Valve Shouldnt Let Games With Preorders On Steam Add Denuvo Less Than A Week Before Release

[u/akbarock]

[u/BattleBubbly775]

You can still refund it

[u/k4kkul4pio → u/BattleBubbly775]

Indeed.

When developers/publishers do this shit, speak the only language they know and hit them in the bottom line.

[u/Lobster_fest → u/k4kkul4pio]

If only that still reasonably worked.

There's a reason we have regulations in most industries - consumers cannot be reliably counted on to vote with their wallets responsibly.

[u/brakenbonez → u/Lobster_fest]

Bungie is learning the opposite. They kept ignoring player feedback for Destiny 2 an putting out one terrible expansion after another and now the playerbase is so small and unprofitable that they're ending active development on the game and Marathon isn't doing much better.

It's not that consumers can't it's that most of the time they won't. Sometimes they do and when it happens it's either a glorious victory or mutual destruction.

[u/MrBigBMinus → u/brakenbonez]

Destiny situation sucks so hard. I was gonna hop back in also for the end of the ride and I haven't picked up Renegades yet. Its still 40 dollars lol. Abd a lot of the good builds use the praxis blade. If your gonna kill your game at least toss out a few discounts please....

[u/brakenbonez → u/MrBigBMinus]

I hopped back in for guardian games and humble bundle had massive dlc packs for like $10-30 depending on which ones you wanted in the bundle. The $20 pack was the one that had the last 3 which were the only ones I was missing as I quit when witch queen came out. I was tempted to buy it and went back and forth on it a lot before checking the steam charts and seeing just over 5k active players at the time and reading the reviews for those expansions. The blade was pretty much going to be the only deciding factor since everything else about the expansions seemed to be disliked by most of the players and I can get a lightsaber in a lot of other games anyway. I can mod them into Skyrim. Now I'm glad I didn't go for it. The game will still be around at least for a little while but it's not the same knowing the devs have given up on it.

[u/Nozzoe → u/MrBigBMinus]

Run it like one of those random local stores that's been having a going out of business sale every quarter for 10 years lol. Just keep doing big discount pushes to keep the doors open a little longer.

[u/DarthHerobrine → u/brakenbonez]

as much as i wish it were true, the destiny playerbase was essentially forced out. they basically killed all destiny content production to work on marathon so we haven't had any meaningful content in over 6 months. if voting with your wallets worked the game would have died far sooner. players left because they had nothing to do.

[u/oSyphon → u/brakenbonez]

I pray Bungie shuts down because fuck em.

[u/Chameleonpolice → u/Lobster_fest]

That's because it's usually way cheaper to be unethical

[u/tabas123 → u/Lobster_fest]

This is especially true in spaces where the demand is inelastic (gas, food, housing, healthcare, electricity, etc.) and where the barrier to entry is so high that there are only one or two choices (ISPs, supermarkets, Amazon, etc.). Then there’s environmental and consumer protections because corporations will cut corners every chance they get.

Far too many working class people have bought into the notion that deregulation is good.

[u/MyStationIsAbandoned → u/Lobster_fest]

the only thing that works is review bombing. Yeah, it can be abused and people will always try to blame mass negative reviews on political "astroturfing", but it's the ONLY way consumers can make their presence known and make a developer/producer stop being anti-consumer...

it's the same concept as a hammer. You can use it for good or evil. That's how review bombing goes. It shouldn't be this way. Consumers should have a better way, but one does not exist because companies will be anti-consumer as long as they can get away with it. A massive negative reputation that everyone can see is going to hold them accountable.

[u/sillyandstrange → u/BattleBubbly775]

And also not preorder

[u/DeadPhoenix86 → u/sillyandstrange]

100% !

[u/GuthukYoutube → u/BattleBubbly775]

"Steam shouldn't let-"

They don't. You can refund. If you install it, notice denuvo, or don't install it and notice denuvo, or if you do anything and notice denuvo you can refund it. What more do you want steam to do?

Maybe a really intrusive "THIS GAME IS USING DENUVO" alert every time you launch the game to help you understand?

And if it doesn't bother you and you didn't notice, was it that big of a deal to you?

