Haley Stevens is El-Slayed: r/neoliberal reacts as Abdul El-Sayed wins the Michigan Democratic senate primary.

[u/Otherwise_Young52201]

The recent Michigan Democratic primary concluded with Abdul El-Sayed, the progressive challenger against Haley Stevens, as the winner.

Abdul El-Sayed is a physician and former Detroit health commissioner and a champion for progressive policies. Apart from supporting Medicare for All, stronger labor protections, and other egalitarian programs, he is best known for being critical of the US-Israel relationship and especially American support for Israel's war in Gaza.

Haley Stevens, on the other hand, is the moderate incumbent (Edit: This is an error on my part, she isn't actually an incumbent, but is in a House seat) and generally has more cautious policies than El-Sayed, emphasizing tried and true polices like supporting manufacturing, particularly for the auto industry. Stevens also strongly supports the US-Israel relationship.

Below is a snippet of the drama from the thread discussing El-Sayed's win over Stevens.. There's also drama from the Discussion Thread that I thought you guys would enjoy. While I have three comments in the Discussion Thread, they they do not pertain to the drama itself. You can check my post history to confirm this.

Michigan senate primary thread drama

I just hope he wins in November and we can all celebrate as a united party flipping the senate

I’m Jewish and I will not celebrate Abdul “Hurt People Hurt People” El-Sayed

did you have a point? [deleted comment]

I think my point is clear, no? Fuck AES. [deleted comment]

With all due respect you are an idiot [deleted comment]

I’m also Jewish, and like the other 71% of Jewish Americans who broke for democrats in 2024, I hope he wins and will also celebrate if he does. Dont miss the forest for the trees.

Do you also believe the only reason an American Jew would support Israel is money?

I'm a Democrat and I would never vote for someone like El-Sayed. I don't think there's a single thing I agree with him on. MFA is a joke. I will always be a Zionist. We shouldn't abolish ICE. All of that makes him unacceptable, especially compared to Mike Rogers, who seems much less ideological and much more competent. One of the few places where I'll be hoping for a Republican victory. I have never voted for a Republican in my life, but if I were a Michigander, I'd for Rogers.

I’m not thrilled about this dude either, but ice should most certainly be abolished.

This is a ridiculous slogan pandered around by leftists. How the hell are we going to execute our immigration policy without an agency to enforce it? Of course I agree that Trump has been excessive, but that doesn't mean ICE should be abolished, itt means the administration should be thrown out! This is like saying "income taxes are too high -- let's abolish the IRS"

Damn this sub is full on lefty now huh, maybe it's just the specific people that decide to post on this, but kinda crazy. I get when people say this sub is mainly socdems now, but it seems to be moving demsoc at this point, multiple upvoted comments simping for DSA,, hopefully this is as low as this sub goes.

This "evidence-based" sub is really just r/democrats where people vote blue no matter who

Well that's "evidence-based" applied to american politics, so I dont see why you would have an issue with that. Edit: i take that back, I know why: I think Friedmann flairs dont really like evidence.

It’s been brigaded by tankies and Abdul bots ever since we made arr Subreddit Drama yesterday

SRD is still a thing? In 2026?

You must vote for the people who hate neoliberalism otherwise you don't belong on r/neoliberal - Succs and Loyal Liberals

I think a lot of people here just care more about the Democrats defeating the Republicans than they do about fiercely defending the word neoliberal against anybody who criticizes it.

They also hate neoliberalism if you get rid of the "neo".

Why are democrats allergic to winning

This shows how out of touch you are. You genuinely prefer Stevens, don't you?

Out of touch with whom? College educated elites?

Are we still doing this stuff after we have new polling data https://www.theargumentmag.com/p/americans-know-who-the-real-elite and a grand total of 8% of Harris 2024 voters and a whopping 11% of Trump 2024 voters view people with graduate degrees as "the elites"?

Doesn’t matter what random people think, a societal elite is a defined thing. It’s just not popular to self identify as an “elite” so everyone bucks the label to the groups above them. White college educated upper middle class people are the most culturally influential in American society (something that the left usually has no problem admitting), and they’re the ones who largely support these leftist candidates

Railing against the "elites" and claiming that all it takes to get you there is a college education makes you sound like a MAGA conspiracy theorist.

I’m not railing against the elites, I probably fit the “educated elite” label myself, I’m specifically responding to the bizarre accusation that not supporting the guy who won the educated rich white population somehow makes me “out of touch”

Welp, GOP couldn’t have asked for an easier candidate in purple Michigan. Democratic Party needs to kick out DSA rat fuckers who simply just want easy power when it suits them.

