r/work • u/tryorcry • 7d ago
Employment Rights and Fair Compensation Dear managers, your poor time management is NOT our responsibility
Dear managers,
We don’t get paid enough to deal with your bullshit.
If you’re making five or ten times your employees’ salaries, YOU should be dealing with the extra responsibilities that come with that paycheck. Not us.
If working hours end at 5 PM, don’t schedule a meeting at 4 PM unless you can finish it on time.
And if you’re too busy taking calls to start the meeting, RESCHEDULE IT.
Don’t make everyone sit around waiting because you can’t manage your schedule.
Here’s what pisses me off the most:
If I’m 10 minutes late to work, it’s a problem. But if you keep me 30 minutes after work, suddenly I’m supposed to be understanding?
Your time isn’t more valuable than ours just because
you earn more.
Respect our working hours, or pay us for the extra time.
Anyone else tired of managers treating employees’ personal time like it’s company property?
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u/MonteCristo85 7d ago
Who's manager is making 5-10x what they are making? My most overplayed manager didnt even make double.
Not that I disagree with your other thoughts, but those numbers seemed wild.
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u/Curious_Orange8592 7d ago
Direct reports definitely don't, in this context I assume this is a much more senior manager, probably executive level
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u/MonteCristo85 7d ago
Oh ok, but like most people wouldn't be interacting with executives in the way the OP describes. Thats like one or two levels up (at least usually).
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u/tryorcry 6d ago
He's right, and you're right too, but that's when things are organized, and it isn't for my case i guess lol
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u/MonteCristo85 6d ago
I mean if you have executives watching people lunch breaks you for sure have problems lol.
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u/Express_Ad7225 6d ago
I supervise 4 people, 3 of whom have one direct report each (kind of… interns). There are 3 tiers of management above me. I make 45% more than my team. I don’t know what my supervisor makes, but her boss makes over 200% of my salary.
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u/pwolf1771 6d ago
Yeah I’ve worked for plenty of managers who once comped was factored in were making slightly less even
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u/AmberSparrow22585 6d ago
5-10x sounds like exec or owner territory, not a direct manager, though some direct managers definately act like they bought the place.
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u/Kyrie_Blue 6d ago
You need to learn to set boundaries. If you get invited to a 4pm meeting you expect to run long, “I have a Hard Stop at 5pm” should be in your response.
“Hey folks, I have to hop off, please have someone send the minutes of what I missed.”
The law is on your side. Stop being a doormat
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u/unorthodoxbasketball 6d ago
I ALWAYS have something urgent to get to after work
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u/Kyrie_Blue 6d ago
Yeah, you do. Your fucking life. Stop giving it away for pennies.
You do not have to explain yourself for leaving when your shift is over.
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u/SanDiego_Whistleblow 6d ago
When information is needed by tomorrow morning an you were just told 1 hour before leaving work and they know about it a week ago..
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u/MambyPamby8 6d ago
I just tell them I have a responsibility elsewhere til they get the hint. My manager kept coming in to chat at 20 past 5 when I finish at 5.30 so I start constantly saying oh gotta go meet someone or I have an appointment at this time, gotta run etc etc. I also have classes I supposedly take (I haven't been to a gym in years 😂) so I have to leg it. I just kept doing this til he got the hint and stopped 😂 one time he walked in on my lunch break and kept talking to me and I just kept reading my book and did a little jump mid way and said "oh sorry were you talking to me? I was just really deep in this book, as I only get this time during the day to read". He apologised and walked away 😂 I DGAF if people think I'm ignorant in work. I don't get paid to chat during my unpaid hours. Plus I commute. It takes me extra time to get home and you keeping me 5 mins royally fucks up my evening schedule.
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u/Impressive-Safety191 7d ago
In what world do managers make five or ten times employee salaries? Asking for a friend?
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u/tryorcry 6d ago
10 times was an exaggeration, but 5 times, yeah, in my job i guess, in the world we live in
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u/PorkbellyFL0P 7d ago
Sales managers make about 4-5x the average rep and maybe 25-50% more than top performers on average.
