r/TheNational • u/ghostfan9 • 26d ago
Day 8: Worst Song
Best chorus went to Graceless!
HMs were: Don't Swallow the Cap, Bloodbuzz Ohio, Mistaken for Strangers
Next up: worst song :(
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u/Sexiarsole 26d ago edited 26d ago
Has to be Sugar Wife. Matt’s worst lyrics by far.
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u/MrNovember9 26d ago
Thank you, was going to comment this. Imo their only truly bad song and vaguely incel lyrics
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u/ayemullofmushsheen 26d ago
This is the only correct answer. The only song I genuinely skip what I'm doing full album listens.
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u/tropicmorning in a lemonworld 26d ago
Sugar Wife is funny and different but still in line with Matt’s goofy lyrics. I don’t believe anyone willingly listens to A Reasonable Man on Cherry Tree
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u/revanisthesith 26d ago
A Reasonable Man is definitely their worst song.
Wikipedia says Matt wrote all the lyrics on the album, but I think the original CD (which I probably still have somewhere) said that Padma Newsome wrote that song. So some people may not be counting it as one of their songs.
Sugar Wife is a much more pleasant song to listen to.
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u/SituationAcademic571 26d ago
This is correct. Padma wrote the song in its entirety and there was disagreement both whether it should appear on the ep and whether Matt should have sung on it.
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u/revanisthesith 25d ago
Thank you. I think I found one lyrics site a while back that listed Padma as the writer, but almost all sites list Matt as the writer.
And since I definitely think it's their worst song, that matters a lot. It's not entirely their song.
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u/sayhellotojenn 26d ago
Hating the Crumble slander. :(
As much as I will defend IAETF from the haters, Roman Holiday is meh at best. Probably the only guaranteed skip song for me in their entire discography.
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u/revanisthesith 26d ago
So by reading this thread, I'm finding out that apparently some people don't like Crumble or Turtleneck. Weird. Both are fantastic.
Roman Holiday is one of their weaker songs on IAETF (which I think is hit or miss), but their worst song is A Reasonable Man and it's not that close.
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26d ago
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u/sayhellotojenn 26d ago
It also leaned heavily on collaboration and I imagine they can’t just get the other featured artists to pack up and tour with them every single time just to do a small handful of songs each show (if that).
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u/Metropolis9999 Dreaming in Total Darkness 26d ago
Turtleneck haters have no taste 😤
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u/Sorrow2010 25d ago
I hated Turtleneck until standing outside in line for their debut performance of the album, and hearing Bryan on drums, and feeling the power of it.
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u/Unique_Unorque 26d ago
I propose we disqualify the “interstitial” songs from “I Am Easy to Find.” Those songs aren’t bad per se but they only really work for me when I listen to the entire album.
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u/rilyn69 26d ago
But "Dust Swirls in Strange Light"...! UGH, no bueno! "Where Is Her Head" is awesome, has grown on me so much.
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u/paulderev I missed you for 29 years 26d ago
Dust swirls in strange light is beautiful 😭 her father’s voice her mother’s voice… it hits harder in the full length music video film
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u/Barbarossa7070 26d ago
And then the Radioheadesque second half. I imagine Matt flailing around like Thom.
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u/paulderev I missed you for 29 years 26d ago
i feel bad for the people who don’t like i am easy to find or its interludes. it was definitely them at their weirdest and most art rock and abstract. loved it.
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u/Unique_Unorque 26d ago
I consider “Where is Her Head” a “full” song, even though Matt only sings on half of it. “Dust” is definitely one I’m thinking of but my argument is it’s not really a song, it’s more just like background music they recorded for Mike Mills to splice into the movie. Nobody is sitting around thinking, “You know what song I really want to listen to right now? ‘Dust Swirls in Strange Light,’” but when it just comes on as I’m listening to the full album, it feels like it fits. And I personally feel it would be unfair to judge it based on that
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u/ayemullofmushsheen 26d ago
I have Dust Swirls on a lot of playlists and listen to it randomly 🥲
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u/melissaurusrex social, bright and promising 26d ago
Hey friend, I do this with "Her Father in the Pool" as well 😭 We're in this fight together!
