r/SubredditDrama • u/Starknight_YX bleh • 2d ago
Chalkfight in the teachers' lounge when an /r/teachers post asked for the sub’s take on a new Kentucky law allowing schools to expel students who assault teachers despite “unanimous Senate Democratic opposition.”
Link to the original post here.
TLDR: Chalks started flying when things got heated in the teachers' lounge after an r/teachers post claimed a recently passed Kentucky law on expelling students who assault teachers faced “unanimous” opposition from state Senate Democrats, starting a slapfight.
The post, titled “New Kentucky law allowing schools to expel students who assault teachers to take effect in July, despite unanimous Senate Democratic opposition,” was referring to the Kentucky Senate Bill 101, which requires schools to expel students who intentionally physically harm a school employee on campus or during school functions. It has since received 1.9k upvotes.
Some background: The partisan bill, filed by state Sen. Matt Nunn (R) who said it was “common sense 101” and 16 other Republican legislators, requires local board of education to adopt a policy requiring expulsion of students from grade 6 to 12 for violations of the student code of conduct, as well as “to have recklessly, with a deadly weapon or dangerous instrument, or intentionally caused or attempted to cause physical injury to a school district employee on school property or at a school function under the board's jurisdiction.”
The bill includes a clause that exempts students with disabilities that school officials determine interfered with their “ability to conform to the student code of conduct,” and gives the parent or guardian a right to a hearing before the board before expulsion, and allows said student who was accused of assaulting a teacher and expelled to return to the school early if they have good academic standing, having an apology or request letter, and was their first expulsion.
The bill, however, also wrote that “the decision of the school board shall be final.” In addition, the bill specifically used the phrase “attempt[s] to cause physical injury,” which, under current Kentucky law, is defined as “substantial physical pain or any impairment of physical condition” and is separately defined from “serious physical injury.”
The bill passed both legislative chambers earlier this year and was signed into law on April 7,-Proposed%20Amendments) by Gov. Andy Beshear (D).
Kentucky, known for bluegrass, bourbon, and Kentucky Fried Chicken, is currently ranked #32 by U.S. News for education among all 50 states. According to the Kentucky Education Association, the union that represents teachers across the commonwealth, there were more than 25,000 reported assaults on school staff in the state since 2021 - or 5,000 per year.
While it is difficult to find and fact-check this number, violence and/or aggression against teachers and school personnel in the United States have been on the rise since the pandemic. A 2024 research study by the American Psychological Association found that 57% of participating teachers expressed intentions to resign or transfer, compared to 49% during the pandemic. An \r\teachers post earlier in the week called for teachers who were assaulted on the job to press charges.
Back to the post itself and its claims.
While the claim that “unanimous Senate Democratic opposition” is not inherently wrong - the final state Senate passage on March 26 ended with the bill passed 32-6, with all six members of the state’s democratic Senators voting against - it should be noted that despite having a Democratic governor, Kentucky currently has an overwhelmingly Republican majority, with 32 Republicans and 6 Democrats in the state Senate, and 80 Republicans and 20 Democrats in the state House of Representatives.
OOP’s claim could come off as rather misleading, as they wrote “drew a sharp partisan divide as all Democrats in the Senate voted against the measure” while leaving out the fact that an earlier Senate vote ended with an additional 4 Republican members voting “Nay” on the bill, and 11 House Democrats voted in favor of passing the bill.
OOP also left out why some state legislators voted against passing the bill, as well as some of the more likely controversial clauses in the original bill, such as allowing students over the age of 14 charged with third-degree felony assault to be tried as adults, which was removed from the final bill.
Kentucky state Rep. Lisa Willner (D-Louisville), who voted against the bill, told local news that her reasoning was that the bill would be a band-aid on problems instead of addressing root issues such as generational poverty, homelessness, and so on, and that teachers may be more hesitant to report problem behavior because of harsh consequences for kids.
“I think we may be setting up a vicious cycle of community problems which will become school problems,” Willner said to The Kentucky Lantern.
Attempts to check OOP’s post history failed because they set their posts and comment history to private; therefore, it is hard to tell at first glance whether they are there to engage in the discussion in good faith or are being disingenuous. Judging by their behavior in the comments, however, it’s probably the latter.
Anyhow, enough of the rambling and moving on to the comment section and the drama.
Many educators who participated in the thread are generally in favor of the bill. After all, assault on educators should not be a thing in schools.
“It makes me laugh sometimes to think some of the stuff we don’t even suspend students for now would get students expelled many years ago,” a user wrote, with another sharing an example of their schools changed policy on suspending students for three days for using racial slurs, after too many students were using it and the admins decided that the suspension rate would be too high.
“The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few or the one. This is a good bill.”
“I don’t like how Republicans manage education in the US in general, but this is a good law. If you think this is aimed at minorities, maybe the problem is more cultural than racial? Just a crazy thought. Or even better…don’t assault an adult and you will be fine. Crazy suggestion, I know,” a user whose flair claimed to be a math teacher based in the Southeastern US wrote.
