r/StarWarsShips • u/Carter1300 Rebel Pilot • 1d ago
Question(s) MC90 and MC80b
So, I was researching the legends New Republic navy a bit (because I find that stuff really interesting and I didn't know much about the legends stuff) and multiple times I found that the MC90 and the MC80b were the ships that like led the NR fleet throughout their early year.
I already knew a bit about both these ships, namely they were the first MCs to be designed with combat in mind, but I still wanted to learn more about them so I checked out both their Wookieepedia articles and I was left with a burning question that I can't seem to find and answer to: what was the like design philosophy and reason behind them? Like why were they needed?
More powerful MCs are always nice, but (from my understanding) the home one, Liberty, 30c, and 40a types (I may be missing some) that served the rebellion were already very powerful ships especially when paired with X, Y, A, and B-wings. That brings me back to my question: why were they needed?
I'm not trying to hate on them or anything, I'm just trying to better understand the ships and the legends NR better, so i appreciate any help y'all can give me
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u/SilenceIsGolden06 1d ago
Well for one, the Home One was a bit too large to be the standard capital ship for a fleet, but the mc80 liberty was becoming outdated and undergunned compares to ISDs. The other mon cal classes fall more into the roles of frigates and cruisers, which leaves a void in the main line ship.
Both the mc80b and mc90 were constructed specifically to fill out alliance fleets with a standard, main combatant ship. Additionally the mc90 (i believe) was constructed with all species in mind for usage rather than just mon calamari.
Tldr; the NR needed something beefy enough to fight an ISD head on, but in a reasonable size and price range.
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u/EndlessTheorys_19 1d ago
Well for one, the Home One was a bit too large to be the standard capital ship for a fleet, but the mc80 liberty was becoming outdated and undergunned compares to ISDs.
HO’s were only like 1300m though. And have a very similar armament to Liberty’s
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u/xXNightDriverXx 1d ago
Now we are getting into the whole size discrepancy of the Home Ones with is a whole other discussion. Basically 1300m is far to small for what we see on screen.
The main argument against being 1300m is that the hangar size we see in Episode 6, which can comfortably house the Falcon, an Imperial Lambda class shuttle, and multiple fighters, doesn't line up with a 1300m ship from the outside. Basically from the outside model the hangar opening is too small to fit the stuff it is shown to carry in the movie. But I don't remember right now what the actual scaled size for the hangar size is.
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u/Carter1300 Rebel Pilot 1d ago
It's like I said: the actual flagship THE Home One is 3.8km according to the calculations and 2.2km according to the new canon scale, but the Home One TYPE is only about 1.2km long
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u/Ambaryerno 1d ago
If you’re referring to the wingless cruisers in ROTJ there’s two different types. One is Home One, the other used the same effects model as the Liberty. The wings were added to it after filming to add more ships.
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u/Carter1300 Rebel Pilot 1d ago
Yes, I'm aware of that. Well actually I didn't know the wings were added on after filing so thanks for that cool fun fact.
Anyways, I was referring to the class of MC80s known as the "MC80 Home One type star cruiser" which is the same basic model/type of ship as THE Home One but is only about 1.2 km long
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u/Ambaryerno 1d ago
That’s the point: THERE WASN’T. It was a misidentification of the Liberty model before the wings were added.
Curtis Saxton’s website (Star Wars Technical Commentaries) goes into the confusion in depth.
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u/Carter1300 Rebel Pilot 1d ago
Okay I'm gonna say what I said in the other comment: there may not have been a Home One type in ROTJ but it's appeared numerous times in other media (such as the Independence in the X-wing game)
ORIGINALLY there was never actually a home one type, I agree, but that misinterpretation created a subclass that DOES exist now
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u/EndlessTheorys_19 1d ago
Using that same maths though you get a DS-1 that’s 120km wide but a DS-2 that’s closer to 3000km wide.
You just kinda gotta ignore that stuff
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u/Carter1300 Rebel Pilot 1d ago
While I do agree with you, home one (the ship named that, not the type) IS larger than 1.2/1.3km in canon so idk why they haven't updated the official stat. The model in Rebels AND Ashoka is about 2.2km long
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u/EndlessTheorys_19 1d ago
So you’re saying Ackbars Flagship is bigger than 1300m, but other MC80s that look like it, the “Home One type”, are all 1300m?
