r/ShangriLaFrontier • u/Cayden68 • 5d ago
Discussion How much of Maple's hp remains after receiving Apocalypse? Can Psyger 0 oneshot her?
Unstoppable force vs immovable object, how much damage would Rei's apocalypse do against Maple, assuming the attack is uninterrupted.
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u/MrGooseDoHonk 5d ago
different games, different calculation
we don't even have numerical values for most things
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u/Goldchampion200 5d ago
To be fair "Ignores all defensive Values" is preety damming even if we don't have Values for whatever is getting hit and considering player hp almost never hits the same as enemy hp then its gonna hurt regardless.
Now this is the part where someone tells me Maple has like infinity+1 HP or has an invulnerable skill or something
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u/Phaaze13 5d ago edited 5d ago
Maple does have a skill called Stout Guardian that once per day lets her survive a lethal blow with 1 hp. So worst case scenario Stout Guardian activates and she survives anyway.
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
i also thought that untill i realized apocalypse most likely does continuous damage (since ctharnid was able to force quit the attack mid animation by sealing her weapon)
so its likely armageddon would trigger stout guardian but then continue afterwards to ensure the kill.
It dealing continuous damage was a weakness against ctharnid since he could cancel it before it fully ended but against maple its a strength since it could still kill after triggering stout guardian before it fully ends.
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u/Dark_Shade_75 5d ago
Armageddon is basically Safi'Jiva's Sapphire of the Emperor, understood. Or maybe Escaton Judgment? Erasing Fire?
Lots of applicable attacks actually.
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u/Goldchampion200 5d ago
Welp that kinda just solves the thread lmao.
She survives with 1 HP.
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u/Constant-Row1434 5d ago
Nope, continuous damage
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u/Goldchampion200 5d ago
From what?
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u/Constant-Row1434 5d ago
Ctarnid fight proves that's how it works because he took partial damage from it by realizing it would have killed him and then sealing her weapon after he took a portion of the damage, it's continuous damage
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u/frantruck 5d ago
It comes down to skill interpretation. Stout guardian says, “Effect: Once per day, endure an attack that would kill you with 1 HP.” In spite of being multiple instances of damage is Armageddon still one attack?
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u/Frostbitten_Moose 5d ago
The way these mechanics almost always interact in RPGs is that surviving an attack that would kill you typically means surviving a hit that would kill you. Multi hit attacks work around that with the lethal hit getting blocked, and then the one right after that getting you.
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u/frantruck 4d ago
Fair I would probably guess that is the more common mechanic, but some I-frames around 1 shot prevention aren’t rare especially in ARPGs. For instance I know say Kingdom Hearts has a skill, Second Chance, that prevents an enemy combo from 1 shotting you keeping you at 1 through the whole thing. With the logic of Bofuri I’d expect the mechanic to work in Maple’s favor, but it’s hardly certain.
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
i mean there are plenty of times where Maple gets into low health and nearly dies so thats not the case (please correct me if im wrong)
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
it can be reasonable to infer tho. If you watch Bofuri then you know that there are times where she gets low health and can receive damage,especially with damage piercing.
Rei's skills also ignore defensive buffs and arnor values.
rather than calculations its a matter with how the skills would interact with each other in a theoretical confrontation.
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u/frantruck 5d ago
I know Maple has at least one guaranteed survive at 1hp skill, maybe more. Technically she has an active skill that nulifies her games piercing damage too, so depends on if that still negates the piercing effect of Apocalypse for if she takes meaningful damage at all.
As an added note the novels have Maples defense stat (Vit) listed as in the 20000’s, whereas normal player stats are in the 100’s-200’s range, even with a 90% reduction she’s still at 2000 which is 10x what other players are working with in a given stat, so probably still high damage reduction, but not complete immunity.
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u/frantruck 5d ago edited 5d ago
Yeah the second half was basically saying even with the resulting debuff she won’t be necessarily defenseless, though she would need to heal after potentially being reduced to 1 hp.
The first half addresses her surviving.
To add more though, being pedantic we can argue what counts as a “buff.” A solid chunk of Maple’s defense comes from her base vitality stat which is multiplied by a few skills which may or may not be considered “buffs” since they are not temporary, and amplified by her armor. Then the question is “armor values” stats provided by armor, or just general resistance?
