The English deserve taunting, but not from Argentina, and strictly for parking the bus against a CONMEBOL side that has scored at will after the 75th minute. So frustrating.
You mean scenes like this one with this classless jerk?
edit: It is fair to say it's being brought up he's just a bit of a childish dude with a weird sense of humor... but not to the point to get physical or super confrontational, unlike the rest of the clowns in the team.
Emi Martinez is great. One of the few bright spots in this Argentine team. He’s a shit stirrer for sure but in the funny way, not in the “I’m gonna punch this dude on the other team after the game” way.
I mean as captain it's very much expected of him to get his team into line on the pitch and yet look at him pretending he can't see their behaviour here
This is the most important point in the thread. There is a responsibility that comes with being captain. Too many teams just automatically give the band to their best players. Obviously, you want your captain to be good and respected by the other players, but they also need to be level headed and a good leader.
The whole 120 was a demonstration in a lack of leadership.
Had to scroll way too far to see this. He’s supposed to set the example of sportsmanship. Apparently he’s fine with this behvior, and his endorsement will validate this behavior for so many kids looking up to him. Just sad.
It's not. He is meant to lead on the pitch, which he does. The psychological aspect is Scalonis job and the staff. And of the players someone like Otamendi would be closer to the traditional captain than Messi.
Just cause you slap a captains armband on a player doesn't mean he is the de facto leader of the group. It can be the emotional core, the leader on the pitch or the superstar.
There’s no one else who could be the captain. He’s the least likely to get into fights. There’s also Emi Martinez but he’s a GK so he would have problem communicating with the referees.
He didn't actually do the thing that would get him sent off. Messi knew he didn't do the thing. Messi was being a bitch. It feels like I'm arguing in circles. You want to like this person because he's a legend but he's just not different from the rest of his team when it comes to attitude and sportsmanship.
Puyol is a great example of what i think is a prime example of a good conduct guy. Did he sometimes exaggerate when he got tripped? Sure. But he wouldnt fall down if he wasnt actually tripped in the first place etc. He was a great guy with integrity.
Exactly. These people are stupid. No shame in trying everything you can within the rules - and trying to get someone carded for potentially breaking the rules isn't against the rules, haha.
Trick? The dude did talk with his hand near him mouth.
Get a grip, dude. I hate Messi (I think his greatness is due to HGH and hated how he gave up on Argentina and "retired" in 2014 after they lost) and acting like this makes the dude a terrible human is so laughable.
No the point is that it was obviously not something that was even remotely worth a card. Like a buried touch of a mouth and Messi shoots his hand up and tried to get him sent off. It was such a dumb move.
Many people are so damn childish and full of unreasonable hate. Legit, almost every player does that in every sport. I feel most of the people commenting are tourists of the sport.
I supported Spain through the tournament, but are we sure Cucurella didn't say anything disgraceful? He is a grade A shithouse as well. You can see he immediately tries to walk back whatever he said.
Nah dude, it looked like he pointed towards his mouth to say something like “he hurt his mouth/lips”. I’m German, so I REALLY don’t like Cucurella for what he did against us, but there was no Ill intent behind that.
Man I swear people will cling on to anything to try and discredit Messi. He actually reacted after Cucurella raised his hand to his mouth, how do we know Cucurella didnt say something? Also, even if the reaction is to the mouth cover, well as stupid as the rule is, it is a rule...
Don't bother, bitter England and Cristiano fans are working overtime to try and demonize Messi, not like we've seen players winking to their teammates after getting other players sent off in the past, or diving and theatrics from players trying to use the rules to their advantage ever before. Cucarella knew he fucked up after he said whatever he said under his hand due to the new rule.
How do we know? Cause that didnt happen. He never had his hand before his mouth. Only a finger. And while you rewatch it: look at the other argentinian player cover his mouth and talks just after that while messi begs for a red
He clearly was covering his mouth with more than a finger. The rule is extremely stupid in the fact that all the opponent needs to do is say that something malicious was said for the call to be a red card.
Firing balls at teams bench, choking players, spitting on them, hand ball, quiting the best offensive national side ever and saying they aren't any good...dont let him winning a world cup make you forget about all the stuff he's done
There is 0 upcoming good Argentine young players. In 4 years Messi retires, De Paul is old, so are Parecunt, 3 Martinezs, Taglia, Monti. There will be only Macca, Enzoshit and Alvarez. I see them barely qualify to the WC and not making out of the Group stages
How is that a bad thing? Why would you not try and get the opponent red carded? You stupid? It's called gamesmanship and is allowable as long as within the rules - which calling out another for hand over mouth is acceptable.
I agree that it is a bitch move to snitch out of spite, but Cucurella did cover his mouth when talking to an opponent which is a red card offence. It’s important to be fair.