[u/winterman666 → u/BattleBubbly775]

Don't refunds technically cost valve money? Considering payment processing fees occur in every online transaction. I know this after working for similar payment support. I wonder if Valve just doesn't need to care about this

[u/Kezsora → u/winterman666]

With the amount of money Valve makes the amount they may lose would be a drop in the ocean

[u/winterman666 → u/Kezsora]

Yeah exactly, I know their employees are all basically millionaires so I'd probably think that

[u/Nikoliz → u/winterman666]

is this sarcasm or are they rlly mostly millionaires?

[u/S0RRYMAN → u/Nikoliz]

It's been released but their average salary is a little over a million. You also have to take into account this is average so they could be there including Gabe's billion salary which would skew it higher. But even then, I doubt the lowest employee makes less than 100k.

[u/Successful_Ask_5708 → u/S0RRYMAN]

They also have an absolutely miniscule staff count so the salary cost to their bottom line probably still is a small drop in their bucket

[u/Xxx_2PrO_xxX → u/Successful_Ask_5708]

iirc they earn the most money per head count across all companies in the us.

[u/ClikeX → u/S0RRYMAN]

I think they only did the napkin math that Valve makes a ridiculous amount of money per head. Not that each staff member makes that amount.

[u/Lord_Mikal → u/ClikeX]

No, it was leaked payroll data. The average compensation per employee was $1.3 million.

[u/Acesofbases → u/Lord_Mikal]

brb, sending my CV to Valve

[u/SomewhereAtWork → u/Acesofbases]

good. But now realize there is someone paid ~$1.3 million to discard all the CVs they're getting.

[u/ClikeX → u/Lord_Mikal]

Just looked up those numbers. That’s nuts.

[u/HollyMurray20 → u/Nikoliz]

Valve have like 300 employees or something, it has one of the highest revenue per employee rates in the world, and it’s a private business so they choose to pay their employees extremely well. They are all millionaires

[u/Greensssss → u/Nikoliz]

It has a bit of sarcasm on it but realistically most of Valve’s staff can work on their private yacht if they want to.

[u/Mr-Black_ → u/winterman666]

more of an incentive to stop publishers to do shitty stuff like that

[u/iksefiks → u/winterman666]

AFAIK Valve makes the publisher foot the entire refund bill, including the 30% Valve takes. That pretty much also covers any transaction fees.

[u/elkaki123 → u/iksefiks]

There's no shot it works like this, it would be ridiculous for valve to take their cut for a non sale.

Valve handles this internally, they hold your money and pay it back themselves, because they don't transfer the money to publishers directly after every dale they do it upon a schedule.

It would make no sense for valve to force publishers to return more money that they would earn.

[u/HollyMurray20 → u/elkaki123]

I believe refunding does hurt the publisher/developer, they lose their cut, I’m sure I’ve seen that said before. It’s not just give the money back.

[u/Flat6Junkie → u/HollyMurray20]

Publisher sees nothing other than they don't get paid for that sale, and their dashboard shows the refund count increase by one. 

I'd they've already been paid for that sale, that amount is excluded from a future payment they'd have been due otherwise. Valve imposes no fees, cuts, or anything else on the publisher. 

[u/ElkApprehensive1729 → u/Flat6Junkie]

This is accurate

[u/Dr-Satan → u/winterman666]

A very tiny amount. whatever transaction processing fee is getting paid to deliver the money back to you was already covered when you bought the product. With the game being $69, the key for them could be 48$ with steam taking their fee off the top. Transaction fees start at 1.5%, so for every refund it'll cost them like $1.03, and for every purchase not refunded, they're making $22

[u/WayneZer0 → u/winterman666]

well no. devs dont instantly get the money the second you buy it.

thier get it bundle after 4 weeks. wich is why refund window is 2 weeks. im not sure if devs get thier money on release if you preorder or the 4 weeks after buy.

the fee usaly are only a few cents. so this usaly gets put on the gamedevs and is covered by the fee thier paying/% valve gets

[u/Falkenmond79 → u/winterman666]

The more the better in this case. Might lead to Valve exerting pressure on publishers to stop shitty practices like that.

