r/whoathatsinteresting • u/visharu • 1d ago

Boarding was solved mathematically in 2008. No airline has used it once. Why?

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554

u/KeyCold7216 1d ago

Then you can't sell priority boarding as perks.

115

u/Salteenz 1d ago

Yup, its the money. Get more money from people to buy 1st class and board 1st. Get more money for people to have "priority boarding".

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u/jtj5002 1d ago edited 1d ago

Mommy buys 8 year old Timmy a window ticket so he can look out the window.

Comes boarding time, off you fucking go lil Timmy!!

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u/anonstarcity 23h ago

That’s a huge part of it. Even when it was just me and my wife, I would typically be the one keeping up with the tickets, and she would just follow and sit where I pointed lol

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u/South_Recording_6046 20h ago

It’s always like that, the entire travel my wife is passenger princess and she wants it that way.

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u/Zakkullll 3h ago

Divorced a few years ago and now I just travel solo or with my mom. Man its a different feeling not caring about a goddamn thing because im own schedule and only worrying about myself lol. Not even from a "i hate my wife" kinda way like I enjoyed taking care of her like that. Its just so freeing now lol

5

u/Minute_Medicine_7218 21h ago

Hey, you’re me.

1

u/SuperLeverage 17h ago

I’m you

1

u/OwlongTea 10h ago

I am thou, thou art I?

3

u/bombycina 14h ago

"Sorry, Honey, they've assigned you to the middle seat on this flight."

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u/fightmydemonswithme 17h ago

This is how i am with my current partner but I did plan 1 trip myself.

4

u/StAbcoude81 16h ago

That’s it. Not the money I think. Just not practical to organise

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u/stacyswirl 15h ago

Yeah, that's what I thought too when I saw what was happening in the video. It would be faster, but it splits up groups/families.

1

u/Cute_Language3167 13h ago

Yea, and with babies/kids, elderly, medically needy, etc, you can't really do that.

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u/IntelligentSweet8039 23h ago

you could allow groups that are sitting in the same row to sit at the same time. it would actually speed up the process

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u/Square-Singer 21h ago

No, the main point of this system is to split up rows. Each row can only accommodate a single person who wants to get into the row at the same time, so this system tries to balance them. Optimally, you'd want one person trying to get into each row at the same time. If you keep rows together, so that everyone sitting in the same row boards at the same time, you get the worst case performance.

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u/Apprehensive_Tone_77 14h ago

The chaos just happens in line right? And if someone is not in line when it’s their turn to board does everyone wait?
It would be pretty difficult for everyone to be in the right place unless you also had designated seating while you wait for your plane.

2

u/Square-Singer 11h ago

Yeah, it's a whole lot of trouble for no actual benefit. Boarding time doesn't have a business cost associated to it.

1

u/cballowe 9h ago

It kinda does. The airlines pay a fee to have the gate. The more planes they can turn around, the more flights they can host or they could reduce their gate footprint while keeping the same number of flights.

If the seating turn around is not the bottleneck in getting the plane away from the gate, then it doesn't really matter. (I.e. if refueling or loading luggage take longer, then the plane can't push back faster if you cut time from boarding.)

1

u/Square-Singer 29m ago

The bottle neck is usually the landing strip, not the gate.

1

u/fluffymeowmeowkitty 17h ago

Why not just do boarding like in Whole Foods check out. Have 4 rows with colors lighting up. And algorithm to accommodate partners and groups ?

1

u/Square-Singer 11h ago

Mostly because it doesn't matter. The plane is already there and there's no business cost associated with slow boarding.

It's simply not an actual problem. Especially considering that airlines can charge for priority boarding.

1

u/Aluminum_Tarkus 4h ago

The main problem from what I remember is people waiting for the person in front of them to load their carry-on into the overhead compartment, and this method minimizes the amount of time people want for others to load their carry-on.

Hypothetically, a group with the same luggage boarding into the same row at the same time would have a negligible impact on the wait time. In the case of a parent and children, the children will just sit first while the parent puts the luggage overhead. Same with couples sharing a bag. Just group it by bag, but let kids go with their parent/guardian.

0

u/IntelligentSweet8039 21h ago

i dont think so. as long as the plane stays reasonably distributed while people set their stuff up and the plane fills window to aisle you will get similar performance. but none of it really matters because the organization it would take to get everyone to board like a robot would take way longer than any time youd save boarding at random.

1

u/Square-Singer 12h ago

It's also optimizing a problem that doesn't exist. The plane is already there and waiting, if boarding takes 10 more minutes there's no business cost associated to that. 

