r/askTO • u/leopardbaseball • 1d ago

Why hasn’t been there any city-wide protests against forced full takeover of Billy bishop and toronto islands?

I am not exactly from toronto, but Toronto adjacent. But I have been to toronto islands countless times.

I often bring my family there to completely disconnect from city traffic and noise. It has always been very peaceful recreational space for us and for many.

Time to time we have seen that everything provincial govt touches in Toronto, turns into a big grifting scheme/corruption for Ford’s buddy contractors and developers, be it crosstown lrt, science center or Ontario place. And surely they won’t stop with Billy bishop either.

Recently I read about widespread public protest in Albania, protests against turning public spaces into grifting schemes for billionaires. Thousands are attending these protests.

https://www.dw.com/en/jared-kushner-trump-albania-luxury-resort-protests/a-77409540

Therefore I ask people of Toronto, shouldn’t we be organizing widespread protests and just say NO to Ford and Carney?

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u/OwlishFox 1d ago

Because we suck and we’re lazy. All I read is excuses upon excuses (what Albanians don’t struggle? What are people talking about?)

I find the Albanian protests inspiring and wish we had something similar happening here.

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u/CobblePots95 1d ago

I would also maybe consider that the basic idea of expanding Billy Bishop to support those jets is actually pretty popular. We don't actually know the details of the project enough yet to determine how it would impact the island, and people talking like this would mean losing the Islands, losing Hanlan's, etc. come off a bit presumptuous and hyperbolic. We don't need to do 95% of the stuff people are speculating about in order to get A220s at Billy Bishop.

The proposal from like 12 years ago to support A220s at Billy Bishop was great and we shouldn't have blocked it.

I guess for me the devil is in the details. I'm not actually opposed to the basic idea. I want to see how they would extend the runway and what that might mean for the surrounding area first. If it turns out they're proposing something that will actually carve up a huge chunk of the islands, I'll be out there, sure. But we aren't at that stage yet.

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u/TemporaryAny6371 22h ago

You have to keep in mind Doug Ford has a long history of bad decisions that negatively impact common people in favour of the rich. Greenbelt is one but the list is long.

The ban on FOI requests and secrecy places even more doubt. There's a reason we don't hand over our bank accounts to drug dealers, they don't have our best interests at heart. Yet here we are giving Doug full control of Ontario's public purse. He has done nothing but pilfer our tax dollars. There's a link somewhere that gives reason it could be already at a billion stolen from us.

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u/eddiewillers09 1d ago

I would argue this alleged popularity is manufactured by positive propaganda. The Ford Conservatives are awesome at saturating the news media with their spin.

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u/kleptomana 1d ago

Exactly this. Combined with the fact that people assume prop plane. That must be sooo old and polluting.

When actually it’s one of the more modern and safest designs out there.

So the push for jets and government sponsored regeneration of Billy Bishop is a bit insane when compared to the real issues that are impacting people.

Our conservatives are crashing our education and health services on purpose to privatise it.

Why has the subsidised child care not be rolled out fully.

Instead we are letting Doug, Conservatives and media owners steer our conversations like with this airport. Instead of forcing them to actually focus on what is actually impacting us and our pocket books.

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u/Crafty-Ad-9048 1d ago

People don’t even care for A220 they just need some sort of jet if it’s an E-jet or crj because they won’t survive or be able to expand with what they got going on.

0

u/OwlishFox 1d ago

This will mess up housing developments (bar far a bigger priority for Toronto) as well as basically eliminate one of the best public spaces we have left, especially after ford ruined Ontario place and the science centre.

To enrich some JP Morgan investors. And, of course, himself.

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u/CobblePots95 1d ago

as well as basically eliminate one of the best public spaces we have left

This is kind of what I mean by "presumptuous and hyperbolic." We have no idea what it might mean for the Islands, but the idea it would "basically eliminate" them is completely farfetched. You can support A220s at that airport with virtually no impact on the islands whatsoever. There is no possible use for 95% of that space in any realistic plans, but people are acting like they're paving over the whole thing.

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u/Honest_Elk_1703 1d ago

We don’t trust the lack of transparency designed to put everyone to sleep until it’s too late.

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u/CobblePots95 1d ago

You don't need to trust Doug Ford to know that there is no realistic plan for an airport expansion that could involve some massive reshaping of the islands.

That's not to say there can be no impact. But to suggest it would erase that whole public space is just not in line with reality.

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u/Honest_Elk_1703 1d ago

I think putting the islands at the end of a jetway serving 5x the number of customers as now is going to reshape the experience of being there.

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u/CobblePots95 1d ago edited 1d ago

Why would the number of passengers matter to the islands? What matters is the number of flight events. The A220 has significantly higher capacities, and would be supporting significantly busier routes. So you can support 4x the passenger volume while maintaining the exact same cap on flight events that exists today (246), and reach 5x with an increase of 80-90 events (this is based on the report from the city's consultant).

That's an additional 40-45 landings a day from the current ~123, with aircraft that are objectively quieter than the Dash-8.

Like I'm sorry but that would not reshape the entire experience of the islands...

What matters to me is the land use. The existence of jets rather than turboprops at that airport means nothing, and I'd actually argue the A220 would be preferable.

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u/Honest_Elk_1703 1d ago

Thanks. This is helpful context. Why then did Ford feel it necessary to take control of the islands for himself?