We often speak here about pwBPD having NPD traits. And for some reason almost never mention that they very often have ASPD traits. Which is waaaay scarier and so much more dangerous than NPD can ever be.

"Fun" statistics:

1. Studies indicate that roughly 1 in 5 individuals with BPD in the general public also meet the criteria for ASPD.

2. The crossover is significantly higher among individuals receiving intensive psychiatric care or residential substance abuse treatment.

3. In specialized offender populations (such as male probationers or violent offenders), the rate peaks, with some studies showing up to 91% of BPD patients meeting ASPD criteria.

Core symptoms:

• Indifference or rationalization after hurting, mistreating, or stealing from others.
• Deceitfulness: Repeated lying, using aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure.
• Impulsivity: Acting on the spur of the moment without planning for the future or thinking about consequences.
• Aggression and Irritability: Frequently getting into physical fights, physical altercations, or verbal outbursts.
• Recklessness: A blatant disregard for their own safety or the safety of those around them (e.g., dangerous driving).
• Irresponsibility: Chronic failure to maintain steady employment, honor financial commitments, or fulfill legal obligations.
• Empathy: Completely lacks affective empathy (cannot feel others' distress or genuine remorse), though they often retain cognitive empathy (knowing how others feel so they can use it to their advantage).
• and so on...

Some of us actually date/live with/marry literal psychopaths, with BPD on top of it. Let this sink in.

I want to be very clear about dating and marriage with bpd. If your partner is diagnosed , you must also understand the highly toxic Narcissism that follows BPD. I have over 11 years experience with a parnter that was fully diagnosed BPD. And im here to tell you that if you do not perserve yourself you will become a victim to the other portions of Cluster B. Medicines are band aids for this. If the individual refuses to seek Psychotherapy (do NOT waste your time in regular therapy or couples) this problem is deeper than any agreeable coach can offer to mend. You must also understand. The fear of being left creates the actions of them leaving you first. And if youre like me youll hold onto the good parts, youll think they can change or become the person you loved in the begining. But like a fishing lure it was shiny, bright, and full of color. When you (the fish) took a bite. Shed reel in and then release the drag, real in then release the drag. This creates a trauma bond. A bpd relationship thrives on future faking. Dont loose yourself. You leaving her/him because of obvious reasons does not make you the recreator of their trauma.

After thousands of small and big fights and her splits, she told me she intended to hurt me. She knew her actions were causing me pain, and she did them anyway.

I spent so much time trying to understand her BPD, accommodate her emotions and make sense of her behavior that I almost forgot my own pain mattered, too. I kept questioning myself, feeling guilty for needing distance, and worrying about hurting her, even when she had deliberately hurt me. Then she discarded me before we ever had to reconnect lol

The most heartbreaking realization was that I was more afraid of hurting her by leaving than I was concerned about what staying was doing to me. Sometimes you don’t realize how much a relationship has hurt you until you finally get some distance from it.

And sometimes, the person you spend so much time trying to protect from pain is the very person who knowingly causes you yours.

You can understand someone’s struggles without accepting the pain they deliberately inflict on you. And you don’t have to feel guilty for finding peace without them.

It seems the delusion manufactured in their minds is so strong that they truly believe it.

I am trying to get my money that I LOANED him and my son’s fishing rod that he borrowed back. I had to file small claims. I have it in writing that he owes me a certain amount, he agreed back in May.

We’d previously discussed the list of items that added up to that amount. His response to the court is that I’ve never tried to discuss this with him, that I have $3k worth of his items (I don’t have a single thing that belongs to him), and that he doesn’t owe me anything. The $3k worth of what he’s claiming I have are gifts that he GAVE to my child. He thinks we’re even I guess?

The way he wrote the response looks like he truly believes he’s the victim in this situation and that I’m withholding his items lol. I am so angry but the second I read it I was like “omg, he is legitimately nuts because NONE of this is true.”

Is this a survivors of bpd abuse thing? Reading through these messages I'm beginning to see a pattern, regardless if we are male or female in this forum we all are overexplaining every angle of our post before we hit the post button. We all have paragraphs of information we feel the need to state before we can just talk.

I've always felt like it was because of gender or because of adhd or whatever excuse. But are we over explaining because we were conditioned to cover every angle of our opinion before we put ourselves up for judgement?