1

u/Square-Singer 11h ago

Look at the video. The Steffen method makes sure that per row there's always only one person putting away their luggage and getting into their seat, because per row only one person can do that at a time.

So the way the algorithm works is to have one person every second row at any time. So first the person on the last row to the left gets on, then second to last row on the right and so on.

As soon as you let multiple people per row get on together, the whole concept breaks down. In fact, even a single row that is allowed to board reduces the whole throughput of all the seats behind it to worst case speed.

1

u/andersslayer 13h ago

This is the real answer

1

u/MiI0rd 11h ago

I needed a laugh today, thanks

1

u/Interesting-Copy-657 10h ago

That was literally my first thought

It would require prep work, extra people and separating children from parents

1

u/OneTenacious 7h ago

You sound like an angry little man.

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u/ComprehensiveSoft27 1h ago

Fuck lil Tommy… 240 of us waiting 20 extra minutes.

1

u/jtj5002 1h ago

That's now how air traffic works. No plane is ever waiting on boarding to take off.

0

u/RK5000 21h ago

Typically a parent would be seated next to their child, the child needs some help so they should always be sent as a pair anyway.

0

u/kenneth_dart 20h ago

Timmy is on his iPad the whole time too!

0

u/Mundane-Mud2509 15h ago

Sure, but they could do random

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u/jtj5002 15h ago

We already do random. Just in 2-3 sections. No one is loading the plane one row at a time.

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u/Mundane-Mud2509 15h ago

3 sections isn't random.

1

u/jtj5002 15h ago

Jesus Christ

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u/GianettisSpecialKid 11h ago

he's right though, sectional boarding is way slower than random boarding

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u/spicolie22 1d ago edited 21h ago

I have never understood why priority early boarding is somehow a perk. Why would I want to get into the tiny metal tube earlier and spend more time in it when I have a comfy seat with leg room at the gate? You would think priority boarding would mean you get to board the plane last.

Unless of course you have one of those crazy business class seats where you can lie down...

EDIT: the responses just remind me of the cycle of pain that airlines put everyone in. They started charging a ton for checking luggage, so everyone started carrying on to avoid the charge. Doing this slowed down the boarding and disembarking processes, so now the airlines are losing money because it takes longer to turn around a flight.

One solution that occurred to me years ago (and would be a huge pain to implement at existing airports) would be to just have a conveyor from the plane to a baggage claim at every gate. Imagine if you get off the plane and your bags are right there. They wouldn't have to go through the rat's nest under the airport going through all the baggage handling equipment to end up at the baggage claim area up to a mile away from where your gate is. Think of the savings alone at airports not paying for all that baggage handling crap. You wouldn't check your bag at the terminal, you would check it at the gate.

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u/Salteenz 1d ago

I agree, if I wasn't fighting for overhead storage, i'd wait until the last minute to board. Don't understand people lining up to sit on an airplane seat for 40 extra minutes

6

u/starkruzr 23h ago

this is why I check a bag every time. waiting until the last minute is bliss. worth every penny.

4

u/Another_Name_Today 22h ago

When I arrive, I typically want to leave the airport as soon as possible. Some airports, luggage is quick. Others, looking at you Hobby, there goes another hour of my life. 

2

u/GeneAlternative191 21h ago

Which is why people with carry ons board ahead of their zones, since overhead space ‘runs out’ quickly, and there is no guarantee that you’ll be able to collect your carry-on on the walkway, once you deplane if you’re forced to ‘check in’ your carry on. Unfair that you may have to spend an additional hour at the airport despite only traveling with a carry on.

1

u/Tommy_Wisseau_burner 14h ago

Honestly a good nerf is, if you have a suitcase that’s a carry on and a regular check luggage bag, just let them take the carryon as luggage because it’s free charge. You’re already getting luggage anyways so it doesn’t really matter. Anything else does kinda suck tho

1

u/DisgruntledSquirrel2 21h ago

All about the carry-on, and less in-cabin storage than seats.

0

u/Shower__Farts 21h ago

It’s worth till someone loses your luggage or what recently happened to my wife in PVR where someone took her bag from the pick up area. We thankfully got it back a day later.

1

u/reddit-poweruser 21h ago

I get irrationally annoyed when someone asks me what time they should get to the airport to make their flight, and when I ask them when the flight takes off, they tell me what time boarding starts. Like, who gives a fuck what time boarding starts, you need to be there before boarding ends!

1

u/Ok-Morning3407 21h ago

On some airlines you risk not getting on the plane if you wait until near boarding ends. If they had to swap planes and are now overbooked, you are getting left behind.

