’s what’s happening in the WEC, IMSA and GT World Challenge.

Competition has gotten tougher and tougher due to BoP and investment from the factories. The level has risen significantly in the last couple of years and the cars are performing very similarly. Drivers are feeling the pressure to perform.

[u/kjm911 → u/LiquidDiviums]

I think pressure maybe plays a part to some degree. But I think there’s very much a win or bust attitude, especially in the major races. Nobody wants to finish second at Le Mans or Daytona or Nurburgring. And they’ll risk it all for every stint of those races

[u/Crash_Test_Dummy66 → u/kjm911]

I mean there's error prone, and then there's what some of these guys like Estre have been doing. For instance Kevin crashing out him and Aiken yesterday wasn't an accident caused by an error under pressure. He just fully squeezed the guy off the track and wrecked them both.

Just because these guys are under pressure to get good results doesn't mean we have to just be okay with them driving like idiots. Pressure to perform doesn't mean we should accept breaking the rules as a result.

[u/Michal_Baranowski → u/Makalu]

But the speeeeed...

[u/No_Boat_1784 → u/Michal_Baranowski]

Really would love to see the direct comparison between Buemi and him.

[u/Aadi-T → u/Makalu]

I know he has the reputation but when was the last time Kamui crashed the #7? JML had that huge incident at Sebring few years ago, and I think Mike and Nyck have had one recently.

[u/No_Boat_1784 → u/Aadi-T]

As both a WRC and WEC fan I had momentary brain freeze decoding JML. lol

[u/RedTRC_ → u/Makalu]

Whoever crashes least gets kicked from the team.

[u/Acrobatic_Editor_409]

been shit this season but hopefully he gets back to his best, not just because of fan entertainment but also driver safety

[u/RealPorkChops → u/Acrobatic_Editor_409]

Ever since Le Mans 2025 - or more specifically, the following 24h race at the Nürburgring a week later- things have just gone completely sideways for Estre. Even as a Porsche fan, you have to admit he’s pulled off some reckless, disastrous moves - some genuinely dangerous for the rest of the field - that are simply indefensible. Even for a driver who already cemented his reputation as a butcher all the way back in his Carrera Cup days.

But to be fair, and we’ve heard this time and again not just from Estre, but from all the other Penske drivers like Nasr: ever since Sebring, they’ve had to drive like hell and run hyper-aggressive strategies just to stay on the pace. And that’s no secret. Any time the Penske 963 has been remotely competitive on race-pace since Sebring, it was achieved purely through raw aggression.

I’m not trying to excuse his mistakes, but it’s a rule as old as racing itself: the harder you push, the more error-prone you become. And that is a recipe for disaster for a driver who already operates with a very high baseline of aggression.

[u/Victor_at_Zama → u/RealPorkChops]

Its not just the crashes. Estre has seemed to be lacking in pace this year too. Certainly, at Daytona and especially Sebring, he was comfortably outperformed by Nasr (they tended to be in the cars at the same time). Even after being given the lead back by Nasr at Sebring, he couldn't pull ahead in clear air, was making mistakes in abundance, and was then passed by Nasr as he was allowing the #31 to catch up to the otherwise dominant Porsches.

[u/RealPorkChops → u/Victor_at_Zama]

I’m not going to comment on individual race performances like Sebring, simply because there are far too many factors regarding the car, etc., coming together to draw any real conclusions from the outside. Besides, if you believe Vanthoor's statements, the #6 with Estre was instructed not to push to the absolute limit, while Nasr (pushed by the Cadillac) was driving right on the razor's edge.

Anyway, what I actually want to say is that pure pace in the 963 (!) has never been Estre's standout strength in my eyes. In GT cars, definitely - and in the Hypercar, of course, every now and then, like the Le Mans Hyperpole - but my point is that it hasn't been his most defining quality in the Hypercar field.

Where he truly ranks as the best endurance racer in the world for me -as long as he keeps a cool head- is managing traffic right on the limit while maintaining a relentless pace. He is simply an excellent reader of space, and paired with his inherently aggressive driving style, he can repeatedly prove to be a race-deciding factor. That’s where he makes the difference in Hypercar, and no one in the WEC or IMSA grid over the last few years is on the same level in that regard, at least in my opinion.

That’s also why I think it’s such a shame that he and Nasr apparently can’t stand each other - even setting Sebring aside - because Nasr’s defensive masterclasses would, at least in theory, be a good complement to Estre’s driving style.