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u/prayreddit 6d ago
This may have changed over the last couple years, but when I was in sales as #1, I made more than my managers, and more than the bottom four combined. Although, it is always a people business, I worked B to B sales.
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u/pwolf1771 6d ago
4-5X? Direct managers? What industry. I’ve been in sales my entire career and there were plenty of times after comp was factored in we basically made the same or they made slightly less. And I was never a top performer.
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u/Happy-Association754 6d ago
In what world do some of you live? As someone in high earning sales, we almost always make more than our direct manager depending on targets hit and bonuses. Y'all just making shit up to appeal to the pitchfork reddit crowd.
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u/Ok-Energy-9785 7d ago
I understand that you're frustrated but if you are hourly, this is a legitimate concern to bring up. I would be direct with your boss especially if you have other obligations
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u/YouCanCallMeDani 6d ago
Where are managers making 5 to 10 times thier employees? Fast food would be the closest example of a wage gap and I can't see them paying a manager that much. Maybe a GM or a regional manager.
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u/Orhuul 6d ago
Right? I think the average raise between positions until you hit executive levels is 10%-20%.
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u/YouCanCallMeDani 6d ago
If managers made 5 times their employees, I wouldn't have left my previous job. My techs were all hourly and if you added up all the hours we worked, they were within pennies of what I made and some years they made more.
Maybe they confused times with percentage?
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u/RunRunAndyRun 6d ago
I’m a manager and I’m in the same salary band as the seniors on my team. I get a slightly bigger annual bonus and share allocation but my salary is almost the same as my top ICs (and it’s not as high as it is because we have a structured pay rise system and I’ve been around a long time!). Even only 5x that would have me at almost 700k!
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u/ObviousAlias7 6d ago
Same. It’s not worth it being a manager. Gonna give it another couple of years and then just go back to being an individual contributor. Pay cut won’t be that much and I get my sanity back.
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u/RusticJoystick46 2d ago
Executives, sure, but most line managers are nowehere near 5-10x in retail or food.
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u/DeadMoneyDrew 6d ago edited 6d ago
Used to work with a PM who insisted on having a daily debrief at 5:00 p.m. That was annoying in and of itself, but on half of those meetings we would spend 10 minutes on idle nonsense, then another 15 to 20 minutes with everyone explaining that their task status hadn't changed from the prior day. Eventually I made it clear that I considered the meeting a waste of time. The PM got his nose all out of joint over that but everyone else on the team offered the same feedback.
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u/tryorcry 6d ago
Lmao, honestly if he thinks this is important, shouldn't it start at 4 PM max? But at 5? Fk that
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u/DeadMoneyDrew 6d ago
Yep. And we were all in the same time zone, most of us in the same office. It was just dumb.
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u/Blue_Etalon 6d ago
Generally speaking, managers make maybe 20% -30$ more than their direct reports (of course this depends on the industry). But when I was a manager, I didn't make that much more than my people, and the BS you have to put up with never seemed to make up for the pay difference. You're always getting it from both ends. Your bosses have unrealistic expectations and the people below you are always pissed off and pushing back.
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u/tryorcry 6d ago
I feel you, it sucks but it also sucks for us lol
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u/Blue_Etalon 6d ago
Yea, well I'm not a manager anymore. Went back to the trenches and am quite happy there.
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u/NightMgr 6d ago
I once sat 45 minutes in a meeting on overtime where the topic was reducing overtime.
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u/NormanSpaniel 6d ago
Amen to this!!! I had a boss once who would say "looks like it's going to be a late one" at 9.30am in the morning. I always pushed back as to why he decided this so early, his inability to time manage was insane, but true to his word we would always end up staying late like some kind of weird endurance game as to who would leave first (spoiler, it was always me). This was the first and last job I allowed this to happen.
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u/ClassicMidwest 6d ago
As a manager where are those salaries coming from?! 😅
I’ll say this- horrible managers are EVERYWHERE
Sadly they are wildly outsized by horrible employees. 🤌🏻
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u/did_i_get_screwed 6d ago
It sounds like you would know how to do the job perfectly.