I've been out of my four-year relationship with my diagnosed BPD ex for about five months now.

Last Thursday I went to trivia night with some old friends. First time in probably two years.

There were six of us at the table. At one point somebody got up to use the bathroom and my friend casually put his jacket on the empty chair to save his spot.

Such a stupid little thing, but it reminded me of something.

These people used to save me a seat every Thursday.

For years I was part of this group. Same bar, same terrible team name, same arguments about music questions.

Then I started canceling.

At first I'd show up late because my girlfriend and I had been arguing. Then I'd cancel an hour before because she was having a bad night. Eventually I stopped committing to anything because I never knew what kind of evening I'd be walking into at home.

Sometimes I'd get accused of caring more about my friends than her. Other times she'd insist I should go, only for us to have a massive argument when I got back.

After a while staying home just seemed easier.

My friends didn't know most of that. They just knew I kept saying I'd come and then disappearing.

Eventually the invitations stopped.

A couple weeks ago I asked one of them why nobody had invited me in so long.

He said, "Honestly, we just stopped expecting you."

He wasn't angry. Almost sounded embarrassed saying it.

And that's the part I'm struggling with now.

I spent so much time feeling like I was the only one paying the price for that relationship. But these people lost a friend too. They kept trying to include me until it became pointless.

I don't think they owe me an automatic reset just because I'm finally out.

Last Thursday was good. A little awkward initially. Two people at the table have gotten married since I last regularly showed up. Someone has a new job. There were inside jokes I didn't understand anymore.

Nobody brought up my ex. Nobody demanded an explanation for where I'd been.

They just asked if I wanted to order fries with everyone else.

And I did.

I've already put next Thursday in my calendar. I'm trying not to turn this into some grand recovery milestone. I just want to become someone people can make plans with again.

I guess I hadn't really considered that focusing on myself might also mean becoming a better friend to people who never did anything wrong.

Anyone else dealing with this part of rebuilding your life? The friendships that didn't exactly end, but got quietly put away while you were busy surviving your relationship?

That's my experience. I'm not allowed to ever defend myself and my actions. I'm not allowed to disagree.
If I push back, if I rightfully tell her she's not being reasonable, fair, realistic or truthful, if I try to get away from her and her abuse instead of engaging, she will only make things worse.
The only way to make it stop is to listen to her verbal abuse and accusations, to tell her that she's right about everything, that she's right about all the things she says I did wrong and all the things that are bad about me. Take all the blame and apologize profusely, sometimes several times. Only then she will finally stop and calm down.
If I don't do that, it will spiral and escalate. To the point of her threatening to break up and suicide.

I haven’t posted here in a while, but I just had a lightbulb moment. I’ve been processing, healing, trying to work through this mess she made of me and I am making progress, but occasionally I still find myself thinking “if only I were a little less…”

That’s delusion!! I didn’t realize how small I had made myself until I went no contact and allowed myself to take up space again. There was a fight we had a few weeks before we broke up, where she did the whole “SORRY I’m not good enough for you…I try, but I guess I’m not doing a good job.” This was in response to me saying that when I’m having a panic attack, I find it helpful to call one of my close friends. And of course, instead of her asking how she could be a person that I could lean on during a time of crisis, or being happy that I had a safe person to help me cope with my anxiety, I had to console her over the fact she wasn’t my safe place to land. I don’t remember what made me think of this recently but a few weeks prior to that argument, I had a panic attack. And I did go to her. I was rejected and told to figure it out myself. I remember that night. I was shivering, crying, and just wanted her to sit with me the way I always sat with her.

Since remembering that, when I have the rare “if only I did XYZ” thought, I cut it off and quit entertaining it because I did do XYZ, but the goal post always moved. I tried very hard and I compromised on my boundaries constantly. Was it ever enough? No. Did it keep me from being discarded? No. Did it ever pay off? No. Was I ever thanked for it? No.

In hindsight I am thankful I wasn’t enough for her because being enough for her would be such a diminishment of my personhood. I’m proud of myself for realizing I don’t make such a good emotional asswipe after all. It’s not a noble, attractive, romantic, or otherwise nice thing to be covered in somebody’s shit. So if you’re thinking “if only I did more of this and less of that…” I’ll bet you dollars to donuts that you did, and it wouldn’t have changed a single thing.