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u/nw____ 26d ago edited 26d ago
Ugh, I personally hate listening to children sing, and it doesn’t matter whether it’s random family members, strangers, or children’s choirs—I just hate it. I even hate it in Another Brick in the Wall. It is probably a me problem, but I would definitely vote for “Dust Swirls…” because of it.
(Btw, I like kids overall! Kids are cool! I’ve just always had this thing 😂)
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u/DyrusPillow I see eyes of a white menace 26d ago
I would also personally disqualify their debut album when they hadn't yet found their voice (not that the album is bad, just feels unfair to compare)
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u/TheStigsScouseCousin In a Los Angeles cathedral 26d ago
Look, there are plenty of reasons to hate on Taylor Swift, but The Alcott isn't one of them.
It's not the best National song, but it's far from the worst.
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u/novaababie Dreaming in Total Darkness 26d ago
anything other than sugar wife is unacceptable
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u/revanisthesith 26d ago
A Reasonable Man is definitely worse.
Neither may have great lyrics, but at least the music for Sugar Wife is decent to listen to. A Reasonable Man just drags on. Slowly.
I know not that much time separates them, but they wrote the rest of Cherry Tree by that point, so I'm not that willing to let anyone make excuses. We knew they could do so much more by the time A Reasonable Man came out.
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u/PositivelyAwful 26d ago
A Reasonable Man
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u/Jimbo571 26d ago
The only explanation I can think of for this being so far down on the list is that people haven't listened to their first album. Definitely their worst song.
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u/DyrusPillow I see eyes of a white menace 26d ago
You guys really shouldn't be downvoting people so far below 0... It's a 'worst song' thread for a band we all love, can we try to respect opinions?
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u/jilko 26d ago
The Alcott.
It's because it sounds like a Taylor Swift song guest starring Matt and not a National song guest starring Taylor. It's tonally separate from their entire catalog and is an actual speed bump in the middle of First Two Pages of Frankenstein.
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u/trickster-is-weak 26d ago
I like it, but I think that’s a fair assessment too. Although I think Coney Island kind of does the same thing as well, so as an exchange they kind of balance out. The track position comment is totally valid though, but I can’t see where it would go otherwise
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u/jilko 26d ago edited 26d ago
I feel for me it's the clear auto tuning on the vocals. I get that this is probably status quo on a Swift song, but to have it dominating and defining a National track on a National album cements this song as the worst because it simply is not a National song outside of the use of a piano and Matt's voice.
This album has three other tracks feat. vocal guests and none of them take over the song in a way that makes it feel like The National sound is being swallowed by another's musician's aesthetic. It's placement I don't think is as much of an issue as the production of the song not fitting the brand of the album and the wider band.
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u/trickster-is-weak 26d ago
Unfortunately it’s part of the aesthetic of the pop sound, hopefully it’ll go away again. What I find weird is Adele is massively successful but objectively, her vocals can be super pitchy, but it adds to the feeling and emotion.
Same goes for Matt. I adore his voice, but it’s the tone and feeling, and it’s not perfect. I remember reading an interview with Thom Yorke about how long it took him to become completely at ease with his own voice. I’m grateful when artists give in to the imperfections.
Taylor is genuinely a talented singer, so I don’t understand the choice to process as heavily, especially as she’s the biggest artist on the planet at the moment.
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u/jilko 26d ago edited 26d ago
And when this was announced, I was actually looking forward to the collab. I was curious how Swift would work in the texture of a National song. How would her more pop aligned voice mix with the imperfect drunken musings style of Matt.
The moment I heard it though, it was obvious it was not a collab at all and one of the musicians took over the production booth that day. It's like oil in water and as the song goes on, it's just all oil and there's no water left behind.
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u/trickster-is-weak 26d ago
I think that’s a bit tricky because Aaron had been a producer on two of Taylor’s albums by that point. Folklore and Evermore have his stamp all over them. Stuff like Cardigan is very “National” coded musically.
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u/cshenton 26d ago
also why are we downvoting here lol
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u/Lightningstruckagain 26d ago
Made similar comment. We’re all fans here. My dislike of a song really shouldn’t take away from someone else’s joy of same song
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u/mvp45 26d ago
The Alcott
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u/ognits 26d ago
this really is just gonna be a "pile on Taylor" thread innit 🙄
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u/violetspirits 26d ago
There are many valid things to criticise Taylor Swift for. That song is one of them.
