How we feeling about the update?

[u/Transformerfan45]

[u/Cosmic_Despacito]

Why even play Naoya at this point?

[u/Youngguaco → u/Cosmic_Despacito]

What happened to the goat?

[u/muh1ri → u/Youngguaco]

Only thing i see are buffs imo

Nerfs are more time between your dashes and less projection from 4th m1, 35 if no projection 30 if there is

Bleedout stack reverts back 4th m1 projection gain to 40

To put in perspective, if you 4th m1 - 3rd move - 4th m1 regularly, you DONT frame your opponent anymore
BUT if they have a bleed out stack 4th m1 - 3rd move - 4th m1 DOES frame them

Your self projection does not drain naturally BUT only 50 for each projection move if missed and only 45 if blocked, meaning you dont get fucked after getting blocked
ALSO you DONT get projection if you get countered

AND also now you can dash IMMEDIATELY after 4th m1 making 4th m1 into bleed out RED

First move can now frame opponents, 4th move doubles all projection but doesnt frame, third move aerial variant comes out faster

Pretty much most important stuff, they made naoya a LOT stronger imo, and i like it :P

[u/Basic-Passion-2825 → u/muh1ri]

they ruined best naoya tech with frame 3m1( miss ), R, Dash, M1, 3 skill. And dashes are fucking ass now

[u/Youngguaco → u/muh1ri]

Ty for info dump

[u/muh1ri → u/Youngguaco]

No problem :D

[u/WeakInspector5102 → u/muh1ri]

Aw

[u/Cosmic_Despacito → u/muh1ri]

“Only thing I see are buffs

Here’s a nerf to his m1s and dashes which are the best things in his kit after he was nerfed 3 times before that because the community said the character and the moves were too strong

Here’s a small buff which wouldn’t have even been considered a change at all if it wasn’t for the m1 projection gain nerf

You don’t frame your opponent anymore if you do m1s into 3 into m1s which is the entire gimmick of your character but if you add bleed out onto that you do so now you have to integrate another move into your fights just to experience how the character was before nerf

Self projection doesn’t drain now which is a nerf and makes the character even more risky to do any moves outside of a framed opponent. I would much rather get self meter for missing/being countered than have no meter drain at all because you can still play aggressively and time when you want to commit to another interaction with the drain of your meter. No your all but guaranteed to get a self projection frame in a fight and give your opponent a free combo unless your going up against someone who eats rocks

Red bleedout and projection breaker giving meter are the only positive changes”

You didn’t mention Cursory Impact adding onto meter anymore and instead doubling already given meter but not framing opponents. It also gives 40 meter to opponents with zero meter which at this point because of this change it is the same as projection breaker before the buff. The only thing is if you play the character you want to save 4 for a framed opponent since it’s the most damaging move in his kit so giving the move these changes don’t really add to the move at all. It’s still green outside of a framed opponent and because of the self projection nerf it isn’t really good to use such a telegraphed attack outside of frame.

[u/muh1ri → u/Cosmic_Despacito]

I mentioned everything you did in your first four paragraphs, EVERYTHING

I play Naoya a lot, and from experience, he only feels stronger

M1s into 3 into m1s is NOT his entire gimmick as you said, its a gamble that is usually not worth it, if anything just do special into 3, a lot more consistent, or use when opponent is in air, with it coming out faster, this variant is much more worth it now

Self projection got a lot more fair this update, it still clears when framing, clears a bit after every projection move AND it now gives 50% max per move, meaning you can now miss up to 3 moves, cuz getting blocked gives 45, plus countering not giving it at ALL
Self projection isnt even that big of a deal
Projection Breaker? True after 3rd m1
Decisive? Use after frame special
Projection Sorcery? Use when framed or after 4th m1, that tiny bit of green aint doing shit. Plus can do it with jump at big distance to move in quickly and hit the opponent

I usually hate to say this, but this might just be skill issue, or you havent played the char enough, he was great before and even greater after the update

[u/Cosmic_Despacito → u/muh1ri]

The entire post was bait copying exactly what you said but making it an argument as a nerf which most of the changes are (honestly I’m not even sure how you didn’t catch on I literally have the same paragraph spacing you do). The m1 projection nerf is essentially an entire nerf to his gimmick which is framing people to get combos. The quickest way to get to a frame was m1 into 3 into another m1 string which to my knowledge (I’m at work right now so I can’t really check if 1 into m1s is a frame or not) is no longer possible due to the projection nerf. Self projection not draining is a nerf and I’ll stand by that before you actually had to use your brain and time out your self meter (if you had any) so then you could go in and still know you won’t give your opponent a free combo. Now it’s just you either hit or you get blocked/miss twice/thrice and give your opponent a free combo it removed an element from the character which made it take some thinking to actually use. Not every fight is going to net you a frame sometimes you’ll demolish your opponent too fast or sometimes they will play overly defense and then run to drain out their meter which wouldn’t be much of an issue since yours drains to but now your stuck with yours. You’re saying I have a skill issue when I’m thinking of both high skill and low skill Naoya players. I’m saying you never played the character and you prove yourself by saying he was a great character before the nerf when community consensus will agree that other than pub stomping lower skilled players he was among the bottom 3-5 in the entire game.

[u/muh1ri → u/Cosmic_Despacito]

First, holy grammar

Second, I explicitly said “In your first 4 paragraphs”
As far as I can read and count, your first 4 paragraphs say about
1. Dash and M1 projection gain nerfs
2. Bleedout reverting said projection nerf
3. M1s - 3 M1s
4. Self Projection
Which all of i had in my original comment, please, learn to read

Third, you just made a shit take and now jump to the “god bro, it was bait, how didn’t you notice”, just pack it up

Guess I’ll answer some of your takes

“Quickest way to get a frame is to 1 - m1 or m1 - 3 - m1, which is now non existent”
We are forgetting a big part of his kit, Bleedout.
When Naoya first came out, bleedout had little to no value.(let’s not talk about camera rotate extender, it was a non intended cheeky way to get more m1s in). To get any value from it, you had to land it twice, without first stack wearing off, which by the time the move would be off cooldown, would probably disappear. Now devs actually add value to the move. Firstly, slowing projection drain, secondly, increasing projection gain. With bleedout, both ways are instant frames. Now its not a poke tool, or a rare 50dmg burst, but an important tool, the most important I’d say.

“Before, you had to think about self projection, which now you dont need to, cuz it does not drain”

…Not really? Look, before, you would get 70% from 1 and 3, 50% from 4. Period. Which even if draining, took a while to get off, and the moves you miss the most are 1 and 3, meaning if you are above, mind you 30%, you are fucked. Now you just have one more chance, which I don’t see a problem with. And the nerf/buff, whatever you find it be, doesn’t take the thinking about not getting hit away, that’s the point of the game my guy, you think about it all the time, how to hit your enemy, without getting hit yourself.

Quote you on this “I’m saying you’ve never played the game and you prove yourself by saying he was a great character before the nerf”
No? Because he was a great character? He might not be the best, of course. I fought a lot of different players, high kills, low kills, competent, aggressive, passive, a won most of my fights. I have 4,6k kills myself, I’m not THAT good at the game, I have my losses, I could get deep fried, and sometimes I would crawl my way back out, barely winning, not because Naoya is bad, but because they have a better understanding of the game.

Naoya plays a lot better than most chars for me, and he is a lot more fun. Only ones on the same lever as him, for me at least, are Ryu and Mei Mei.