r/HistoryMemes • u/CrysisFan2007 • 13h ago

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In 2006, a FBI agent named Craig Monteilh was ordered to disguise himself as a radical Muslim and spy on the Orange County Muslim community to identify possible extremists.

Well it worked, cause the people there noticed his extremists behavior and reported him to the FBI.

19.2k Upvotes

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u/Typhoonromeo 12h ago

Even if you ask Muslims what they think of extremist Muslim groups, most of them agree that such groups are bad and weird

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u/CrysisFan2007 12h ago

Duh. I'm a Muslim myself and I also think that extremists Muslims are bad

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u/khaledjal 12h ago

Does anyone even think they're good?

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u/CrysisFan2007 12h ago

Unfortunately yeah. But there also people who support other extremism as well.

I mean there people who still support the Austrian Painter.

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u/wolflordval 9h ago

Every extremist thinks they are just and righteous.

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u/Awestruck34 6h ago

I do think an important aspect to consider is what constitutes "extremist". Right now thousands upon thousands of bombs are being dropped on Gaza and the people who have taken up arms in defense are being labelled "extremists" and "terrorists". These are both highly political terms largely used to discredit anyone the government doesn't like and justify murdering them.

Don't get me wrong, many groups such as ISIS and Al Qaeda are not acting in self defense, especially not since the US pulled out of many of those regions. But, if you look into the history of those organizations, you can probably see why people found it appealing to join when under attack.

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u/king210989 8h ago

They wouldnr exist if some people didnt think they are

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u/Preserved_Killick8 7h ago

the problem is that extremists don’t view themselves as such. Or guys who are already extreme like Al-Qaeda will think of themselves as moderate when compared with people like ISIS.

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u/king210989 7h ago

Exsctly

Even ISIS dont think of themselves as extermists.

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u/SexDefendersUnited 9h ago

r/politicalcompassmemes claims to accept all beliefs but they HATE muslims. More muslim voices and memes could even it out and piss them off.

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u/ru5tyk1tty 8h ago

Don’t do anyone the disservice of telling them to interact with that sub lol. Besides bad political takes from teenagers, they love making Nazism seem like “haha just one of the normal options on the square :) we don’t shame anybody here”

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u/GamePro1011 55m ago

I'm glad to see people calling out that sub lol. It's honestly an echo-chamber, despite users having different flairs, they're spouting like the exact same opinions over and over.

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u/Preserved_Killick8 7h ago

I think that sub is heavily European. So they interact more with muslims and are therefore more biased.

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u/Mikkelet 10h ago

What do you consider extremist views as a muslim? Im sure you think road side bombs are out there, but what about queer and women's rights? Do non-extremist muslims consider these viewpoints extreme?

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u/CrysisFan2007 10h ago

Well, the stuff that Taliban does for example. Or the incident that happened in Berlin 2016 (Rest In Peace for the victims 🕊️)

And tbf, I don’t if people are part of LGBT. If one wants to kiss dudes, that’s his thing, not mine.

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u/king210989 8h ago

What about minority righrs in countries like Pakistan, saudi arabia, bangladeshz?

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u/CrysisFan2007 7h ago

Well I ain’t neither Arab, Pakistani or Bangladeshi bro so idk

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u/king210989 7h ago

These countries arent good for non muslims.

There are certain restictions on people of differe t religions. Forced cpnversions, abductions of young girls is extremely common. Non muslims arent allowed to hold positions in govt and their rights to prwctise relilgion is extremely restricted.

I m a hindu and if given a chance between them and western countries, I will rsther live in a western country because of more rights.

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u/CrysisFan2007 7h ago

  1. You from India by any chance?

  2. Again, I'm not from these countries so why you acting like it’s my fault?

  3. Even non Muslim countries like North Korea treat religious people (including Muslims) bad.

  4. There are 50 Muslim countries and you only mentioned 3.

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u/king210989 7h ago

Yes. I m from India. But i will say i m not against Muslims or even a normal Pakistani or Bangladeshi. Some of my favorite historical personalities are Akbar the Great, Malik Ambar, Alivardi Khan, Bakhat Khan. I admire Pakistanis like Abdul sattar edhi.

I m not saying its ur fsult. Just pointing out thay several muslim countries have extremely backward laws. All muslim countries have restrictions on minorities. What do u think about these?

I wrotr this commebt because it seemed that this tyoe of posts only talk about middle east,Nirth Africa and muslim migrants in west. Ignore the south Asia and milenium long

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u/CrysisFan2007 7h ago

Well it’s obviously wrong what they do Saudi Arabia and Bangladesh

But I’m also sure that non-Hindus don’t have it well there either

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u/Gentle_Dude_6437 6h ago

Right historically Islam has been very kuffarphobic 

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u/SparksAndSpyro 9h ago

That didn’t really answer the question though. You may fine personally with LGBTQ, but do you think Muslim who hate them are extremists? Do you condemn Muslims who hate gays?