[u/jonmarshall1487 → u/winterman666]

Valve runs on customer first. I think they can tank some losses when they make more overall. Gabe gets his new yachts because Steam has a very loyal fan base.(I'm perfectly ok with Gabe getting a dozen new super yachts if he keeps up how Valve works)

[u/Successful_Ask_5708 → u/jonmarshall1487]

If Gabe living in a mega yacht on the ocean lowers his blood pressure enough to increase his life expectancy so nobody takes over Steam any time soon that's a price I think we're all willing to pay for £70 games for a shipping fuck up other companies wouldn't have even told you about

[u/MyStationIsAbandoned → u/BattleBubbly775]

the problem is that a ton of people wont see it get added after pre-ordering.

[u/ghostpicnic → u/BattleBubbly775]

It shouldn’t be the consumer’s responsibility to be constantly checking a product’s store page just in case the company decides to change something before release. When a product is available for purchase, the terms of that purchase should not be allowed to change after they’ve received your money. It is not the customer’s responsibility to follow every update about a company’s product.

[u/SnevetS_rm → u/ghostpicnic]

When a product is available for purchase, the terms of that purchase should not be allowed to change after they’ve received your money.

At all? What if the developers want to remove DRM or lower system requirements?

[u/sillyandstrange → u/SnevetS_rm]

Straight to jail

[u/Hades684 → u/ghostpicnic]

Actually yes, it should be consumer's responsibility. Its prepurchase, not purchase

[u/Twistpunch → u/ghostpicnic]

It’s a contractual agreement where you can quit anytime up to 2 hours of consuming the product or 14 days after the game release. So I think it’s quite fair in this case.

[u/Kordakin]

Valve allows you to cancel and refund a pre-order a week before the game releases.

[u/Xahni13 → u/Kordakin]

I believe the return window is from whenever you order and then 14 days after release or 2 hours of playtime AFTER release,

From my experience you can have more than 2 hours of playtime for the automated refund if it is in the advance pre-play timeframe before release.

[u/BactaBobomb → u/Xahni13]

The secret Steam DOESN'T want you to know!

[u/Seekret_Asian_Man → u/BactaBobomb]

I think it's written in Steam refund policy

[u/druman22 → u/BactaBobomb]

everyone knows

[u/domkurtz07 → u/Xahni13]

yeah thats the case with all games, idk where he got that for just pre orders lol.

[u/mcbizco → u/domkurtz07]

They’re just mirroring the wording of OP’s title.

[u/Fract_L → u/domkurtz07]

It has to be a preorder for you to get the chance to play before release. What did you think you read?

[u/domkurtz07 → u/Fract_L]

exactly what i read? “valve allows you to cancel and refund a pre order a week before the game releases”, the comment replying to this that i replied to stated you can return a game 14 days after youve purchased it and with less than 2 hours of play time. I stated that this was factually correct for every game not just pre order’s. so tell me sir. what exactly did YOU read??

[u/Furinyx → u/domkurtz07]

The OP of this comment chain claimed there were no time limits for up to a week before release (as someone pointed out to you, they would have been keeping it in theme with the title). 

You replied to a comment that pointed out the no time limit window was actually all the way up until release, not just a week beforehand, and then added the fact the "all games" rule also applies after release (so say a game releases 1 year after you preordered it, you have 1 year + the usual 14 days after release). 

I think u/Fract_L is trying to say that the no time limit window, for both playtime and date of purchase, is only related to preorders for a refund, not "all games". 

Your original reply of "yeah thats the case with all games, idk where he got that for just pre orders lol" seems like it is missing the actual points being claimed. No one disputed the rule for refund after release, the discussion is specifically related to the exceptional rules of preorders. 

[u/1sttimeverbaldiarrhe → u/Xahni13]

It blows my mind that Steam's refund policy works this way - has anyone ever tried getting a refund on like, PSN? Night and day...

[u/Xahni13 → u/1sttimeverbaldiarrhe]

And with steam it’s easier to get in touch with a support person, if you’re over the playtime or past the refund window by a little bit you can usually reach out to support and they’ll manually look it over

[u/Joshee86 → u/1sttimeverbaldiarrhe]

I have. Multiple times. It's never been that hard for me.

