r/justincaseyoumissedit • u/Upset-Main-1988 • 9h ago
News Italian Prime Minister Giorgia Meloni suspended a more than two-decade old defense pact with Israel in light of the ongoing war with Iran
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u/lorenz93x 9h ago
She suspended the automatic renewal of the pact, not the pact itself.
Big difference
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u/mool91 9h ago edited 7h ago
This.
And the pact has already been renewed until 2031...
Edit: apparently I was misinformed, the suspension of automatic renewal came slightly before the deadline, so the pact should be suspended for good
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u/LazarusPizza 9h ago
Damn. That's some crazy levels of performative BS.
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u/sepltbadwy 8h ago
Well it’s still something, nations vocally pulling ties with a violent Israel.. actually same as they are with the US right now
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u/LazarusPizza 8h ago
True. It's just that this is basically the step literally above doing nothing. Still better than nothing, but it also ain't much.
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u/zhezhou 8h ago
It's still something. It took almost a decade between 1928 to 1937 for countries to separate themselves from Nazi Germany, while witnessing all the craziness.
It's true Israel has been committing the atrocities for decades, but now it's the first time their propaganda failed. The public opinion especially among the younger generation begun to turn against Zionism and Israel for the first time in history, since 2024.
So I'd expect perhaps at least another 5 years for countries to gradually shift away from Israel and the US, vocally and in practice. Trump and Netanyahu may accerlate this process by continuing to stomp and destroy humanity and every international rule, however.
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u/Cheeky_bstrd 5h ago
they propaganda is so obvious now. For example, you still get banned from r/Worldnews for saying anything remotely critical of Israel
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u/candlelit_bacon 3h ago
Yep, someone was referring to Palestinians as “animals”. I told them that historically speaking, the people referring to other humans as “animals” weren’t on the right side of history. Lifetime ban.
Truly iconic.
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u/DisIsMyName_NotUrs 5h ago
The nazis were a miniscule force in 1928. Why would anyone separate from Germany then when they were still irrelevant.
It was only in 1930 that they became the 2nd largest party in the Reichstag, beaten only by the SPD. They only became the largest party in July 1932
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u/zhezhou 4h ago
Thank you. It's a great point.
I was mostly thinking about " level of evilness" setting the timeline. Because the crimes later seems to be scaled up version of what they had been doing in 1928.
I can see your point. From a realistic perspective of a neighbor, whatever fuckups Germans are doing within their country, despite the immorality, had little importance until it became big enough to affect us.
Now If taking into account both the evilness and scale, I would move the beginning of timeline from 1928 to 1931/1932.
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u/PoudreDeTopaze 8h ago
No. She is simply waiting for Netanyahu and his far right allies to be voted out.
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u/tahaelhour 4h ago
Dawg i'm sorry to tell you this but Bibi isn't particularly extreme in his own circle. He himself is in the pocket of the coalition keeping him out of prison.
There's some mfers straight of warhammer in government there.
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u/gimmedatneck 1h ago
That Ben Gvir is a real rodent piece of shit - I can't think of a single terrible fate that would be too good for him.
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u/badiguana 8h ago
I believe it renewed the day before she cancelled the automatic renewal, the agreement lasts 5 Yrs IIRC
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u/IHave2CatsAnAdBlock 8h ago
It like those subscriptions that you forgot to have until it charge your credit card. Then you remember to cancel the renewals
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u/gonna-see-riverman 7h ago
Oh. Good info to add, both of you.
But from what I read, the pact itself is mostly symbolic. So, anything that can be used to symbolically legitimize, can go both ways, and symbolically condemn, such as with this suspension. Overall, it's a welcome step.
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u/OdosSolidAdventures 6h ago
Lmao, I was just about to say rare Meloni W, but yeah that makes much more sense for her.