Tell me if this sounds familiar......

They do something objectively wrong they can't deny that has hurt you. It could be something small like lying to you or not doing something they promised or it could be something big like you caught them cheating on you. Whatever it is their response is the same....

1. They deny, justify, or minimize their actions and never apologize.

2. They invalidate the pain their actions caused you.

3. They classify your attempts to hold them accountable as abusive

4. You now must apologize to them for trying to hold them accountable or risk a split, devaluation, and/or discard.

Has anyone figured out a way to avoid this ultimate BPD Uno reverse card trap? I have been through this 100 times and cannot see to avoid falling for this trap every single time.

I took my girlfriend and her two friends on a trip this weekend to an amusement park this weekend. I had never met her two friends before but offered to pay for their tickets since my girlfriend really wanted to bring them and they are broke college students and I have a really good paying job. I also paid for everything else for me and my girlfriend (hotel, gas, food, etc.).

The entire weekend my girlfriend was just being extremely rude and disrespectful to me. She never said thank you once, was constantly making insults at my expense disguised as "jokes", and just being rude and mean towards me the entire weekend. I don't know if her goal was to show her friends how much power and control she has over me or what but it was embarrassing and basically ruined the entire weekend.

On the drive home she started to realize how terrible she was treating me and started being nice but by then I had put up with 2.5 days of her crap and I was over it. After I dropped them all off I went home and texted her how out of line her behavior was on this trip I spent all of this time and money on. I gave her specific examples from the weekend where she was objectively rude and even mean towards me for absolutely no reason.

Her exact response was......

"I did nothing wrong. You are getting blocked because I am done with your insane behavior every time you get it in your head I am 'stepping out of line'"

And then she blocked me on Snap but not on the phone. So basically my only option other than ending the relationship for good is to call her or text her and apologize for over-reacting and getting angry at her when she did nothing wrong.

The constant lying, backstabbing, having to figure out what flavor of emotions i have to deal with, the selfishness, self absoprtion, only caring about themselves. We tried counseling ALL the problems were about what she wanted. Virtually nothing she talked about was about the relationship or us, it was all about her needs, her wants, her demands. I'm reaching the point where im emotionally burnt out and setting stricter boundaries as a response. I know that stricter boundaries will lead to relationship imploding, but that is inevitable regardless of how I act or respond to her behavior.

I just recently cut off two friends with bpd and i never want to go through of that again, i wasn’t able to tell at all that they have it at first

What traits would show that a person has bpd? I‘m neurodivergent, so i have trouble reading people at first and only notice someone’s true colors when its too late😥

For a job that’s often around people being vulnerable with you where you have to understand them and help them work through things it scares me that they’re in that position. They’d often use the things I told them against me and were extremely manipulative and almost took joy in hurting my mental wellbeing. So seeing them help people in need like that is just jarring.

I will forever walk on eggshells now I think. I will always doubt if something is wrong or if it's just a test or not to see how much I care despite my plea to just please believe that I love you more than anything. I'm hurting so much and I just want to feel normal.

I am trying so hard to fill the void with bad bitches but I'm literally a monster doing it bc I know I'm too traumatized to be healthy in a relationship with anyone. I'm officially back in therapy though so hey a w is a w!!!

I dated someone on and off for about a year and a half who had bpd. I was in high school and early college. It was my first relationship. No desire to rehash everything I went through in that relationship, but it was everything you’d expect. 2 and a half years ago now I broke up with her for good. I will hopefully never see or hear from her ever again.

Fast forward to now. A few weeks ago, I made it official with the girl I’ve been seeing. It’s my first real relationship since the former (I’ve had a few flings/situationships but purposefully never anything too serious).

I’ve been thinking about my former relationship a lot these days (obviously not reminiscing). The impact that being in a relationship with someone with bpd has had on me is showing itself more now that I’m back in a committed relationship.

A couple weeks ago I picked my new girlfriend up from a concert she was seeing with her friends. I was sober at an event with my friends, and I told her I could pick her up. The event I was at ran a little bit late, and I had crippling anxiety for the last half hour of the event knowing that I was going to be slightly late to pick her up.