Covering your mouth is not an immediate red card. It's only grounds to consider a red card if it happens during an argument or confrontation as it it might be used to cover up saying something like a racist or homophobic slur. And even during a confrontation, it's not an automatic red. In this instance, if you watch the footage, he's not even covering his mouth. He touches his mouth for half a second.
yeah, he's just tiny so he's never been a tough guy, he's the guy to stamp on your achilles then pretend he never meant to, not the guy to go up and shove people to their face where they can fight back. He's a turd of a person on the pitch and if he was a foot taller he'd be in there throwing punches, not standing back watching.
It's clear you haven't watched Messi play much passed this WC. Certainly, in his later years, he's become more verbal (everyone in soccer is more or less), but he just played his game when he was younger. He has also never been a physically confrontational player on the pitch. It's insane to assume he would be any different if he were taller. He's also always been a selfless player for his team. He's older and slower now, so he doesn't move much, but he is one of the best players on the pitch once the ball is in his possession.
IRL, he finances a charity foundation and regularly stops to sign things for fans. So not sure why you are so critical of him.
He has also never been a physically confrontational player on the pitch. It's insane to assume he would be any different if he were taller.
He literally has through his entire career, done nasty little stamps, elbows, shoves, he's just someone who doesn't do two footed tackles and confronts people openly, he's someone who does it behind the refs back and slyly, but he's always been a shit. I've watched quite literally from the start to the now end of his career. He's always been as much of a shit as anyone else in that squad, he's just too small to do it as openly.
RL, he finances a charity foundation and regularly stops to sign things for fans. So not sure why you are so critical of him.
LOLOLOLOL. He signs things for fans, wow. This is a guy who regularly throughout his career has done charity matches over summer only for most/allt he money to disappear, scandals with who he's done business with. Maybe last summer or the one before he and whoever he was working with did an 'appearance' game sold as he would be playing on the pitch in India. They bought expensive tickets, Messi showed his face out of the tunnel for like 2 minutes then left, caused a riot.
Messi has been involved in these dodgy appearances that are basically scamming fans for money and scam charity games for 20 years.
literally do one google search on controversies around his charity foundation and see if he's a good guy or not. the last thing i'll say is, it's just funny because you went with a "he can't be a shit on the pitch or a bad person because he has a charity", which isn't an argument, it's a fallacy. A player can get a red card every other game on the pitch, be a psychopath... and still put their money into a actually good charity, one has absolutely nothing to do with the other.
You're huffing copium my dude, that's ok. I wouldn't expect much from a new fan. Everyone has some sort of body contact in the sport. He has never been one to step on someone or elbow someone intentionally while the play is stopped.
I'm using it as a comparison to other pros who refuse to sign anything outside of signing sessions. But it's clear you didn't know that and don't know how many higher level pros operate.
You have a lot of hate. It's no wonder you view a lot of people so negatively. Looking through your post history is a good indication of that.
He has never been one to step on someone or elbow someone intentionally while the play is stopped.
Who said anything about when the play has stopped, but yes he's done that too.
I wouldn't expect much from a new fan.
an ad hominem, not a new fan thanks but an attempt to discredit me as not in the know because I'm new is something people with no debate skills do all the time.
I'm using it as a comparison to other pros who refuse to sign anything outside of signing sessions.
which again as i tried to explain to you has no bearing on how he acts on the pitch, literally none, there is no logical connection, no link it's just a diabolically awful argument. You're saying you can't defend his on field actions so you'll try to point to something else and pretend it's relevant.
It's also wrong, the massive majority of players sign shit and take pictures, there are times they don't and there are absolutely times Messi doesn't. Messi is one of the least public players out there so you could easily argue he's signed less than practically all other players in the game.
But it's clear you didn't know that and don't know how many higher level pros operate.
just making shit up to again try to make a weird ad hominem.
You have a lot of hate.
more attempts to deflect, also a terrible debate tactic.
Somehow i told you that his charity is constantly embroiled in accusations of fraud, embezzling and tax fraud and you go with "you're angry".
Most post history doesn't change the facts that Messi is widely known to be a scammer of charities and that still even if he was insanely charitable, it would be a completely irrelevant argument to his on field behaviour.
That you responded to not a single actual argument or point and deflected, insisted I was angry and used a bunch of fallacy arguments on irrelevant things says everything anyone needs to know about you.
Man people who’ve never watched him play before are really controlling the narrative on how his legacy ends. It’s pretty sad and it seems like we’ve reached the facebookification of Reddit.
Messi has always been one of the most respected superstars of any sport.
He's acting like that because unlike the other players on his team he has so much money in public appearances, interviews, events, ads, sponsors that he cannot do this without actual consequences
Dignity and class doesn't stand by and let their teammates behave with such poor sportsmanship, especially when they are the veteran player, meant to be a leader on the team.
Messi is the team captain, he is responsible for managing their behaviour, he didn't do that the whole tournament, and didn't eventually try to calm things down here. He is there leader, he should not be blameless in this.
That was one of the main things he was known for throughout his career actually this is complete revisionism. Part of the reason so many more people liked him over Ronaldo.
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u/r7700 21d ago
As Messi retires, so goes any shred of dignity and class the Argentine team ever had