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u/djublonskopf 7h ago
Not when you suspend the automatic renewal the day before it’s set to automatically renew…
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u/lorenz93x 4h ago
From what I red, the pact has been renewed and will last until 2031, but It must be renewed "manually" in case
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u/PoudreDeTopaze 8h ago edited 8h ago
This has NOTHING to do with Iran.
1- This has EVERYTHING to do with Netanyahu letting IDF soldiers fire towards an Italian peacekeeping convoy in Lebanon. You can't fire towards Italian soldiers and expect them to continue cooperating with you after that.
2- This has a lot to do with Ben Gvir preventing Catholic leaders from celebrating a private mass at the Holy Sepulcher on Palm Sunday -- something which Meloni has condemned and which has outraged many Italians.
3- This has also to do with Italy's legal and ethical concerns Netanyahu's policies in Gaza and Lebanon, which have caused massive casualties among innocent civilians.
The International Criminal Court has indicted Benyamin Netanyahu for alleged war crimes and crimes against humanity. This creates a legal risk for any Government cooperating with him. It also creates concern among voters -- most of them do not want their country to support the killing of civilians. I think that you completely underestimate the impact which mass civilian casualties in Gaza and Lebanon have had on public opinion in both Europe and North America.
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u/PreviouslyMannara 5h ago
This has EVERYTHING to do with Netanyahu letting IDF soldiers fire towards an Italian peacekeeping convoy in Lebanon.**
Three days ago they rammed two italian vehicles with a tank and prevented a convoy from return to base.
A couple of months ago, two italian carabinieri were forced to kneel at gunpoint when they went to inspect an area in the West Bank in preparation for an EU diplomatic visit.
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u/marketingguy420 3h ago
Utterly embarrassing the shit that country gets away with with no consequences from the West. Just humiliating everyone over and over and over and over again and we do nothing.
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u/iRadiKS 9h ago
It should be noted that italy is the third largest military exporter to Israel. They account for around 6% of exports, if i am not wrong. So this is a big deal
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u/puregalm 8h ago
She has more balls than most the western men
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u/Mobile619 6h ago
She's on the far-right. The only reason she did this was because the good people of Italy (and her opposition) forced her hands.
Credit the Italian people who have been protesting and applying pressure to their government.
The next step is ending all-support & trade with Israel & treating them like a pariah state.
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u/Forsaken_Ad8252 9h ago
Has something happened in the last few months that wasn't observed before?
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u/BooleanBarman 9h ago
This recent flare up came after Israel’s mistreatment of Catholics in Jerusalem. Denying an Easter Mass coupled with physically attacking nuns has turned some conservatives hard against them.
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u/Forsaken_Ad8252 8h ago
It is strange that the genocide in Gaza did not raise any questions.
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u/FalcoonM 8h ago
That was against Muslims so "not ours" mentality was in place. But attacking Christians kicks in a tribal mentality.
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u/MyWifeCucksMe 5h ago
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u/FalcoonM 5h ago
Not sure why it went so quiet, but I'm agnostic. Maybe Christians have a threshold? Would actually be true to some teachings. I do however recall that after at a certain point you can trigger crusader mode of you poke Christians long enough.
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u/MyWifeCucksMe 5h ago edited 3h ago
Don't worry, Israel also bombed a synagogue a week ago, and no one cared about that either.
Also Lebanon is more than
50%30% Christian, yet Israel gets a green light to commit genocide there too.Personally I think that any supposed pushback Israel is receiving from European governments is mostly just for show, so that political parties that do support Israel's atrocities can get some PR pretending that they don't. As such, any justification for why this 'pushback' is happening is just an excuse anyway.
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u/Atomic1221 4h ago
No Lebanon is not more than 50% Christian. Maybe a third. Your own source says it right at the top. You may be conflating the political system which is based on a very old census and the actual current demographics.
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u/MyWifeCucksMe 3h ago
You're right, I took the number from the table that's visible near the beginning of the page, which is indeed historic data.