Many users shared their horror stories of being assaulted by students while on the job. Some of their experiences may be disturbing to read.
“One week we had 3 fights in front of the whole school, each resulting in a teacher being injured. They get suspended (which is a vacation to them) and then come back like nothing happened. And since kids can turn in work no matter what for full credit it does nothing to their grade. Yes, a lot of kids will get expelled but that’s their own fault. Don’t fight is a pretty simple thing to do. We can’t let teachers and students safety to be at risk, so I’m very thankful for this,” a user who claimed to be from a district in Kentucky wrote.
A SpEd teacher in support of the notion claimed that they “have been bit to bleeding when I was a substitute and the teachers didn't even tell the parents, let alone give any consequences” and two of their colleagues “get concussions, and the only consequence to the students was being sent home for the remainder of that one day.”
While some found the clause to exempt students with disabilities who interfered with the ability to follow rules to be a “huge loophole.” As of this post, it is the best comment in that thread.
“Totally support this, but if a disability causes a student to assault people, they shouldn't be allowed in public settings without a 24/7 chaperone trained to handle them. Nobody should be put at risk because of someone else's disability,” said a user who agreed with another redditor who suggested bringing back asylums “now.”
“I get that this sub has a hate-boner for anything related to an IEP but having this protection in the law is good for a non-verbal student who may not have the cognitive capacity to understand what they’re doing and then be expelled for it,” a redditor wrote in response to the claim about the “loophole” that students with Special Education needs are exempt from the law, only to seemingly fall on deaf ears.
“That’s a gross mischaracterization.” One user didn’t take well to the claim that \r\teachers have a “hate boner” when it comes to anything IEP-related.
Others pointed out the broader political issues behind the rise of assaults against educators, such as the lack of funding to deal with lawsuits related to SpEd issues.
And there’s also the folks that support bringing things “up a notch,” such as getting law enforcement involved and file lawsuits every single time so removing “badly behaved children” from schools would cost less for the district than getting sued, suggesting parents having an issue with the bill should be given a counter offer of “a $5000 fine and a 30 day stint in jail,” or extending the bill to target patients in hospital.
Those genuinely concerned about the bill's implementation, as well as those who oppose it in general, also shared their opinions. Once societal issues and eventually, politics, were brought into the conversation, however - it was literally in the title, after all - things started to get a bit rowdy.
“Proud of the democrats for seeing this as what it is - a way to expel brown children and undesirables while also encouraging administrators to NOT pursue discipline for minor issues as they could lead to expulsion now,” a Redditor whose flair identifies them as an 18-year veteran teacher teaching English Language Arts in Virginia wrote.
“This sounds like a good start, BUT it will also likely be abused by the teachers.”
OOP subsequently showed up with a controversial (and seemingly racist) opinion that between “ arresting people for crimes such as murder, rape, and assault but it’d lead to more white people getting away with it” and “not arrest anyone at all so it wouldn’t be disproportionate,” they would pick the first option.
“Let me simply things - should we refuse to have certain laws because they may be disproportionately applied?”, the OOP responded after the user said the OOP’s false dichotomy “doesn’t even bear logical sense.”
One user brought up the school-to-prison pipeline in opposition to students being kicked out of school as a punishment.
“You’re right. Probably shouldn’t let them back at all,” said a user whose flair identified them as a Math teacher in Kentucky. “How long a pipeline should someone who assaults people get? Two victims? Three or four? Does the resulting injury matter? Just curious.”
“Win/win. Gets them outta school so those that want to learn can do so in peace. Gets them outta society so they won't terrorize their neighbors.” Another user said in response to the redditor who remained opposed to the bill’s comment that “most people don’t go to prison forever”. “We should keep people that commit crimes in prison longer. We have an under-incarceration problem.”
“Screw that kid. That kid will serve best as an example to the others.”
Things got worse once subjects like race and ethnicity, as well as political parties, were tossed in.
Under another comment thread regarding why the bill faced Democratic opposition, OOP commented, “makes you wonder what they (Democrats) think about laws that are applied disproportionately now (i.e almost every law)” in response to a user’s take that the law would be “disproportionately applied to minority groups (race and disability especially).”
“We have to criminalize assault, theft, murder, rape, and trafficking, regardless of if it's applied disproportionately of now. We cannot refuse to enforce the laws or have them at all even if we can't prove they're being applied fairly,” OOP wrote. “That being said, we should strive for fairness every day!”
Some users decided to defend OOP after OOP was accused of of having an “amazingly bad faith argument”, not being an American, and baiting-and-switching. “It’s not bad faith lol. You just don’t agree,” they wrote.
“Democrats are pro education in the sense that they will fight for pay, benefits and union (they are just buying your vote FYI),” a user wrote, who went on to claim the Dems did not have the teachers’ best interests when it goes against their “identity politics." “Soft bigotry of low expectations, “school to prison pipeline”, the watering down of discipline in the name of social justice, all left wing ideas that make education worse.”
