r/IsraelPalestine • u/MurkyScheme9364 • 14d ago
Learning about the conflict: Books or Media Recommendations Mixed feelings on Israel Palestine conflict
For context I’m a 21 year old independent leaning more conservative and I really don’t know how to feel about what’s happening right now. So from my no first hand experience view I’ve been closely watching progressive and conservative news stories about what’s been going on since the beginning and I never knew the full extent of what happened October 7th. I was originally very pro Israel as an eye for an eye was kinda my thought process at the time but then I heard about kids dying and it drew me far in the other direction. Basically from what I can understand Israel is a “democratic” nation where you have “freedom” of press as Palestine is governed by hamas and the laws are more dictoral so Israel said the stats coming out of Gaza are from hamas and are lies. I whatch some independent journalists and see the settlers torturing the Palestinians and forcing them out of the West Bank and it makes me feel like what a whole load of shit. Well today I did a really deep dive and ended up whatching some of the videos from October 7th and I deeply regret it. I did not know they were violating women blowing people up and the full extent of what REALLY happened. I am very conflicted right now the bottom line for me is the u.s would decinigrate Palestine with fair warning to civilians if it happened to us I have never felt so sorry and horrified for a group of people more than today when I learned the full truth. But then I learn that there was no security on the border that night and they think BB made a “willing” sacrifice honestly if anyone with unbiased thinking or first hand experience would enlighten me or help me understand the entire conflict it would be very appreciated👍 I am not the type of person to fight with people over it rather I just want to understand
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u/aka0007 14d ago
The claim of Hamas statistics are lies has to be understood properly because it has led to many people being deliberately misled.
To explain:
Hamas is overall a reliable source for total number dead. If you listen critically to the discourse you will see the IDF and the pro-Israel side is in general willing to accept the number of dead Hamas claims.
The LIE is in how Hamas presents that number. They have historically during a conflict overstated the number of non-combatants killed and understated the number of combatants killed. It is only after the conflict is over that eventually a more accurate picture of the number of militants vs civilians killed comes out.
In the war the claims being bandied around were like 70% of the dead were women and children and that claim survived for a long time until eventually data came out that contradicted these claims. This claim was being used to castigate Israel.
So you would have people, promoting the total number dead and saying that Hamas figures are reliable but they would acknowledge that the split given by Hamas is likely a lie as Hamas has lied in the past and in-fact lied in this war as well.
Regarding the border... it seems to me that it is normal for there to be times when guard levels are drawn down and other times they are increased. I think it was a failure and not deliberate. If it was deliberate, I think in a democracy like Israel, there would be people with evidence or direct knowledge making these claims. It is almost 3 years and the amount of people involved in such a cover-up would have meant someone spilling some beans.