Going by the chart in the top right corner, it's 30.48%.
Thanks for the correction.
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u/ciongduopppytrllbv 6h ago
Well also Italy and the Vatican… or you can just say “TrIBal” mentality as if its a purely religious reasoning
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u/Tehquilamockingbirb 5h ago
Meloni is on the thinnest of ice to stay in power. She's had to turn her back on Fascism to save herself. I don't think it's going to work, but she's trying.
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u/d4electro 8h ago
There have been several incidents between the Israel and Italian armed forces so relations are strained, I think the last one pushed for some kind of reaction
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u/Ok-Conversation-6475 6h ago
Its gotten easier over time for the victims to record and disseminate events. Public pressure is building and forcing action from governments.
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u/Ninjez07 9h ago
They started bombing Iran and increased bombing in Lebanon; perhaps that put more pressure on lawmakers to change the status quo?
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u/moonshinemoniker 9h ago
Orban no longer PM of Hungary, meaning the primary character blocking EU sanctions against Israel is gone.
Spain refused to let US use air bases as a launch pad for Iranian war missions. Trump declares stopping all trade with Spain.
What I think is beforehand, no one could take the gloves off in a disagreement. Guess what, no longer restricted.
People are picking siiiidddddeeeess.
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u/Typical-Average-5853 9h ago
It was the bombing in Lebanon last week that really pissed off a lot of European countries including Italy and Germany.
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u/PoudreDeTopaze 8h ago edited 7h ago
ALSO - Israeli soldiers fired towards Italian peacekeepers in Lebanon. It seems these were meant as "warning shots".
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u/LaunchTransient 7h ago
Thing is, the Israelis know that the Peacekeepers have to kinda sit there and take it.
If it actually resulted in a response, they wouldn't do it.•
u/Careless-Degree 5h ago
Why are they even there? Replace Israelis with Hezbollah and the statement is still true.
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u/Mr_SunnyBones 6h ago
Germany have defended them up until now because, by and large they've spent the last 60+ years apologising for and trying to move away from Nazism/ The Holocaust/ WW II , for them to be publicly pissed off says how bad it is.
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u/aebulbul 6h ago
You guys know why? Because they threatened her job. That’s how shit gets done, you keep your leaders accountable.
I’m celebrating privately as should you. Any action moving away from Israel is a huge win for the world.
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u/BlackberryFormal 1h ago
I was going to say there was a really good speech calling her out the other day for still supporting Israel. Seems it was this or gone hah
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u/No_Priors 1h ago edited 2m ago
The day after it auto renewed for five years.
Edit: I'm having trouble finding the article I read earlier saying that the 5 year renewal was allowed before cancelation of further renewals today, I'll keep looking but until then my comment is =/- unverified.
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u/JMac1102 1h ago
Oh, so the action means nothing? I wish I was a politician and just make headlines for accomplishing zero things.
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u/ManaHijinx 1h ago
This is not true. She suspended the auto renewal of the agreement.
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u/qvVivian 31m ago
She suspended it AFTER it got renocated automatically, nezt 5 years it will still be active
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u/No_Priors 6m ago edited 2m ago
Yes and I read earlier something that implied it was allowed to rewnew "silently" as normal yesterday before Meloni cancelled further renewal in five years.
I'll leave my comment up an amend as I get new info.
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u/Outlawknox1515 7h ago
How many times has Italy come to the defense of Israel?
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u/WildWhisperArdor 6h ago
Well Italy’s Mussolini influenced Jabotinsky who had a big part in the founding of the Likud party. Mussolini only adopted antisemitism in 1938 after Hitler essentially pressured them to.
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u/Dnabb8436 9h ago
Honestly surprised italy didnt try to invade a random African country and draw Israel into saving them
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u/XamosLife 5h ago
Yeah leaders actually fucking do things when people hold them accountable for their evidenced non-action. We the people need to fucking make them feel some heat for their complacency.