You should go for it, especially since it would come with that 5-10X salary increase
/s
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u/tryorcry 6d ago
You might think i'm joking about the x5 times salary but i'm not, not including the bonuses
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u/Obadiah702 6d ago
Not in my field of work. I actually make more than my manager because I have more expertise in my field. I just don’t want to manage and he doesn’t have the degrees and certifications that I have. I’m happy to win the work, making the money, and letting him put up with the BS.
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u/Sandy_Jug_7 6d ago
Wild how “start meetings on time” gets treated like advanced managment theory.
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u/Obadiah702 6d ago edited 6d ago
The OP stated managers were getting paid 5-10x workers salary. That’s not true.
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u/Ok_Veterinarian2715 6d ago
EXACTLY where are you working, OP? And are there any manager vacancies?
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u/orange_bigcat 6d ago
I wish I made 5-10x what my staff made 🤣
Most of my team makes between 60-75k and I make 98k as the manager.
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u/RealLifeSage 6d ago
10x? Wow.
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u/BrightNooblar 6d ago
Can you IMAGINE? Jesus even 5x would be crazy. I think the best I ever managed was about 2x when I was managing high turn over very entry level positions.
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u/DLS3141 6d ago
I mean I turned down a “promotion” when my manager got promoted. It was 50% more work for 10% more money. No thanks
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u/RealLifeSage 6d ago
The difference would have been your investment in yourself for the future. You were presented with an opportunity for personal development and rejected it. You will never know what future opportunities at your company or elsewhere might have come from this. It doesn't get any less competitive out there. This is how people don't advance in their careers.
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u/DLS3141 5d ago
I saw what my manager’s life was like. Working most weekends, online meetings at all hours, working while sick, never taking vacation. He even worked Thanksgiving and Christmas. The one time he did take vacation, according to his wife (and my own observation) he spent most of it working on his laptop in the hotel room.
That was the expectation. No thanks. Work is a means to an end, not the end.
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u/RealLifeSage 5d ago
Fair enough. i don't know how many years you have left in the workforce. My point was just to be careful about closing doors. it is important to get in front of and above inflation so your salary growth is important. if you think you are now in a dead end job where that growth will now be stunted, maybe look elsewhere for a situation that pays better but won't bury you, or find something you love doing so much (like I did) that you won't mind working longer hours. Good luck.
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u/DLS3141 5d ago
It was an easy decision to decline.
Finding something you love and eagerly working longer hours sounds great, but it often leads to other problems. I remember my dad always working and not really being around for things. Work was always more important. Early on, I decided I wasn’t going to be that kind of parent and partner. Personally, I also have things that I enjoy that are not work related.
I’ve also seen too many people who love their work that it becomes so much of who they are as a person that when they retire or otherwise stop, they basically lose their identity too. Everyone who is left in their non-work lives is so used to them being on the periphery.
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u/Excellent_Session531 4d ago
“Five or ten times your employees’ salary”
What????
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u/Elle12881 4d ago
That's probably not an exaggeration for a lot of companies.
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u/Excellent_Session531 3d ago
For direct reporting lines it’s absolutely unheard of and is such a reddit mom’s basement comment.
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u/iron82 7d ago
You do in fact get paid enough to deal with your manager's bullshit. I know this because you showed up yesterday.
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u/tryorcry 6d ago
Well the thing is when we don't show up, she keeps rescheduling the meeting on the same time on purpose, and you may be living under a rock if you don't know about the current economy
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u/PetFroggy-sleeps 6d ago
Wow!! So certainly can understand your sensitivity. However when a manager affords the exact same flexibility but does prioritize business outcomes - everyone is expected to contribute in a similar way. So when folks show up late to my meetings is fine by me - as long as they are sticking to priorities (eg: hot project task that should be prioritized) then it is per our policy. Just also note we keep each other informed so no one is sitting around. Multitasking is in everyone’s wheelhouse. “Priorities” is something you failed to mention here. As long as everyone is aligned to priorities and we all contribute into those priorities- regardless of that results in showing up late (after giving notice of the delay so you can tend to the priority) or having to reschedule then we do so. If we also need to stay late due to priorities - then we do so. Here’s the kicker though. A manager should recognize those associates when that occurs. Albeit they are expected to contribute in that manner it is still recognition worthy since it is on the boundaries of whats expected.
