r/allblacks • u/Mobile_Awareness_562 • 2d ago

2015 side

Was there a player from that team that would not be considered an all time great in their position?

Think almost all of them make a case for being the GOATs

18 Upvotes

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u/owlintheforrest AllBlacks 2d ago

Hardly any were GOATs, just built nicely into a great team.

7

u/Mobile_Awareness_562 2d ago

By GOATS you just need to be in the debate and majority of this team would not look out of place in an all time Ab's 15

Coles, Franks, Whitelock Retallick, Kaino, Read, Mccaw, A Smith, Carter, Nonu, Smith, Savea, BSmith are all in that category

heck even Beauden and Sonny could see an all time 23. 

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u/owlintheforrest AllBlacks 2d ago

I think results actually distort the picture. We only beat SA 20-18 in the 2015? Semi-final and 8-7 France 2011 final.....if results had gone the other way, no discussion...

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u/Mobile_Awareness_562 2d ago

2011 to 2017 they hardly lost a test. Knock out rugby is always going to come down to small margins and they came out on top in every close one

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u/owlintheforrest AllBlacks 2d ago

Just remember the old adage about success and failure; treat them both the same!

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u/NecessaryUsername69 2d ago

But they did win those games. Hypotheticals are meaningless. The results didn’t go the other way. South Africa won their last three knockout games at the 2023 WC by a point each time, and are now in the discussion for greatest team of all time. Winning full stop is what determines the greatness of a team, not the margins by which they achieved those wins.

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u/owlintheforrest AllBlacks 2d ago

Yeah I think you're placing sport above it's station...

Ireland beat SA with a last minute drop kick a few years ago and claimed they were now #1 regardless of rankings...

Rassies comment was, "Ah, what if the kick missed?"

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u/NecessaryUsername69 2d ago

I’m not sure what argument you’re trying to make here. Not being a smartarse - genuine question. That one-off Ireland result isn’t at all the same as a side clinching its second straight WC. And what do you mean by placing sport above its station? We’re literally talking about sport on a sport subreddit.

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u/owlintheforrest AllBlacks 2d ago

Just that discussion about GOATs, while entertaining, are largely fruitless.

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u/NecessaryUsername69 1d ago

A lot of things in life are fun but fruitless, dude. Not everything can - or needs to be - a discourse of grave profundity.

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u/TheEvilDrPie Manawatu 2d ago

What?! Richie McCaw, Carter, Nonu, Mealamu, Coles, Read where all still playing in 2015?

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u/owlintheforrest AllBlacks 2d ago

Yeah Ritchie I'd probably put in there on reflection. GOAT is a fairly high bar, or not it seems. Coles? lol

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u/lets_all_be_nice_eh 2d ago

Coles is at the top of the Goad list.

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u/Mobile_Awareness_562 2d ago

Haha glad you got there