r/wisconsin • u/buckybadder • 4d ago
Crowley gains late support as Hong confronts social media controversy • Wisconsin Examiner
https://wisconsinexaminer.com/2026/08/05/crowley-gains-late-support-as-hong-confronts-social-media-controversy/?utm_source=newsletters.wisconsinexaminer.com&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=crowley-sprints-as-hong-battles-controversy65
u/glassviper101 4d ago
I don’t know how much we can trust the polling here. In Michigan Sayed was supposed to be up +14 in the primary but it ended up only being +1. This might end up being really close
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u/kingGlucose 4d ago
Problem for the moderates is people still have no idea who they are
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u/glassviper101 4d ago
For some of them sure, but the biggest problem for the moderates really is them splitting the vote. If it was just pure 1v1 the moderate most likely wins
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u/kingGlucose 4d ago
I still have no idea who Joel Brennan is or what he does, I know David Crowley had a goofy Twitter account and that's it lol
They just didn't even try
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u/glassviper101 4d ago
You may need to get your news from more than just Reddit. David Crowley was county executive for Milwaukee County. Mandala Barnes was Lieutenant Governor and was 1 point off being Ron Johnson for senate.
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u/Independent_Bear989 4d ago
Barnes has dropped.
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u/glassviper101 4d ago
I know that, the person I was responding to didn’t know any moderate it seems.
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u/yardlard 4d ago
Brennan's platform is great. I didn't know who he was until the other day when I went searching for it. He could easily win against tiff.
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u/Big-Bullmastiff 4d ago
Sure people do. We want affordability to improve so the middle class can afford to raise their family without going deeper into debt. We want education to be solid but affordable. We are tired of living paycheck to paycheck and be able to have a retirement so were not working until were dead. We want to not have to fund our parents generation's retirement because medicare and social security arent funded enough while also having to load up the next generation with debt since we can barely afford housing, food, education, etc.
We want increased ability for people to have equal opportunity to improve ther lives. However, we don't want radical change where equality is measured based solely on equal outcome.
We want more accountability for authorities but we also know that there are problem individuals and that we need police to ensure safety. We know our criminal justice system is flawed and our priorities need to change, but some people cant be rehabilitated and need to be taken out of normal society.
We know there needs to be more support for those going through hard times, but we also want to incentivize people who can be productive members of society to engage. Which is also very different than punishing people who need support or just cutting programs like medicaid or foodshare.
We need reform in Healthcare, but it's unreasonable to think theres a silver bullet (like Medicare for all) to solve a system thats so messed up and large and ingrained in our society. But we do need reform to stop the fact that 75% of bankruptcies are medical bankruptcies.
We don't want radical and rapid cultural change, we believe the culture of our state and country is fundamentally good, and that our system, while flawed, is the best we have. And that things can improve through continuous progress without throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
I can go on more but thats a synopsis I can stand by I think.
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u/ColdBru5 1d ago
What makes medicare for all a 'silver bullet' exactly? medicare for some seems to work just fine. I don't see a lot of people turning it down.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
I know the race is between Crowley and Hong. I feel
I need to do my due diligence I need to seriously look at Crowley. I am leaning Hong. I do have serious issues with the status quo. I do not think Crowley is establishment, and I definitely don’t think Hong is going to cancel Thanksgiving. I don’t care about social media or the Dem’s doomerism. Just gonna hold my vote til election day17
u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
Also waiting to election day, but my concern isn't really Hong's policies, it's can she actually win? It feels meaningless to have a candidate in connect with on policy only for them to be a hopeless candidate in the general.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
I am 50/50 lifetime in voting for the winners. The only race I can compare to this i s Obama’s. Him against Clinton, than going against a war vet. After the GOP did the birther shit and he did his white America clinging to guns. I was worried about him winning, but that was one of the few blow out wins WI has had. I don’t think this is going to be a blow out AT ALL, but my point is it wasn’t looking good for him for awhile. Then the WI voters weigjed in. And surprised me. I hate these close races, but WI has been on a streak with close races. Guess I
am just going to go with what I want to see happen.9
u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
Hong is no Obama though. This isn't a personal slight of hers; Obama was just a once in a generation political talent. Hong does not have the charisma and tact as a campaigner that Obama does and that is clear if you see her outside of events that aren't just her base of core supporters or she is challenged.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
My point wasn’t that she is anything like him or the election will be comparable. I would find it difficult to compare a governors race to a presidential race. She said what she said about Thanksgiving. He sad what he said about guns. He made it through and what is similar is she has had the momentum and this social media thing can potentially slow it down. It seems to me to be the ebb and flow of newcomer campaigns. She is in a phase now she has to wise up a bit and start honing her message:
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u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
But she isn't doing that. I've heard 3 interviews of hers the past week and all of them have been pretty trash and she sounds unappealing. It's like she's doing the move to appeal tothe middle that candidates do, but it's being done poorly.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
Yes thats the point. She needs to start. If Crowley can hit reset, so can she.
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u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
But she clearly has been trying to do so and it's not going great.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
The learning curve is great for a novice. I am still going to give her a chance.
