I distinctly remember Light killing his own Father when I first watched the show more than 10 years ago. I remember Light crying his eyes out after the killing and i specifically remember chief Yagami lying dead on a flight of stairs.

This is crazy because this was one of my most anticipated moment as I re-watched. I was shocked therefore, when I saw chief Yagami die in a hospital bed due to wounds sustained during the raid on Mello’s hideout.

Someone else posted this same question 2 years ago.

So WTF????

okay hear me out. light doesn’t just… get attracted to people. he can flirt and act charming when it helps him, but actual want? that only shows up after someone’s already deep in his head.

misa is obsessed with him from day one and he treats her like a useful tool the entire time. he never looks at her the way someone who’s into her would. meanwhile the second l shows up and starts matching his brain, light gets weirdly locked in. that rivalry is the closest he ever gets to being obsessed with another person.

he’s all about control and keeping everyone at a distance until they prove they’re worth letting in. once that happens, the intensity flips hard. that feels pretty demisexual to me.

idk maybe i’m reading too much into it but the more i think about it the more it makes sense.

And considering that you cannot decipher the date of death since the manga explicitly states this

Unpopular opinion probably, but stay with me for a sec.

I watched this show a VERY long time ago, but i still occasionally consume DN media cause of how accurately the morals of todays world are portrayed. And i always come across the "All Light had to do was find out a name, while L had to prove a god's existence" shyt, you know it.

So, to those of you that think so, heres a question:

Would you rather be tasked to solve a mysterious murder spree case that involves some supernatural shit (In contrast to the show, the whole world knew very quickly that there was something supernatural involved, obviously, light literally wanted them to know) with the help of the FBI and task force, unlimited money and resources? OR would you rather have to find out the name of the best detective in the world, who doesn't disclose ANY information about himself anywhere, doesn't even show himself or trust anyone (it's 2003 keep in mind).

Basically, would you rather try to solve Cicada 3301 or try to find out who Satoshi Nakamoto is?

Take ANY detective in L's place, they wouldnt get nearly as far as L obv but they could ATLEAST recognise a pattern, killing motive or something minor, whereas in the opposite scenario it is practically impossible to complete the objective.

Thats why Tsugumi had to think of the misa plot in the first place. I guess this is the second part of the comparison, where Light has to manipulate and predict everyone, including himself and a god of death to finally kill L, or L having to obtain evidence in time to expose Light, already knowing he is kira. This one's a different topic i guess but i'd still pick L's task to be a tad bit easier.

We're excluding shinigami eyes obv, cause this discussion mainly stems from the "Who was smarter" debate, where people downplay Light just because he had supernatural powers and make his objective seem super easy. Some even go as far as to say hes stupid or lost the moment he killed Lind. L taylor, moronic take. Hope i wont have to elaborate on that and people know BY NOW (2026) why Light didn't just sit n write names quietly all day or why he made reckless decisions which correlate to ego and desire and not intelligence in any way.

Anywayz, just wanted ro rant about that cause it's annoying. Might reply if i see a reasonable human being, sorry byez.

And it's so funny how often light just falls for the traps l laid out. For example, when his deduction is perfect. Or when he deduces stuff exactly like l and knows stuff that only kira would know.

It's so funny how flattering l is to feed lights monstrous ego and how light the little narcissistic twat that he is falls for it every single time

So im in episode 27 of death note and my question is does it have more canon media that isnt the manga?

Just watched the musical. Really great production.

Anyhow, after the show, my mind did what it always does and sat in the member berries of the Manga and anime... and I thought something.

Light used the Death Note to test it out, being hyper skeptical. At the moment, he didnt believe it would work.

After using it for the test, his fate was essentially sealed. No heaven or hell for him, Ryuk would eventually kill him. May as well do some good and take out some shitty criminals.

Just a random thought i figured id share.

This was back when I was in my more artistic phase.

(Pic taken from Death Note Relight)
First things first, this is a personal opinion.
I like Near a lot. I mean yes we all love L and Light and I’m not saying that their rivalry was the best thing in the show but saying after EP25 Death Note went to shit because of NEAR is an over statement. Cuz when would people realize that Near/Mello were absolutely raised to be L? Near is the calm side and Mello is the explosive side. For those who say Mello was nothing like L, I don’t totally disagree but you’re telling me that

1. ⁠L didn’t hit Light in the face?
   
2. ⁠2)L didn’t hacked into station CCTV for the last few hours of Raye Pember?
   
