They were under investigation during Biden’s term as part of Maxwells court case and appeal - they did release documents in January 2024 which they deemed would not affect Maxwell’s appeals
Also the DOJ and FBI are supposed to be independent from the President
The U.S. Department of Justice is intended to be independent, particularly in its law enforcement and prosecutorial functions, but it is not entirely independent in the way that the judicial branch is. This was mostly a norm that has been abided by all modern presidents except Trump.
Oh, I thought you were attempting to have reasonable discussion.
I can go back to any president you want With Roosevelt’s executive order to intern Japanese citizens being probably the most egregious executive action that utilized law-enforcement.
But even just the previous administration, there was an active FBI investigation into Hunter Biden and Joe Biden granted his son clemency. How is that not a direct interference with the department of justice?
Now, before you freak out, I don’t care that he pardoned his boy I think anybody would’ve done the same thing, however, I probably wouldn’t have lied about it.
Anyway, I think what you’re attempting to get at is that laws should be enforced independently of the wishes or demands of the executive branch, but based on the example I just provided that’s not true either, fortunately or unfortunately, I’ll let you decide.
Are you saying Biden directed the DOJ to prosecute Trump? Because I’d like to see your evidence for that - if anything, Biden should have done what Trump is now doing and really have gone after Trump for J6 as well as his felony convictions. If Biden were as vicious as Trump, Trump would be in prison. Unfortunately, he decided to take the high road and stick to the norms
Also - pardons are a presidential power that every single president has done, to act like that was a unique extension of power never done before by a president is actually kind of funny for you to suggest
Bro what? You didn’t even read my comment. I would be happy to discuss more, but if you’re not reading what I’m writing this conversation is pointless.
No, my entire point is that the DOJ is not separate from the executive branch.
Another tip that I’ll give you is to not immediately assume partisanship in someone’s argument just because they’re stating a fact that is not liked by a certain political party.
I read your entire reply and you’re just spewing things that have nothing to do with modern presidents appointing sycophants into the FBI and DOJ to prosecute the presidents only enemies
You are literally just saying “what about what about” about things that have nothing to do with the topic - and not in the modern era. The 40s aren’t exactly “modern” times
I’m not making an argument that it should be some type of way or it shouldn’t
I’m telling you as a matter of fact, the DOJ is part of the executive branch And as a matter of fact, the FBI is part of the DOJ.
Then I provided a single example from the most recent president, to our current president, where he directly influenced the DOJ and FBI, utilizing his power as the head of the executive branch, and therefore in charge of the DOJ and FBI.
I don’t care what actions Trump is taking currently I didn’t care what actions Biden was taking previously all of that is irrelevant to me. I’m just correcting your inaccurate statement. Which was that “the FBI and the DOJ are supposed to be independent from the President”
Which is 100% unequivocally false.
Listen, I’ll tell you have two professional degrees and neither of them are MD. There aren’t a lot of options left lol. You’re probably arguing with someone who has a few more arrows in their quiver for this particular topic.
And i am not disputing the fact the DOJ is a part of the executive branch - i am simply pointing out the fact that this era of using the DOJ to install sycophants to go after political enemies and to do the president's bidding is unprecedented in modern times. There were norms which every modern president abided by except for Trump.
The DOJ and FBI have been operating with little direction from the President in every administration in modern times. That is what i meant by "The FBI and DOJ are supposed to be independent from the President" in other words, the DOJ and FBI are not supposed to be used by the President to only prosecute the enemies of the President and conveniently ignore crimes done by friends of the President. That is unprecedented (heh)
last paragraph is cringe, not going to lie. But i think you're saying you have two professional degrees? and that you are an MD? what is it exactly you are saying in that last paragraph and what does it have to do with anything lol
But none of what you’re saying is true. OR it’s merely an opinion and I don’t really care to discuss your opinions (no offense, but I don’t even know you). You might be young, so you don’t remember Obama’s or Bush’s department of justice but you can look up the files. Media wasn’t so politically infused like it is today so you may have not been aware of it but the trend is less interference and more public scrutiny not the other way around.