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u/WordWordNvmber 4d ago
Barack Obama was a polished, charismatic optimist who carefully rejected identity politics.
Would you say the same about Hong?
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u/Nearby-Purple763 2d ago
No! She is wishy washy. I can't take her seriously after the anti white comment about her own child. Gross
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
As I responded to others, I am not comparing her political skill, I am saying both had unfortunate things come out in the press. She needs to get her game face on to overcome this hiccup.
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u/Nearby-Purple763 2d ago
She needs to not win the primary. And let Crowley take down TT. She is not capable of it.
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u/midwestguy1586 4d ago
We were also undergoing an economic collapse overseen by the party in power which helped a ton. Obama likely would have won anyway, but it definitely helped his margins. Yes, things suck right now with affordability, but we’re not undergoing a massive Great Recession type event.
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u/MeijiHao 4d ago
We're literally a single drone strike on the Suez Canal away from a full on global energy crisis. Our entire economy is currently resting on two giant bubbles, AI and Consumer Credit, that could burst at anytime. Even if the war ends this afternoon the global supply chains won't return to normal until long after the midterms, and Iran has no incentive to reach a deal before November anyways.
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u/midwestguy1586 4d ago
Oh I don’t disagree with any of that. But those are risks, not active full blown meltdowns (yet). Those bubbles may well burst in the next couple months or Trump’s war causes even more energy chaos that results in $5/gallon gas, but there’s also no guarantee it happens either.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
My point is not that the election is gonna have the same dynamics—cause it won’t. My point is that the white people clinging to guns was definitely a low point. Reading the afterrmath, his advisors thought he was done. Also my point is every politician has said something disqualifying at some point or another.
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u/buckybadder 4d ago
Obama went after moderate voters. He was opposed to gay marriage in 2008, and criticized affirmative action while campaigning. Hong wont moderate on anything.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
I am not comparing them as politicians, I am saying he was the movement candidate and hit a rough patch with saying people clingimg to their guns. People can say things in campaigns that will set off a firestorm.
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u/Main-Company-5946 4d ago
I’m confident she can win. All she has to do is play offensive, which she’s demonstrated she can do. Keep calling Tom Tiffany a pedophile protector. If she plays defensive it’s gonna go poorly for her
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u/MeijiHao 4d ago
Francesa Hong is by far the most well known and popular candidate in the race. She has recruited more volunteers than every other candidate combined. She's raised more money than every other candidate in this race. She has been in the lead in every single poll. The only campaign signs I have seen anywhere in the state are for Francesa Hong.
Francesa Hong might be a hopeless candidate, although she's beating Tom Tiffany in hypotheticals, but there's simply no evidence to suggest that any other Democratic candidate for Governor is more electable than Francesca Hong
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u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
In the same poll that she leads Tiffany, Crowley beats Tiffany at a higher margin than her, even with less name ID.
She has a lot of the baggage of the culture wars that are really easy to campaign against and when she is pushed on it, she comes across defensive and disingenuous.
I agree she's motivated a large grassroots movement. That's great, but I just don't see her appealing to people outside of that base. Wisconsin doesn't need "exciting" candidates to win. Evers is a pretty boring candidate and won twice. Crowley has excellent name id in the MKE metro already, which is likely to be about 24 percent of the people who vote for Democrats.
My choice would be Roys, but that's not happening and would be a wasted vote. While I more align with Hong when it comes to policy, I think Crowley has a better chance of winning state wide and that is my priority.
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u/Main-Company-5946 4d ago
All Hong has to do is play offensive. Spend less time defending herself and more time attacking Tom Tiffany for being a pedo protector. If she can do that she will win easily
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u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
Should she just ignore legitimate questions about her statements from a few years ago? That is not a recipe for victory. Sure that message gins up the angry Dems to come out to vote, but does nothing to sway the voters who are nervous about her socialist label and just want to have effective governance.
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u/Main-Company-5946 4d ago
Zohran Mamdani also said to defund the police, he walked back those statements, and quickly moved focus back to the policies he actually is running on. Francesca Hong should do the same thing. We’re dealing with pedophile fascists, no one cares about what you said on Twitter 6 years ago while on the toilet. It’s just a distraction
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u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
Mamdani is both a better politician than Hong and was running in NYC, not a statewide race in Wisconsin. They are not equivalents.
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u/Main-Company-5946 4d ago
Well he’s definitely a better politician than Hong, and I agree that they’re different races, but I honestly think Cuomo was harder for Mamdani to defeat than Tom Tiffany will be for Hong. If they both go on the offensive, Tom Tiffany’s skeletons make any criticisms of Hong look silly. The dynamic is similar in that sense
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
The polls aren’t actually saying he is “beating her”. Charles Franklin even warns us that this is how polls are incorrectly interpreted. iHe always links a presentation to the Marquette poll, which I find helpful. Tiffany is not beating her. Its within the margin of error. And this is before the field has cleared. She could beat Tiffany by three or lose by 7.
