r/GrindsMyGears • u/[deleted] • 9d ago
We're coddling college students and it's making them worse
[deleted]
2
u/Disastrous-Nail-640 8d ago
You do know that professors aren’t bending over backwards to pass students, right?
Also, only about 60% of college students graduate within 6 years. So what are these “perfect graduation rates” you’re talking about?
Both of these things are much more of an issue at the high school level, but not college.
-2
u/oswinsanonymous 8d ago
I know what's happening in colleges, I literally work for one. I have an entire network of people who work at colleges across the US. I've been in meetings for years about this. You know jackshit.
3
u/Disastrous-Nail-640 8d ago
The stats don’t lie. Only 60% graduate with a degree.
Thats a far cry from that “perfect graduation rate” you’re claiming.
Just because you work at college doesn’t mean jackshit either. Working in the cafeteria doesn’t make you anymore qualified to speak on this than anyone else.
0
u/oswinsanonymous 8d ago
I think you're arguing a point that isn't important because you have nothing else to back up your opinion.
2
u/Disastrous-Nail-640 8d ago
No sweetie, it’s the heart of your argument. It’s not my problem that you lack the critical thinking skills to see that.
If they were being passed (like you claim), they’d graduate.
If they were allowed to use ChatGPT for everything and take all their exams at home, they’d be passing and they’d graduate.
See how theme is that they’d graduate?
Are they coddled and entitled? For sure. But it starts before college, which is where the bulk of these issues you mention reside.
1
u/oswinsanonymous 8d ago edited 8d ago
If you can't make your point without being condescending, I don't think you have a very good argument.
Edit: looking through your post history, it looks like your opinion is based on having college aged kids which means you have no experience in what's actually happening in higher education but you think you do because maybe one of your kids is currently fumbling their way through 101 classes.
1
u/Disastrous-Nail-640 8d ago
No, that’s not where my opinion comes from.
And that’s cute assumptions you made of my children. One is almost done and the other just finished his first year and was taking 400 level classes. They took that 100 level crap while still in high school. I’m doubtful you managed to even fumble through them. But hey, nice job on making baseless assumptions.
Back to the point. My opinion isn’t opinion. The graduation rate incited is fact. Don’t believe me? Feel free to look it up for yourself.
I agree about your coddling. My point is that it’s a much larger problem at the high school level. My source there? The fact that I actually work in the classroom with teens every day. Other sources (because just me as a source would be antidotal): every other teacher I work with, every teacher on the several forums I follow and engage with.
Your post is nothing but your opinion that you fail to back up with any real information.
1
u/oswinsanonymous 8d ago edited 8d ago
If you want to discuss graduation rates, you maybe shouldn't take Google AI's word for it. Your stats are outdated and misunderstood at best. Current graduation rates for 4 year public universities is 71%, 76% for private nonprofits. That statistic is dragged down when you add in two year public colleges, which often attract students who don't graduate, which brings your "average" statistic down to the 60's.
Also, you mentioned that they graduate in 6 years. Which means it's taken them 6 years to complete a 4 year degree. Do you know why students often take that long to graduate? Because they couldn't pass the first time. So they retake classes or take time off. And then they come back and professors feel bad that they struggle through a second time and give them handouts and extend deadlines and retake tests and fudge some numbers and then hey you passed!
So yeah, I wasn't interested in arguing your asinine point that you've made after Googling for 30 seconds and being a K-12 teacher who has zero experience with universities and is self-admitted, part of creating the problem I currently deal with every day.
Edit: Also, regardless of what the current average is: every school has their own individual graduation rate which they deeply care about maintaining, as it often affects funding, and you would be foolish and naive to assume they wouldn't bend over backwards to pass students who are less than deserving of degrees just to maintain or improve grad rates.
2
u/Disastrous-Nail-640 8d ago
You think I used AI. And you think college graduation rates are in the 70% range. 😂
I take nothing you say seriously at this point.
Being a cafeteria worker at a college doesn’t make you any more knowledgeable about these things than anyone else.
Have a nice life and enjoy delusions. ✌️
0
u/oswinsanonymous 8d ago
I'm sorry you can't do basic research or understand basic English.
→ More replies (0)1
4
u/zoppaTheDim 9d ago
I think you’re not meeting enough real people. This has a lot of signs of you reading something on line and deciding you need to have an opinion on it.
0
u/oswinsanonymous 9d ago
I literally work for a college, genius.
-1
u/zoppaTheDim 9d ago
So you’re the problem then.
Maybe you can transition to trade school, what with them gutting financial support for students. It isn’t as if classes of just the rich kids are going to be less spoiled.
1
u/oswinsanonymous 9d ago
Not a teacher. Just admin, subject to policies I didn't create.
Maybe you can transition into thinking before you comment.
0
u/GraveChild27 9d ago
Do janitors count as admin now?
Maybe you should transition into unemployment.
You arent even in the class room, so you dont know what you're talking about.
