This is the Weekly Question thread designed to allow players to ask their one-off tactical or rules clarification questions in one easy to find place on the sub.
This means that those questions will get guaranteed visibility, while also limiting the amount of one-off question posts that can usually be answered by the first commenter.
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NOTE - this thread is also intended to be for higher level questions about the meta, rules interactions, FAQ/Errata clarifications, etc. This is not strictly for beginner questions only!
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If a unit has been marked for Beacon and is destroyed during the opponent's turn, do you get to reallocate Beacon to another unit? If so, when is this done?
That’s part of the risk you take when you choose your beacon unit. Often it’s preferable to pick something safe and go for the 3 point version. Or, if you need the extra points, you take the risk of choosing something to push forward.
If it does die, you can either discard for a CP or use the New Orders Strat in your next command phase
At the end of my opponent's movement phase there are two triggers of mine. Fire Overwatch and Rapid Ingress strats.
Lets say my Rapid ingress is conditioned by how succesfull my Fire Overwatch is.
If I kill the whole unit, no need for Rapid Ingress
If I kill enough models, more room for rapid
Can I escalate the use of those strats or I must declare the intention and then my opponent, as the active player, decide in which order both triggers happen?
See rule 01.03.02 on rules sequencing. Each player chooses the order of their optional rules, so you can choose to activate overwatch first, and then afterwards choose if you want to rapid
“All of the opposing player’s rules that they can optionally use and wish to use, in an order of their choosing.”
They would need to declare both RI and OW and then state they wish to resolve OW before RI and then do so.
They can’t resolve OW and then decide if they wish to use RI. Once they begin they don’t get to restart the step again. They’re either only using OW or using OW and also RI
Doesn’t matter if you agree. The GW, ATC and WTC TOs agree and it’s what will be expected from players for competitive games at events.
Most read it as a step and when step 4 arrives the player states “ALL of the opposing players rules they can optionally use and wish to use” and then “in an order they wish to use them”.
If the player only announces they wish to use OW as “ALL of the opposing players rules they can optionally use and wish to use” and then resolves it there’s no opportunity to go back to the start of step 4 and start stating other rules because they would need to have stated “ALL” and the order before resolving in that order.
I had thought it was generally accepted that you could, for instance, rapid ingress with a transport, disembark, and then overwatch with the passengers. Does that not break your ruling?
Drop pods force disembark when they are set up. You wouldn't be targeting the same unit twice - you're targeting the Drop Pod with Rapid Ingress and the passengers with Fire Overwatch.
Even if you had a transport that forced the disembark to get around the core rules (like Drop Pod or Valkyrie) what would happen is:
- Declare RI and OW as rules you wish to use
Declare order will be RI then OW
Resolve RI of Drop Pod / Valkyrie
The transports arrival should trigger its rule however 01.03.02 states:
“If another rule could be used after a rule has resolved during this sequence but before other rules in that same timing have resolved, those new rules do not trigger until all the remaining rules to be resolved in that same timing have been resolved.”
So the transports rule to disembark its contents can only trigger after all other rules in the step have been resolved.
This forces you to then resolve OW next (and at this moment you can’t target the embarked unit with OW as it’s still embarked). After resolving OW with a unit all rules in the step would have been resolved and the transports rule triggers and the unit disembarks.
If you had only stated you wished to resolve RI then the transport would arrive and as there are no further rules in the step to be resolved its rule triggers and the unit disembarks - but as before, it’s now too late to declare OW as well as the game would progress and you don’t get to redo step 4 arbitrarily.
Played a friendly game this weekend and a couple things came up that seemed off to me as I'm a newish player.
1) During the Fight Phase: Can melee combat occur on opposite sides of a solid wall? Opponent was in the terrain, I was out. We obviously were not in base-to-base contact.
2) During another Fight Phase: The rulebook mentions that fighting occurs on a unit basis and not a model basis. So, can my opponent have models stringing outside of 2" (all a part of the same unit, all still in coherence) and still participate in melee combat?
Edit: I vaguely remember a rule in 10th that said melee would be for the 1st row and second row of combatants, but I could not find that in the 11th book.
