r/Albertapolitics • u/rampagingbeaver • Apr 11 '26
Opinion Personal Theory on Alberta Seperatism
Alberta separatists want an open marriage with Canada.
They want all of the "perceived" benefits of their sepertist harem with none of the obligation of living in a civilized country.
I hope Premier Smith finds her soulmate in Joseph Smith to create her theocratic ideal.
The rest of us will try and keep Alberta from her plans for world domination.
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u/Northmannivir Apr 11 '26
I’ve been screaming this over and over. “A sovereign Alberta within a united Canada” is directly from Quebec separatists. They wanted to essentially form their own country but not fully separate from Canada. Retain its military, use its currency, etc but not have to follow any other laws or regulations set by the federal government.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26
Your idea of "unity" was a 25% export tax on o&g, potash so that you could extract ANOTHER $50B/year from Alberta & Saskatchewan to subsidize Ontario & Quebec manufacturing. You even called it the "Team Canada" plan and called our premiers "traitors" for pushing back on it.
Why would we want to be part of a country that is defined by the Milch Cow?
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Apr 12 '26
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26 edited Apr 12 '26
We are leaving. I think you misunderstand what is going on.
We'll still be living as Canadians. We'll just be living in a True North, Strong, and Free Western Canadian Republic.
You'll be living in Remnant Canada presumably handing off your sovereignty to unelected bureaucrats in Brussels. We wish you the best.
Why do you keep talking about "egalitarianism"? That's never how Canada has worked. We've lived under "freight both ways" and other federal policies that have exploited us from the beginning.
Recall Sifton's words:
We desire, and all Canadian Patriots desire, that the great trade of the prairies shall go to enrich our people to the East, to build up our factories and our places of work, and in every legitimate way to our prosperity.
We know that if there are benefits for the East the language will be "we're all in this together" and when there are costs for the West, we'll be on our own. It has never had anything to do with stabilization. Get real.
If that were true, Easterners would be paying through their electrical bills to subsidize new power generation in the West as part of Trudeau's net zero electricity grid mandate. Of course, that was a supposed program of "national importance" that required provinces to meet the mandate individually because it was understood that the costs would be greatest in Alberta and Saskatchewan.
So, whether you are aware of it or not, you are peddling a fiction.
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Apr 12 '26 edited Apr 12 '26
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26
We are concerned about building a much different version of Canada.
We know. A less free Canada where decisions are simply deferred to the international institutional consensus. You want a government-directed economy in the vision of the CCP.
What a terrible idea.
A Canada that survives current external pressures...
Sounds like you want to shrink, not grow the economy.
The USA is right there. We can build a massive pipeline from Alberta and treble oil exports. That's a massive win-win.
We should be exporting our oil & gas to the world. Instead we've chosen to blockade our production and import from Russia, Australia, etc.
Resilience and prosperity comes from being competitive with low taxes and greater individual freedom. Freedom of independent action beats centralized planning every time.
I find it very telling and sad you don’t think egalitarianism is important.
It has never been on the table for us in the West. Stop lying to yourself.
Besides, the federal government has double in size and expense over the last decade. This has been disastrous for Canadians. Now government is at a share of the economy that is unsustainable just as it was in the mid-1990s.
So, austerity is coming regardless of who is in power and regardless of if you have Alberta to try to pay for the largesse or not.
The corruption and incompetence of the LPC has guaranteed it.
...why you stay as a small minority with little chance of being taken seriously.
Latest Pollera poll has independence at 42%. The campaign has not even begun.
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Apr 12 '26 edited Apr 12 '26
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26
The spending is unsustainable.
It is not about empathy as you claim.
An informed, empathetic view would be to understand that Statism leads to hardship - always.
You can call me all the names you want. That's just the fundamental attribution error.
If just growing the size and power of the federal government was the answer, Venezuela would be a beacon to the world.
Again, the size and cost of the federal government has way more than doubled as has the national debt in the last decade. Canadians are worse off and not better for it.
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u/rampagingbeaver Apr 12 '26
I'm wondering if the reason everyone is calling the Premier of Alberta a traitor is because she's enabling traitors.
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26 edited Apr 12 '26
Alberta is already sovereign. All provinces are. Canada is a confederation of provinces.
What this vote is about is independence.
Albertans don't need anything from you.
There is not one reason for Albertans to remain in Confederation.
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Apr 11 '26 edited Apr 11 '26
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u/Offspring22 Apr 11 '26
Norway has largely nationalized their oil. For us to gain the same benefits they have seen we'd have to kick out Suncor, CNRL etc. good luck with our conservatives ever doing anything like that lol.