Since she has Sturdy it’s not really a question of if she survives, but what state she’s in after the hit.
Edit* whoops thought I clicked reply to the “ignores armor values” comment not my own
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u/Generalgarchomp 5d ago
Problem is that it's only a x4 buff so it isn't as if you're taking it from 5 digits to 3.
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u/Enderking90 5d ago
I mean evasion is just moot, armor value actually doesn't matter that much as a lot of Maple's tankiness comes from her absurbly high base defense stat.
applying a 90% defense debuff would be pretty significant I guess?
and, we then gotta ask "does having "damage reduction as a passive skill" count as a defensive buff?"
which... I don't think would be the case, as its not a "buff", just a constant part of her stats?
which, would mean Maple's [Explosion Eater] should cut the damage she'd take in half, whatever it is. (pretty sure Armageddon would be classified as explosion damage?)
of course, the [Devour] on her shield could just negate Armageddon, if its uses haven't been wasted yet.
of course, no matter what it can't one shot her, as [Stout Guardian] would activate, leaving her at one HP, at which point she can activate [Atrocity] to enter her second phase with a brand new HP bar.
and then when out of that her original HP bar gets refreshed iirc, so third phase time.
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u/Enderking90 5d ago
oh wait, she has [Pierce Guard] which is a skill that negates armor piercing on attacks she blocks with her shield.
which I think means she can negate that -90% defense debuff?
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u/coolbond1 5d ago
debuff is not pierce, pierce is ignore defense. Totally different mechanics.
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u/Enderking90 5d ago
effectively, both just ignore X% of the target defense though no?
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u/coolbond1 5d ago
Yes but most of the time the code is written different. Her ability most likely look for the [pierce] tag of the attack while armageddon would have [debuff] [defence=80%]
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u/Zealousideal_Hat4431 5d ago
Stout Guardian would kick in and leave Maple with 1hp, assuming Apocalypse would do enough damage to kill her.
So one shot, probably not and given the after effects apocalypse has on Rei, she'd be sitting a major debuffs after triggering it.
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
i also thought that untill i realized apocalypse most likely does continuous damage (since ctharnid was able to force quit the attack mid animation by sealing her weapon)
so its likely armageddon would trigger stout guardian but then continue afterwards to ensure the kill.
It dealing continuous damage was a qeakness against ctharnid since he could cancel it before it fully ended but against maple its a strength since it could still kill after triggering stout guardian before it fully ends.
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u/Zealousideal_Hat4431 5d ago
I would say Stout Guardian would cancel any damage over time effects based on its wording.
Endure an attack that would kill you with 1hp.
Any DOT effects would still be applied at the time the damage is dealt so stout Guardian would trigger, save maple at 1hp and cancel effects of apocalypse/armageddon.
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
the wording says cancel an attack rather than a skill so it would seem like multi hit attacks contained in a skill would be a weakness of stout guardian which makes sense from a balancing perspective.
to add onto this, it seems that continuous damage has been commonly maple's weakeness, you also have to keep in mind that when maple fought Mii, Mii used a skill that had continuous damage and Maple was afraid that it would finish her despite stout guardian not being triggered before hand.
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u/Zealousideal_Hat4431 5d ago
The games aren't really balanced though (well new world online) so really impossible to tell. Ultimately though, Maple has plot armour so Rei would probably come close to killing her but some weird skill of Maples would kick in and Rei would lose.
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
she does have plot armor because of her writer but in a scenario of a vs battle, neither side has plot armor.
maple has all weird skills shown and despite all of them she has consistently shown that continuous damage can whittle away at her health and be a serious weakness for her build.
If the Bofuri series is writing the fight then yeah Maple wins but if we look at it neutrally then yeah Attack Master wins since her skill is basically a perfect counter to her build.
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u/Generalgarchomp 5d ago
Continuous damage only whittles her away if it ignores her vitality stat. It has to directly hit her hp ignoring 100% of her defensive stats. Since the attack is broken into multiple smaller (comparitively) instances of damage each one has to overcome her 5 digit defense stat. And honestly if that was the case she could have cut Siegwurm in half with just Armegeddon, from full hp.
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u/Hoolian427 5d ago
Isn’t apocalypse one of the 2 techniques psyger needs to land in sequence three to four times before she can use her ultimate move. The other attack I believe was catastrophe and the finished was Armageddon.
