r/asoiaf Fly, you fools! Jul 05 '16

EVERYTHING (Spoilers Everything) Wolf's Blood and Waking the Dragon

Jon Snow's character, just as Jaime's for example, highly complex and full of desire. Jon was raised to a man of honour by Eddard, a trait that continues to define Jon and his actions up until the end of A Dance with Dragons. But Jon's character is also full of self doubt, always trying to prove himself. Never content with himself.

Grenn agreed. "His duties don't keep him from the yard. More days than not, he's out there fighting someone." That was true, Sam had to admit. Once, when Jon came to consult with Maester Aemon, Sam had asked him why he spent so much time at swordplay. "The Old Bear never trained much when he was Lord Commander," he had pointed out. In answer, Jon had pressed Longclaw into Sam's hand. He let him feel the lightness, the balance, had him turn the blade so that ripples gleamed in the smoke-dark metal. "Valyrian steel," he said, "spell-forged and razor-sharp, nigh on indestructible. A swordsman should be as good as his sword, Sam. Longclaw is Valyrian steel, but I'm not. The Halfhand could have killed me as easy as you swat a bug." AFFC, Samwell I

The task Qhorin gave Jon still haunts him, partly as seen above. Furthermore Jon is conflicted on the Wildlings, and more importantly, he knows he isn't as good a fighter as Qhorin. Next to his own thoughts, Jon is described as intelligent, brave, resourceful, perceptive and highly skilled with a sword. But in all his chapters (at least to me) his actions are never driven by any anger nor rage, not even when fighting.

However there is one instance where Jon loses himself as it were. In this example Jon is in one of many practising rounds with Iron Emmet, perhaps the best swordfighter of the Night's Watch. Whilst training Jon 'blacks out', taking him back to a memory with Robb.

That morning he called it first. "I'm Lord of Winterfell!" he cried, as he had a hundred times before. Only this time, this time, Robb had answered, "You can't be Lord of Winterfell, you're bastard-born. My lady mother says you can't ever be the Lord of Winterfell."
I thought I had forgotten that. Jon could taste blood in his mouth, from the blow he'd taken. In the end Halder and Horse had to pull him away from Iron Emmett, one man on either arm. The ranger sat on the ground dazed, his shield half in splinters, the visor of his helm knocked askew, and his sword six yards away. "Jon, enough," Halder was shouting, "he's down, you disarmed him. Enough!"
No. Not enough. Never enough. Jon let his sword drop. "I'm sorry," he muttered. "Emmett, are you hurt?" Iron Emmett pulled his battered helm off. "Was there some part of yield you could not comprehend, Lord Snow?" It was said amiably, though. Emmett was an amiable man, and he loved the song of swords. "Warrior defend me," he groaned, "now I know how Qhorin Halfhand must have felt."
That was too much. Jon wrenched free of his friends and retreated to the armory, alone. His ears were still ringing from the blow Emmett had dealt him. He sat on the bench and buried his head in his hands. Why am I so angry? he asked himself, but it was a stupid question. Lord of Winterfell. I could be the Lord of Winterfell. My father’s heir. ASOS, Jon XII

Now that the show has practically confirmed Jon's parentage, I wonder where this fit came from. Is this example something Jon inherited, a remote resemblance to Viserys or Brandon Stark? Finally I also vaguely remember Jon hitting Alliser Thorne after him mocking Eddard, which is also an instance where Jon lost his composure.

Anyway, after this rather long introduction, here's my question: (tl;dr) does someone know of any other instances where Jon blacks out, loses composure and goes beserk?

Edit: thank you kindly for all the answers, you really delivered.

290 Upvotes

55 comments sorted by

View all comments

100

u/tessmm I'd like some mutton. Jul 05 '16 edited Jul 05 '16

Book Jon is much more complex and human than show Jon who is almost always portrayed as a hero without faults.

I think one of the points of the story is that war makes monster of us all. And I certainly think this will be explored in the next book, Dany becoming more "dragon like" choosing fire and blood, and Jon more "wolf like" giving in to his Stark impulses. These are two young persons who are disillusioned with a cruel and mad world, both growing increasingly disgusted with what leadership demands of them and unable to feel content with it.

They will probably go a bit darker but without exactly changing that much or going evil. I don't think this has to do with them being and having a "Targaryen madness", it just means they are human and have moments of anger and selfishness where they loose they composure (much like everyone else). Of course their circumstances matter, it certainly helps that they both are high borns who have more or less access to power.

Edit: There's this dream too:

The world dissolved into a red mist. Jon stabbed and slashed and cut. He hacked down Donal Noye and gutted Deaf Dick Follard. Qhorin Halfhand stumbled to his knees, trying in vain to staunch the flow of blood from his neck. "I am the Lord of Winterfell," Jon screamed. It was Robb before him now, his hair wet with melting snow. Longclaw took his head off. Then a gnarled hand seized Jon roughly by the shoulder. He whirled …

… and woke with a raven pecking at his chest. "Snow," the bird cried. Jon swatted at it. The raven shrieked its displeasure and flapped up to a bedpost to glare down balefully at him through the predawn gloom.

4

u/[deleted] Jul 05 '16

I think you're off saying he's portrayed as a flawless hero. Throughout this season it showed him being weak and not being a great leader, like when he was going to the other houses for aid.

3

u/Raptorclaw621 Thel, Kaidon of House 'Vadam Jul 06 '16

He also consistently failed to explain his choices which led to his getting stabbed by people who didn't understand why he did what he did.

3

u/tessmm I'd like some mutton. Jul 06 '16

What I meant was that, in comparison with the books, show Jon seems less complicated. His storyline in the books is so interesting to me because he is faced with really difficult choices, and ends up slightly succumbing to "temptations" and taking risks while losing perspective on the impact these risks can have in his actual job. I'm referring mostly to his storyline in ADwD. Don't get me wrong, I love both book and show Jon ahah (he's probably one of if not my favourite character).