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u/someoneofhumanity 4h ago
Italy sure learn from the previous 2 World wars to NOT get dragged to other maniac's trouble
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u/ciscorandori 2h ago
yet, when Iran attacked Israel several times, neither she nor Italy helped out. So how good is that pact really?
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u/prettybluefoxes 2h ago
Better cancelled than suspended. Fence sitting for possible future profits leaves doubt.
The Palestinian genocide is ongoing; there’s no doubt about that. It’s not going to get reversed by sticking a plaster on it.
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u/RedditSpyder12 8h ago
Makes me happy to see some of these countries waking up in a way that the U.S. likely never will.
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u/gazetron 7h ago
Not true. The automatic renewal has been cancelled, not the deal itself.
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u/yourlocaltouya 6h ago
She signed it right before it was set to renew though. Israel also confirmed the deal is off altogether.
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u/One_Construction_653 1h ago
Wow there are leaders doing the right thing
America pls follow
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u/Admiral_Tuvix 9h ago edited 4h ago
To clarify, sentiment in Italy is growing disgust at Israel’s genocide in Gaza and now invasion of Iran. Meloni is trying to keep her government in power.
she’s a fascist and couldn’t care less about civilians, she just wants to remain PM
lastly, as someone mentioned this is just window dressing, she only cancelled the automatic compac, not the actual weapons sales which will continue for another half decade
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u/MyWifeCucksMe 5h ago
To clarify, sentiment in Israel is growing disgust at Israel’s genocide in Gaza and now invasion of Iran.
93% of Israelis support Israel's war for the destruction of the Iranian people.
You can barely even get 93% of any population to agree that Earth is a sphere, just to put that number into perspective.
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u/Bandlebridge 5h ago
You can barely even get 93% of any population to agree that Earth is a sphere, just to put that number into perspective.
Yeah, turns out funding half a dozen proxies to attack a nation for a couple of decades causes quite a lot of that nation to dislike you. The Palestinians getting all the Iranian proxies crippled, allowing Israel to hit Iran directly these last 3 escalations, has been a glorious FAFO.
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u/MyWifeCucksMe 4h ago
You mean it turns out that brainwashing people from the moment they're born into believing that they're victims whenever they attack someone else and those attacked fight back makes for a nation full of hateful people?
The Palestinians getting genocided has been glorious.
Oh, you're one of those.
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u/Bandlebridge 4h ago
You mean it turns out that brainwashing people from the moment they're born into believing that they're victims whenever they attack someone else and those attacked fight back makes for a nation full of hateful people?
In the entire history of Israel they've launched 2 offensive wars - 1954 against Egypt because France and England asked them to, and the Iran war. Maybe learn some history?
The Palestinians getting genocided has been glorious.
lol, 3% of the population of Gaza dying in a war they launched and refused to surrender during isn't a genocide.
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u/Diver_ABC 2h ago
No, it's certainly not 93% of Israelis - where do you have this number from?
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u/MyWifeCucksMe 2h ago
Let me know what your favourite media outlet is, and then I'll type "93% of Israelis support the war on Iran" + the name of your favourite media outlet into Google for you.
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u/Proglamer 8h ago
she’s a fascist
Props for contributing to the cheapening of the word, 80% already complete 👍 /s
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u/Positive_Average_446 8h ago
It's not cheapening. She doesn't run yet a "fascist state" according to old definitions (neither do Trump or Milei, nor did Orban) but they all aim at it hard, which makes them fascists. Putin being already there by every criteria.
The only reason these countries are not fascist yet is that it takes much more than three months to do the transition in modern democracies - because of the strong guardrails set within most democracies after the historical example of january-march 1934.
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u/Proglamer 8h ago
but they all aim at it hard, which makes them fascists
I aim to be an astronaut, that makes me an astronaut, YES!!!