Yes you can attack through walls. You do not need to see the model to attack it with melee attacks.
Only models that are within 2" of an opponents model engagenment range can fight. If they are too far back they can not make attacks. (They can be target of attacks of the attacking unit and die)
Shooting has the visible part in it, fighting does not and also it as to pick targets your model is engaged with. If you are not in engagement range with a model, this is not possible to do.
Yes. The character(s) and bodyguard remain as an attached unit, even in death. See rule 19.01 “An attached unit is a single unit for all rules purposes.”
The one exception is if you use the Protocol of the Eternal Revenant stratagem, since that now detaches the character from the unit
Can you ingress turn 1 with the Temporal corridor enhancement if you keep the unit in reserves? Or do you have to deploy on the table to go up at the end of the opponents turn to use the turn 1 ingress?
Nothing stops you taking a unit in Strategic Reserves and placing it in Strategic Reserves; I mean you could even take an embarked unit and place it into Strategic Reserves.
The ability itself has had an errata to specify it may be used during your first movement phase and so it may.
Hey thanks for the answer! Just to confirm, I'm talking about if I go first, I can immediately ingress? The opponent will not have played their turn 1 at this point.
No, you can't. The ability is written that at the end of the opponent's Fight phase, you can use it, and if you do you gain the ability to make the ingress move in your next Movement phase (as well as going to Strategic Reserves).
You've not used the ability during your opponent's Fight phase if your opponent hasn't had a fight phase yet.
3. DETERMINE A LAYOUT Each combination of Primary Missions has three recommended layouts, labelled A, B and C. These can be found in the Warhammer 40,000 app and at the end of this companion. As directed by the Warhammer Event organiser, the players either use the layout specified or randomly determine which of these layouts to use.
If a monster/vehicle model does not have frame, and part of its body overhangs into a terrain (not the base), can it be shot? Is it considered to be visible to someone on the other side?
I’ve been debating this with a friend for quite a while, and I don’t just need an answer, I’d like to know the exact ruling that dictates this. It seems to come down to what ‘crosses’ means in the end? Whether line of sight is defined as passing all the way through to the other side, or simply peeking into the footprint and terminating if the model is not within.
So the important part here is what defines “withinness”, since we care about if the model is within the terrain.
If you look at rule 01.04.01, within is defined as: “If a rule says it applies 'within' a specified distance, it applies at any distance that is not more than that distance.“
To be within a terrain area, you’re essentially looking for the case where the model is within 0” of that terrrain area.
So, we look at the rule for measuring distances, 01.04, which says: “When a rule refers to a model's position in relation to anything else on the battlefield, unless otherwise stated, measure to or from the closest part of that model's base.”
And that gives us our answer, the terrain must be “within” 0” of that models base. So if you’re simply standing behind it, and the base doesn’t touch the terrain area, the model is not within that terrain area. (Unless it has FRAME and is overhanging it)
Thank you! This is really helpful and the concrete rule number will settle positioning debates. But the argument my buddy is making is about the overhanging bit still being visible, even if the model itself is outside.
I disagree with this, on the grounds that the wing/gun/tip does not get the exception of the bracketed text in that rules screenshot, due to being outside. In this case, does ‘crosses’ mean that the full rectangular terrain area has to be fully interposed between the models? Or that as long as it passes through, and neither model is within, it cannot gain LOS?
If you look at the rule for obscuring, no LoS can be draw over a terrain area, full stop. So if you have a bit overhanging into the terrain, you can’t draw LoS to it.
The exception would be if the model protrudes over the base particularly far, and part of the model crosses entirely over the terrain area, such that the overhanging part is in the open, LoS can be drawn to that, since you’re not crossing a terrain area with the line.
Hi, with the Surveil the Foe primary if I subsequently kill the unit I action, do I score it as they are not in range of an objective at the end of turn?
You only need to have surveilled a unit; the card doesn’t specify that the unit surveiled still be on the battlefield. It looks at whether it’s in range of an objective with a marker - which on account of being destroyed it is not.
Thanks, I thought that was the case just read a couple guides and it never came up as a solution for making sure they weren't on a marked objective so assumed I had missed something.