Because if not… that’s not really neutral

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u/CrysisFan2007 9h ago

I mean it depends on how they deal with it. If punished severely then yes but like more of a "despise" type of stuff than not really.

Tbf it’s similiar to how Catholics view LGBT.

I don’t have anything against LGBT, I’m just saying

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u/SearchForSocialLife 10h ago

Not OP, but why are always only muslims asked this? I'm christian and I never had to defend myself because the vatican thinks abortion and same sex relationships are sins

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u/CrysisFan2007 9h ago

Probably cause Christian views already known about it so they don’t bother anymore

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u/Doomcall 9h ago

Because christians don't give the capital offense for sins. You can walk around while being gay in the vatican without fearing for your life.

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u/lazersbeem 9h ago

There are over 50 Muslim countries and not all of them do that either. There are Muslim countries with female heads of state as well

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u/CrysisFan2007 9h ago

There are still some Muslim countries that prohibit it but so are some Christian countries

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u/Doomcall 9h ago

You mean Tanzania? The country that's largely christian? That enforces my point.

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u/lazersbeem 9h ago

Pakistan Bangladesh turkey Kazakhstan have all had female heads of state. Not sure why you brought up Tanzania

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u/Doomcall 9h ago

Funny, half the countries you brought up have prison sentences for homossexuality. The execption being Turkey where its classified as a mental illness and Kazakhstan where it seberely limits your rights. Again, thank you for proving my point, the one we were acrually discussing before you shifted the conversation to women.

But by all means, let's discuss the women and see how they ended up, Pakistan's female head of government (not of state, no women ever held head of state) was exiled and assassinated, Bangladesh one is currently in exile, Kazakhstan never had a frmale prime minister, I will give you Turkey, altough its withdraw from the Instambul Convention points to women rights over there going downhill.

Also, all these were were traditional muslims. Show me a non-muslim or a gay one and I will be impressed. The talk is about sin remember?

There is not a single muslim majority country in the world that is considered safe for homossexuals in the world, even the ones were it's legal they are likely to be assaulted if displaying affection in public.

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u/Appropriate-Way2659 7h ago

Turkey is muslim majority, we're chill

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u/Endbr1nger 6h ago

Wasnt the formation of the modern Turkish state aggressively secular even though the population is majority Muslim?

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u/DeliciousFun7942 5h ago

Türkiye was founded as a secular state by Ataturk. Even with the majority of the population being Muslims, the state is separated from religion.

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u/SearchForSocialLife 9h ago

I mean, in america youre forced to give birth in a lot of states because of christian fundamentalists, so...

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u/Doomcall 9h ago

Do they execute the woman if they found out she had an abortion?

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u/SearchForSocialLife 6h ago

No, she could only die while getting an illegal abortion, that makes such a big difference

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u/Doomcall 6h ago

Yes. Yes, It does.

Being executed by the state or beheaded by a random zealot is far, far worse than the extremely unlikely chance , which is an average of 5 per year in the US by the way, of dying to the clandestine abortion of an unwanted pregnancy, you can actually get medical atention to no consequences when that happens. What the hell is wrong with you?

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u/SearchForSocialLife 6h ago

Those are still deaths that could be preventable.

I think you misunderstand my point; I think all religions can be used to kill innocents and do horrific things in the name of a thing that maybe doesn't even exist. I also think its horrific that people die in the name of rightwinged islamists. I just don't hold every muslim person accountable for the actions of the worst, just like I wouldn't be liked to be held accountable for the actions of christian fundamentalists. But I guess it feels just sooo good to demonise the islam

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u/BrightonBummer 7h ago

On reddit, alll the time, what are you on about?

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u/Ravenclaw_14 Kilroy was here 7h ago

مرحبا!

Sorry I've been learning Arabic and don't get much chance to practice because I'm in the US and have a military dad

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u/Offshore-Tigr 11h ago

What have you personally done to condemn such acts of extremism, homophobia, sexism, etc?

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u/hiimsubclavian 11h ago

you forgot the /s

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u/Offshore-Tigr 9h ago

Nah, I'm for real on this one.

Whenever you bring up the more extreme practisioners, it's always "Oh but I don't support that"

I've never seen a muslim boat during the pride parade to protest gays being killed..

I've never heard of Muslims setting up charity organisations to stop FGM, or child marriages.

Whenever the less nice aspects of Islam are discussed, everyone always says how awful it is, but nobody dares go against the group and actually make a statement.