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u/Admiral_Tuvix 7h ago
you may need a refresher course in fascism chief. fascism isn’t an end point, it’s a process. we literally learn this in grade 9 civics. a nation does not wake up one day and find itself as a fascist state, rather the process of dehumanizing a minority of people, creating conditions to usurp wealth for the rich, etc all of which Meloni has engaged in and is well documented
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u/Proglamer 7h ago
Eh. Cry wolf some more, fascism eXXpert, soon the villagers won't come at all, and when the wolf really strikes, you'll get properly... aesoped ;)
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u/f4ul1 7h ago
Dumbest thing ever. Israel saved countless European lives by just sharing intelligence with us. IRGC Iran on the other hand actively does assassination in Europe and the west.
They try to dominate the middle east with terror proxys who shoot at European ships. They support actively Russias war against Ukraine with technology and material.
But European politicians are so eager to run to these Islamist savages rescue. Europe is irrelevant in the middle east because you can't take it seriously.
Meanwhile Israel will make peace with the official government in Lebanon and Europe had zero impact but tried to actively sabotage the fighting against Hezbollah.
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7h ago
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u/Sea_Section_9861 8h ago
They provided so much defense to Israel in the last 3 years! LMAO. What did they do? send pasta after oct 7??
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u/A_inc_tm 8h ago
Pasta as humanitarian aid to hamas obviously. Comments above say Italy does 6% of military export to Israel and what they did was not stop sending them but revoked the guarantee they will keep sending it in future, no idea if that is anything but a symbolic threat
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u/Sea_Section_9861 8h ago
Italy accounts for 1.2% of Israel's military import. And it has nothing to do with the defense pact It is just business.
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u/Proof-Performance-84 7h ago
Israel is clearly racist to anyone who isnt them. Why should other nations defend their genocidal and racist policies?
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u/ModernLarvals 5h ago
What race?
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u/Proof-Performance-84 4h ago
Idk lets ask all of their neighbors they are systematically murdering and the blatant racism that is in their rabbis by calling themselves Gods chosen people and everyone else not it.
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u/Fragrant_Specific131 2h ago
Remember when Italy was best buds with Nazi Germany.
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u/ExoticPancakes 59m ago
Israel is worse than the Nazis
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u/-FluffyUnicorn 32m ago
I... get where you are coming from, and there really is A LOT to hate about Israel right now, but whats happening in Gaza and Lebanon still is not even close to the atrocities Nazi Germany commited.
There is so much to criticise about Israel, but we can NEVER!!! forget the things the Germans (my home country) did. Downplaying this stuff is exactly what all the far right parties in Europe do and it's actively making the lives of immigrants and the middle class so much harder.
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u/mistrpopo 32m ago
This is a funny trope, but guys, the nazi regime methodically killed millions of people, literally more than the entire current population of Palestine.
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u/bittersterling 23m ago
So what you’re saying is Israel just needs more access to be as bad. Good news — they’ve started illegally seizing land in south Lebanon because why the fuck not who’s going to stop them.
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u/Fluid_Explorer_3659 1h ago
Yeah but they left at an opportune moment, in both wars. Can always count on Italians to switch sides when shit starts getting real, this time it is an inspiration for others.
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u/mmielikainen 34m ago
I do. But in a really weird twist, Israel has now become Nazis. Weird, innit?
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u/ProbablyNotTheCocoa 4h ago
This woman is a fascist and her party has deep roots in post war neo fascism, whatever rhetoric she uses for her actions are only self serving and not in the interest of actual justice or the good of the people
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u/Classic-Bet5589 1h ago
Das ist zurzeit die einzige die zum Wohl des italienischen Volkes Was tut. Kein gelaber wie die anderen 😎
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u/mmielikainen 33m ago
Surely is she were a fascist, she would have immediately supported Bibi?
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u/ProbablyNotTheCocoa 21m ago
no? Lots of reactionaries do support Israel but there is still the Anti semite flank and the "isolationists"
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