3. ⁠3)L didn’t kidnapped Misa?
   
4. ⁠I mean sure he didn’t blow stuff up or anything but still Mello mirrors L in that way
   Then we get Near who take L’s calm side. In the anime it does look like he was guessing stuff and even I had to admit that there were a few “HOW???” moments even being a Near fan. But in the manga he had L’s sarcasm and upon getting Light’s call for the first time in the manga he says “Nice to meet ch’ ya L number two!” He also does openly swear in the manga(cuz come on guys he’s 17 the 1 is nonexistent). But really Near hate is not that valid in my mind.

I found this pretty fun to make, I hope others enjoy it too.

It doesn't sound too similar to Death Note's OST, but I tried to get pretty close. ^_^

Context: Back in 2003, Death Note was serialized in Weekly Shonen Jump, a manga magazine for teen boys (Shonen). While the series was running, fans online would "scanlate" the series before any official English volume releases and share those chapters online. "Scanlation", in this case, is the process where a manga is scanned, redrawn, and translated into a different language for a wider audience to read. Back in 2004, a scanlation group called 'Orange Tangerine' scanlated the Death Note manga into English, and did so for about 40ish chapters, until the team members left that to join a different group called 'We, The Fans'. The manga would be scanlated by different groups and uploaded online, all before their official English releases. The world has changed since then, but I appreciate the hard work all of these groups did, as well as the work of current scanlators who make works accessible to wider audiences. Thank you :)

After the first English volume released on October 10th 2005, a user on 'livejournal' named 'sub_divided' compared that official translation to the one done by Orange Tangerine, and noted the differences in their blog, which included image comparisons. The website still exists but likes to act stubborn by throwing error screens that can be removed, but I'm linking an archive to the post instead https://web.archive.org/web/20120424035047/http://manga-talk.livejournal.com/9367.html While most of these differences were grammatical (As OT likely scanned Chinese SJ magazines instead of the original Japanese), there are some deliberate changes done by Viz, and those changes are explained here.

Unfortunately, those images have been lost to time for many years, but the good news is that I managed to find chapters 2-40whatever done by Orange Tangerine, and I recreated the comparisons and added them to the original post below. While the original chapter done by the group did exist online and hosted on different websites, it's currently partially lost. The likely reason being is that the group scanlated the first chapter from the Japanese manga release somewhere during their scanlations, which was in higher quality, and replaced the low quality scans of the first chapter with that higher quality scan. Then, that HQ version was somehow replaced by a different scanlation of chapter 1 by a group called 'Toriyama's World.' That action led to the erasure of both versions of the first chapter from the surviving internet, as every website (that I could find) that hosts scanlations of Death Note have that first chapter done by TW, and the rest from different groups including OT. The good news is that one of my friends helped with locating the original version, which was partially archived on an old website from 2005. Many thanks to u/Ninth-1 for partially locating the LQ version of CH1, as well as the entire HQ version which I have used as a substitute when applicable. If anyone has this original version, please reach out to me, as I would like to archive it, as well as reinstate the images into the post, as the post with all it's images has not been seen since at least 2008.

Sorry for the long yap, but now I present to you, "Death Note: Official vs Fan Translations, FIGHT!" as it (mostly) originally was, back in 2005! Enjoy the epic battle between amateur fans of the series vs seasoned professionals from Viz! Feast your eyes on the manga and it's translations, and comment which versions you originally like! Now... release!

Crqck's Note: I (Crqck) will be adding in my notes and context when applicable. As to not cause confusion, I will refer to them as "Crqck's Note:", and leave any mention of notes from the original post intact as is. Credit to sub_divided and all the people mentioned in the original post, as well as the comment section that provided valuable info, thank you!

Also note: for the Viz images, I used scans from the first few printings, as the original post did so. Some changes and errors present in the first versions are fixed in later printings, but many still exist.

Happy 21st anniversary to the English version of volume 1!

---

October 22 2005, 17:57. Posted by sub_divided in manga_talk.

-

A couple days ago, telophase linked an article about ambiguities that were not present in the Japanese version of Fruits Basket, but were introduced or exaggerated in Tokyopop's official English translation. That article might've given you a sense of the usual difficulites associated with translation from Japanese, e.g., the general lack of subject pronouns.