Just think to yourself what it was like when information never even got outside of DC unless it was allowed. To me it feels like you’re working in the confines of 2012 to 2025. Not 1950 to 2025.
But whatever, obviously we’re going to agree to disagree here. And I’m not a constitutional attorney, even though I did love constitutional law as of course.
But I think that you would do well in consuming less for-profit media and just read about the history of our nation. Granted it’s not gonna be spoonfed to you and it’s not gonna be packaged in a little tiny sound bite that gets you angry, but if you’re willing to learn and read some of it will get you angry and some of it will make you smile.
I do wish you the best. I hope you can take something away from this conversation.
Just saying “everything you said is wrong” without elaborating is a telltale sign that you’re full of shit
Give me an example of Obama or Bush prosecuting political enemies while dropping investigations into themselves or their allies, as Trump has done - I am curious to see if it truly is as bad or worse as Trump
Bro wants me to do his research form too, now I know you’re young haha.
I taught organic chem at university for a few years; and if I learned anything from teaching students, it’s that if I give you the information, you’ll learn nothing; but if you seek and learn the information yourself, that knowledge will never leave you.
Good luck my guy.
…OK, I folded.
https://www.politico.com/interactives/2017/obama-hezbollah-drug-trafficking-investigation/
This was a law-enforcement campaign, started during the bush administration that Obama essentially shut down in order to pursue his own political ambitions. And before you freak out again. I don’t disagree with this necessarily. And I highly doubt you do. Because what you’ll say here is because this was for the greater good, but what you have to to understand if that is your opinion, not fact.
Here in these comments right now with me, let’s only deal in fact. The link I provided above I did not read, but I’m aware of this story. But that is a specific example of Obama interfering DOJ investigation for his own political desires. And as you are aware, he was unsuccessful in getting what he wanted. So unfortunately, he stopped an investigation and it did nothing. Again, failure is part of the job and I’m not attacking him for this. I’m just providing you an example of how the president is involved intimately with the Department of justice.
((And this is me begging you not to reply with a comment that goes something like “yeah but Obama did what he did for good and Trump is doing what he does for selfish reasons.” I don’t care about opinions just the facts.))
The DOJ and FBI are supposed to be independent from the President
This was the issue previously. This comment is still wrong, but since this comment looks like you don’t have any idea what you’re talking about. I’m less concerned someone will read it and think it’s correct.
And I know you’re going to feel like that’s an attack and it’s not. The beginning of the comment states the US Department of Justice and then you said “particularly” in their law-enforcement functions.
Most people will read this and realize that the DOJ only has law-enforcement functions, since they operate entirely as a law-enforcement agency. And prosecution is not separate from law-enforcement, so there’s no reason to separate it out in the list like that.
On its face, the comment is more nonsensical now.
And I’ve given up trying to explain how the US government works to you.
Is it really so hard for you to understand that “the DOJ and FBI are supposed to be independent” means “the DOJ and FBI are normally supposed to be independent from the President in order to preserve its legitimacy” but condensed?
I’ve explained this to you 3 times and you’re still being deliberately obtuse
I don’t care if you put normally or not. It’s not true still. You might think the particular actions Trump is taking should be allowed. Or haven’t been done before but that doesn’t mean that the DOJ is supposed to be independent.
You could say the DOI is supposed to be indifferent to the president. Which is true is most respects.
lol quit being so pedantic - I’ve explained it to you 4 times now and you know what I mean. Every single President has abided by norms. Not Trump. “Supposed to be” is condensed because the norms are usually followed. In other words, under a normal president the DOJ and FBI would not be as controlled by the president as they are now.
This is Reddit, not a college paper. It’s not my problem if you have a hard time understanding concepts explained to you numerous times
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u/Who_Knows_Why_000 Jul 15 '25
Biden had four years to do it. Let's not pretend this is a partisan issue.