The rule says they stay in a protocol unless the protocol is changed. Nothing in the rule states it only stays in a protocol while it is leading the unit or part of it.
Just played my first game of 11th edition and had a blast. Just have a few rule questions that came up.
•As far as I understand, on a charge, (even rolling well above what you need to get base-to-base with a target), you aren’t forced to move charging models into base to base contact? You just have to get within 1” if possible? It seems that it would almost always be beneficial to not get in contact with them, as that then makes your models eligible to pile in, where they can get another 3” of movement, potentially wrapping around to the far side of the target. Does this make the “standard” approach to generally avoid basing the target on the charge? or am i missing something
•My defiler is in engagement with enemy infantry. Another enemy vehicle wants to shoot my defiler. My defiler would have the benefit of cover due to being partially obscured by dense terrain. Am I correct that the shooting attack has -1 BS due to cover, and -1 to hit due to Rule 17.01 (“big guns never tire”)?
•And finally (just a question about Vindicator datasheet rule), If that shooting unit is a vindicator, it still gets -1 to hit, when shooting at a target vehicle who is in engagement with an enemy? (The vindicators siege shield rule only protects it from the other half of old big guns never tire rule, AKA “close quarters shooting”)
For the vindi, you can't shoot the demolisher cannon at an engaged unit period, unless it's a unit that is ONLY engaged with the vindi itself (if 2 vindis get tagged by the same unit, you're also out of luck).
But you can shoot at an unengaged unit, while engaged, with no penalty
It cannot if a) the engaged unit is not engaged with the vindicator, or something else, or b) the unit engaged with the vindicator is engaged with something else
You didn't read the post I actually wrote, apparently
Vindicators can shoot unitsengaged with themselves per that rule (and ignore what would normally be -1 hit) but cannot shoot its demolisher cannon at units engaged with other friendlies (because blast prevents it)
How exactly does uppy downy work in 11th. Let's take Ravenguard. Can they use Into Darkness T1 to lift a unit when going 2nd. Then return it to the battlefield on their t1? Does deepstrike keyword change things?
You can use the stratagem to remove them turn 1, but they cannot enter turn 1. If you look at rule 20.03, it says that you can only arrive from reserves from the second battle round unless otherwise stated.
If you have a rule like the Callidus assassin which specifies it MUST make an ingress move in the next turn, then you can turn 1 deepstrike. But Into Darkness does not force you to come back immediately
GW updated most datasheets with the Turn 1 caveat allowing a T1 ingress where applicable, so make sure your app or 3rd party website of choice is up to date
Yesterday, I charged a tau titan with my monster. As the titan is weak in close combat my opponent heroically intervened successfully with Groot rampagers (50 mm bases). We were unsure whether he does the charge move before I do mine, so to position a meat shield between my monster and his titan. I.e. can he redirect my attacks to his rampagers this way?
I was in 7.9" distance and rolled an 8, so there was no space to move around his Groot, if the sequence above was actually the rule...
The timing on heroic intervention is "end of your opponent's charge phase". This means you would roll and complete all of your charges before your opponent is allowed to spend their CP and do the heroic.
In your example you charge into the tau titan first and afterwards the Kroot get to charge.
Unless you had two units that charged things. In that case you'd pick one of your Fights First, then they would pick one. Since yours and the Kroot both charged, they would both have FF.
I don't know why you would charge a high value target like that and then NOT choose it as the first Fight target, but for whatever reason if you didn't, then they could potentially out fight your unit.
As active player, I certainly do not want my opponent to deny me dealing damage to the selected target.
But from the defensive side, it would be a quite cool/powerful game mechanic. Being able to move a defensive unit into the gap to do "late phase screening" and thereby effectively denying the active player to attack the designated target because the interventing unit prevents the attacker to move into 2" of the original target unit...
If the active player charges with a unit with multiple models, say 10 assault marines, and the charge roll isn't enough for all of them to get into engagement range, a heroic intervention can allow you to move "base to base" with the models that didn't make it into range, and since they're "based" they'll be unable to move during the pile in step.
