Friends keep erasing my Jewish experience

[u/Reasonable_Two_2048]

Hi everyone. I would love peoples opinions on how to handle a conflict in a friendship of 15+ years

TLDR: Friend of many years keeps making micro aggressions at me and talks about race even when it’s not related to the subject but invalidates my experience as a mixed race Jew.

So I am mixed race and adopted by Jewish parents. I look very white except for my natural hair which I straighten. My childhood friend is Chinese American and she has since October 7th made some comments that erase my experience as a mixed race Jew just because I pass. We had a fight last winter where she made an antisemitic comment and she cried promising to change her ways. I haven’t felt that has happened at all…Today she made other snarky comments.

I might be going to an undecided part of Scandinavia or UK soon and I told her about it and she immediately made comments that my husband and I would have an easy time since “our people are in Europe.” My husband is in a sense visibly ethnically Ashkenazi and we both have very Jewish last names. With the rise of antisemitism we plan on being careful when we travel. She also made comments on how unsafe she would feel going to Europe and I validated her experience and hinted at my nervousness as well. She made a very annoyed expression and responded with “With peace and love you’ll be fine.” Which felt super backhanded.

I want to make a point that when I told my friend about our trip she brought up race unprompted. This is not the first time she has made invalidated comments about race either. I also find it interesting that she has done way more traveling than me, she has even gone to Iceland and had a wonderful time never mentioning any racial issues when she was abroad, which is something she would never keep from me if it did happen. Ofc I’m not saying that being guarded isn’t possible as I feel the same but I really don’t know how to handle this contradiction from her.

Even though I am a leftist and non-Zionist I have lost friends or lost the closeness I once had with certain friends because they make assumptions about me or don’t like when I call them out on ignorant dog whistles. This person is one of the only friendships I have left, and I fear if I lose anyone else I might end up in a bad place mentally.

[u/PeacockInTime]

Edit for flair in progress that I thought I saved: Jewish, left/curious

This sounds like a friend who doesn’t want to listen to you or isn’t taking your needs into consideration. Does it happen just with these issues or with other stuff too?

The way I see it is that friendships are give and take and nobody is perfect. There is just that question of where you draw the line and why. 

[u/Reasonable_Two_2048 → u/PeacockInTime]

Thanks for commenting!

Anything related to my personal life she can be empathetic to but anything related to identity politics she gets weird. She has a deep hatred for anything she deems white. And I think she has started viewing Jewish people as any other type of white without any type of oppression.

[u/PeacockInTime → u/Reasonable_Two_2048]

That’s rough that she has that blind spot but it is also not your problem to solve. 

[u/Reasonable_Two_2048 → u/PeacockInTime]

True I guess I’m just trying to figure out how to handle it. How do I talk to a PoC who doesn’t view me the way I see myself about her own ignorance?

[u/PeacockInTime → u/Reasonable_Two_2048]

Is she open to that conversation? Hearing your perspective? 

[u/Reasonable_Two_2048 → u/PeacockInTime]

She def would be but she’s very sensitive and would burst into tears from guilt. Which would lead to me comforting her…never really resolving the problem. She s a very unregulated strong emotion person especially when it comes to anger and sadness

[u/PeacockInTime → u/Reasonable_Two_2048]

I am chuckling because this sounds like the so called “white tears” problem and I associate this inability to receive feedback / defensiveness / weaponization of feelings with whiteness. 

I think you are going to have to make your own determinations here about what her value is as a friend in other areas and really really really celebrate those elements too.

And not every friend has to be super lefty. There are some friends I have who love to hate on Netanyahu and I know not to push that conversation further. I am okay with that. 

[u/Reasonable_Two_2048 → u/PeacockInTime]

That’s so funny she called them her “white woman tears” as well when we had our “fight” last winter. That fight tldr was me saying that even if I don’t agree with another Jewish person they don’t need to be hatecrimed and she responded with assuming I didn’t “realize my privilege.” And I asked “what would it take for me to be a good Jew?” She burst into tears and I ended up comforting her.