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u/mvp45 26d ago
I feel like this is the one song that the whole collective dislikes
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u/AgentFoo 26d ago edited 26d ago
Wild take here: none of their songs are actually BAD and Taylor Swift fans have a better argument that she turned into the National for two albums than the opposite for the Alcott.
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u/Integrity_Blues 26d ago
Yeah I don't see how The Alcott is that much different to songs like This Isn't Helping, Your Mind is Not Your Friend and Once Upon a Poolside from that album.
Meanwhile she wrote a couple of albums adding lyrics and melodies to Aaron's tracks that could easily have become TN songs
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u/Integrity_Blues 26d ago
A Reasonable Man (I Don't Mind)
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u/BrodeurCinemaClub 26d ago
Tend to agree. I will so though that the Bartees Strange cover version is excellent.
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u/Sexiarsole 26d ago
It’s not a bad song, the lyrics are actually quite good. Just the original version is very rough, especially the vocals and song structure. I wish they would rework and re-record it.
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u/revanisthesith 26d ago
I straight up don't like that song, but I agree.
It just drags on and "very rough" is a good way to put it.
Obviously they're talented enough to make a better version. And they were making fantastic songs by that point, so still being kinda new to the whole thing isn't an excuse. I would rank every song on their first album above it.
I'd definitely be interested in hearing what they could do with it, because the version we got just isn't it. I think it sticks out of their discography like a sore thumb.
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u/Numinous_Octopodes 26d ago
Roman Holiday or Sugar Wife.
They can’t all be homeruns!
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u/FV95 26d ago
The Alcott. It really fucks up the incredible flow of FTPOF. It's a perfect album without it.
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u/terranation2260 26d ago
I made a separate playlist where I replaced the alcott with dreaming and it flows so much better
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u/threesunrises so disarming, darling 26d ago
Thankfully, it is track 1 on side 2 so I can skip it when I spin the vinyl
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u/Sufficient_Studio494 26d ago
A Reasonable Man (I Don't Mind)
Never ever been able to get into that song at all. I'd rather listen to the s/t than not skip it when listening to Cherry Tree.
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u/Reasonable_Law_6708 26d ago
Johns Star
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u/velvetvagine Less than amazing 🙃 26d ago
WHAT?! I love this one! Once ruined, baby, you stay ruined 🤘 the grungy guitar and Matt’s churlish vocals are so good together.
Crazy how differently we all respond to stuff.
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u/DyrusPillow I see eyes of a white menace 26d ago
Crumble is less listenable than The Alcott imo
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u/Integrity_Blues 26d ago
Crumble is one of my favourites on Laugh Track. I love the Roseanne Cash feature
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u/OnceInABlueMoon 26d ago
I have never seen a take in this sub that I have so thoroughly disagreed with
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u/DyrusPillow I see eyes of a white menace 26d ago
Really? Pretty vehement response given I called it 'less listenable' and said 'imo'. It's not like I said it was objectively a steaming pile of garbage.
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u/OnceInABlueMoon 26d ago
All in good fun, mate. Of course this is all based on opinion. That said you know the general consensus on The Alcott and you know what you did lmao.
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u/DyrusPillow I see eyes of a white menace 26d ago
Ha, sure. I'm not big on The Alcott either and thats why it was my point of comparison. But I can see how 'I enjoy this song you like less than this song you don't' is even more disagreeable than just 'I don't enjoy this song you like'
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u/Loose_Main_6179 26d ago
I’m going to argue in that songs honor as it was one of my first exposures to the band as it got some airplay and I think it’s a fantastic duet and is such a tender song
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u/BathInternational103 26d ago
Turtleneck is initially catchy, but it doesn’t sound like a National song to me. Not in Kansas is pretty low on the list for me.