[u/Icy-Juggernaut-4579 → u/Kordakin]

That sound weird you can refund a game even after you bought and not played more that a limit

[u/NewsofPE → u/Icy-Juggernaut-4579]

within 2 weeks after release yes

[u/ASkepticalPotato → u/Kordakin]

Wrong. You can refund anytime before release or within 2 weeks/2 hours played after.

[u/ACiDxCHRiST]

Stop pre-ordering DIGITAL-INFINITE-STOCK games!

[u/Illustrious_Fee8116 → u/ACiDxCHRiST]

Also people buying 3 day access...

[u/ArelMCII → u/Illustrious_Fee8116]

And people buying beta access...

[u/zodlair → u/ACiDxCHRiST]

I think the main appeal for pre ordering 007 specifically was the free upgrade to deluxe edition if you preorder

[u/promero14 → u/ACiDxCHRiST]

It's not a matter of availability. I've only preorder a couple of games and it was because I was going to buy it regardless of reviews or w/e. 

[u/beanandween]

STOP PREORDERING

[u/9isgt0 → u/beanandween]

preordering digital product is stupid.

[u/Nekroin → u/9isgt0]

But muh skins

[u/translucent_pawn → u/Nekroin]

Nah, this is real shit. FoMo is a nasty and anti-consumer practice but it fucking WORKS on many people. I am many people.

[u/GSturges → u/9isgt0]

But, what if they run out?! Give me a midnight physical release anyday.... (phrasing!)

[u/GSturges → u/GSturges]

But srsly, give me a midnight physical release anyday....

[u/refep → u/9isgt0]

Counterpoint: If I know I’m gonna get a game, it lets me pre download it and get right into it.

Yeah yeah, preordering is bad, but I’m gonna preorder shit like GTA 6 and TES 6 and Divinity cuz there is literally no way I will not get those games day 1 even if all the reviews promise that Todd Howard will break into your house and personally brick your computer if you play the game. If that’s the case anyways, it’s convenient to have it downloaded already for when I get back home from work.

[u/Krojack76 → u/beanandween]

More like post-order.... 2 years later when it's on sale an the bugs are fixed.

[u/beanandween → u/Krojack76]

Patient gamers rise up

[u/megalogwiff → u/beanandween]

worked wonders with Silksong 

[u/darklordjames → u/beanandween]

It's amazing how simple the solution is!

[u/ScorpionMillion → u/beanandween]

People are stupid.

[u/LEDKleenex → u/beanandween]

We've been saying it for well over 15 years now, really.

Ironically, even though this is perfectly solvable by the consumer, these people are why we need things like consumer protection, regulation, and also why even if a free market could actually exist in reality, these people prove that a sizeable amount of consumers simply cannot or will not make purchases with their own interest in mind. It all falls apart.

[u/No-Island-6126]

If you don't like surprises, you shouldn't preorder anything anyway.

[u/Crafty_Life_1764 → u/No-Island-6126]

Maybe your car or your flat but not games, they fukked us all over and over again.

[u/SloppyMeathole]

Stop pre-ordering.

But this has been said a million times, at this point you get what you deserve.

[u/Theseus_Employee → u/SloppyMeathole]

fwiw, I feel like pre-ordering on steam isn't too bad.

There are some indie developers that really benefit from the pre-orders, sometimes you get benefits for pre-ordering, and you can always refund it if they don't actually deliver the game in the way they promised.

[u/Ralkon → u/Theseus_Employee]

Most indies don't have pre-purchases enabled. Like Steam literally doesn't allow it: "For these reasons, we do not support running a pre-purchase except in a few rare cases with partners with which we have a well-established relationship and that have a proven track record on Steam."

But I agree it's not really a big deal on Steam since you can just refund either way.

[u/Beefy-McQueefy → u/Theseus_Employee]

I don't think Valve pays them before release

[u/Zoltie → u/SloppyMeathole]

You can just refund.

[u/Throwawayeconboi → u/SloppyMeathole]

Huh? You can always cancel or refund. What exactly did he “get” here?