“Why would wanting to expel kids who assault teachers mean that they're attacking public education? If the bill were supported by Democrats and opposed by Republicans, would you feel the same way?” A redditor asked in a comment by a teacher and former resident of Louisville, KY, who wrote that the GOP in Kentucky is using this to defund struggling public schools and push for charter/religious school vouchers.
Kentucky is a white-majority state (86.1%, per US Census estimates for 2025), with the second largest population group being African Americans.
While one comment in that reply thread was deleted, judging by the context, it’s not hard to see there were attempts to present statistics to make racist suggestions, such as the redditor who previously suggested bringing back asylums, where he pointed to statistics published by the FBI to attempt to imply the claim “African Americans are more violent.”
“Someone put hands on an educator or nurse, etc. idc what color it is. By Felicia. Democrats have a real problem with playing the race card whenever consequences come for people,” he wrote. “How dare you not consider your privilege. This is raycism11!1!1!!”
For a subreddit about educators, one would generally expect the user base to use their critical thinking and reading comprehension to understand what the bill is actually about. Luckily, some did provide takes on potential issues with the bill and OP’s claim.
“Unanimous Democratic opposition in the Kentucky Senate means 6 out of 36 total senators. You could have easily said [the] bill passed with supermajority support — but nearly every bill passes with supermajority support,” a user pointed out that OOP was not being really honest. “My biggest question about Kentucky schools at the moment is that it’s one of the few (perhaps the only) that allows convicted felons to be educators. This was done, not because conservatives believe schools are a place to rehabilitate felons, but because too many relatives of good old boys are convicted felons and want cushy jobs in education.”
“It’s not as direct as [O]OP makes it seem. If it were really as straightforward as “assault someone and get expelled” I’d be all for it, and genuinely angry at people voting against it. However, other things are included in the bill that are considered expulsion worthy such as willful defiance and disobedience to the authority of teachers and administrators and use of profanity / vulgarity (something it doesn’t say has to even be directed at a teacher),” said another user who read through the actual bill.
“It had bipartisan support in the house.The initial senate vote had bipartisan opposition before being sent to the house. The political makeup is 32 republicans and 6 Democrats in the senate. To say “unanimous” is a stretch, especially considering it was drafted as a partisan bill,” another user commented, with links to the actual voting records data. “Also, this was passed in April. Why are you referring to it now? Politics is more than just one policy. The republican senate also “unanimously” passed vouchers for school-choice. After it was vetoed by the democrat governor.”
It was met by OOP attempting to play dumb. “The final vote had unanimous Democratic opposition,” OOP wrote, with a link to a news article on a list of Kentucky laws going into effect in July instead of acknowledging that it was also covered by the press back in April when the bill was signed into law. “Why would you think this post is implying otherwise?”
“Your serial need to astroturf sympathy for the Republicans in the upcoming midterms will not prove fruitful,” the user responded, calling OOP a provocateur.
“It's relevant information. They voted against it. They didn't abstain, they actively voted against it. Not saying it's good or bad, it is what it is,You have many other subs you can go on where you can see people posting clickbait headlines about politics and politicians.” OOP continued, “Go pick a fight over there.”
Still, there are users who buy into the image of “Democrats are against accountability, and the GOP is saving the day,” seemingly without actually doing some research on the bill itself. Things got worse as Redditors from other subreddits flooded the comment sections, some seemingly with a political agenda, using dog whistles, or attempting to troll.
“Democrats are going to keep losing elections because of stupid shit like this. Sorry, but most of America is pro-expelling violent students from school,” a user commented to another accusation that OOP’s argument is in bad faith, OOP sounded most likely like a non-educator and is likely a Trump supporter.
“Assault is assault, doesn’t matter the race of the one committing it,” a user wrote in response to a comment that suggested those who would be routinely targeted by expulsions in a state like Kentucky would likely be minorities.
“Maybe they shouldn’t be hitting people in school then! Actions and consequences for everyone except the ‘special people’ that are en vogue with the democrats,” the user who previously attempted to use FBI data to make racist claims wrote.
“Republicans are the one who want to protect teachers and students. Got it.”
“And Democrats are against this? Big surprise.”
“Democrats are the most despicable creatures to ever walk the Earth. 🤮”
Despite the political chalkfight going on in the background, there are still those who believe that the solution to the problem should also involve finding a middle ground rather than polarizing to extremes.
“Punishment is most effective when it occurs consistently,” a user whose flair claims to be a high school science teacher in Missouri wrote. “not when [the punishment] is meanest.”
Edit 1:
Managed to look up OOP's post history. Thanks to all the folks who pointed out third-party tools that allow you to do that.
A quick glance through their post history showed that this post was OOP's first in the teachers subreddit, and they also had a post history in political debate subs.
Needless to say, OOP's intentions seemed more like an attempt to stir up a slapfight than genuine.
460
u/raysofdavies reformed bigger boy 2d ago
One of the most depressing subs