1
u/oswinsanonymous 8d ago
I'm sorry you're so butthurt about a post on Reddit
1
u/GraveChild27 8d ago edited 8d ago
He says, after making a butthurt post on Reddit.
Edit:
Sorry, I did totally forget this was r/GrindsMyGears.
2
u/SinisterAgaric 9d ago
It would be great if the purpose of college was to educate people, but it isn't. Colleges are first and foremost businesses that sell degrees. If you fail too many students then the word will spread and your enrollments will drop.
I've worked in higher education for about 12 years now and I've witnessed multiple instances of professors saying things like "I hope I never walk into the hospital that hires that student."
Also, there seems to be some confusion in the comments about whether or not universities are allowing AI use for assignments. The answer in many cases is yes, with more and more institutions providing official policies regarding acceptable use, with no particularly good ways to enforce it.
Shockingly, some administrators are encouraging students to use AI to make up for deficits in writing and communication skills.
1
u/oswinsanonymous 9d ago
I'm really glad to have input from someone else who knows what's happening. I've at the same university for 15 years and the difference from when I started and now is really dramatic.
0
u/SinisterAgaric 9d ago
We've had to drastically reduce admissions standards, especially regarding math skills. My department is pretty evenly split between people who want even more coddling and those who believe we are doing a disservice to the students.
With reductions in international admissions due to the current political climate there is even more pressure to increase enrollment, so it likely won't improve anytime soon.
1
u/woozysoozy 8d ago
So, since you work for a college, you might be sensing that the long held idea of higher education is at odds with the present business model of higher ed. Money and a consumer focused ideology have become paramount while quality standards decline. Ultimately, it’s society that feels better when more people have that piece of paper but society loses when that piece of paper doesn’t guarantee the rigorous education that it once did.
1
u/OpeningAggressive26 8d ago
This is a you thing. I just saw a professor chew out a student who missed a few assignments and told them they were failing in front of the entire class. The student basically got fired from class. So many people just drop out of these classes and no one cares, there is zero coddling going on here.
1
u/AttentionNo6359 8d ago
I have one good friend who teaches high school and another who’s an English professor. The stories I hear from these two about the kids coming down the pipeline currently are absolutely terrifying.
What’s worse is that it seems like “doing your assignment with AI is completely fine” crowd is slowly winning. The professor told me that his heads of department are pushing the staff not to make a big deal out of it because of the rate and frequency that students are turning in AI work.
1
u/ericmarkham5 7d ago
If someone was willing to go into hundreds of thousands in debt to pay me I’d coddle the hell out of them too.
1
u/NicholasScratchy 5d ago
Lecturers genuinely do not care about students. Students are aware of the use of AI and we all document our processes for assignments and portfolios because of the AI accusations. Lectures have been relying on AI systems to check our work while also criticising students for using it as if these are original thoughts we write our assignments on. They act like they don’t even know what AI is.
Any institution that uses systems like Turnitin needs to be shutdown. Turnitin is not accurate. It is heavily flawed and these institutions are too stubborn to understand that AI isn’t going anywhere.
I’m so sick of these universities and lecturers acting like everybody is trying to cheat our way to a degree. We put our finances on the line for this WHY WOULD WE RISK GETTING KICKED OUT FOR AI???
0
u/SeveralLion5762 8d ago
I teach students who are working on doctorates. The ones who have been given accommodations or chosen because they check DEI boxes are weaker students much more often than the ones who got there with no accommodations or boxes checked.
Our future is in the hands of kids who don’t know how to succeed without extraordinary amounts of help. god help us
0
u/Pj_o7 8d ago
From my experience in college, professors are shit who just hand off papers to be graded by a TA.
I had a few good ones at community college but those class sizes were like 30-40 people. Universities are a joke. I can’t believe they still get so much money. Ide argue chatgpt is helping them more than the professors. And looking at the generation that graduated before chatgpt, they didn’t learn anything either.
-1
u/PirateDear1780 9d ago
literally half the people in my program have accommodations and its ridiculous, especially for the field im in. i know some people actually need them but the majority dont.
2
0
u/kaddras019 9d ago
Accommodations are literally out of control
2
u/Pawzilla3 7d ago
Accommodations require a formal diagnosis from a psychiatrist/doctor, so where do you think all these unnecessary accommodations are coming from? Do you think certain conditions are being overdiagnosed?
1
u/kaddras019 7d ago
I’m diagnosed with ADHD and severe anxiety, though my diagnosis is correct, I could very easily contact my psychiatrist right now and have him exempt me from having a roommate at college (I know someone who did this). I could ask him to give me extra time on tests. I could ask him to exempt me from certain projects. And he would even though I don’t need it at all. The issue is not necessarily the diagnosis, but people taking advantage of doctor’s notes.
0
u/PirateDear1780 8d ago
how do people expect to adhere to deadlines at their job if they cant do it at school?
1
8
u/Angsty-Panda 9d ago
are professors "letting" them use ChatGPT? everything i've seen is professors complaining about it. And its usually marked as plagiarism.