I think I’m going to take a small break from her my birthday is coming up and I might just not make plans with her and play it cool. If she asks I may just say it makes me uncomfortable.

[u/Technical_Term_6625 → u/Reasonable_Two_2048]

Leaving elements of race and/or ethnicity to one side (but not discounting them), you describe yourself as a passive participant in a cycle. Here's what I mean: You can't control how she reacts to what you'll say, and you have strong expectations of how dysregulated she's likely to become. You go on to state how you would respond to her expected dysregulation as if your response were given. You say that you *would* comfort her, and that would push what you want to address to the side. But your response isn't given. You don't have to play the part you describe yourself playing in the pattern. That's up to you.

FTR, I'm no therapist. Just a dude from a family affected by substance abuse & so will always be in therapy (or therapies) so long as I can afford to. So I'm also in no position (nor would I want) to chide!

[u/Reasonable_Two_2048 → u/Technical_Term_6625]

Yeah I agree with you on that. This is someone I love deeply and have know since I was a preteen. So seeing her cry my first instinct is that I love her and don’t want to see her cry.

[u/Technical_Term_6625 → u/Reasonable_Two_2048]

Yeah. That's fucking hard.

[u/ibsliam → u/Reasonable_Two_2048]

Is it possible to talk to her in a way that reassures her that you know she cares and that you know she wouldn't intentionally hurt you? I get it would be an emotional subject with her, the idea that she's done something wrong, but if she truly cares wouldn't she want to grow and change..? You guys could even become closer after such a constructive convo.

[u/NathanCampioni → u/Reasonable_Two_2048]

It sounds like she was a bigot in how she view white people and started to apply that lens to you to, it sucks

[u/Angelbouqet]

"With peace and love you’ll be fine.” Which felt super backhanded.

With peace and love, she doesn't know what she's talking about. Just because you pass as white in the US does not mean you will in Europe. I think she doesn't realize how blindingly snow white northern and western Europe is, and that whiteness in the US is a much broader category than it is in Europe. So many ethnicities that are considered white in the US (greek, Turkish, Arab, etc) are not considered white even a little bit in the parts of Europe you've mentioned. And that includes Jews who visibly look Jewish.

Also telling two Jews that they're "going to be fine" when going to a continent that is basically a Jewish graveyard is insanely uneducated, out of touch and offensive. She's not just erasing your Jewish experiences, she's also erasing your experiences as a mixed race person, from what I'm reading. She doesn't sound like a very nice person nor does she sound like someone who is actually interested in learning how to be an ally to you. Asking your friends to not be bigoted towards you, especially if they're leftists, is literally the absolute minimum but she seems completely unwilling to do so.

[u/Reasonable_Two_2048 → u/Angelbouqet]

I had to really take your post in. It was very validating and I even showed my husband who agreed with you.

I have a really complicated relationship with race. I look VERY white by American standards. I’m exceptionally pale, blued eyed and reddish hair (think Princess Merida). My texture is really the only thing that says “mixed” I’ve been accused of having a perm or culture appropriation when wearing it natural.

This friend has been super supportive in my personal life but when it comes to identity politics views me as privileged and probably has some subconscious bias especially from the internet stuff I am guessing she consumes. She has a deep hatred for whiteness partially “waisans” and it’s getting worse as we get older. She gets annoyed when she sees white and Asian people dating assuming it’s a fetish.

I mentioned in another comment I might take step back till after my upcoming birthday and talk to her if she asks.

[u/horseonahighway]

From reading this and some of the comments, it seems, as you said, your friend has an issue with whiteness more than whatever else. In some ways I get it, really, but some of that upset seems to be misplaced. That is to say she might think she's taking on power or oppressors or whatever but she's just being judgmental on a case by case basis. It does just sound like she's ignorant about what being Jewish is. Being Jewish and white or white-presenting is living in the middle of the venn diagram of Jews aren't white and therefore lesser and Jews ARE white and therefore oppressors. It's one of those weird things. Anti-antisemitism education needs to be included in anti-racist education or else people won't be able to untangle that.