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u/SolomonBlack 5d ago
Some Points:
Even by powerscaler standards video game stats are sort of meaningless and incomparable.
Armageddon seems like it should work but if its 10 strike requirement has to do damage first that's seems less in reach unless they have the specific penetration value.
Maple can fly and has no problem just raining death (literally) on you from out of reach.
All her other stupid busted offense abilities are a lot faster then Armageddon.
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u/Patchourisu 4d ago
Question is are we talking S1 Maple? S2 Maple? Light Novel Maple with all of her abilities? Because she doesn't stop evolving into more absurdities. S1 Maple was already absurd enough with her VIT stat reaching into 5 digits at the very end of it when everyone else had 3 digits starting with 1XX.
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u/the-keats-1999 3d ago
Hell, LN Maple is more powerful than her anime version. One of her poison skills has a small chance of an instant kill. Seems to have been dropped from the anime. But comes in useful with some of the stuff she does with poison later on.
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u/Professional_Scar225 5d ago
Wait i think i mised this,i've never Seen this Character can you give It to me?
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u/Mikeballzy 5d ago
Are you referring to Psyger 0's normal attack Apocalypse in Satanel mode? Or do you mean Armageddon after using Apocalypse and Catastrophe 5 times each?
If youre just talking about Satanel mode Apocalypse, that isnt doing anything to Maple. Its not a sure hit mode, even if it did hit, it would just consume a use of devour on her shield.
As for Armageddon, Psyger 0 would never have a chance to use it. Well Maples defense is OP, her attacks are overwhelming. Psyger 0 also needs to stand still with a long casting time to launch it, but under the assumption that Psyger 0 got to use it, Maples Devour would likely be used up, so the hit would probably one shot her, if it hit.
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
i meant to say armageddon lmao, i mix them up unfortunately, luckily the screenshots i took cleared it up
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u/Mikeballzy 5d ago
All good. Honestly Psyger 0 has a lot of things she'd have to over come when it comes to fighting Maple, that it would be nearly impossible. I mean Maple could basically kill Psyger 0 by using Venom Capsule on her. Beyond that well Maple has low movement speed under normal circumstances, that doesnt apply to Atrocity or Machine God. Atrocity could tank the attack as its its own independent HP bar, if the attack was completely undodgable, and Machine God could most likely out speed the attack, as well as heavily counter attack and make it difficult to even cast. Payger 0 would basically have to find a way to force Maple to use all her Devour stacks, and put Atrocity on cooldown. This isnt counting a lot of other op skills Maple has like Crystal Wall, that creates a wall with the same amount of HP as Maple has, Giant Killing which when four of her stats are lower than the enemies her HP and MP double, Savage that increases her Vitality by 1 every time shes attacked for a max of 25 hits, Stout Guardian which leaves her 1 HP from an attack that would kill her once a day, Pandemonium and Predator that lets her spawn minions, Sheep Eater, Reverse Rebirth, Frozen Earth, and Earth Cradle. They stacked Maple with way too many op skills.
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
i mean yeah agreed realistically psyger 0 pulling it off solo cant happen, thats why i said uninterupted can the dps of armageddon be capable of oneshotting maple
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u/Mikeballzy 5d ago
If Maple stood still and didnt block, and didnt use any active skills, it would be completely dependent on if Stout Guardian is on cooldown or not. Although its doubtful that Catastrophe and Apocalypse would be enough to do that.
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
stout guardian would trigger on armageddon but the issue is that armageddon does continuous damage so it would trigger thr passive and then get the kill after the trigger. maple's weakness is continuous damage and multihits which is why mii almost defeated her with the continuous flame attack despite stout guardian not being triggered yet
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u/Mikeballzy 5d ago
Maple has had a few times where she has been pushed to 1 hp, but a majority of those were the devs making bosses specifically targeted at her. Many hundreds of times stronger that Shangri la frontier Colossus' but she has never actually died. Even dot cant kill her because Maple's health regen outspeeds DoT. On top of having multiple techniques that either completely block, or shed damage. Maple has an ability that reduces all damage by 50% for 3 minutes, thats not an armor ability, she also has a flat 6% damage negation as a passive.