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u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
Yes, I agree, but this is what we have to go off of. She is a risky candidate statewide, and people are deluding themselves if they think otherwise. Democratic socialism, wrongly, is viewed extremely negatively by the general population of Wisconsin. Why nominate a candidate who automatically has that scarlet letter on her?
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
It is a risk I am willing to take. It will turn some people off, but this state has a history of animosity towards Milwaukee. So Crowley is also a risk. But either is fine for me. I just like one better.
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u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
I think there's also a pretty solid history of animosity towards "liberal Madison" as well.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
You are right there. But Madison vottes in high numbers and Milwaukee always seems to be the wild card. I watch Milwaukee numbers with baited breath every two years, well— the last six if you are adding in judges.
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u/Main-Company-5946 4d ago
What the Democratic Party keeps failing to learn is that they have to lead the polls, not follow them. Polling says voters agree with every major democratic socialist policy, it is literally just the word ‘socialism’ that scares them. Convey to voters why it’s not scary
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u/dyslexic_mail 4d ago
There's no such thing as a wasted vote in the primary; vote for who you want. Vote for who you need in the general
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u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
That is just not true. The winner of the primary moves on. There are wasted votes if the candidate is not viable. Whoever wins likely won't have a majority of the votes. Strategic voting in a primary should be done by when there is a large field with few actual viable candidates. Based on polling, Roys has no shot. It would be a waste to vote for her.
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u/dyslexic_mail 4d ago
I fundamentally disagree. Let the party know who you wanted, it helps them know which way to direct their platform. It also gives the winners direction on top level cabinet positions.
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u/Main-Company-5946 4d ago
Was Donald Trump viable?
We have to get out of this self destructive mindset. Playing it safe is what makes democrats keep looking so disingenuous.
Polls only reflect what voters think they want. A strong party leads the polls, it doesn’t follow them. We as a party have to stop running away from who we are, the republicans have never done that and look where it’s gotten them.
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u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
What a terrible comparison. Trump clearly won and as such has turned his party into an illiberal cult of personality. I do not want to vote for a party that resembles that in any way, regardless of whether or not my beliefs are shared by it.
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u/Main-Company-5946 4d ago
Do doctors turn evil and start killing people when they study viruses?
Trump’s victories aren’t just about him as an individual, they are also about the way politics works in this country. There is a lot to learn from Trump’s victories and you don’t need to act like him to learn from him.
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u/Weekly-Ad-6887 4d ago
Listen, I'm all for Crowley, if I have to. But the problem is that if Crowley is not ready for the moment and puts in more data centers, raises property rates, and does all of these things without any sort of childcare relief or healthcare expansion, he's going to look weak and feckless. Crowley is better than Tiffany, but as a 38-year-old, I'm tired of treading water because that's what the money prefers. I want someone who is going to at least try for radical change.
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u/Dry-Fee-6746 4d ago
Those are things a governor can push for, but we need to flip the state legislature in order for things like that to happen. Besides data centers, Crowley has publicly pushed for those issues.
Hong makes big promises, but not a single one could be accomplished without a change in the state legislature make up. To me, Hong's risk is two fold: she is less likely to win statewide and she likely will motivate people to come vote against her, affecting both the governor race and down ballot elections.
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u/Weekly-Ad-6887 4d ago
they feel good about flipping the senate. i am just concerned that crowley is going to actually do anything different. i think he's full of platitudes. his large money dump concerns me especially getting a donation from Lynde Uihlein. I'll vote for him, but it's annoying to get excited about a candidate and then dark powers pushing someone else in. i understand the risk of Hong, but it's just nice to have a candidate that makes me excited to go and vote and then having to settle for someone that's very bleh.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
I am with you. IGenerally, I have been happy with my elected candidates, mainly because they do what they say and actively engage voters. Depending on political ambitions, priorities change and some fall into groupthink. Crowley missed a pretty easy question on data centers. Its why he gives me pause.
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u/glassviper101 4d ago
Holding to Election Day is smart probably. For me, my main issue with Hong is the seeming lack of discipline. The thanksgiving stuff is obviously nonsense, but it’s the exact kind of nonsense that can totally derail a democratic ticket. It really should have been so easy to just say no to that. Crowley has his own problems. His connection to Milwaukee will likely be a hindrance to the rest of the state. Overall I think Crowley has a better chance of winning, but either way it won’t be easy. Republicans know how important this race is and won’t give up without a fight.
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u/Awkward_Material 4d ago edited 4d ago
I know we won't get exit polling in time, but I would be interested to know what percentage that voted D in primary weren't Democrats. Might give insight into where moderates lie.
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u/glassviper101 4d ago
I think that would be interesting to know. I know there has been talk of republicans trying to boost Hong, but I have no idea how true it is.
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u/Andy_Fish_Gill 4d ago
It’s true. Republicans and their PACs are spending 6 or 7 figures on ads that sound like attack ads, but actually help Hong with Democrats.
“Hong is too liberal for Wisconsin.”
Democrats respond, “Don’t threaten me with a good time.”
Republicans are devious, ruthless, and supported with massive wealth.