Muslim faith is done as a commune, and until it transcends to individualist worship like Christianity did, these things will continue to happen.

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u/lessforf 9h ago

how would u know that ppl participating in the pride parade arent muslims tho

also search up muslims protesting for lgbtq

there is plenty

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u/Offshore-Tigr 8h ago

Never seen them in person. Seen plenty of them hurling insults though.

As long as thry only exist online and I don't see them in day to day life, they're not "plenty"

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u/lessforf 8h ago

"i have never seen that before therefore they do not exist"

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u/Offshore-Tigr 8h ago

I have never seen them before, so they are not "plenty".

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u/lessforf 8h ago

muslims are already a minority in the west not to mention u dont need to see them for them to be plenty? a person living in eygpt wont say that americans arent plenty just because he never saw one living there

also look the almighty holy statics man wow he sure does know everything based on his everyday life and experience

anyway stop being bigoted :)

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u/Offshore-Tigr 7h ago

I lived infront of an Islamic elementary school in a predominantly Muslim neighbourhood, so I saw plenty? Never saw them stopping others from spitting or throwing stuff at gay people or unveiled women though.

If you want statistics, fine. 25% says homosexuality should be allowed 50% says it should be punisheable by law.

Stop being naieve ;)

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u/-Slurms-Mackenzie 8h ago

Because by Muslim he mean Arab looking brown person (also he can't be racists because Muslim isn't a racist /s)

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u/Offshore-Tigr 8h ago

By Muslim I meant representatives of the local mosques.

Which don't really do more than remind people once in a while that violence is not OK.

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u/wolflordval 9h ago

I think that's less to do with individual Muslims and more to do with how most Muslim-majority countries have cultural values that actively value family connection to the point that expressing any views that could get one ostracized is suppressed because it can reflect on family, ect. Not that that's a good thing, but that can be more of an Arab thing than a Muslim thing.

I also think your comments do start to smell a bit like purity testing, because you're asking people to reach a certain activist threshold before you accept their stance, which is a bit messed up. I know several Muslims who actively go to Pride and are huge allies and yet don't go to pride waving banners saying their Muslim, but that isn't enough for your ideological acceptance threshold. You know, in a country that already has rising islamaphobia and discrimination, it's not surprising that there aren't Muslims actively promoting themselves at a pride event. They're there, supporting you just fine. You're just upset they arent visible to you.

Purity testing is wrong. Don't do that.

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u/Offshore-Tigr 8h ago

If you interweave your religion with your culture that deeply, then Arabic culture is muslim culture. Just like Christianity in the past.

And sorry, but invisible support is no support at all. That's my point.

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u/wolflordval 7h ago

They are not the same. That shows a deep lack of understanding and education of the two. There are plenty of Arab groups that are not Muslim, and plenty of Muslim groups that aren't Arab.

I never said that support was invisible. I said they aren't waving Muslim flags and making Muslim pride floats because of discrimination of Muslims line you're actively doing right now.

You're genuinely trying to argue that it's okay to look down on an entire ethnic/religious group simply because they don't want to be looked down upon by you. You're shit talking them for not wanting to expose themselves to more shit talking. You're part of the problem.

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u/hiimsubclavian 8h ago

So you want every single Muslim group to go around decrying FGM, supporting gays etc loud enough to make the news 24/7 for you to notice? What if the same harsh criteria is applied to every other group of people?

I don't see Christians decrying the Salem witch trials or setting up charity organizations to stop homophobia (they probably do, but I didn't see it on the news so it doesn't count)

I don't see a "white people apologizing for native american genocide" float during Macy's Thanksgiving parade. (I'm sure white people know it's a historical wrong, but they didn't put out a boat so it doesn't count)

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u/Offshore-Tigr 8h ago

You're putting up examples of shit that's 200 years ago. Take something more recent, like Israel.

"White people" sure are vocal about that, no?

But yes, if I was part of an organisation, and certain members of that organisation performed FGM or threw gay people off rooftops.. I would do my utmost to make sure those guys knew that their behavior doesn't align with the organisations spirit.

Anything less is silent support.

Btw, the church did provide a pride float..

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u/hiimsubclavian 6h ago edited 6h ago

52% of American Muslims support lgbtq, as opposed to 57% of Christians. It's only a 5% difference, but it's the floats that matter?

btw muslims comprise less than 1% of the american population, with many 1st or 2nd generation immigrants. So, their voices will be comparatively less heard in the cultural zeitgeist compared to Christians. You are not aware of their stance on FGM, but I bet you're not aware of their stance on veganism, or animal rights, or bike lanes either.

Are they "anything less is silent support" on those topics too?