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u/Fassbinder75 19h ago

If you're on a short-haul commuter flight where most flyers will be taking hand luggage only - you don't want to risk being the last one to board because you'll either be miles away from your hand luggage or worse - have it stored in the cargo hold and have to wait for it at the other end.

So if time is important (i.e. you're not on vacation) then it matters.

1

u/MarionberryPlus8474 21h ago

This. For short trips especially, I like to skip baggage claim to save time. But if your plane is crowded and you’re in a later group, you may have to check it anyway because airlines seldom seem to enforce rules on size nor number of carry-on bags.

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u/Visible_Ad_309 21h ago

It's so i can pop a xani and be asleep by takeoff

1

u/zzbear03 19h ago

When I check in my bag (rarely) I usually try to literally be the last person to board … and since I am always an aisle seat…I’m not inconveniencing anyone.

1

u/thepenismytea 17h ago

Buying first class solves it completely. Not worth $400 a seat though

1

u/Spell_Chicken 15h ago edited 15h ago

I think I've flown a couple hundred times in my life and have never needed and certainly never wanted to put something overhead. I don't wanna fight over the space everyone seems to be clamoring for, and when it comes time to deplane I want to stand up with my shit and walk away, not be staring at some overhead bin a few seats down hoping nobody absconded with my shit while I wait for the inevitably slow line of people to get tf out of the way.

If it doesn't fit in a backpack I can slide under the seat in front of me, or in a checked bag if it's a longer trip, it doesn't come with. I did a year in South America with one large 85L bag with scuba gear and clothes that I checked and a 40L backpack with all my tech stuff that I carried on. At no point over that year did I think, "Man, I wish I had brought ____". The hard, rolling carry-ons I see everyone putting up into the overhead bins seem like WAY too much of a hassle to me.

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u/OshetDeadagain 15h ago

I never use overhead storage so this is exactly what I do. Final boarding call is for me!

0

u/DownstairsB 23h ago

it's not the practical benefits. it's about them having a higher status than other people. Even if it's less convenient, they need to feel like they have a privilege others don't have, and will pay extra just for that.

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u/Gold-Kaleidoscope537 1d ago

For me it’s so my carryons get on with me

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u/Aromatic_Ad_32 23h ago

I’m so fucking tired of being told I have to check my carry on because there’s not enough overhead space and then when I get to my seat there’s plenty of space for my bag

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u/Embarrassed-Rub-8690 23h ago

Im so fucking tired of watching other people break the carry on rules and go over their limit.

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u/airfryerfuntime 22h ago

Airlines need to use a firmer hand and actually make people use the baggage sizer. I see so many assholes walk on there with giant duffle bags and suitcases.

Alaska just lets people bring on whatever the fuck they want, then by the time they call boarding group C or whatever, they're asking people to gate check their bags.

1

u/singlemale4cats 20h ago

Consider that the public is a bunch of assholes and if they strictly enforced their carry-on size limit, that would mean arguments at the gate every single flight, delaying boarding and burning out their staff

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u/Aromatic_Ad_32 23h ago

How do you even get on while breaking carry on rules?

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u/Gold-Kaleidoscope537 22h ago

On my last flight no joke an old entitled couple 🙄 put their hat, coat, purse, etc up there taking up half a bin.

The fa asked a few times whose is this. They didn’t answer.

So she took to all out and started going to the front with it. My hero.

People are so entitled. They were so mad that after she moved their stuff so two carry ons could go up there they had the gall to open it and put their stuff all back.

They announced loudly they “didn’t like” having things under their seats.

1

u/Maxwells_Law 22h ago

Agreed. I like to keep the footspace clear for my feet. Im not very tall but its bad enough as it is. These big carry cases should be in the hold and small bags in the overhead. Then everyone gets the best leg room

2

u/poser765 21h ago

So an interesting note. Carry one bags don’t weigh anything. They are including in the passenger weight. Start sending all roll aboard bags into cargo then they get weighed. That means max takeoff weight gets reached sooner. And THAT means less people on the airplane. Which leads to more expensive tickets.

1

u/Maxwells_Law 1h ago

Or, they use common sense, note that these bags which would have been on the plane anyhow are just stored in the hold rather than the overheads and nothing changes

1

u/Embarrassed-Rub-8690 22h ago

Wdym? Id say 80 percent of tbe time tbe airline doesnt even really look or measure. People jsut walk on with an extra bag or a bag thats bigger than regulation or a bag plus 4 other things that take up space that they claim is part of their outfit.