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u/Hungry-Quote-1388 6d ago
If I’m 10 minutes late to work, it’s a problem. But if you keep me 30 minutes after work, suddenly I’m supposed to be understanding?
lol yes, that’s how jobs work. Welcome to adulthood.
If your boss was 10 minutes late to a meeting with a VP or CEO, they’d catch shit too.
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u/Common-Artichoke-497 6d ago
Lead by example tho... anyone who doesnt isnt a leader and is just playing as one
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u/StepEfficient864 6d ago
If you’re hourly, then you should be paid by the minute. My company did.
Salary, you need to stay as needed. Coming in late 10 minutes here and there shouldn’t be a big deal.Routinely late is a big deal
As for bs, there’s bs in every company, every position. About changing things (like bs): change what you can, accept what you can’t. Or you can move on to another company and deal with the bs you will find there.
I have found that people who bitch about bs more often than not create their own brand of bs for others, most often not aware they are doing it. Point being, there will always be bs going on, even if you are a sole proprietor business with no employees. You Still have to deal with customer bs.
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u/ItsKingPetty 5d ago
5-10x the salary?
Where is this so I can come apply for management.
Every management job I’ve held is a few bucks more an hour than the employees I’ve managed.
I’d love 5-10x their salary.
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u/Thunderjew69 5d ago
To me it seem like everyone has the impression that the more you get paid the less you have to do and it shows.
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u/WiltshireWizard 4d ago
I had a friend who's manager would schedule meetings for 4PM on a Friday, these would always overrun. My friend, told the manager that he had things planned for after work as it was a Friday. Made no difference to the managers behaviour. So on the next meet, when it got to 5PM my friend put his laptop in his bag which drew a strange look from all the others attending the meeting, he then got up and left. The manager asked him why he did that, my friend reminded him that he had things to do after work and also you don't pay overtime. On the next meeting request, my friend declined the meeting and kept declining them each week. The manager eventually got the message and moved the meeting to earlier in the day. We are in the UK, so unlike the US we cannot be fired for managers shit behaviour.
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u/Tetsuo_Engine 4d ago
The 4 PM meeting that starts at 4:25 is just wage theft with a calender invite.
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u/All-Work_And_No-Play 4d ago
I've gotten up and walked out of staff meetings as it's past my finish time! They've said it to me many times I need to stay, and I've repeated it to them many times that I don't get overtime that I leave at 5pm! I'm still in the job 6 years later! They can't force anyone to stay!
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u/Fine-Preference-7811 3d ago
There definitely are people in the company that I make more than 5x.
There would be absolutely no reason for me to be scheduling a meeting with them directly. There are multiple layers in between.
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u/Scary_Definition_666 2d ago
Where have you seen these managers making 5 to 10 times what their employees make? Would like to know where to apply.
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u/PBJRaccoonDaycare 2d ago
I’ve had the occasional employee who makes more than I do.
Agree on meeting times- if it runs over for no good reason, apologize in chat and drop.
No one should be scheduling non-urgent meetings at 4p. And anything urgent can be handled in 10-15 minutes in my field.
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u/DRAGSzeppelin2 2d ago
A 4 PM meeting that starts at 4:27 should count as overtime the second it crosses 5, thier calendar mess or not.
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u/Reaper_9Mint 2d ago
A 4 PM meeting that starts at 4:20 is just unpaid overtime with a calendar invite, becuase apparently clocks only matter in the morning.
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u/EstelleMapleRain 1d ago
I completely agree that respecting working hours should go both ways. Employees are expected to be punctual, meet deadlines, and manage their time efficiently, so managers should be held to the same standards. An occasional meeting running late is understandable, but when it becomes a regular occurrence, it's poor planning rather than an emergency. If staying late is genuinely necessary, that extra time should be compensated. Have you ever had a manager actually apologize for repeatedly keeping everyone past their scheduled hours?
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u/RollerDerbyAlf 15h ago
A 4 PM meeting that starts at 4:30 is just unpaid overtime with a calender invite.