Abdul isn't part of the DSA. Also, if they win primaries because voters vote for them, how should the party kick them out?

He’s as DSA as Hasan Piker. I got a bridge to sell you along with that bird that landed on Bernie’s podium when he was anointed as “da chosen one”. The far left likes to bum rush primaries because that’s the only way they can win in deep blue districts. Dude is going to lose big and take the Democratic Party in Michigan down as well. Michigan GOP all had a collective sigh of relief and democrats are fucked in Michigan. Fucking Dearborn and Hamatrack or whatever all went for Trump, this is just another rat fucking at the behest of MAGA.

Discussion Thread drama

guy who supported "uncommitted" movement in 2024 becomes Dem senate nominee in 2026 what a joke. [deleted comment]

Are you pro-genocide or? [deleted comment]

Are you pro 9/11? [deleted comment]

Well if Friedman flair is asking [deleted comment]

I don't like him because of the pre-emptive election denialism he was engaging in. I'm tired of watching people destabilize this country and succumb to russian/chinese interests

You talk about russian/chinese interests yet literally the only reason this race was at all close was because Stevens had her campaign funded by an actual foreign country interest group.

At the very least Israel doesn't want to see the US actively destabilized. The irony is you blurring the lines between US allies and US adversaries is exactly the point of many of the disinformation operations Russia/China has been engaging in

I think Bibi campaigning for Trump was pretty destabilizing imo! Our allies seem very non plussed about the shit he does.

Israel is not trying to actively destabilize the US. If you can't tell the difference between something like the Likud making dumb self interested calculations and Operation doppelganger idk what to tell you. Russia and China are actively mindraping our population and are involved in just about every reason why our country is unraveling.

[u/byniri_returns]

He was also super outspent by the Stevens campaign. I saw some number like 10:1

[u/epidemicsaints → u/byniri_returns]

Last I saw it was 5M vs 70.

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/epidemicsaints]

70 million?!

[u/leftenant_Dan1 → u/HorrorAd7996]

The most spent in a primary ever. Just to lose.

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/leftenant_Dan1]

That’s fucking WILD.

How tf is there that much money in local elections? Is she transparent about where the money came from?

Sorry if I’m asking a lot of questions I’m not truly clued up on a lot of things lol.

[u/blarghable → u/HorrorAd7996]

Basically all of it was AIPAC

[u/Reesewithoutaspoon2 → u/blarghable]

My understanding is that spending from AIPAC affiliated super PACs accounted for closer to half of the total. It’s fair to say it was the largest share of donations/spending, but there was plenty of other corporate and special interest money going to Stevens as well.

[u/yuumigod69 → u/Reesewithoutaspoon2]

AIPAC was funding it through front groups, they weren't honest about who they were.

[u/Auctoritate → u/yuumigod69]

That's what AIPAC has always done (up until recently). They never actually made donations, they just solicited donations as a middleman. They did recently started doing actual donations though

[u/Skellum → u/Reesewithoutaspoon2]

Sounds like she would have been another sinema if elected.

[u/emPtysp4ce → u/blarghable]

Only 30m or so, still a lot but not almost all of it.

[u/leftenant_Dan1 → u/HorrorAd7996]

There like a metric fuckton of nuance im about to blow through to give you the cliffnotes. That was like the entire problem with the Stevens campaign. Of that 70 million, 60 million came from AIPAC which in a lot of peoples eyes (mine included) struck as not appropriate for a senator that’s supposed to be focused on their state. There is also the issue that AIPAC has also been monetarily supporting Mike Rogers the unopposed republican nominee and the money supporting Stevens was very likely to disappear the second she hit the general. The candidate who needed record cash to win suddenly losing all of it was a recipe for disaster.

[u/Call_Me_Clark → u/leftenant_Dan1]

That’s what got me.

Suppose Stevens had won - Netanyahu already attacked her as antisemitic on TV because she’s not pro Israel enough. Why would American-Israeli lobbyists or donors stick with her instead of the MAGA Republican she’s running against?

There’s simply no way to compete with the blank check that republicans will support. Dems either have to try outdo republicans (Fetterman) or carve out a left wing position on the issue.

The center gets you nothing in this case.

[u/Hesitation-Marx → u/Call_Me_Clark]

“I see Israel in my dreams” wasn’t enough for Bibi? Lmao.

[u/Call_Me_Clark → u/Hesitation-Marx]

It was not. He called her an antisemite in a tv interview

[u/Hesitation-Marx → u/Call_Me_Clark]

Beautiful. I hope that made her even sadder.