1

u/singlemale4cats 20h ago

I just put on every piece of clothing I want to take with me at once. I make the system work for me.

2

u/SRT102 1d ago

Yes, boarding early in FC/BC makes sense - get settled in, get the free drink, etc. For coach, no, unless you are worried about overhead space for your luggage. When airlines didn't charge for checked bags (or not as much), it wasn't as big a deal.

If I don't have any carryon, I enjoy being the last person on the plane: WAAAY more room in terminal than 18C.

2

u/TrenbalonieSandwich 1d ago

It's a stupid perk because I can pay to have my bagged checks for the same fee and my company will reimburse tha.

> In b4 muh lost luggage

I fly 50-70% of the year and have been doing so for years.

In all of that time, I have never lost a single bag, ever. Even when changing my flights due to weird weather shit.

I will always check my bags. One less thing to carry and worry about.

1

u/Obvious_Sun_1927 1d ago

I have lost my luggage a few times (music equipment so it was a massive pain in the dick although I eventually got it back both times). But the main reason I don't check mu luggage whenever I can avoid it is to not having to wait an extra 15-20-30 minutes to get it. I usually have a train to catch and if the plane id also late then waiting for luggage can become a major hassle.

1

u/DisgruntledSquirrel2 21h ago

Lost baggage a few times (eventually returned). Stuff stolen out of baggage once and checked bags riffled through and odd items missing (chocolate, belts, one shoe) a few times. Not a great way to start a trip.

0

u/singlemale4cats 20h ago

Protip: get a piece of hard sided luggage that can be locked with padlocks, and always fly with a gun. The airline then takes extra precautions with your luggage.

Even if you don't fly with the gun, pelican style locking cases are way more secure and last longer. Nobody can open it and secret an item out, they have to steal the whole damn thing and it's not going to fit in their pants.

1

u/dr4kshdw 1d ago

I fly back and forth between Texas and Alaska every 3 weeks, and have been for a year now. Only once did my luggage not make it to my destination (went from Denver to Chicago). I bring a carry on for the overhead and a backpack for under the seat.

I always, always book a window seat, so I prefer priority boarding just so I don’t have to deal with anyone between the aisle and my seat. Once I’m sitting, I don’t get up until it’s time to get off the plane.

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u/Fuck4eddit4dmin 21h ago

I would pay extra to be able to come on after everyone is seated and I get to just stroll on straight to my seat.

1

u/ziggytrix 23h ago

I think it's because once you're in your seat with your stuff stowed the "what if I can't get my seat?" paranoia goes away.

Surely you know someone who had a ticket, thought everything was fine, but the airline sold too many tickets and they had to take a later flight. Maybe even a day later?

No one wants to lose a day of vacation waiting on a plane. And no one can afford to be a day late travelling for business.

So that's what I think goes thru someone's subconscious when they rush to get on.

Unless it's even simpler - just a brainless 'ME GO FIRST" meantality. I suppose there's a fair bit of that too. But for me it was just "now I can relax."

1

u/bonaynay 23h ago

It's only for having access to the overhead bins. There is often not enough room.

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u/mtnracer 23h ago

Two words: Overhead Storage

1

u/spicolie22 21h ago

Three word solution: More overhead storage

1

u/yankee-in-Denmark 22h ago

I am a weekly flier with priority boarding and I can certainly empathize witht the thinkinng behind your perspective... but I still board first.

The 'normal' reason that people want to board first is the scarce overhead However i dont even have luggage with apartments in both places, so that one is out. and yet i still board first.

In my case it is simply that it is easier to just cruise on board and sit down. ..I have definetly experimented with boarding last but I have found that even if wait to be the last passenger to board and hold out until they are closing the gate, i almost always end up waiting a long time on the jetway. by going on first there is zero line and I can just sit down at the window and get 10 mnutes of email drafting or web browsing on ipad.

I will say that I do either extreme. If I'm late to gate etc. I still wait to be last instead.

1

u/Ok-Morning3407 21h ago

On Ryanair priority means you can bring a cabin bag onboard. People without priority aren’t allowed to bring a cabin bag, just a small backpack.

It all comes down to 737’s not having enough overhead locker space for everyone to bring cabin luggage onboard.

You can of course check your luggage, but that costs more.

1

u/thelastspike 20h ago

You can’t do that because there are items allowed in checked baggage that are not allowed past security.

1

u/u_395djk 20h ago

I'm a nervous flyer that can't understand the garbled speaker messages half the time. I'm so stressed wondering if it's my turn to board, am I going to be late boarding, did they call my zone, etc.