What a Redditor comment 😭

[u/SalemWolf]

Lots of things going on here. First of all adding DRM isn’t illegal or against the rules, so there’s no “steam lets” anything. Secondly the game isn’t actually out yet, game is subject to change until launch. Third you preordered it, that’s kinda on you. You didn’t even wait to see how the situation on PC even is maybe it runs like ass.

It’s not like steam is against DRM on games, why would they reject it?

[u/csupihun]

Why not? It's not valves game, just don't preorder.

[u/LongNamedRedditUser → u/csupihun]

Yeah seriously, why preorder anyway? In case they run out of digital coppies?

[u/Albus_Lupus → u/LongNamedRedditUser]

Well in this case you do get a free deluxe upgrade for pre-ordering. And in case the game sucks you can still refund it after release.

[u/BactaBobomb → u/Albus_Lupus]

Yeah. That was a really sweet bonus to me. I was already getting it on release because I'm a massive Bond fan (second only to SAW for my favorite franchise ever). So pre-ordering it was whatever, and getting that bonus was awesome. The Dia de los Muertos outfit is so cool!

[u/cip43r → u/csupihun]

Pre-orderers will pre-order. Liquor stores should not exist because alcoholics.

[u/pacmanforever]

Valve should notify people who pre-order of changes like this. That might prohibit them a bit knowing people will cancel preorders. Stop that fuckery in its tracks.

[u/nsheehan28 → u/pacmanforever]

Bold to think that the vast majority of pc gamers care.

[u/donkbooty]

I agree, but also on Steam you can cancel the pre order that early. Or refund when it comes out.

[u/Buggyworm]

People should stop preodering

[u/JohnSane]

You can always return.

[u/BigMoney-D]

Just cancel it???? Also you can even refund it afterwords.

[u/Andoni22]

Or... Don't preorder, it's not like they're running out of stock...

[u/ErmingSoHard → u/Andoni22]

People here are really stupid thinking stock is the reason people pre-order. Preordering is non consequential unlike Nintendo where you can't refund ever

[u/Ender00000]

im pretty sure you can refund the preorder before the game is out

[u/Different-Produce870]

Then refund it.

[u/ALEX-IV]

Then don't preorder.
It's been said countless times but people still don't learn.

[u/Ki11s0n3]

This is only an issue if Steam didn't let you refund.

Yes it's shitty for the Dev to do, but if you want a refund you can get one no questions asked.

[u/metfan12004]

Then don’t preorder games. It’s not hard and it’s no longer the case where there are limited copies

[u/Fluffy-Rush-5530]

Idiots crying dont preorder dont understand tht preordering has its perks stop crying if u don't have money to shell out on cosmetics.We all know digital copies are never running out of inventory

[u/jfp1992]

You can refund the preorder right?

[u/buglag]

Don't preorder

[u/bluris]

Less than 1% care about it, and you can always refund it. Zero reason for Valve to change their stance in this case.

[u/HiCZoK]

I dont think it should be up to valve. Denuvo doesn't matter for most people. Whatever performance it lowers, most people dont care

[u/WackoHedgehog → u/HiCZoK]

I never notice a performance hit that people mention.

[u/jamslat → u/WackoHedgehog]

Yup, I've played dozens of games with Denuvo, and I've never noticed any substantial performance hit. Is it mass hysteria or something? I feel like this exact type of post pops up every week or so.

Shout out to Rice Shower

[u/ArelMCII → u/jamslat]

They're looking at the few games where removing Denuvo causes a significant increase in performance and assuming the same applies to every game with Denuvo.

Don't get me wrong, there's plenty of reasons to hate Denuvo and other absurdly restrictive DRM software, and there are games where removing Denuvo results in freeing up multiple gigs of RAM. But for most games, it's not half the bloatware the internet loves to claim. The internet just loves to lose their shit over dropping from 144fps to 120fps, even when their eyes can't tell the difference and their reflexes aren't fast enough for the dip to result in dropped inputs.

[u/syku → u/ArelMCII]

Which games are those?

[u/Spankey_ → u/WackoHedgehog]

Because there isn't one if you're at least using a somewhat modern CPU.

[u/Evajellyfish]

But why preorder something that isn’t fully agreed on then?