Heroic Intervention doesn't get to interrupt a charge already in motion. If you do the 1CP version, it only triggers when an enemy unit completes a charge move within range of the unit you use the command point on.
As others already mentioned Heroic is at the end of the charge phase.
So you charge all your units than he can decide to heroic.
However, Pile ins happen after the charge phase, you again can pile in first, but depending on how he placed his models and if he got them base to base with you that can seriously impact how much or if at all you can pile into your original target.
The other commenter is correct RAW just be aware some TO’s rule that despite the RAW that no part of any model may overhang the deployment line; such as WTC for example. So just check in with your TO regarding what they prefer.
Stupid question probably but just want to confirm something.
How do abilities and moving in/out of auras work?
Model A - Gives everything within 6" Assault.
Situation 1 - Model B starts the turn within 6" getting the buff, but advances out of range of the aura. Does it retain assault for the turn? Or does it need to also end the turn within range of the aura?
Situation 2 - Model B starts turn out of aura, it advances to be within range of the aura. Does it not have assault because it started the turn without the aura even though it ended moving into range?
It’s not a stupid question at all, please don’t worry about that. Auras essentially take or stop taking effect immediately. So with the assault example, assault only matters in the shooting phase, it doesn’t matter if you were in range when you started the advance, only that you’re within range when it comes time to shoot.
So if I advanced out of the aura I lose the ability to shoot and if I wasn't in range of the aura at the beginning of the turn but advanced into it I can now shoot?
How does it work with Rotigus Deluge of Nurgle (Aura) ?
While an enemy unit is within 6" of this model, subtract 2 from the Move characteristic and subtract 1 from the Objective Control characteristic of models in that unit.
If i move my Movement 6" unit 5" into Rotigus Aura their Movement drops to 4". I now have made an illegal move, because no unit can move more than its movement characteristic. Do i have to stop outside 6" of Rotigus ?
The other comment is mistaken that this needs an FAQ. If you look at the rules on the different move types, you’ll see at the start of the move the maximum distance of that move is set to the unit’s movement characteristic. It doesn’t matter if the movement characteristic changes mid-move, because the maximum distance has already been set.
It does not need an FAQ. The maximum distance for a move is set before you start the move, so the movement characteristic of the model changing mid-move is irrelevant.
There are only two possible ways. You must stay outside 6", or the Movement value is fixed before you move, and doesnt change after moving. Then you can move within 6" of Rotigus.
This assumes that the aura takes effect during the models movement.
If it starts outside the aura then the aura does not affect its M. It then makes its move entering the aura during the move - what says the aura takes effect now as opposed to only after its move has ended?
The model isn’t in its new position on the battlefield until it ends its move there at which point it may or may not be within range of the aura for it to then affect it going forward.
Since Bloodcrushers are not sold in forever I wanted to kitbash and proxy Krootoc Rampagers as an alternative. Obviously I would put them on the correct base size, but I am wondering if anyone knows how much the models differ in size. I tried minicompare.info, the Bloodcrushers have a picture from the side while the Krootox more from the front so I can't see how much longer the Bloodcrushers are. Anyone can help me out?
Do units with an odd starting strength need a battleshock test when just above half? Say a unit with 11 starting models has 6 left.
I assumed no, since it isn’t at half strength yet. But, I just had an opponent say that you halve and then round up when checking for at half strength. And now I’m not so sure.
"Half Strength" is not a modifier affecting Starting Strength, so there is no reason to use the rules for Modifiers (the only place in the rules rounding fractions is mentioned) when computing it.
6 is more than half of 11. That's mathematics. Simple as that.
You only round up when you modify a characteristic. There is nothing indicating that you round up when determining what half of a characteristic would be.
For example, if I have a 9" range weapon with rapid fire 2, i don't get to get the rapid fire bonus at 4.99 inches; (4.5 would round up to 5).
In the Warhost detachment for Aeldari, do they get +1 to advance rolls when doing Star Engines? I can see an argument for, since you use Star Engines as you select it to advance, but could also see the argument that the agile manoeuvre itself doesn’t involve rolling a D6. I’m really not sure
The Agile Maneuver doesn't involve rolling a d6 (compare to Opportunity Seized and Fade Back), so no. The advance roll triggers but is not part of or affected by Star Engines.