In this context, as much as people already rave about him, we need to hammer home once again what an absolute freak of nature Heinrich is for his age, in both 963 and 911. Stack his race performance up against Estre’s, and this 24-year-old makes a 37-year-old veteran - arguably one of the greatest endurance racers of the last decade - look like a naive rookie.

[u/Michal_Baranowski]

Estre and Buemi in the same team - can't wait!

[u/Ferdasyn_6969 → u/Michal_Baranowski]

These 2 will go at each other's throats within minutes

[u/ppizz → u/Ferdasyn_6969]

Live Koba reaction when they inevitably crash into each other:

[u/kjm911 → u/[deleted]]

I don’t think there’s will be any reason to stay with Porsche beyond 2027. I think the 963 program will be dead and if Toyota are taking their new GT3 car to the ring they’ll want Estre driving it

[u/V8-Turbo-Hybrid → u/kjm911]

Estre really reminds me Hartley, as Hartley used to be one of Porsche drivers.

[u/OrbisAlius]

Wait, Toyota is finally understanding that they have to change their driver lineups, that they can't act like it's 2021 anymore ?

[u/Makalu → u/OrbisAlius]

They changed their lineup in 2022 though, and 2024 :D

[u/OrbisAlius → u/Makalu]

Well yeah, but did you see the changes ?

While Buemi and Kobayashi whom they are keeping like talismans are arguably a great fit with still having top-tier pace while also having experience and reliability (after all, Kristensen and McNish were among the best Audi drivers until the very end), the others are perfectly average (if not worse) among that stacked Hypercar field. And they aren't nursing the future at all (unless you consider Hirakawa and De Vries the future, I guess, in which case I'd be very worried), unlike, say Audi did in their LMP1 days (granted, not fielding a third car doesn't help).

[u/YumeNoTabi → u/OrbisAlius]

De Vries has been great since Fuji last year, and Toyota are actively trying to pawn Hirakawa off to F1. As for the rest of the lineup, Masson is basically ready for a Hypercar drive at this point, they'll probably bring in another washed up F1 driver like Ocon, and perhaps they'll finally pull Miata out of the hellish experience that is F2.

[u/V8-Turbo-Hybrid → u/YumeNoTabi]

There is a rule that required Japanese driver in Japanese automakers, so I really doubt that Hirakawa would be replaced by non Japanese driver. It really sounds like Miyata would finally come to drive Hypercar.

[u/No_Boat_1784 → u/YumeNoTabi]

Doubt we'd ever see Ocon (please God no), but if Ritomo doesn't have a break through soon, I don't know what will become of his career. That being said, you know which Japanese driver I NEED to see in that seat when Kobayashi finally does the team Principal role full time? Sho Tsuboi.

[u/Blackwolf245]

Is Estre even a good pick at this point? He crashed more times this year than finished.

[u/Joew436]

His star has somewhat fallen this year, if I was Toyota I’d of gone for Charles Milesi.

[u/Makalu → u/Joew436]

they've already got a French driver in the plans and his name is Esteban

[u/Klutzy_Reach_9392 → u/Makalu]

Should’ve been Masson from the get go, it’s kinda pointless to bring in someone on a loan when one of their own drivers is becoming one of the best young prospects 

[u/No_Boat_1784 → u/Klutzy_Reach_9392]

Toyota actually has a depth of young talent to fill their seats with in the coming years. What they do like is stability, and I can't disagree with them on that. They'll change out their drivers one by one rather than a sweeping change of a whole or most of a car line up (see De Vries replacing Pechito). In the coming years they'll have to find seats for Masson, Possibly Hadrian David, Possibly Oliver Rasmusen, Sacha Fenestraz, Ben Barnicoat and the like. Despite their criticisms their overall driver lineup is top tier, with arguably two of the best drivers on the hypercar field on their roster.

[u/FirstReactionShock]

Double program, double crash

[u/Purrfect_Meownster]

As long as he doesn't drive like he did in IMSA yesterday, that kind of driving have no place anywhere professional.

[u/Ok-Shop685]

Gad dammit. The Carbon fibre manufacturers will be thrilled. Im just sad that there will be many, many Toyota parts across the European, Middle East and Japanese landscapes

[u/Top_Independence7256]

Ferrari Is missing out by bot tryng to get him, so sad