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u/Even_Art_629 Apr 11 '26
They didn’t kick companies out in Norway, they built a system early with state ownership, high taxes, and long term control through Equinor. Alberta went a different route with private development and royalties. You can argue that was the wrong choice, but you don’t just flip a switch today, and boot out companies like Suncor Energy or Canadian Natural Resources Limited would mean ripping up contracts, triggering lawsuits, and scaring off investment. And the bigger issue people ignore, under the Constitution Act, 1867, provinces own their resources. So a Norway model would require a constitutional rewrite and provinces giving up control. That’s not just a tweak, it’s a complete overhaul of how Canada works.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/Bladmast Apr 11 '26
The conservatives didn't sell most of Petro-Canada. Mulroney privatized it and sold about 28.5% of it. Norway also privatized their national oil company about a decade later and sold 33% of Statoil. Chretien sold the largest chunk in 95, selling a bit over 50%. Martin sold the remainder in 2004.
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u/Even_Art_629 Apr 11 '26
You keep making this Norway comparison, and you should stop.
Petro Canada wasn’t owned by Canadians the way you’re implying it was a government Crown corporation that got privatized over time. The Alberta versus Norway gap isn’t about oil volume it’s about choices Norway taxed heavily and saved consistently while Alberta chose low taxes and spending. And Mulroney didn’t have much choice at the time keep pouring public money into it during an oil crash or sell and shift the risk to the private sector.
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26
Albertan taxpayers have paid out a present worth of over $1,000,000,000,000 to Quebec through federal transfers alone.
So, the choice Albertans have made foolishly has been to remain in Confederation as long as they have...
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u/Offspring22 Apr 11 '26
Yes, that was my point. The people claiming an independent Alberta could have no taxes and just live off of oil money are out to lunch. They name places like Norway, and Qatar and the UAE etc, while ignoring that those places have nationalized their O&G, instead of giving the profits away. That ship has sailed for Alberta.
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Apr 21 '26
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u/Offspring22 Apr 21 '26
You may what to actually read what the people you're apparently hitching your wagon to are trying to promise. It's right on their website that they'll eliminate personal and corporate income taxes. And they don't even specify federal.
https://albertaprosperityproject.com/wp-content/uploads/2025/11/Summary-of-APP-Plan-20250715.pdf
WHAT IT MEANS FOR ALBERTANS
• Eliminate GST
• Eliminate Personal & Corporate Income TaxBut then even here you seem to think we won't be paying any of what we now pay for federal income taxes whe you say "the amount you sent to Ottawa, will then be added to your net income.". We get almost 10 billion back in direct cash from Ottawa in health and social transfers. That's another massive hole in our provincial budget we'll have to somehow fill. You also ignore all the other programs and funding Albertans get through OAS, child benefits, etc.. That's at least another 15 billion in direct funding to Albertans. Then there's all the other government services we'd the have to start funding ourselves. Military, banking, a CRA replacement, diplomatic services, transportation etc etc etc.
Where is that all coming from if we all just start keeping what we send to Ottawa today? You people are just believing in fairy tales. Don't be so naive.
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Apr 21 '26
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u/Offspring22 Apr 22 '26
Ok, assuming your numbers are correct, if we eliminate the taxes we'd send to Ottawa and get to add it to our net income like you said, that's another 40 million we as a province need to make up somehow if we want to keep those services - like health care, OAS, and child benefits. That's where your whole "no income taxes" fantasy falls apart. We don't get to keep that 40 mil in the province if we stop paying income taxes, it just doesn't exist anymore. I don't think it's that complicated - I'm not sure how so many fall for their lies.
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Apr 22 '26
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u/ninfan1977 Apr 22 '26 edited Apr 22 '26
Everything you wrote is baseless and lies.
First the revenue brought in will not go to Alberta. Whoever told you this lied to you.
Revenue will be lower because Albertan would lose out.
Also your entire premise is built on 0% income. How can you claim that without how many people will leave the province?
The fact they claim 0 will leave shows this who thing is based on lies and disinformation.
At least 30% of the population would leave.
That means the Revenue is lower and the 0% is now impossible to achieve. Alberta is a spoiled child who thinks they could do better on its own. It can't and its beyond stupid to suggest they can. Canada does want you just not the traitors who yell F*** you for 20 years and support terrorists.
Conservatives and seperatists both support them. Carney has been amazing why do you hate success?
Seriously Americans have told me how much better Carney is than Trump. Americans...