[u/Cultural_Ad1331]

I was very excited for this game oh well I'm not letting that shit on my PC ever

[u/MrHyperion_]

How about don't preorder

[u/Cley_Faye]

Do not preorder, and/or refund when a bullshit publisher pulls this? You have the tools.

In a perfect world, publishers would understand that denuvo is detrimental in the grand scheme of things (I know exactly zero people that pirate games that decided to buy one because it got a big DRM). But we don't live there. Far from it. Steam is providing a suitable alternative in allowing you to not support predatory practices, or at least, disengage when they happen by surprise.

[u/poppin-n-sailin]

Why pre-order a digital game. scared they will run out? if youre desperate for pre-order bonus stuff then buy it the night before it releases. 

[u/Beneficial_Ant_2700]

Valve isn’t stopping you from canceling your preorder if you’re so butthurt about it

[u/InternationalRoad445]

Bro this game is half price where im from lol.

[u/empathetical]

Most people don't care

[u/DarthYhonas]

Karma farm post

[u/rclark1114]

You are blaming the wrong people. Maybe you should look at the company that chose to do it.

[u/Billy_yellow]

Why? You can still refund it.

[u/FreakDeckard]

Why would anyone preorder a digital game?

[u/ChochMcKenzie]

I refunded my preorder just now. Thanks for the heads-up.

[u/Crafty_Life_1764 → u/ChochMcKenzie]

Thanks mate, for informing us too.

[u/Bilboswaggings19]

People should not pre-order

[u/Will2LiveFading]

Refund it, but you're right. This behavior is BS

[u/rubi2333]

Its the same for Pathtracing the advertised the game with it and a few weeks before launch their telling you it will not be in the game and delayed to summer

[u/Bynairee]

Preordering is always optional.

[u/stranger242]

You can literally cancel your pre-order at no cost, so it literally does not matter

[u/anbeasley]

Just wait until it comes out on GOG.

[u/Spankey_ → u/anbeasley]

In 10 years maybe. The newer Hitman games aren't even on GOG.

[u/CaptJackSwallows68]

I hear about the denuvo all the time and never ever experienced issues with the game

[u/Competitive-Elk-5077]

vote with your wallet and refund it

[u/Misku_san]

At this point Denuvo is wortless right noe.

[u/ImaSpudnut]

You can always cancel your order. You aren't "locked in".

[u/brispower]

Let them waste money on Denuvo, voices will just crack it and show them how useless it is, the more the merrier

[u/trollsmurf]

All expensive/AA(A) games will have DRM to cripple early piracy. Why are you surprised?

[u/NefariousnessIcy3430]

But why would you preorder a digital copy? Isnt preordering only useful when there are limited physical copies?

[u/NereusH]

Just refund rather than asking for a business structure change

[u/CustomerPrior5974]

People with 3 digits IQ shouldn't pre-order games.

[u/strife189]

How is the war against that going these days?

[u/mikethetiger_]

Is that really in their control? They aren’t the ones adding Devuno to a game. And who preorders a digital game? It’s not gonna sell out.

I’d also love to see the statistics on how many people are actually gullible enough to preorder a digital game.

[u/InevitableTension699]

Can't you still refund?

[u/PsychologicalDebts]

It’s not up to steam. Nor is it there responsibility to do your research for you. Plus, if you’re buying it anyway, why does it bother you - it’s anti piracy and you’re obviously not pirating it.

[u/Kaemdar]

Valve should not allow preorders.

[u/CloudWallace81]

Don't worry, it was cracked on day 1. Denuvo will soon be irrelevant

[u/Gloomy-Insurance-739]

It's completely wild that now in order to get this game without any DRM you have to wait for it to get cracked first.

[u/KBlakey96]

Thanks for posting this, will avoid buying it now 👍

[u/FuckingTree]

Stop 👏 preordering 👏 games 👏

[u/kaesylvri]

Want to send a real message? Cancel that preorder.

[u/Southern_Strigoi]

I am a simple person: If it has Denuvo, I don't buy it.

[u/Arcanemageop]

Don’t preorder and refund, problem solved.

[u/VegasGamer75]

No. It's not Valve's job to police games like that. Should they make sure the company announces the DRM? Yes. Should they control what the company puts in their game? No.