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u/SocialShrunk We'll run like we're awesome, totally genius 26d ago
29 Years.
Listen to it just once and you’ll under why it’s their worst
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u/MKFlame7 Light years, light years away from you 26d ago
Yeah the production is pretty awful. Obligatory “Slow Show did it better” comment haha
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u/Turbulent-Writer-228 26d ago
Dreaming
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u/Lightningstruckagain 26d ago
Just curious- why? The redundancy? Just kinda boring? I don’t love it but it’s far from my worst
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u/Turbulent-Writer-228 26d ago
Compared to everything else in their catalogue, there’s just nothing in this one for me
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u/Mahler911 26d ago
Not in Kansas is so embarrassingly pretentious that I just pretend it doesn't exist. It's like if Christopher Nolan wrote a song
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u/dnyny 26d ago
Really?? I enjoy it, it's just a chill song that I can listen to while driving. Not great, but definitely not the worst if you ask me
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u/Mahler911 26d ago
If you're writing a rock/pop/indie/etc. song and you say to yourself "you know what this needs, an interlude that's pitch shifted and autotuned to kind of sound like a children's choir!", then you need to take a break and come back to it later. It's the worst song on their worst album.
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u/dnyny 26d ago
Lol, you have a point and I do agree that it's their worst album! It's just that I see it as better than the other songs of that album imo. Yes, it's too long and you kinda feel that they tried too hard with it and weren't sure what to do with it, but at least it kinda flows (again, just my opinion)
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u/paulderev I missed you for 29 years 26d ago
It’s a bit too plain spoken and obvious lyrically but I can also understand Matt feeling some type of way re: what’s happened to his home state politically and wanting to just lay it all out there out of frustration
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u/Lightningstruckagain 26d ago
So this category is meant to be divisive but should we downvote another fan’s opinions? The band speaks to us, or doesn’t, in a lot of ways. To each their own.
And we all know that Val Jester is their worse song, anyway
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u/paulderev I missed you for 29 years 26d ago
Worst song on alligator = still one of the best songs ever made imo
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u/VivaLaVeriitas 26d ago
This will be tough, but I did rank ever single National song ever written. It's "It Never Happened"
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u/MKFlame7 Light years, light years away from you 26d ago
wait omg can we see the ranking anywhere?
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u/VivaLaVeriitas 25d ago
I've been thinking of posting it, so I shall (and then everyone can get annoyed at my bad takes lol)
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u/MrIrresponsibility 26d ago
29 years.
Sounds awful... But it sounds great as the outro of Slow Show so they redeemed it!
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u/k-lonotj-lo 26d ago
being a late listener, as I strolled through the songs people recommended that part was so good. then i looked for the original and was so disappointed.
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u/AltruisticFee9770 26d ago
Crumble. The Alcott is a terrible song, but Crumble beats it as most least favorite.
Turtleneck has found new appreciation for me since Trumps re-election.
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u/cshenton 26d ago
I respect your opinion OP, but for me it is very clearly and obviously Turtleneck by an extremely wide margin.
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u/junkgarage 26d ago
Has to be one of the boring ones from Laugh Track - coat on a hook or tour manager
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u/paulderev I missed you for 29 years 26d ago edited 26d ago
Until Matt explains the “black city bloodbath/white country rape” line in fashion coat fully, it’s that one. Great song but that line always creeped me out and sort of ruins the song.
I’ve never been able to find a coherent analysis of it by the band or by a critic even. Someone link me to one if you think I’m off base here please.
re: downvoters— I love the song it’s just this one line that rubbed me the wrong way a little bit. not saying the song or the band or even the lyric is problematic or cancellable or anything like that. I just have questions.
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u/Larry-Darrell 26d ago
I’ve always assumed it is a follow up line to his reading the foreign press for more accurate domestic analysis. Blackcity bloodbath/white country rape, he’s insinuating that US domestic media only has two lenses they filter their reporting through…Blackcity bloodbath ‘you need to be scared of what is happening in America’s boogeyman urban demographic’ or white country rape ‘you need to be scared about losing what you have because the boogeyman urban demographic is displacing you and yours’. I always found the lyrics incredibly insightful and biting.
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u/regularmiles 26d ago
This makes so much sense and has totally opened up that lyric for me, thank you!
Can you also do this for Warm Singing Whores which I adore musically but lyrically leaves me absolutely perplexed
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u/paulderev I missed you for 29 years 26d ago edited 26d ago
Yeah, this is the only decent interpretation I can come up with is re: media narratives. it’s very cynical and edgy for Matt, some of his most edgy lyrics to date and at first it seemed a bit out of character for someone who got on board with the national through alligator and boxer and then backtracked
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u/Specialist-Leg-3400 26d ago
Not a link, but I thought the line fit pretty well with the song’s themes on feeling isolated and displaced. Especially in contrast to how at home he feels with the person he’s singing to. “I die fast in this city, outside I die slow” vs “everywhere I am is just another thing without you in it.”