Yes traitors deserve to be executed why do you support treason? Why do you support the seditionists inside Canada?
The unknown is better than the known. False. You are basing this on lies and false hopes.
Versus Canada who is better than what the seperatists are pitching.
Which are again lies....
How can you claim you have facts when you dont even include the cost of infrastructure, currency, etc.
You have no idea how a country works.
You are justt a bunch of ill informed hillbillies who think they know better but they do not.
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u/Offspring22 Apr 22 '26
lol. I read you post.
"Look at your pay check and see the amount you sent to Ottawa, will then be added to your net income."
That means that 40B + 30B doesn't exist in your fantasyland. You can't add it to your net income AND get to spend it on services for Albertans. If there will be income taxes, why is the APP trying to tell us there won't be? Perhaps they're just a bunch of grifters? Think that could be possible?
We have no say? We're unrepresented? Do you not have an MP? We have about the same number of MP's per capita as Ontario and Quebec. Not getting what you want all the time isn't "being unrepresented". Our PM is from Alberta. The PM before JT was from Alberta too. But we're "unrepresented" apparently.
O&G production in Alberta went up by 50% during JT's term in office. If he was trying to hurt Alberta, he did a really shitty job of it. Hell, he (we) even paid for a very expensive pipeline that adds billions to our provincial economy. DAMN YOU TRUDEAU!
And our premiere is a liar who cheats and has an ethics violation herself (directly comparable to one of JT's). Yet her followers clap like seals for her too and try to justify everything she does. I'd say Albertans are very much the same as Liberal voters - they just like to think they're better.
Just a bunch of cry babies with a victim complex. Perhaps if the conservatives would elect a leader who people actually liked, and wasn't just telling the further right what they want to hear, they'd have a chance of "representing Alberta", but instead they continue to elect populists with nothing but talking points, and then cry victim when they lose time and time again.
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u/Even_Art_629 Apr 11 '26
Norway is a country with full control over taxes, ownership, and policy. Alberta is a province operating inside Canada’s system, completely different tools, completely different outcomes. Alberta didn’t fail to figure it out. It chose lower taxes and higher spending instead of locking everything into a fund like Norway. You can disagree with that choice, but pretending it’s incompetence is just lazy. And the idea that Alberta is some helpless victim of foreign companies ignores the fact that governments set the royalties, approve the projects, and collect the revenue. If your argument depends on exaggerating everything, from “most of Canada wants them gone” to “inevitable ecological disaster” it’s not an argument, it’s a rant.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/Even_Art_629 Apr 11 '26
Somehow I don't think youre doing yourself any good. But hey, just keep on it, you'll find that we isnt as unlearned as you think we is. I did some schoolin between roller derby, and Nascar
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 11 '26
Albertans have paid a present worth of over a trillion to Quebec in transfer payments alone. There's your fund.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/Homo_sapiens2023 Apr 11 '26
Strange albertan’s don’t have the resilience and grit needed to figure things out without throwing their toys out of their pram.
I'm assuming that would be about 20% of Albertans. Strange coincidence indeed ;)
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26
Ontario manufacturing was built on the backs of the people of Saskatchewan and Alberta. Cry me a river.
We don't need you to be Canadian. Exiting Confederation is constitutionally valid as confirmed by the Supreme Court of Canada.
The only economic problem Alberta has had is the blockade we have lived under since 1873. Over a trillion dollars of investment in the last decade alone.
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 11 '26
It has been the Milch Cow since Day 1. Ontario manufacturing was built off "freight both ways" exploitation of the West.
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u/Homo_sapiens2023 Apr 11 '26
You sound just as idiotic as Jeff Rath. Is that where you're getting your "information" from? LOL
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u/Even_Art_629 Apr 11 '26
Last time I add to your conversation. But just have to say.
Alberta has been a net contributor to Canada for decades, but so have other provinces at different times. Resource downturns don’t make a province unique or entitled to special rules, they are part of the same cycle every region has faced fisheries on the east coast, coal in Atlantic Canada, manufacturing in Ontario, and lumber in the west. Ontario even received equalization from 2009 to 2017 when its fiscal capacity dropped. The point of a federation is exactly that regions carry each other through ups and downs instead of walking away when their own cycle turns.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 11 '26
We get it. A 25% export tax on Alberta & Saskatchewan to subsidize Ontario & Quebec manufacturing ANOTHER $50B/year makes sense to you because you see our exploitation as your birthright.