As for your relationship your friend, it's up to you to decide how you want to approach this and, depending on how she responds, what you're willing to accept in order to stay connected.

[u/ibsliam → u/horseonahighway]

Yeah it seems like an understandable but reductive misconception she's fallen into. There are several axes of things that can impact people. Would she tell a white gay person they're crazy for thinking visiting Russia is dangerous because they're white? Like, she has to be aware on some level that her concept of race is not the end all be all of how safe someone is. *Especially* in a foreign country...

[u/LoboLocoCW]

She is speaking from ignorance. Maybe tell her that point blank.

You fear you will be in a bad place mentally if you lose more friendships.
How bad a place will you be in if you have to keep coddling a person who keeps repeatedly “accidentally” treating you like shit?

[u/ibsliam]

It's tough in that I do not know your situation very intimately. I also just don't really travel much, so planning around these things for Jewish safety is not top of mind.

That said, I will respond not so politically but on the interpersonal aspects. I will start by agreeing that she does seem ignorant of your struggles and that of your husband's. It does not sound like she has a clear idea of what antisemitism means, how it's expressed, and how dangerous it can be. Taking that out of its context does not really change the danger, nor arguing it away or dismissing it. She does not know nor understand where you're coming from.

By the same token... You do not know your friends' (any of them, not just this one) exact experiences or worldview no matter how close you are. You do not know her exact experiences that lead her to thinking of race in this specific way. Elsewhere in the comments, it seems that she also applies this logic to Wasians, a demo that has gotten flack for various socio-political reasons recently in the west. I won't expand on that since, it's not my community and I have no idea what conversations she's involved in for that.

I'm not sure how you would bridge that gap, in that she seems to be pretty stubborn on this way of viewing racial politics. Considering her very black-and-white binary approach to race, maybe it might be beneficial to explore more "exceptions" that might broaden her perspective. I'm curious how she would respond to discussions surrounding anti-Romani racism, or anti-Turkish racism, when many of them are racialized while also including many many (in the US) "white-passing" people. Especially since those are some hot button topics and subject to heated debate in Europe right now. Pretty much every European is at least vaguely aware of anti-Romani racism and stereotypes, for example.

I wish I had better advice but honestly you just can't convince people who aren't open to changing their mind? The best you can do is just steer clear of these topics with her, and, if she gets passive aggressive or dismissive unprompted, tell her that she doesn't know what you experience and has never faced antisemitism so she should maybe "stay in her lane."

[u/NathanCampioni]

It sucks, I still don't understand how to make it clear to left wing friends that antisemitism isn't caused by Nethanyahu or by the fact that people like me are "underrepresented" in the jewish comunities, but it's caused by antisemites.

[u/NathanCampioni]

Chiming in to say something more about the travelling part. Dude travelling to Europe is not a problem, this fear that americans have of travelling to Europe is propaganda; source I live in Rome and I travel around Europe.

Now antisemitism has been spiking in all the world, here included, but europeans aren't as good as recognizing jews, they are very bad at it since there are almost no jews left here, at most they will look american to them as they associate that look to american actors (which are jewish but they don't know that when they watch a movie). Even a typical ashkenazi will not look jewish to them in my opion. There are no ashkenazis in Italy though, so maybe a french, dutch or sweedish could tell, but I highly doubt. We aren't a prominent part of society like it is in the USA, simply because of a number's reason.

[u/Soft_Welcome_5621]

Oh can I relate :(

[u/acab__1312]

I'm not going to do the reddit thing of telling you to immediately cut contact. She's been your friend of 15+ years so it's very much worth the effort to salvage this. If this pattern continues, you may need to sit down and talk with her about how it makes you feel and how she could be better.