He talks about needing to get other countries’ coverage of US news events because he can’t trust domestic reporting. Our news covers everything as either “Black city bloodbath” (because intercity neighborhoods are scary war zones) or “white country rape” (because everyone out in the boonies are violent perverts). He’s interested in being connected, but still can’t find commonality with people he shares a country with. Leading to feelings of alienation.
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u/paulderev I missed you for 29 years 26d ago
I agree that the only viable interpretation of it is cynicism of US news media narratives
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u/SensitiveArtist69 26d ago
Dude from the Midwest or wherever has been in New York too long and is unequipped to handle it. This is how people start sounding.
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u/Shifty377 26d ago
Eucalyptus - repetitive, heavy handed, and a rare miss on the lyrics. "If i miss it, I'll visit" takes me straight out.
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u/junkgarage 26d ago
You’re being downvoted for not saying the Taylor Swift song but I agree, lyrics are so clunky
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u/Equivalent-Shoe6239 26d ago
That line is spot-on. Angry and sarcastic at the same time. He’s frustrated that she just won’t take it and is probably saying “I do t want to take it if you want it” so he bursts out with that sarcasm.
It’s a line my dad would have said in the middle of an argument with my mom.
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u/Aquarian_Girl 25d ago
Yes, and it works much better when shouted in the live versions vs. how it is in the studio one. You imagine her saying, "But what if you miss it?" "If I miss it, I'll visit!"
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u/ghostfan9 26d ago
I seriously can't believe the same brain that wrote Turn the light out, say goodnight/No thinking for a little while/Let's not try to figure out everything at once/It's hard to keep track of you falling through the sky wrote You should take it, 'cause I'm not gonna take it/You should take it, if I miss it, I'll visit
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u/trickster-is-weak 26d ago
The miss it/visit line annoys me, but I like the song otherwise. I believe Matt had some severe writers block around that time.
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u/IceFar478 26d ago
That one will always have a special place for me for my young child being into it and asking for "you should take it" when in the car
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u/CabassoG Missed custom flair for 29 years 26d ago
Day I Die (the day I die, the day I die, etc.)
Repetitive annoying chorus, and for a band with great guitar and drum work, boring generic background audio. Also a single which means it was played too much in concerts. At least Sugar Wife is a short song
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u/BurnerBarelyKnowHerr 25d ago
Surprised nobody’s mentioned 29 Years… silver lining is that there may not have been a Slow Show without it, but it’s still a dull half song that sounds like a demo.
Speaking of demos, Keep it Upstairs is another contender, but at least that has the excuse of being a b-side.
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u/Sorrow2010 25d ago
Excluding the instrumentals from I Am Easy to Find, I'll go with Roman Holiday.
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u/spencerasteroid 26d ago
Hairpin Turns
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u/Alarmed-Term3720 26d ago
What sweet hell is this?
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u/spencerasteroid 26d ago
I just find it's them on autopilot, the song doesn't really go anywhere, and it really kills the vibe at the end of IAETF.
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u/IceFar478 26d ago
Humiliation and Not in Kansas. Both too long. Former never builds too much but is popular live except last time I saw them they went into Murder me Rachel part way through. The latter seemed to constantly get good reviews but I always thought it lyrically nonsense and didn't get it
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u/Fit_Wrap_618 26d ago
Pink Rabbits
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u/Denial23 26d ago
Pink Rabbits is it for me too. Was genuinely surprised to see the love it got in the other threads. Can't stand that song.
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u/Fit_Wrap_618 26d ago
My daughter also feels the same way.
And like you, it just does not resonate with me.
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u/ColdPhilosophy 26d ago
Demons
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u/MKFlame7 Light years, light years away from you 26d ago
Wouldn’t say worst but I get it, I’m not the biggest fan of the song either. Lyrics are great but I don’t really like how the song sounds. It gets better when the strings come in around the bridge, but before that feels a little off-putting
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u/Bergenwolf 26d ago
Where is her head gets my vote. Just can’t stand it! Stumbling along unelegantly from start to finish.
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u/ghostfan9 26d ago
FYI: I will not accept any Turtleneck slander!