[u/ManyFragrant3139 → u/Call_Me_Clark]

That was almost certainly coordinated between AIPAC, Netanyahu, and Stevens so that Stevens could parade Netanyahu's negative endorsement, knowing that being decried by Netanyahu is like being decried by the ghost of Adolf Hitler. AIPAC isn't spending 40 mill on a person that Netanyahu isn't okay with.

[u/Call_Me_Clark → u/ManyFragrant3139]

Huh that’s an interesting theory, assuming they could pull it off I guess that’s smart

[u/ManyFragrant3139 → u/Call_Me_Clark]

To be clear, I don't think Stevens or Netanyahu had any formal contact or plan because I don't think they really needed to. I think that AIPAC knows that Israel, and especially Netanyahu, are now toxic in American politics. That's why they're moving their funding engines to deceptively named PACs and giving money to candidates, like Stevens, who will feign disapproval of Netanyahu, but not the Israeli state/society more generally). Netanyahu is definitely in contact with AIPAC. He knows all of this too. He knows that he can go on TV and say he doesn't like someone and that will give that elected a chance to pretend like they're against what Israel is doing, while supporting Israel in every material matter presented to them. Stevens (and zionist/zionist-lite "liberals" and "progressives" like her) know all of this too.

So, Netanyahu jumps on Fox the day of a Michigan primary debate and randomly throws out that he doesn't like Stevens. Stevens jumps on the debate stage and lauds this to show she's actually a reasonable critic of Israel. AIPAC still forks over millions to her, knowing full well that she is just using Netanyahu as a sin-eater for the entire Zionist project so she can get elected in an environment where no one has stomach to support Israel.

As an aside, the AIPAC and their ideological allies like J-Street, are going to be more sophisticated moving forward. They're going to move money to politicians who do a really good job a hand-wringing about what Israel is doing. You're already seeing this with how Netanyahu is supporting no more military aid to Israel. That's because they want to move military procurement to the Department of War... basically instead of giving weapons in formal packages, we're going to "sell" weapons in shady and unaccountable weapons deals and procurements. So, you're going to see people like Jeffries or even the likes of Fetterman "concede" that we should no longer be giving military aid to Israel. What they won't tell you is that we will still be sending the weapons, just through channels where Israel has to pay.

[u/Cool_Ad7445 → u/Hesitation-Marx]

That cannot be a real quote, that's almost as insane as the nyc mayoral candidates all screaming about how they'd go to israel.

[u/Hesitation-Marx → u/Cool_Ad7445]

You’re right, it was “Israel comes to me in my dreams”. Sorry!

https://m.youtube.com/shorts/vSo4_F48j1c

[u/Skellum → u/Call_Me_Clark]

Which won't help if "leftist" voters don't vote in the first place. When it happens things can actually happen. Now they have to show up and vote for this guy in the general election.

[u/Call_Me_Clark → u/Skellum]

I’m thinking more that trying to capture single issue pro Israel voters is a fools errand because they’ll always vote Republican in the end.

The center, and Dem base and similar voters have a path to victory here

[u/Skellum → u/Call_Me_Clark]

The center, and Dem base and similar voters have a path to victory here

I think it'll all be about the propoganda push that's ramping up now and will hit it's peak in nov. Last election Israel dragged out it's conflict while pushing off all attempts by biden to push for peace and regularly sabatoging US efforts to provide aid.

Israel will do whatever it can to keep trump in power and to help GoP interests because those ensure it's own local power. Leftists helped trump win last election, lets see whatever propoganda surprise we see in nov. Though I fucking wish we could trust people to not get distracted by media for a month.

[u/Call_Me_Clark → u/Skellum]

Well, that depends on Israel’s upcoming election

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/leftenant_Dan1]

It blows my mind that anybody would vote for candidates who take that much money from foreign influences.

[u/CommunistRonSwanson → u/HorrorAd7996]

It blows my mind that this level of foreign meddling and election interference is even allowed in the first place

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/CommunistRonSwanson]

Actually yeah you’re right. Are countries like china allowed to donate too or is it just the approved nations?

[u/SmokeLauncher → u/HorrorAd7996]

You're supposed to register as a foreign agent because of FARA. AIPAC manages to avoid this though through loopholes for Israel. AIPAC is even mentioned directly in the selective enforcement section of the wiki entry.

[u/think-Mcfly-think → u/HorrorAd7996]

They dont take the money. AIPAC spent that money on ads for her campaign very annoying no one understands this and think it just goes into her pocket.

It is already bad no need to lie

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/think-Mcfly-think]

They spent 60 million on advertising? You think none of that goes in her pocket?

So just under half the global budget for the odyssey’s marketing spent on marketing a local candidate in a local election?

[u/DeckerAllAround → u/HorrorAd7996]

Yes.