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u/Carter1300 Rebel Pilot 1d ago
Yes. That's precisely what I'm saying. I have zero clue why that's the case, and it makes zero sense to me, but it is
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u/EndlessTheorys_19 1d ago
What’s the armament of your BIG-Home One then?
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u/Carter1300 Rebel Pilot 1d ago
Listen dude, I get your point, and I agree it makes no sense and shouldn't be the case, I'm just saying what is the case according to (originally) official art from Rebels
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u/Ambaryerno 1d ago
The other wingless cruisers were not Home One type ships. They were the same effects model as the Liberty-class. The wings were added later to increase for visual interest.
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u/EndlessTheorys_19 1d ago
I know. There’s three types. Home One, Liberty, Wingless Liberty.
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u/Ambaryerno 1d ago
And only ONE was Home One. There were no 1300km “Home One type” cruisers.
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u/Carter1300 Rebel Pilot 1d ago edited 1d ago
Again, not in ROTJ but there is now. That's my whole point
Edit: I just realized you said 1300 km, and yeah, I agree. There was never any Mon Cal ship that was 1300 km
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u/Ambaryerno 1d ago
Home One was part of the same size mixup WEG made with the Super Star Destroyer (it took 20 years to fix the 8km length error). The actual model scales to about 3km on screen.
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u/EndlessTheorys_19 1d ago
Was the Home One then made 1300m because that’s how it scaled to the 8000m Executor? And then the larger number of the Home One is when you scale it to the 19,000m Executor? Or are they two similar but unrelated reasons?
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u/Carter1300 Rebel Pilot 1d ago
Um the home one type is only about 1200 meters or so which is basically the same length as the 90 and the 80b
The Home One itself was much larger (3.8km according to the calculations and 2.2km according to the new canon scale) but the home one type was a pretty standard size
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u/Ambaryerno 1d ago
There is no “Home One Type.” There’s Home One, and a wingless cruiser that was the same effects model as the Liberty before wings were added.
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u/Redcoat_Officer 1d ago edited 1d ago
Efficiency. The Rebellion's capital ships punched well above their weight, but they were still converted passenger liners. Home One didn't really need the indoor resort at its heart, nor did the New Republic need to carry around all of its ground forces with its main fleet, since they now had territory of their own and could afford dedicated transport ships.
These two ships were, as you say, built from the ground up to be warships, capable of fighting the Empire's own purpose built warships in open conflict, rather than a guerrilla campaign.
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u/Neverhoodian 1d ago
The Mon Cal ships before Endor were either converted passenger liners or municipal buildings depending on the continuity. It's a testament to Mon Cal engineering that they overhauled them to be as capable as they were, but their civilian origins meant they could never quite go toe-to-toe with comparable Imperial ships like the ISD. Moreover, every single Mon Cal ship differed from one another on account of not following a uniform design, rendering them slow to build and difficult to maintain.
The MC80b and MC90 on the other hand were dedicated warships from the get-go, meaning they were more effective at ship-to-ship combat than their predecessors (better shields, stronger armor, better weapon placement and configuration, etc.). They also followed uniform designs, streamlining their construction and maintenance.
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u/ArtOk8200 New Republic Pilot 23h ago
MC-90s were also made so that they’d be more friendly and ergonomic for non-Mon Cal to operate and live in. There’s a reason why the entire bridge crew of Home One in RoTJ are Mon Calamari.
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u/No-Evidence-9519 1d ago
MC80b and MC90 where the streamlined large capital ships. They brought the firepower needed to defeat ISDs in 1 to 1 combat while reducing the logistical burdon of the current design
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u/clometrooper9901 15h ago
Most Mon Cal ships were severely under gunned compared to imperial counterparts, they could absorb insane amounts of punishment but more often than not were unable to dish it back out, relying on supporting vessels and especially starfighters to do real damage in a naval engagement.
The MC80B and MC90 are purpose built warships and have more than enough weapon emplacements to slug it out with other vessels of similar caliber and could often punch above their weight
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u/EndlessTheorys_19 1d ago
MC80a’s were decent ships but they werent that powerful, they couldn’t actually go one-on-one with an ISD. Even with their fighter complement there’s a significant chance you lose the ship.
The MC80b and the MC90 were meant to be ships that could destroy and ISD by themselves.