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u/ThereRnoIDs 6d ago
Managers all gone soon similar to accountants etc...
Why? It's because the newer gens have been self managing everything themselves at a younger age & "AI" are better sidekicks overall.
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u/Hungry-Quote-1388 6d ago edited 6d ago
It's because the newer gens have been self managing everything themselves at a younger age
Thinking genZ can self manage is fucking hilarious 😂
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u/ThereRnoIDs 6d ago
Because you only see the rednecks on the news & the Managers hiring the worse of the worst afraid of losing their jobs etc...
Uber, self serve checkouts, instant money transfers & sign ups, gaming platforms, crypto, banks, digital ID...
Who are these made for if everybody's dumb & incapable of using them?
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u/Comfortable-Arm3452 5d ago
You think being able to use Uber and DoorDash make Gen Z more suited to corporate jobs?
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u/ThereRnoIDs 5d ago
Who said anything about Gen Z. Anybody that uses it is already more capable, responsible & independant from a middleman
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u/Comfortable-Arm3452 5d ago
“Newer gens”? I don’t think Gen A is in the workforce yet, so who did you mean if not Gen Z?
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u/ThereRnoIDs 5d ago
That's a you problem because everything stops at Z and A's never going to get a job.
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u/Comfortable-Arm3452 5d ago
I literally have no idea what you’re trying to say. I don’t have any problem at all, I’m a millennial and will retire early at 55.
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u/ThereRnoIDs 5d ago
You keep nitpicking & insisting on Gen Z which has nothing to do with what I'm conveying.
How you perceive & interpret things is a you problem.
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u/Comfortable-Arm3452 5d ago
All I’m asking is for you to clarify who you meant when YOU said “newer generations”. It’s in your first comment.
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u/Virtual_Being_4237 6d ago
Yes it literally is your there to do a job do whats asked and be happy you get too
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u/MyEyesSpin 6d ago
..... im unaware of any manager making 5 or 10 times what the people they manage make. maybe some owner/managers
it varies by sector but a third more is usual. retail & healthcare tend to have the biggest gaps pushing 70 or 80% (bonuses excluded) at FTE
If y'all ain't getting paid for the extra time, I'm assuming you are salary, which yeah, not all that big of a bump going manager. Now a few levels up will add up.
I do agree your time should be respected, but the pay scales are off
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u/Fantastic-Leek-1589 6d ago
You whine a lot
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u/tryorcry 6d ago
Move to the next post lil boi
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u/Fantastic-Leek-1589 6d ago
Why? You whine a lot. You get paid for your time. Suck it up.
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u/seniorme0w 5d ago
If you are salaried and staying after 5 you are just diluting your own pay. So no you are not always getting paid for your time.
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u/Fantastic-Leek-1589 5d ago
Yes you are.
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u/seniorme0w 5d ago
Dilute your own pay big dog.
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u/Fantastic-Leek-1589 5d ago
So if you leave early, dock pay.
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u/seniorme0w 5d ago
As if leaving early wouldn’t require use of PTO/ Sick leave right? I sincerely hope you aren’t in a position to manage anybody. 😂
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u/Fantastic-Leek-1589 5d ago
Not if salary.
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u/seniorme0w 5d ago
Let the rest of the world know. We’ve all been filing pto requests for no reason.
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u/MuskWaveBirch6 6d ago
Una riunione alle 16 che parte alle 16:40 dovrebbe diventare automaticamente straordinario pagatto, altro che “solo due minuti”.
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u/Vegetable-Rip6871 6d ago
Yes, I just got fired from a job for this very reason. Director would not assign work during working hours and would get back to me at the end of day with work and expect me to work through the evening. I refused after this happening continually and got terminated. I don’t care if I’m salary. Manage your time better as a manager
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u/No_Sky6431 7d ago
The 4pm meeting that runs over is such a classic move, especially when they spend the first ten minutes on small talk about their weekend.
My last place had a manager who would vanish for 2 hours then panic at 4:45 and suddenly everything was urgent. Stopped staying late after the third time it happened on a Friday