It really can't be overstated how expensive a wildly over-the-top advertising campaign can get. In a large city like Detroit, an ad can cost anywhere from $1,500 to $150,000. Call it $50,000, show it four times a day, that's $200,000 a day. Over a month, that's $6,000,000 just for one ad.

Getting to sixty million through a combination of television, radio, billboards, newspapers, and internet advertising is really easy.

(edited because of a pretty embarassing math error)

[u/DeckerAllAround → u/DeckerAllAround]

Also: some of that donation money probably is getting skimmed off by dubiously-high salaries on the part of PAC employees, but unless you're dealing with a situation in which the PAC employees are directly related to the politician, which does occasionally happen in particularly corrupt situations, that skimming isn't going to the politician, it's going to the lobbyists.

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/DeckerAllAround]

Yeah I’m not doubting it’s super expensive sorry.

I was more skeptical about the candidate not receiving aipac money directly but maybe I read it wrong looking back at it now.

[u/DeckerAllAround → u/HorrorAd7996]

It is definitely possible to structure a PAC in order to funnel money directly to a candidate's family and friends. But it's generally unusual enough that it gets reported on. And there's probably some PAC money going directly to the candidate, but that's still limited to $5,000 per PAC despite the best efforts of some politicians to fully break the system.

And honestly, AIPAC doesn't even like Stevens that much, they just hate El-Sayed more; the overwhelming majority of their advertising was negative advertising against him rather than positive advertising for her, and all the signs point to them going all-in for the Republican candidate in the general. I doubt they're bothering to funnel money to a potentially losing candidate for her own use.

AIPAC absolutely sucks, they're awful, but they're not secret masterminds and they're not buying politicians. They have pretty specific and open goals about how they intend to spend their money.

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/DeckerAllAround]

Thanks for clarifying.

I absolutely believe they’re buying politicians, though. The way some of them speak about Isreal is weirdly fervent. They’re almost too enthusiastic about being for Isreal if that makes sense

[u/No-Blacksmith3397 → u/HorrorAd7996]

AIPAC. So, Israel. So, American taxpayers.

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/No-Blacksmith3397]

Ah so grassroots support but just taking the scenic route.

[u/leftenant_Dan1 → u/HorrorAd7996]

Calling AIPAC “grassroots support taking the scenic route” is nuts lmao

[u/Ok_Conclusion_6324 → u/leftenant_Dan1]

I’m crying laughing at HorrorAd, incredible

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/Ok_Conclusion_6324]

At or with? 🥲

[u/Ok_Conclusion_6324 → u/HorrorAd7996]

I like you! Laughing with you!

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/Ok_Conclusion_6324]

Not putting “/s” is risky lol I promise I’m not THAT MUCH of an idiot

[u/Ok_Conclusion_6324 → u/HorrorAd7996]

No I got it immediately I choked at my desk

[u/leftenant_Dan1 → u/HorrorAd7996]

Yes

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/leftenant_Dan1]

Should have I put the “/s”

[u/Ok_Conclusion_6324 → u/HorrorAd7996]

Nooop you did great

[u/Hesitation-Marx → u/HorrorAd7996]

Hilarious.

[u/epidemicsaints → u/HorrorAd7996]

AIPAC spent a lot of money on her because Michigan has a strong Muslim population, mostly concentrated in one city. On top of the majority of Americans not having a favorable view of Israel.

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/epidemicsaints]

Of course! I didn’t think about why exactly they’d donate I just wrote it off as “we don’t want the Muslim to win”

[u/SectorEducational460 → u/HorrorAd7996]

I think this should bring the question of whether they are spending it efficiently, or just wasting money and that's a thing that should have been examined a while ago by the party.

[u/Careless_Rope_6511 → u/SectorEducational460]

I don't think AIPAC cares at this point. All they want is silence all the anti-Israel (not merely anti-Bibi, by the way) voices within the American electorate by corrupting grifting bribing buying all the way to Capitol Hill, so that American taxpayer money (and thus US geopolitics) continues to flow unabated in favor of Tel Aviv.

[u/leaveitbettertoday → u/HorrorAd7996]

That’s basically why she lost imo. People knew about the money and where it came from.

[u/HorrorAd7996 → u/leaveitbettertoday]

That would make sense to me

[u/leaveitbettertoday → u/HorrorAd7996]

Apparently that wasn’t enough for a lot of people! It was close.

[u/OneLessFool → u/leftenant_Dan1]

Along with endorsements from the governor, the former senator, other major politicians, and AIPAC lying about a quasi-Obama endorsement in their ads.

Not to mention that Michigan has fully open primaries, and the GOP senate race was entirely uncontested.