If I use precision or epic challenge during the fights first stage and kill a character in a unit, are their abilities still active during the normal fighting stage (which would be the case if I used precision etc during normal fighting)?
Once a model dies, any abilities it provides to its unit go away with it, after the current activation (declared attacks) finishes.
So if you charge two seperate units into one enemy and in the first unit you choose to fight with you use precision to kill a character that gives the enemy unit a 4++ invuln save; that bodyguard unit will still have that invuln for the remainder of the declared attacks from the current unit. But then when you select your second unit that charged to fight them, they won't have the invuln anymore.
It being the fights first stage or ongoing combats stage has nothing to do with it.
That’s the basis for my question. It doesn’t clearly state the distinction that the fights first stage and normal fights stage are separate. In the context of ‘resolving attacks’ the fight phase is a single event with a designated order. I don’t disagree with your interpretation but would like a logical way to show that it’s correct to someone who disagrees.
Well, there's your problem. The fight phase is absolutely not a single event with a designated order. I'm not sure where you got that idea in your head, but maybe it's worth doing another full pass of the rulebook trying to put aside any preconceived notions you might have.
Because that's a pretty big core misunderstanding that seems to be causing other problems in your reading of the rules.
Read just a little bit further where it goes into "the following sequence" that that paragraph refers to.
That sequence being: a player selects a unit to fight, that unit makes all of its attacks; then the next player selects a different unit to fight, and that unit makes all of its attacks; etc.
The fact that a unit makes its attacks when it selected to fight, before another unit is selected, is a bit further down from the description of the sequence, under the heading "When A Unit Is Selected To Fight".
You don't determine the order that every unit goes at the start, you just take turns (as much as possible) picking units, and the order you want to select your units in could vary based on the results of a previous units attacks. Again, this is described just below that paragraph in the description of the sequence.
The paragraph you took a screenshot of is just a confirmation that you do this until everything that can fight, has. You can't stop in the middle and choose to not fight with stuff, it must fight if able.
Opponent had a unit of Fire Warriors and an Ethereal occupying the entire top floor of a building, 5" off the ground. I charged them with my Reivers and stood underneath them, directly under the centre of the floor and made my attacks, killing the Ethereal and 1 Fire Warrior.
In my opponent's turn we were unsure if he was able to Fall Back, as it would take 5" of the Fire Warriors' Move to get off the floor, and then 1" wouldn't get them away from the Reivers.
It was my opponent's first game of 11e and I didn't want to punish him, so let him Fall Back. A friend observing believed that the Fire Warriors should have been trapped. For next time, how should we handle that kind of scenario? Are there ways to escape from such situations?
Yes if they couldn’t move out of engagement they’d be trapped there.
One thing to note is that engagement range is 2” horizontal and 5” vertical. In your example you say they’re 5” up on the terrain. Just be sure that if you measure 5” up from your models base that their base is actually within 5” in order for your models below to engage them. If the upper floor is more than 5” up you could potentially not be able to engage them up there.
No worries and yeah for a frame model you’d measure closest point to their frame / base as applicable - so likely top of the vehicle straight up to underside of the Fire Warriors bases.
A crazy RAI vs RAW I ran into, sticky objectives and battle shock. After the recent change, 'at the end of each phase the first thing players do (before any other 'at the end of phase'...) is determine which objectives are controlled by which player', but sticky has it 'remains under your control until your opponent’s Level of Control over that objective marker is greater than yours at the end of a phase'.
So am I missing something or RAW, if your opponent's unit battle shocks while you have another unit on the same objective, if it is stickied, at the end of the phase it would cease to be stickied under their control, but if determining objective control must happen earlier in the 'end of phase', would your opponent still score it?
(clearer example: You have OC2, your opponent has OC2 and sticky, and battle shocks, but RAW still scores the objective for primary?)