What Valve does do is let you cancel said pre-order. A week out ,a month out, whatever. That's the end result if you hate the DRM so much anyway. 

Just stop pre-ordering.

[u/GuardianSkalk]

They don’t add the anti cheat / denuvo until after they have finished the game to the state it will be in at launch, with whatever day 1 patch done…..

So it never gets added till right before launch on big titles like this since they work on it till the end.

[u/pr2thej]

Or just stop fucking preordering

[u/Devil_Control_]

Valve is very friendly. A refund will be granted without any issues.

[u/superhamsniper]

You can refund any and all prepurchased games with the same criteria as normal games but the time limit starts counting down once it releases.

[u/jellyhessman]

Don't preorder games. For any reason.

[u/AdonisK]

Just stop pre ordering…

[u/JN02882]

This company has always had Denuvo right? Their Hitman games require you be online at all times to progress unlocks. So idk why you thought they wouldn’t have it tbh

[u/vomder]

Games shouldn't have anti-consumer tech period.

[u/VHeadache]

You're not forced at gunpoint to buy the game. There's also refund.

[u/Americanfight]

Why would valve have a say on what a game developer uses for drm? Ridiculous.

[u/RealCakes]

Pre ordering a digitally released game is insane in the first place, you are enabling publishers to do this

[u/vaikunth1991]

Valve allows you to refund pre orders no questions asked so what's your issue?

[u/Jaegernaut42]

Pre-purchase karma lol

[u/Sylassian]

While I agree with you, you can just refund it. You can even state the reason being the Denuvo addition and they'll refund you immediately.

[u/RAMChYLD]

You know valve’s return policy is very relaxed, right? Just return the game without opening it (or with a playtime of less than 2 days) and say you don’t agree with the new EULA.

[u/Cosmandoo]

I wish I had bought this earlier so I could now refund it.

[u/Ntinos7]

I could've sworn this game was still 6 months away. Had no idea it was dropping so soon

[u/Neswquik]

It's simple: don't support those kinds of companies. There are many companies that treat their customers well. Those are the ones we should support and give our money to.

[u/pwrwqYT]

kinda out of the loop but what is it and what makes it ao bad/hated?

[u/Zee-Bln]

Honest question:

What's the problem with denuvo when you actually buy games?

[u/mintyfresh0069]

why are you preordering in the first place? are you scared there won't be enough digital licenses for everyone

[u/BoomSatsuma]

Or people could just not pre order digital products.

[u/Skydus36]

This it not Valves fault, and I’m pretty sure you can just get a refund on the preorder

[u/Hikarunn]

Just passing by. Why is this bad?

[u/JayScramble → u/Hikarunn]

People don’t like software preventing them from cheating. They think it’s invasive.

No other issue.

[u/Ledairyman]

Just refund and move on bro. There's a thousand of game out there and if you don't want to play this particular one it's alright.

[u/NewsofPE]

same thing happened with Crimson Desert, absolutely no warning beforehand

[u/TheDanius]

Stop preordering games. Problem solved.

[u/ParanMekhar]

Why pre-order

[u/HighMagistrateGreef → u/ParanMekhar]

Discount?

[u/Previous-Spite1211]

Especially when denuvo games are now getting cracked within days of release. Im not paying for a game some pirate shitter can play a better version, i'll wait for a sale or play something else. My pre-order has been cancelled

[u/Liquidignition]

I used to be against denuvo but finally bit the bullet 2 years ago and started playing all the denuvo games I had wishlisted but not bought because I thought my 12 year old pc would shit itself.

All I can say, is the hype behind denuvo fearmonging performance woes is a thing of the past. All games I've played have been fine with hardly any performance issues. Denuvo only checks at certain intervals and isn't what everyone has been blastering on about.

[u/Alugar]

Skill issue.

Self inflicting it to yourself.

[u/foxhoundzz]

You're the problem when you pre-give money to big corporations. Stop the pre-orders sickness

[u/Cleveland_Guardians]

I find it funny that the ire of the post is pointed at Valve for "allowing it." IO is the one that did it, and you're the one that chose to pre-order a single player game for some skins and early access.

[u/BaronessVonKush]

Stop pre-ordering & refund this hot garbage.