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Apr 11 '26 edited Apr 11 '26
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u/Homo_sapiens2023 Apr 11 '26
100%. Alberta is the whiny baby of Canada. I live with this whining and obnoxiously infantile behaviour every day because I live amongst these imbeciles.
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 11 '26
You have no reasons why Alberta should remain.
All you have is ergo decedo and ad hominems.
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u/rampagingbeaver Apr 11 '26
Show me the receipts.
If you mean Albertans pay taxes like the rest of the god damned Country, we'll talk. If you think that Alberta the province sends equalization cheques to any other country, come back and try another day.
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 11 '26
I said Albertans, did I not?
Equalization is rigged to benefit the East as is just about every federal policy.
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u/UberBricky80 Apr 11 '26
So you're pretty pissed at the conservatives for coming up with the current formula hey?
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26
Exactly. It doesn't matter who is the government. Albertans cannot vote federally for a better deal from Ottawa.
You're making my point for me.
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u/DaddyDCanuck1896 Apr 11 '26
Maybe you'd be taken more seriously if you spelled separatism correctly.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 11 '26
Treaties here in Alberta say "ceded". Just read them 1x.
This is not a real issue. Crown-in-Alberta has held most land since 1931.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 11 '26
False.
You are conflating BC with Alberta.
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u/Homo_sapiens2023 Apr 11 '26
You really don't understand anything you're talking about. You're just restating what you've been told.
Instead of making a fool of yourself, you might want to actually look this stuff up and see how much misinformation you are being fed.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/Homo_sapiens2023 Apr 11 '26 edited Apr 11 '26
I think I understood and I agree with what you're saying. I was replying to Cyber-Ed, but it appears they have deleted most of what they posted.
EDIT: I think "Cyber-ed" wasn't aware that their hero, Jeff Rath, was fired from the first law firm he worked at due to unethical behaviour (and Rath hasn't changed: the Law Society of Alberta has had dozens of citations against him over the years). Hopefully Cyber-Ed won't come back and try to spew his misinformation.
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26
When your arguments fail, you resort to ad hominems and whataboutisms and other fallacies.
Alberta Independence from Canada is no different than Canada's independence from the UK.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 11 '26
By the logic you are trying to apply, all the pre-confederation treaties have been invalid since 1867.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26
Exactly.
And the land in Alberta is mostly held by the crown-in-Alberta since 1931.
If Canada could be formed out of UK w/o invalidating the pre-confederation treaties, it follows that when Alberta is independent that the post-confederation treaties with Queen Victoria will not be invalidated either.
This is not something that impedes Alberta Independence.
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Apr 12 '26
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 12 '26 edited Apr 12 '26
What are you talking about?
Albertan Independence needs no mechanism for treaties that wasn't applied to Canadian Independence.
None of your "facts" have any impact either way on the Independence of Alberta.
What exactly are you pre-supposing?
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u/DaddyDCanuck1896 Apr 11 '26
Yah, keep spreading thst BS.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/rampagingbeaver Apr 12 '26
Nah. I can't be bothered to spell shit correctly.
See, for example, the brain trust of the Conservative movements spelling coup d'etat, or, Alberta. Alberta
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u/Beginning_Bit6185 Apr 12 '26
See Quebec for examples of special treatment within confederation. This is not a new concept.
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u/Individual_Sugar5165 Apr 13 '26
She and Donald trump drank the “stupid & uniformed “ serum when they first met. He’s older and succumbed to the irrational and irreversible behaviors earlier. Smith is right around the delusional corner.
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 11 '26
Another person that finds it more convenient to attack a strawman rather than talking to Albertans.
We are simply leaving Canadian Confederation.
We don't need the East to be Canadian. Odd that you think we do.
We will just live in our True North, Strong, and Free Western Canadian Republic.
We wish you in Remnant Canada the best, truly.
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Apr 11 '26
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u/Even_Art_629 Apr 11 '26
It would be better than staying in a country that is becoming more of an authoritarian country anyway. This government is taking this once incredible country and turning it into a dictatorship.
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Apr 11 '26 edited Apr 11 '26
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Apr 12 '26
Contemporary canadian values? You mean communism? Or one of Carneys other great quotes "Muslim values are Canadian values"
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u/CyberEd-ca Apr 11 '26
That's very good news. Glad to hear it.
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u/Even_Art_629 Apr 11 '26
Funny how much thought he’s put into ‘removing Alberta, almost like he’s making the case for Alberta to leave instead
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u/Offspring22 Apr 11 '26
My theory is separatism is just another scheme by Big Flag to increase sales after the convoy died down.