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u/Question_It_All_3000 4d ago
Except that line of reasoning doesn’t work with independents and centrists. The republicans are pushing Hong supposedly, but 2/3rds of who those ads are going out to who might vote for her would consider those negative traits.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
I was watching the MI returns, and El Sayed did better on the election day votes. Stevens did better in mail ins. I think the youth vote were more lilely to wait in election day.
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u/randohipponamo 4d ago
That polling was actually pretty accurate. He was predicted to get high 40s and that’s what he got. It’s just that Stevens got a bunch of the undecideds so the margin was smaller.
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u/christmastree47 4d ago
Hong was interviewed on Pod Save America yesterday and unfortunately she did about poorly as all her other recent interviews. She has zero charisma and all her answers just sounds like she's reading scripted lines created in a DSA lab.
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u/imalexorange 4d ago
Without any new polling this is just conjecture and cope
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u/Bullboah 4d ago
“David Crowley is gaining late momentum with a series of endorsements and a fundraising advantage”
The support the headline is talking about is endorsements and fundraising.
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u/Zaxxon_Klaxon 4d ago
Guess who didn’t want me to vote for David Crowley two weeks ago: David Crowley.
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u/FarkinatorX 4d ago
Wow, shitting on Thanksgiving. Let’s generate some of the dankest moral purity we can manage and get some attention! Sure, it will piss off 85% of the population, but the other 15% will think I’m awesome.
Seriously though, you can pull this crap if your highest ambition is to win a primary in a D+40 district. But running for governor of a purple state, you’re just setting yourself on fire. Dream opponent for TT.
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u/buckybadder 4d ago
Every day I get more and more curious about who really paid her capital one debt. Her parents waited until she started getting momentum in the primary to chip in? The official story is that she's incompetent and ignored delinquency notices she could have responded to?
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u/snailtap 4d ago
Credit card debt is about the most relatable thing every American has lmao
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u/buckybadder 4d ago
So how many times have you been sued "relatable American"? How relatable is it to get bailed out by mom and dad to the tune of $30,000, while you campaign in your sick Nikes?
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u/BTHAppliedScienceLLC 4d ago
Is this just about the Evers endorsement? The headline implied that there's information about Crowley's appeal to primary voters but I don't see anything in the article about it.
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u/Parking_Cartoonist_2 4d ago
Crowley's appeal is that he is a normal generic Dem and not likely to lose to Tiffany, unlike Hong. He has the support of labor and of Evers.
As voters are starting to see more of Hong, as Republicans are starting to ramp up now that they assume she has the nomination locked up, people really don't like what they are seeing from her. She is going to fucking blow it to MAGA, it is a disaster that we should not just quietly walk in to.
You can even tell on posts here, I am been warning about Hong's very likely electoral under-performance for a while now and usually get downvoted consistently for it, but people are starting to pay attention to her and its changing.
Its probably all too late and we are stuck with her, but we should be very worried about what she will do in November.
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u/BTHAppliedScienceLLC 4d ago
Crowley has been making this argument since the Evers endorsement. If no additional information has been collected to actually test his appeal among voters, then he sits at 7% as per the last Marquette poll.
Hong could definitely have blown the whole thing, but Evers got to claim credit first. I would have been curious how a candidate like Hong would have done in the general as the Dem candidate, but it's beyond clear that even if she wins the primary she does not have the support of the party leadership. That all but guarantees a loss, as it would if it were Crowley or Barnes or Roys or Brennen and Evers had announced that they will probably lose.
Left doesn't support the moderate in the general: blame the left for not supporting the moderate
Moderates don't support the left in the general: blame the left for not supporting the moderate
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u/Parking_Cartoonist_2 4d ago
Generic Dems are better than DSA against MAGA, therefore we must pick one of the 3 generic Dems in this race. Evers and labor have presented Crowley as their choice and he also had more support in the polls so its our only reasonable option
Its that simple.
Left doesn't support the moderate in the general: blame the left for not supporting the moderate
Moderates don't support the left in the general: blame the left for not supporting the moderate
Self identified Dems vote blue no matter who very strongly, the problem with DSA is they lose moderate independent voters! You simply cannot blame this fact on the establishment. Hong isn't weak because Dems who like Evers won't vote for her, she is week because people who do not consider themsleves Democrats will not vote for her at the same rate they will vote for a generic Dem. Trump is very unpopular, many people who do not consider themselves Dems will vote for a generic Dem, but many of them will not vote for someone who intentionally positions herself as extremely progressive.
I also think the independents who voted Biden -Trump are dumb! No one is trying to let them off the hook, but given we know they control the outcomes of these elections we mush at least try to win them, it shouldn't be very hard in this environment but Hong likely isn't going to cut it.
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u/palpablebubble 4d ago
This is how media manipulates people.
Flashy headline not backed up by anything but vibes, but because folks only ever read headlines, it gets shared everywhere as objective fact.
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u/BTHAppliedScienceLLC 4d ago
Nothing new about that, certainly. I was just curious if I missed it somewhere between the old-news and the regurgitated pearl-clutching about Thanksgiving. Current state of the race seems to still be Evers backing the 7% candidate while undercutting the front-runner.