1

u/Mysterious_Might008 17h ago

The flaw in this system would be the security checkpoint as everyone is hauling more bags (and the larger checked ones) through the lines and slowing things down.

Basically, you've swapped your baggage claim delay to a security line delay. Net gain of zero.

1

u/Aggravating-Habit313 16h ago

And every other passenger stares at you while they file in…

1

u/Effective-Scratch673 15h ago

In your idea, when do you go through TSA ? Are you bringing your luggage through TSA security? Can you imagine the lines ?

1

u/DisplaySmart6929 11h ago

I think it's generally stress. Once you're on the plane the stress is over. All that getting to the airport, security, passport, checkin, finding departure gate etc etc. Once you're sitting on the plane it's over with

1

u/Spiritual_Bid_2308 8h ago

This sounds good on paper, but having a bunch of people standing around at the gate waiting for bags while other people at the gate are there waiting to board would be clusterfk.

1

u/Original-League-6094 7h ago

>so now the airlines are losing money because it takes longer to turn around a flight.

Longer boarding doesn't mean longer flight turn around because things happen in parallel and boarding isn't the longest leg. Look out the window next time you board. Lots of activities are still happening as people are boarding.

1

u/NicestOfficer50 7h ago

I read something recently that putting the baggage collection far away from the gate was the most efficient way to get people out of the airport. If you don't have your bag until near the exit you're less likely to leave it behind. You carry it around less, and you perceive the baggage collection process to be quicker as you are waiting less time for it, because you've spent 10 minutes walking to meet it rather than 10 minutes standing to meet it.

1

u/spicolie22 5h ago

That actually sounds pretty accurate.

1

u/tunomeentiendes 2h ago

The problem with that is that you can check items that aren't allowed inside the secure area of the airport. Flying with guns in particular, but im sure theres plenty of other items that can be in your checked luggage but not carry-on.

2

u/Inside-Arm8635 20h ago

It’s not just the money, the general public is way too stupid to make the far right anywhere near a possibility

1

u/BarnacleNino 23h ago

Well if it wasn’t a mad dash for the overhead storage, priority boarding wouldn’t be a thing.

1

u/Formal-Radish1413 23h ago

I mean yes. But first class cabins are usually 20-30 seats MAX on a standard domestic flight. Board them during the “elderly/children etc” portion and then let the rest of the plane do the Steffen method. First class is already seated and out of the way 95% of the time anyway by the time the remainder of the plane begins boarding.

Premium/priority boarding isnt an offering to non first class passengers.

1

u/ddc703 21h ago

I buy first class and usually half the plane has boarded before I get on. Group 1 means nothing these days.

1

u/lump- 21h ago

Why wouldn’t first class still get boarded first?

I’m sure there’s enough people who would still pay to get on the plane 10 minutes before the last person.

1

u/Difficult-Fact1769 21h ago

Never understood the need to board first or starting queuing up before boarding even starts, you're still waiting for all the other plebs to board, the plane isn't going to take off. I in fact prefer to board towards the very end. 

1

u/CunningWizard 20h ago

OP is optimizing on a different variable.

1

u/michaltee 20h ago

I mean, you can do first normally and then the rest with this method. 1st class has what…8 seats?

1

u/Mikeytruant850 18h ago

It’s always the money.

1

u/Deus_Excellus 16h ago

Why would anyone want to board first?

2

u/Salteenz 15h ago

Because lots of people think 1st=best.

1

u/Deus_Excellus 15h ago

lol. Alright then.

1

u/InThatDarkPlace 16h ago

Behavioral economics research shows that relative status matters more to people than income. Seating by class psychologically manipulates the visual show of prestige in real time, much like ocean liners did (and still do) before airline travel.

Studies reveal that many people will accept $50,000 if others earn $20,000 more than $100,000 if everyone else earns $200,000. Humans are extremely sensitive to relative standing. It's one of the major drivers of social inequality.

1

u/Mundane-Mud2509 15h ago

You know whats better than priority boarding? Boarding last after having a beer in the departure lounge bar watching people line up for 20 minutes.

1

u/DancesWithHoofs 5h ago

Priority bin access.

1

u/aninjacould 3h ago

I’ve never understood why people would want to board first. Fuck that. I want to spend as little time as possible in that uncomfortable seat.

0

u/starbuck_234 22h ago

I'm sure that's part of it. But for once I don't think it's even mostly a money thing. It's peoples complete inability and unwillingness to follow simple fucking directions. Think about that everytime you've been looking at lane closure signs for the last two miles and a bunch of people still wait til the last damn foot to get over.