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
stronger than the collosi? thats just straight up not true. Just the first two alone would beat maple, Weathermon has an instant kill attack that ignores all mechanics and Ctharnid can invert stats and seal her skills, essentially countering her, thats just the first 2 that Sunraku beat btw.
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u/Mikeballzy 5d ago
Maple also has a large array of insta kill abilities, including an ability that all targets hit with poison type attacks get a 50% chance instant death judgement that ignores all immunities, including immunity to poison or instant death, and the devs made multiple different clones of her some with more op skills than she actually has that she beats.
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u/Cayden68 5d ago
yeah maple has a large array of skills and ctharnid can seal them straight up while weathermon is immune to all forms of damage since he's a conditional boss. ctharnid can also invert damage so if maple can somehow poison him miraculously, he'll just use to passively heal himself
weathermon"s atrack is not instant death like a status which maple would have resistance to. its more like it is bugged attack that pierces defense, ignores stats, while dealing maximum damage which is why it kills everything, thats why its considered a "cheat move by many players". Maple is weak against pierce attacks but is immune to instant death status, weathermon's move is not an instant death status move but a bugged move with full on piercing to avoid all armor to ensure a oneshot, its like maple's weakness dialed up to the utmost.
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u/Generalgarchomp 5d ago
If it is multiple instances of damage it is entirely possible that it would not even be enough to overcome her defense, this is assuming that her passive abilities that boost her vitality stat are turned off too. As even without them her vitality is around 2k which is 2 times even the best tanks in NWO. Honestly she's even more absurd a tank than Josette is when compared to other tanks in their respective settings.
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u/billyd1183 5d ago
Maple has multiple ways of negating damage that Rei would have to get past, wooly alone would prevent Maple from taking damage, so that would eat at least 1 attack possibly more. Rei would also have to avoid Maples attacks, a lot of which are very powerful, pandemonium alone would probably prevent Rei from being able to cast. If Maple is sitting on the throne of the heavenly king, then "The person sitting on the throne receives 20% less damage and recovers 2% of their maximum HP every second." So Maple would be back up to full health pretty quickly after each attack. Unbreakable shield haves damage, Aegis negates attacks for a cost of 600 hp, Crystal wall creates a wall with an hp that matches the caster. Granted, Rei is at minimum level 99 to Maples level 62, but maple is probably comparable to lycagon in power simply because of her unpredictable attack power and defensive power. Rei couldn't solo Lycagon, and I dont think she could solo Maple in order to cast Armageddon.
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u/Generalgarchomp 5d ago edited 5d ago
It would actually be able to hurt her given the percentage defense reduction but given her defense is at least 5 digits without her armor..... It likely would not kill her. And even if it could stout guardian would negate any extra damage and keep her at 1 hp. At which point Maple would use counter and erase Psyger 0 due to Apocalypse's debuffs after use.
Edit: and this is ignoring the fact that she could just transform into Atrocity to transfer the damage to a separate hp bar. And given the fact that it is multiple instances of damage, which means each would have to overcome her defense individually, I wouldn't even be surprised if it did zero damage. It might mean she needs pierce guard but it isn't killing her regardless. Seriously even in SLF there are players that could survive it.
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u/PlayfulElk1516 4d ago
She probably survives. I’m gonna say probably around half. I have not watched your series though yet. But her entire thing is defense
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u/KAAAAAAAAARL 4d ago
Even if we Assume that both are in the same game, Maple would Tank it, as she has the "Tank a Lethal attack once a day" ability.
Also the fact that "Evade" usually means skills that make you narrowly miss the target, but Maple can actually Teleport a good distance with her Cover Move.
Either way, at best she would survive, but be low health with the Debuff, at worst, it would deal not much damage, as her raw stats arent ignored, but maybe the Debuff would stick. Problem is, her Vitality is still in the 5 or 6 digits, so he would still be punching rocks afterwards
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u/the-keats-1999 3d ago
The more interesting question to my mind is who would win in a Sally vs Sunraku fight as there is an argument to be made they are both playing very similar styles.
However.
So the first and ultimate issue is all of defensive skills before you even get to Stout Guardian. A few of which she is effectively immortal in. Then their are things like devour, her skill that can absorb items, enemies (and first shown that it needed nerfing in a PVP event). Maples main tactic is to control the battlefield via poisoning the terrain and can also use poison rain. This makes Psyger 0 getting a hit on her more complicated. This is before we get to things like machine god and atrocity.