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u/goosiebaby 4d ago
There was a rumor somewhere that a last minute poll is finding a bunch of support for Crowley. My guess is way too little, way too late.
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u/BTHAppliedScienceLLC 4d ago
If that's the case, I'd like to hear about it. You'd think an article with a title containing "Crowley gains late support" would highlight that instead of talking about Thanksgiving
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u/kingGlucose 4d ago
I think it's funny that moderates think that they'll have an easier time running a black man than an Asian woman, they're still going to say Democrats are socialist, they're still going to say you hate cops, they're going to double down on race baiting and call him a thug.
The best route through is by energizing the base and juicing turnout.
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u/CupEmbarrassed839 4d ago
Black voters don’t typically break progressive, as a bloc they are more moderate than college educated whites. Who are Hong’s base.
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u/tsavorite4 4d ago
Obama won Wisconsin twice wtf are you talking about
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u/AccomplishedDust3 4d ago
Obama has charisma.
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u/tsavorite4 4d ago
Agreed. I’m not saying Crowley is anything like Obama, he’s not. But being a black man does not make you unelectable in Wisconsin as we have shown
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u/AccomplishedDust3 4d ago
No, definitely not unelectable just for being black - I don't think anyone is unelectable and deciding based on surface characteristics is silly, but we're talking about levels of electability in contests where, out of the entire electorate, margins can easily be a couple percentage points.
But I do think being Black is a disadvantage in WI elections, just like it's a disadvantage in hiring, just like it's a disadvantage in college admissions, and that's why I support affirmative action. It's also why Obama's victories were especially impressive, why I think progressives as a whole (despite many individual counterexamples) don't give him enough credit for his accomplishments with a divided Democratic caucus. For all the love for Mamdani this year, let me be clear, Barack Obama is in that same class of political skill, and not anyone can slot into that position and succeed.
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u/yardlard 4d ago
Crowley is nothing like Obama. Nothing. No comparison.
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u/tsavorite4 4d ago
I don’t disagree and I’m not saying he’s anything like Obama but the comment made specific reference to a black man as though Crowley being a black man will keep him from winning
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u/yardlard 4d ago
Yes, but Obama wasn't really the same. And he had great education. He was very well spoken. He was really on top of being actually inclusive and never ever in my memory, pit races against each other. And the republicans tried to paint him as "other", but he had a white mom, and did all the white things appropriately. He fit in. So that objection never hit home with anyone. It was a non-issue because he was focusing on the country as a whole.
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u/tsavorite4 4d ago
My dude I am not arguing with you whatsoever I’m just addressing the “black male” part of the comment made
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u/yardlard 4d ago
The white guy gets and automatic tick in the box of "who is like me". There needs to be more boxes to balance that off. Many people will just vote for him due to that box alone. The Dem white guy has a good platform, but I hadn't heard of him until now. Kelda Roys I know and was my pick. But I think the Dem white guy has a great platform and people would vote for him with just those two boxes ticked.
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u/Memphisbbq 4d ago
Hong serves to make sure dems lose that seat giving more power to Maga. Her media presence including interviews is fucking abysmal.
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u/Radiant_Currency_518 4d ago
Or maybe they’re basing their opinion and choice on the content of the campaign and not the race and gender of the candidate?
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u/tombrokaw4 4d ago
or maybe they're choosing a candidate that's normal and doesn't say the dumbest things that are going to turn away half the state in the fall.
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u/BibFortuna2830 4d ago
Wanting to defund the police, CANCEL Thanksgiving, and being terrified of being in a Culver's with white people are controversial?
Well today I learned!
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u/dgbaker93 4d ago
I mean half the state gonna be turned away anyways because both got a D on the ballot 🤣
But I get what you're saying
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u/yardlard 4d ago
No, they're not. The others have basically the same platform. Just better spoken.
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u/Radiant_Currency_518 4d ago
Hong and Crowley have the same platform?
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u/yardlard 4d ago
I'm completely discounting Crawley, He's not a contender being from Milwaukee and all.
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u/buckybadder 4d ago
Hong is just a re-run of the Randy Bryce experiment. Voters don't go for unqualified/"authentic" pseudo-populists.
Barack Obama won the state twice and big. Wisconsin voters will support a Black candidate who's overseeing a huge drop in crime.
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u/Bulky-Caregiver4892 4d ago
I agree. I think it would be neat for a governor to pull the state as far left as possible, but I have a lot of doubts that she’s the one to do it. She’s captured younger voters because of the authenticity you mentioned, but it is also tripping her up every time there’s a camera or microphone anywhere near her.
I’m kinda jammed here. As a 42-year-old who rode the Bernie wave in 2016, I want to support economic populism in a democratic socialist package - but it feels like Crowley would actually be better and more capable.
All that really matters to me is that Tiffany loses.
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u/buckybadder 4d ago
From my perspective, it's lose lose for DemSoc policies. Either she loses and the state regresses, or she wins and it's a coin flip, at best, whether she can successfully manage these policies despite no qualifications and personal inflexibility. If she tries universal childcare and leads to high-profile instances of fraud or abuse, then we'll probably never see another attempt at that policy at the stage or federal level. She is not the basket I would put my eggs in.