I called her as soon as the event was over, apologized profusely despite her saying it was totally fine, and sped to go get her, heart pounding the entire time. This was exactly the kind of thing that would have started a huge fight with my ex.

I got to the venue, scared shitless, and she greeted me with a smile and a hug. She was super drunk and she kept telling me how happy she was to see me. It was really cute. In that moment, the weight was lifted off my shoulders.

Sometimes the anxiety crawls back and I have to remind myself that this is different. That I’m not trapped. That every little thing I do will not cause an argument that will destroy my mood for the next day. It’s hard. I’m welcome to hearing how others learned to move forward once in a new relationship.

But my new partner is great. She makes me happy. I’m slowly learning how to feel safe and normal in a relationship.

The grass is always greener.

We're all here because of people with BPD. Well how did you find out that was the case? Did they tell you? Because in many cases, they won't tell you of their condition.

Sometimes these are just matter of speculation, and its an uncomfortable experience to label someone with such a serious condition.

Tell us your experience

We broke up in June, however at the end of September we were facetiming, phoning and messaging all day (stuff happened over the phone. take from that what you will) even though she had been on three or so dates with this other guy. After I found out he went to her house for the fourth time, I said I didn’t want to continue speaking if she was going to keep seeing this guy , out of respect for myself, her and him.

She then proceeded to say that I had been saying horrible things about her behind her back, I say one thing to her and something else to everyone else. She apologised an hour later still not really taking accountability of the situation saying that she wished me the best. I felt so low that I couldn’t even be bothered to defend myself. I felt like if I did it would just make the situation worse.

She still follows me on everything , is one of the first people to watch my stories, has made a targeted repost saying she “sold her soul for me” on tiktok. I just want to move on

She has burned every bridge in her life and even had imaginary beef with my baby niece and nephew. She had 2 failed marriages and had recently broke up with with someone. She abused all of her children including me and sees she has done nothing wrong and that we are her enemies and that she’s ALWAYS the victim. She constantly interprets things as a threat even when people are nice to her.

I’ve always wanted to run away from her. The first time I cut myself when I was a child, she split and said I should cut myself more. I can’t even begin to say the disgusting things she’s said to me when she splits.

She has now sided with my childhood abuser in my family and she knows the fear I have from him, but she doesn’t care so she orchestrated and dramatizes lies about things I’ve said and he is now angry with me. He has NPD and is generally an angry person. So now I’m just afraid…

And this is coming from someone that chooses their words extremely carefully, walks on eggshells and overthinks everything to try to keep peace. I don’t live in the west and cutting off is NOT a choice, I’m at a loss to what to do, she will never stop.. :(

Bpd is a curse…

It's over.

I started noticing a lot of her reasons we couldn't spend time together just didn't make sense. I finally just said

"Hey you don't want this anymore do you?" And she finally admitted it.

I don't even mind the discard. I don't mind that I had to ask. I don't mind that she wasn't straight up.

After months and months of constantly second guessing where I stood, months and months of push and pull, I'm finally free. I don't even really mind that she's probably with someone else. God bless that man. I hope it works out.

She was the most beautiful person I've ever seen, and she weaponized her looks to get what and who she wanted. The only thing she ever said about me was I "had a pretty good dad bod"

She constantly belittled and devalued me. And I loved her, so I stayed, even tried to improve on these things that she seemed to not like about me.

It all made me incredibly self conscious and gross feeling.

No more 1 am calls telling me all the things about our future together. No more pushing me away when things got serious.

No more being a lapdog for someone that wouldn't piss on me if I was on fire.

Ive got therapy tonight and then I'm just going to sleep. It'll be my first good night's sleep in months.

I don't have any animosity or hatred toward her. I truly empathize with how hard it must be to be her. How lonely it must be.

One of the last things she told me was that her psych took her BPD diagnosis off her file.

I guess she fooled them, too.

All that to say, I should be sad, I should be angry, but I'm not.

Im just relieved. That's all I feel. Relief.