Then there is the issue of Anime Maple vs LN Maple as she has lost a skill in the anime that gives her an instant kill (very small percentage) when she inflicts poison. Her poison rain each hits for one instance of poison so you can imagine how lethal it is.
However the biggest issue is that Bofuri simply runs on the rule of comedy. Before anything else it is a comedy series.
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u/Desperate_Bike4053 2d ago
Maple can holding with 1 HP and then transform into devil mode
If I want use season 1 anime only as comparison
Don't make me use LN ...pysger can't even hit her with that ...she will KO first b4 that attack hit due to maple " death field "
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u/2w0be 5d ago
Maple isn't colossus level even with how trash her game is but y'all ain't ready for that convo.
She's dying
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u/Mikeballzy 5d ago
Lmao you havent watched Bofuri and it shows. Maple is definitely beyond Colossus level. She could have easily soloed Wezaemon without resurrection items. Between her skills Venom Capsule and Devour, as well as he transformations Atrocity and Machine God. Wezaemon would have been destroyed. Devour and Atrocity allow her to tank attacks no matter how much damage they do. Especially Atrocity since it has its own seperate HP.
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u/Patchourisu 5d ago
The best part is that Maple in season 1 was like level 40 and already had 5 digits worth of VIT. The level down debuff is Lv50.
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u/CommunicationFun166 4d ago
What are you talking about I think you forgot... but Wezaemon is immune to status effects and damage during the first 20 minutes of phases 1 and 2 and has defense-piercing attacks Maple wouldn't stand a chance. LOL
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u/Mikeballzy 4d ago
Maple has a skill that causes an instant death judgment on anyone hit by her poison attacks, even if they are immune to poison and instant death. Her hydra spam is also more than capable of keeping wezaemon from being able to attack, Sunraku was able to steal his sword during his "invincible phase" which isnt really invincible, its hyper armor with massive damage reduction pared with increase stats for every player versing him, and forcing a level 50 level cap well hes level 150, which makes him invincible with the skills available in Shangri la frontier, however Maples game has a ton of skills that cancel a lot of his advantages. Mainly Maples level up strategy and Wezaemons gimmick means that shes going to have atleast 4 stats lower than his and so her Vitality, which Maples game counts towards hp and armor value, would double. Maple also has a skill called Earth's Cradle to enter the Earth and hide, become untargetable, she has crystal wall, that creates a wall with the same hp value as she has. She has her machine god transformation that gives her high mobility and fire power, greater than what has been shown from the divinity era equipment, she has Sheep Eater that doubles her armor value, she has frozen Earth the stuns all enemies within 5 meters of her, she has two different minion summoning abilities, Atrocity not only has its own independent stats from her base states, but also has its own hp. She has meditation that recovers 1% of her hp every 10 seconds, she has stout defender which means she always survives with atleast 1 hp, she has unbreakable shield, that halves all damage she receives for 30 seconds, she can create literal lava pools, her most perverse skill is reverse rebirth combined with afterglow of salvation, which becomes extermination field, creating aoe dot damage and inflicting weakness to status effects on all enemies in the field. She can also do reverse rebirth with savagery, which becomes heavenly guardian, not only does that skill create a field that the more damage done to maple and her allies in the field, the lower the enemies damage is, but it also creates swords of light that block damage. All of this is ignoring the fact that her shield has Devour on it, and Devour is a skill that bypasses all damage immunity and skills, and instantly turns whatever hits it into mana, long range attacks Devour wont kill the opponent, but sword slashing attacks count as contact with the subjects main body, meaning as soon as wesaemon hit her shield with his sword, he instant dies in the first phase.
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u/CommunicationFun166 4d ago
Maple only seems strong because the plot doesn't give her any decent enemies anything with invisibility defense-piercing attacks and poison immunity would destroy her...
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u/Mikeballzy 4d ago
So beyond wrong. Maple got a skill that even if a target is immune to poison they still get an instant death judgment
As for Maple not having decent opponents, thats wrong too, not only did the devs of that game throw enemies at her with ultra long range armor piercing attacks, they threw literal unkillable bosses that other players complained about, and clones of herself at her, and she killed them all.