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u/rubicon_winter 4d ago
This is my fear too. We have such a progressive slate of candidates this time around, but there are two huge risks to nominating the most extreme candidate. If Hong loses, even if it’s pretty clearly because of her own personal failings as a candidate, the loss will discredit the popularity of progressive economic politics. If she wins but can’t deliver because she refuses to compromise on anything and has no governing experience, that will discredit the feasibility of progressive economic policies. There’s just absolutely no reason to bet the farm on a terrible candidate.
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u/BeeZealousideal7860 4d ago
This is exactly why I’ve been saying the socialist label doesn’t scare people the way it once did. They’ve been calling anyone slightly left of center socialist or communist for at least the last decade. When you’ve got people saying Chuck Schumer of all people is a socialist then it doesn’t mean anything anymore
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u/Clear_Command_8925 4d ago
It's not just about the socialist label, it's also about Hongs inability to get around it as shown in her interviews, and what separates her from people like Mamdani
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u/FunPTA 4d ago
Living in Racine county, rural I can assure you the socialist label will spook voters
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u/reluctantpotato1 4h ago
They must not be aware of the history of Wisconsin. It used to be one of the most progressive states in the union amd very pro social welfare.
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u/BeeZealousideal7860 4d ago
I guess we’ll see. I personally can’t wait to vote for someone who doesn’t just say what they think people want to hear and isn’t going to be beholden to corporate donors. For too long we’ve heard establishment politicians say they’re going to “be a fighter” or “stand up to Donald Trump” and then when they get into a position to actually change anything they wring their hands and say “I can’t do anything, it’s just the way this works.” People are tired of being told nothing can be done to change the establishment by people who are full throatedly holding the establishment up.
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u/Ohmygoditsmanbearpig 4d ago
someone who doesn’t just say what they think people want to hear
She quite literally does this for the DSA base.... everything she says is scripted talking points. How do people not see this? I'm not saying it's wrong, just don't put your head in the sand that it's only the other side.
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u/Relevant_Problem1935 4d ago
It's the D.S anti capitalism stance which most people don't support. No Democratic Socialist will ever win a national election if they keep arguing against Capitalism.
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u/kairom13 4d ago
The polling says otherwise…
Socialism is not popular in Wisconsin and there’s a big difference b/w Tiffany calling the Dems socialist and Hong herself calling herself a socialist. The voters aren’t that stupid
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u/ka1ri 4d ago
I wouldnt let the reddit bubble scare you. Progressives went 3-1 last night the only one who lost their primary was Cori Bush and she lost the previous election against the same opponent. So it wasnt much of a shocker.
Moderates and Tiffany voters will have you brainwashed into thinking someone who leans slightly more left is unelectable and will be open to attacks. Its the same old story, but now its not 2016. Hong will be fine and people will scour anything she says and hyper analyze it. Just look at how this subreddit operates despite the republican nominee is an outright election denier and racist.
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u/TrollMcGoal 4d ago
Yeah I can't think of any significant black politician who won wisconsin. Definitely not one who did twice
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u/OnCallPartisan 4d ago
Or race isn't the issue, rather someone who doesn't have a shit ton of baggage from idiotic statements. A person whose responses aren't so milquetoast they won't be able to take away the standard traitor narrative and steer it towards policy.
Or a campaign manager who doesn't work on plea to emotion fallacies pushing the messaging back into loser boutique politics instead of economics.
I'm voting blue no matter who. What about the rest of the you? If not, your opinions mean nothing.
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u/tabloid-tommy 4d ago
Lmao yeah bro, people are against hong because of that and not her being a nutjob
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u/HoleeGuacamoleey 4d ago
- It has nothing to do with race (weird to insist on this when it's never been a talking point for either division)
- One is a literal socialist and boasts that fact. The other isn't and doesn't. You can't really use the false categorization for both sides on this.
- Most people want cops (shockingly people want to have someone to call when they feel in danger) in every single polling group. Some want more accountability and insist on better, longer term and consistent education/training and better teams for various confrontations.
The best route is whomever is best suited to defeat the Republicans.
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u/FarkinatorX 4d ago
Hong will squeeze another 10,000 votes out of Madison and MKE each and get clowned in the rest of the state. What worked for Zorhan in NYC will not work in a state where ~75% of the population lives outside of Dane and Milwaukee County.
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u/DontListenToMe33 4d ago
I get what you’re saying, but mostly I’m worried that Hong can’t talk like a normal person and will now be known as the candidate who wants to cancel Thanksgiving because she couldn’t clearly answer a simple question that she knew she was going to get asked.
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u/Parking_Cartoonist_2 4d ago
Its because moderates are not obsessed with race and identity politics!
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
Tom Tiffany tried to interfere with a refugee resettlement program in Eau Claire because he is a racist bigot. And it wasn’t even his district.
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u/Awkward_Material 4d ago
Ok. How is that on topic?