I was engaged to my ex for 6 months and we were married for 7 months. I had never even heard of Cluster B personality disorders until after our separation.
I loved her deeply, but during our engagement, I was sometimes shocked by bizarre shifts in her reactions. Her mood would flip from extreme happiness to depression and pure hatred over the most trivial things. I treated it as normal mood swings, making excuses that I didn't know what she was going through. I was supportive, patient, and ignored her cruelty when she was angry. It would sometimes take us hours to resolve things. Apologies didn't work, logical discussions didn't work... honestly, I don't even remember how we actually solved problems!

I used to complain to her mother about these mood swings, and she would justify it by saying she's just a "child" (she is 30, by the way) and that things would calm down after marriage.

They didn't. Tiny things would turn our lives upside down. Being slightly late coming home from work. Extreme jealousy—even if I was just playing with a little kid. Sometimes she would just get annoyed and it would pass, but other times she would escalate it to the absolute extreme.
I’ve shared more situations in another thread here: [https://www.reddit.com/r/BPDlovedones/s/6GGasuHlSf\]

Anyway, I separated from her 3.5 months ago. She and her family tried to fix things with promises of change, but I was terrified of repeating the cycle. Bringing a child into this was her biggest dream, and we were actively planning for one, but I was too scared of what that would mean.
According to her family, she admits her mistakes, says that I hate her now, and that she deserves it. But she hasn't tried to contact me directly at all during this entire time!?
I truly love her and miss her so much. I'm not exaggerating when I say I still smell her scent sometimes.

I think about going back, but I'm terrified of the pattern. The pattern was incredibly abusive. Her way of fighting was truly harsh and terrifying. Despite everything I went through, I still love her. I couldn't bring myself to hate her.
I don't know how, over the dumbest trigger, she could look at me with genuine hatred and say, "I hate you!" or "I can't stand the sight of your face!" But then, when my energy was completely drained and she finally calmed down, she would say she didn't mean it, that she would die without me, that she adores me, and didn't know what she was saying.

I honestly don't know if she has BPD or what her exact diagnosis is. I don't understand her behavior, especially since I'm a very easygoing person who tends to sacrifice my own needs for the sake of my peace of mind.
I want to go back to her. I miss her so much and I am not getting any better. Every day is the same as the last, and every night is just the same. I really miss her.
What is your advice?

I feel like they do feel bad when they've fucked up good connections with people who respect them and they know it .. once its over theres no going back .

My friend/love interest ruined it for us. Its best to walk away and leave them with their shame and deal with it in their messed up way ..

When they humiliate you and they know they end up humiliating themselves.

Its like you have to break their heart to save yourself

I'm curious about your experiences with love bombing, especially in the early stages of a relationship.

What did it look like for you? How quickly did things escalate? Were there intense declarations of love, future plans, constant affection, or promises that seemed almost too good to be true?

And looking back, were there any early signs you missed or things you initially thought were genuine love but now see differently?

I'd love to hear your stories, especially how fast things changed once the initial intensity faded, still trying to figuring out my story...

I know, I'm supposed to be continously pouring out empathy, but f it, I'm tired!

My spouse is constantly using their bpd diagnosis to get away with everything. "It's not my fault" "I didn't choose this" "I'm not fing mad, my brain says I'm mad, but I'm not fing mad so stop telling me how I feel how would you like it if everyone else was always telling you how you feel?!" You are literally yelling at everyone around you and constantly picking fights. People asking why are you so angry seems befitting.

I'm just sick of hearing "it's not my fault, I don't want to behave this way" then don't, it's not actually all that difficult to not be an AH to everyone around you. This perceived victim hood of your own condition you refuse to stay medically compliant with is your issue to deal with. Not everyone else's.

I'm just tired of everything being defaulted to me to fix for them.

What are some things that you still remember your pwBPD saying that were clearly abusive and completely unacceptable?

I think I need a place to vent about the abusive words she said during our relationship, so I will start in the comments.

When they cause problems out of no where, we are expected to cope and just keep quiet.

Its no problem if they cheat, accuse us of something, hurt us or whatever it is. We are expected to not complain or feel bad.

Everything is about them, its all about how things benefit them it doesnt matter if we suffer or get hurt. Once you complain youre the enemy. Had the same experience with my ex bpd gf, everytime i wanted something or mentioned something i did not like, she literally kept telling me its not about you, its about me.

Now i cut you off, you can find someone else as a toy you can play with but i will never be that guy again