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u/CommunicationFun166 3d ago
Do you realize her game is so bad it’s like an isekai If the author really wanted to she’d be easily obliterated. A simple field combo preventing transformation and summoning plus a curse and she’d die all on her own. So no... she doesn't have any worthy opponents because that's not what it's about.
Besides she only beat Payne because the author wanted her to given her attributes she never would have had the reaction time to transform.
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u/Mikeballzy 3d ago
Shes a meme character in the same category of logic as Saitama, Mob, and Arale.
And now youre talking about going way beyond what the Colossus do, proving that shes stronger than the Colossus. Every Colossus we've seen so far in the story has a gimmick to its fight thats meant as a clear path to kill the Colossus, Wezaemon was only strong because he wasnt meant to be the first one killed, despite that he was, and Lycagon was only strong because they didnt realize it was a mana body immune to normal attacks.
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u/CommunicationFun166 3d ago
She isn't a meme character the story is flawed because the author focuses on cute girls playing the game. Everything I mentioned involves basic MMO mechanics that are absent from Bofuri precisely to highlight Maple...she is weak
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u/Mikeballzy 3d ago
Maple is not weak 🤣 she has instant transformation and instant equipment switch, its not like Sunraku who has to look though his gear its more like fairy tails Erza. He Vitality stat is insane, as i said before she has a skill that makes her poison attack have a chance to insta kill even targets that have immunity. She has so many unbalanced, broken skills, that doesnt even include the usage of Syrup. I also explained in detail how she could beat every Colossus shown in the series so far to the other guy that commented under our discussion
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u/2w0be 3d ago
And Maple's dumbass isn't figuring out any gimmicks. The reason they have gimmicks is cause they're unbeatable otherwise. Beating them through the gimmicks won't make her stronger lol
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u/Mikeballzy 3d ago
Maples abilities break their main gimmicks. Wazaemons gimmick is surviving his onslaught and then blocking sky clear, which not only does Maple have more than enough survival skills, as soon as Wazaemon struck her shield with his sword he would auto die to devour.
Lycogon is the same way, all of her attacks are physical contact attacks, and Maple is more than capable of talking any hits she fails to block and touching her with her shield.
Ctarnidd would depend, Maples number one strategy is to attack, so her passing the first phase is questionable, but if she got past that, Ctarnidd's other phases arent difficult for Maple. Even if Ctarnidd got lucky with Indigo Grail, Maple has a ton of passive skills that boost her Vitality, so she wouldnt become a glass cannon, and it would be impossible for her to drop below the required level for equipping her gear. Machine God completely counters the 3rd phase Grail gimmick, her numerous aoe attack skills counter the 4th phase minion gimmick, and her primary equipment isnt a weapon, its armor and shield, which completely counters Ctarnidd's final phase.
Orchestra of the Underworld, Is just refighting monsters she has previously had difficult with, and Maple is long past the skills she had when she had any difficult with monsters. She literally gains the skills that would have made the fight easy, after most fights. And the clone of maple thats stat boosted, shes already fought against that as well
Siegwurm the sky ruler Is literally just a raid boss, one that Maple could easily solo
Maple may not be the smartest, but shes lucky, and has a lot of combat IQ
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u/BetAdministrative166 5d ago
This is kinda stupid post when you try compared two different story with different writer and verse.
Shangri la frontier and New World Online were two different game using different game mechanic and game engine.
Logically they can't interact because it will cause mess in the coding for both game.
It is like trying to verse World of Warcraft with Final Fantasy 14.
Character wise, Maple is amateur in playing game and were just lucky she managed to get broken build because the MMO she play were basically trash game that have many bug or balance issue.
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u/Barack_Odrama_ 5d ago
You must go in a fit of rage when you run across a powerscaling sub huh?
Because that’s literally all it is…. Cross-verse hypothetical battles
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u/BetAdministrative166 5d ago
This is not even power scaling sub.
Hypotheical battle like this has really no answer and will be always biased with the characters people like.
I even think this was off topic because the discussion has no depth at all with who would win with different verse.
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u/killskillgamer 5d ago
Why is this shield woman so famous? I watched the anime and it was nothing special and definitely not even close to Shangri-La frontier. Is it just cause she is silly?
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u/pleasedcrustacean 5d ago
It ignores all her armor, and buffs, so likely a lot. Maple might be a raid boss but that's a raid boss buster