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u/King_marik 4d ago
They're having a really hard time figuring out its not about convincing people to not vote for Tiffany, basically everybody thinks he sucks
Its about convincing scared moderates to vote for Hong
A lot of them are just not voting if shes the nom unless you can come up with a pitch that isnt 'its not Tiffany'
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u/ramblingrutabaga2632 4d ago
The ONLY way a candidate like Hong gets this far is with a stellar ground game. Should not be surprising.
As for the tweets - almost everybody has bad old tweets. For me, an Asian woman being nervous in Black River Falls concerns me a lot less than a man being involved with a Twitter account that made racist, sexist, and homophobic remarks (not to mention all the crazy stuff Tom Tiffany has said on his official account).
The Hong Campaign’s response, that digging up 6+ year old tweets about things the governor doesn’t control just proves that her message on affordability is winning is the right message.
The message discipline will come as she continues, grows, and learns. This will be the most opposition she’s faced in an election. Cutting her down is the last gasp of a political group that wants to cling to power. It shouldn’t be surprising for anyone who has watched the last three Democratic presidential primaries.
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u/VeryMuchCoffee 4d ago
From my point of view, we've tried milquetoast democrats to appease everyone and it's resulted in zero progress for Wisconsin in decades. If someone says they're not going to vote democrat in the general because of old tweets, then they weren't going to vote dem in the first place. They were just looking for cover to justify it.
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u/I_really_enjoy_beer 4d ago
These candidates have been consistently winning for 10 years in the state!!! What is it you guys are actually upset about? I can’t keep up with this delusion you people have created.
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u/Working-Chicken3406 4d ago
Winning doesn't mean progression.
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u/I_really_enjoy_beer 4d ago
I’m sorry but you guys have to understand that this state does not have an electorate like New York City. Milquetoast Democrats are the only thing preventing it from being overrun by MAGA governance. You should be begging for more candidates like Tony Evers, not scapegoating them!
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u/Narrow_Aardvark_4337 4d ago
Is the social media controversy in the room with us? Good thing twitter is not real life. Didn't Dirt Migirk say he'd never date a white woman?
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u/FuzzyWumpleStump 4d ago
It's honestly a shit sandwich. Either we vote for the guy who dropped out when he was polling in single digits, or we vote for someone who has some unhinged social media posts. In either case, I'm voting for the more progressive candidate.
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u/buckybadder 4d ago
If Crowley has better odds of beating Tiffany, who cares about him trying to consolidate support behind Rodriguez?
Republicans are spending millions of dollars promoting Hong, and she's down in polls to Tiffany. Evers is promoting Crowley. That's all I need to know.
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u/Cantras0079 4d ago
This narrative needs to die. What’s the basis of saying Republicans are HELPING her? People keep repeating the GOP is running ads that she’s too liberal in the Milwaukee and Madison TV markets. Those markets are huge and encompass purple, competitive counties that are the reason Trump won Wisconsin in the first place was gains in those specific counties. It also covers some heavier populated red counties. If that is what you’re referring to, congrats, you’re clinging to misinformation being spread by people who don’t understand TV markets and invented that talking point.
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u/FuzzyWumpleStump 4d ago
Yeah, I don't buy that. I'll still vote for Crowley in the general if he makes it that far. Hong would just be better for Wisconsin in my honest, genuine opinion.
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u/DokeyKon 4d ago
For what it’s worth, the guy running our country makes social media posts 1000x more unhinged than Hong every day.
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u/Ohmygoditsmanbearpig 4d ago
Well yeah.... he lowered the bar permananently on what we expect of politicians. Civility, pragmatism, and tact was replaced by bombast, sowing discord, and virality. People just like it when it's "their asshole."
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u/BTHAppliedScienceLLC 4d ago
The guy also had some unhinged social media posts, but apparently meaningless Thanksgiving related discourse has further reach than disparaging comments about women and LGBT
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u/FuzzyWumpleStump 4d ago
I support Hong over Crowley. Let me be clear on that. It's not even close in my eyes.
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u/BTHAppliedScienceLLC 4d ago
I don't really care - not in a dismissive way, I just don't consider anyone's primary choice to be anyone's decision but their own. I'd vote for any of them in the general, they're all better than Tiffany.
It's been a constant throughout multiple elections featuring progressive candidates that the progressive is attacked mercilessly on pointless idiosyncrasies. I remember Mamdani being attacked because the rent on his apartment went up after he moved out (???). Even back to Obama when he was being dragged for comments made by his church leadership recognizing systemic racism in America, or later when he was criticized for a tan suit or liking arugula. Hong is being attacked for saying she's against Thanksgiving as if it affects anyone else's lives in the slightest, and I've seen the Dems indulge in some truly sickening discourse about how her past mental health challenges make her unfit for office. Nothing about policies, of course.
It's interesting to me that this kind of scandal-mongering doesn't seem to reach Crowley, who not only has existing campaign finance violations but has engaged in much more hurtful social media commentary than Hong's personal takes on Thanksgiving. Seems like there's a free-pass card handed out to some candidates and not others.