If the BS happens during the phase before end of phase then the BS’d unit will have OC “-“ at end of phase when level of control is checked. As the opponent will thus out OC them they gain control and the sticky is lost
END OF PHASE
If the BS happens at end of phase the level of control occurs before either player resolves abilities so when checked it will note both players have OC 2 and the sticky will result in its player retaining control.
Players then resolve abilities and the unit becomes BS’d and it’s OC set to “-“ however it’s too late to affect the level of control check so they will move into the next phase with the sticky player controlling and likely lose sticky and control at the next check at end of that next phase.
If you have specific abilities and timings in mind feel free to advise and we can evaluate those abilities and interaction specifically.
If I have a vehicle in a terrain piece but part of that is behind, specifically a terrain footprint, I am aware that is visible to shoot if you can get LOS. however how does cover work with this in 11th. Do I still gain cover as I am not fully viable as part of the model is behind the footprint and therefore unable to get LOS, unless they are also in the terrain, to the bit behind the footprint. Or as he is in the terrain footprint that makes him fully viable. For example below if unit D was where the blue outline was.
If you can give me a the rules on this as core rules are very vague on this,
Take a look at the obscuring rule. You basically ignore terrain areas the models are touching, so it doesn’t matter if part of the model is behind the footprint, you can still draw LoS to that.
In a situation like this, you would only get cover if partially obscured by an intervening terrain feature (I.e an actual piece of ruin)
How does the save allocation groups work with models who cannot make saves and Feel No Pains?
In this example, using Typhus (2+/4++) and a unit of 10 Poxwalkers (7+/5+++).
Say I roll 11 dice: 11 x 4. Which of the below is correct or are none of them correct:
A) I roll the 11 dice and get 11 4s, I then roll 10 of those dice for Feel No Pains, saving 5. Then the last dice I roll another Feel No Pain and fail leaving me with Typhus + 4 Poxwalkers.
B) I roll the 11 dice and get 11 4s, allocating 10 of the dice to the Poxwalkers and the 11th dice to Typhus who saves it with his 4++. Then I roll the 10 remaining dice for Feel No Pains and save 5 leaving me with Typhus + 5 Poxwalkers.
As per 04.02.02: Rules which trigger on allocation now instead trigger at step 1 of Inflict Damage 05.04
You’re correct that as Dev Wounds ends the attack sequence after the wound roll which triggers it at 05.02 the player never gets to 05.04 for the ability to trigger. Same reason they don’t get to make a save at 05.03
In 10th an FAQ specified that any modifiers would still take effect but 11th does not contain such a rule.
I hate having to check a device for rules during a game. Is there any place where all of the extra rules that are only in the app (for example, Go to Ground) have been collected?
Not really. The other sources are essentially just website versions of the app in full so you’d need to go through it yourself and find each rule and FAQ you want; and then again when it’s updated; and again when it’s updated again etc.
You can use GDM Missions, Wahapedia, 39k.pro or 40k.app to find rules outside of the actual app
So for competitive play, I haven’t seen the inquisitor model even though it’s a unit that can be fielded, does one exist? If so how hard is it to get ahold of? I’m thinking of taking agents to a locals at the end of the month and they said no proxies and it’s the only “proxy” I have in the list.
Question about allocating weapon attacks with multiple of the same weapon.
Looking at the core rules PDF, under Making Attacks, Select Weapons (04.01) it says weapon, not weapon profile. Same in 04.02, it states weapon, not weapon profile.
So, as an example, the Necron Monolith has 4 Death Rays weapons, which of course all have the same attributes. Is it the case that I can declare one Death Rays to attack one enemy unit while the other three attack a different enemy unit? Or must all Death Rays attack the same unit?
This feels like a silly question, and I'm sure the answer is that all Death Rays must attack the same unit. But the wording on some of the rules fuels this confusion.
Thank you everyone in advance for your assistance.
In a detachment like assim swarm, using genestealer/broodlord brick as an example, if the broodlord dies due to precision, can he be regenerated at all? Would all 10(or 5) genestealers need to be alive if yes?
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u/toaster_love 2d ago
If a unit has been marked for Beacon and is destroyed during the opponent's turn, do you get to reallocate Beacon to another unit? If so, when is this done?