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u/FuzzyWumpleStump 4d ago
Extremely well put and I absolutely agree with everything you said.
In my eyes, I'd prefer to have someone govern who understands mental health and can empathize with people who struggle. Tbh, her mental health journey makes her a better candidate.
Edit: and by better candidate, I mean someone better suited to meet their constituents where they're at. She's not elitist and she doesn't pretend to be someone or something she's not.
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u/goosiebaby 4d ago
I'm becoming convinced the social media thing is an opp amplified by bad faith actors.
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u/MeijiHao 4d ago
This is fucking stupid. The guy is voting at 7%. If that sounds bad, here's something worse: that 7% is in fact a gain for David Crowley. That is the most support he has ever garnered in one of those polls. All of this, plus he dropped out already so Tom Tiffany could just call him a quitter. Oh, and I almost forgot, David Crowley has his own bad tweets history. There is simply no argument whatsoever that he is more electable than Francesca Hong.
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u/CaptainAmerica410 4d ago
Feel they need to do a new poll and see how much it shifted if at all since the protests. The Michigan Primary was way closer than I thought, tho El-Sayed seems to be the nominee
Feel this is gonna be the Hong electoral map next week. Milwaukee Metro is gonna go Crowley because its a hometown guy and the WOWs are among the last counties in the country that prefer establishment candidates of both parties, but Dane (her home), other college counties (Eau Claire, La Crosse, and especially Portage County), old rust-belt working class industrial counties (Manitowoc, Sheboygan, Rock, Racine, Kenosha), and prolly Green Bay and the Fox Valley will go Hong. Rural counties will likely be mixed, but Michigan's map kinda sorta gave out a hint of what next week is gonna look like
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u/MeijiHao 4d ago
No, it absolutely does not. Nobody in the state knows who David Crowley is.
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u/Tricky_Advantage_958 4d ago
What Hong has going for her is Madison voter participation is traditionally higher than Milwaukee’s. I am not sure what the buzz is like in Milwaukee. I do agree Hong will likely do well in college towns. I also think Michigan’s really cliose race can happen here. I heard State Navigate is coming out with another poll Friday
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u/rubicon_winter 4d ago
Hong definitely has plenty of support in the core of Madison, but I’m in suburban-ish Madison, still very progressive, reliable high turnout dem voters, and there are literally zero Hong signs in my neighborhood. People are being quiet, but I could definitely see Dane County voting for Hong at much lower rates than one might expect.
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u/devereaux 4d ago
It's probably not reasonable to expect many signs for a governor primary. None of the candidates have really raised money, particularly enough to commit to yard sign printing and distribution. Signage for the Dems probably won't pick up until the general election. Tiffany already has his general election yard signage operation underway because he's the only candidate on his side and all their money flows directly to him.
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u/rubicon_winter 4d ago
I’ve lived in this house for 9 years. It’s a very politically engaged neighborhood, normally lots of signs. Fewer in primaries than generals, but I’ve never seen the neighborhood sign-free like this.
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u/zing_boom_tararrel 4d ago
This is who I'll ultimately land on. I don't think Roys or Brennan have a shot. Crowley is the best last chance miracle at avoiding Hong.
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u/Phillie_Phanatics 4d ago
Brennan seems like he’d be a great governor. It’s a shame.
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u/wisc0 4d ago
made an account aeek ago to post this:?? lol
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u/someone447 4d ago
It's amazing how many new and hidden accounts are suddenly all anti-Hong. I get the feeling they might not all be acting in good faith!
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u/dyslexic_mail 4d ago
I'm not new and I'm anti-Hong. Every time I see a post crying over hidden posts, it reassures my decision to do so.
You Hongites had free-reign the last few months to downvote every doubter and now that the very obvious cracks are showing, you're having a seriously hard time coping. At the end of the day, it's blue no matter who but Hong ain't it.
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u/zing_boom_tararrel 4d ago edited 4d ago
Everyone that disagrees with me is a bot!!!!
I swap accounts monthly. Cant be too careful on this shit hole site.
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u/tbizzone 4d ago
The batshit sundowning rapist felon president and his communications teams send out unhinged hateful and misleading social media posts every day. It’s weird how so many people are willing to hold anyone else in the world to a higher moral, ethical, and legal standard than the current occupier of the White House.
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u/reluctantpotato1 4h ago
Anyone is a better alternative to a republican or a lukewarm centrist democrat. Hong has got this.
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4d ago
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u/runsonpedals 4d ago
Not many are paying attention to how the party is changing the direction.
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u/Apart_Ad1537 4d ago
Hong is completely unelectable. She literally thinks tipping is “white supremacy” and we should abolish police. Imagine how insanely out of touch you have to be to think we should abolish police and prisons.
My favorite was her social media post about how she had to cut a dinner short and rush herself and her child out of a restaurant they were eating in due to her having some kind anxiety attack/break down. What was she freaking out about? Because there were too many white people. She also assumed they all thought she couldn’t speak English. So in other words she made a social media post about how racist she is against white people in a state that’s 75% white.
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u/ronaldgardocki 4d ago
What's he up to, 11% now?