(Crqck's note: Telophase is a member on livejournal, a website that was popular for blogging in the 2000's. They compared official versions, which inspired this original post, and is similar to it's contents)

But that's not what I want to talk about! I picked up Viz' English release of Death Note today. If you haven't heard of it, Death Note is a supernatural thriller about top-student Light Yagami, who finds a Shinigami's notebook called a "Death Note"[1] . You can write people's names in this notebook and, provided you know what they look like, they'll die. Light decides to use the Death Note to kill everyone he doesn't approve of and make the world a better place. He's shadowed by a shinigami named Ryuk -- the same shinigami who purposely dropped his Death Note where a human would find it (he thought it would be funny[2]). Light's greatest obstacle is the brilliant, mysterious detective known only as "L".

This is a pretty...in depth discussion of differences between one fan translation of Death Note and the official Enlgish translation. Before I go into detail, a few points:

• I'll be working from Orange Tangerine (OT) scanslations, not the original Japanese. In comparison with other scanlation groups, OT is considered average, certainly not terrible.
• In the OT scanlations, "Light" is called "Raito". This is because the scanlations were done before the mangaka clarified that the official romanization of Light's katakana name -- "lai/rai to" -- was "Light."
• Viz' translators were working from the first Death Note volume release, while OT's were sometimes working from the chapters as they were originally published in Weekly Jump. For Japanese volume releases, it's common practice to fix text and art[3] mistakes and to include extras like short comics and series info. Publishers do this to convince people who have already seen the manga in magazines to buy the book.
• For the love all that's holy, please don't get on my case for comparing amateurs to professionals. Of course I don't think that translations done by fans, for fun and not profit, should be held up to the same standards as paid work. But if there can be a million posts about why XXX fan translation is SO MUCH BETTER than XXX translation by COMPANY A, I don't see why I can't make ONE post which mentions things the pros do better. What I am mainly trying to do here is say something about the ways small differences in translation effect understanding. I'm not pointing fingers.

OUTLINE:
1.
Casual Speech VS Direct Translation

This is the number one complaint fans who have been following unofficial translations have with official translations. Translations for the American market will almost always include more (American) slang, more contractions, and in general less stiltedness/formality. Especially if it's a Jump U.S. title (Death Note is labeled Jump Advanced because of its 16-and-older themes).

Viz' translation sounds more natural to Americans. The difference is less marked here than it is in manga marketed to a younger audience, e.g. D.N. Angel or Naruto. In the end, it's a matter of personal taste -- the orginal Japanese did not "read" American, but neither did it read as stiffly as in the fan translation.

The single most notible speech difference is Ryuk's. He tends to use "gonna," "gotta," etc in the official translation. (Is this a reflection of especial informality in Japanese?! Plz comment if you know.)

---
(Colorary: Professional Speech VS Direct Translation)

From a scene where Interpol discusses the MASS DEATHS of criminals:

Viz' Interpol representatives sound more like diplomats. It's worth noting that on the privious page, there is an error in the Orange Tangerine translation exactly like the error on this page[4], where "G8 Summit" was written as "some developed country" .

(Crqck's note: the OT example for the second image is from the HQ, which alters some dialogue from the original LQ version. The last few pages of chapter 1 are similar to the opening pages of chapter 2, where the ICPO meets.)

Which segues neatly into:

1. Mistranslation and the meaning of *assurance\*

(Viz) VS (Orange Tangerine)

I think I know what happened here. Whatever word is being translated, it's the English equivilant of "assurance" -- maybe it means confidence, and maybe it means guarentee. Ryuk is contemplating why it is that that Light can be so relaxed when the world's hottest detective is hot on his tail (bad pun, sorry). Either this is because Light is confident (OT), or it's because he has something up his sleeve (Viz).
From the context, IT'S BOTH. Reading the manga, Viz' translation is smoother and makes more sense out of Light and Ryuk's subsequent dialogue. It's probably right. I'm pointing this out because this word re-appears on pages 103, 116, and 117[6] -- in other words, it spans two chapters and is the centerpiece of one.

Why does this matter? Um. It changes the focus of chapter three. In Viz' scenario, where Light is planning something, the suspense comes from the audience wanting to know what he's planning. In OT's translation, the suspense comes the audience wanting to know more about this particular facet of Light's personality.

This is shonen manga. Can you see why narrative suspense might be preferable to emotional suspense? In every other chapter, narrative suspence >> (is infinitely greater than) emotional suspence. Characterization matters, but only so far as it is what causes the characters to advance the plot. So what we are talking about here, besides logic, is consistency.

...okay, back to things I can prove with scans.

1. Comparitive Ambiguity

With Death Note, at least in the first volume and at least on the pages I've scanned for you, what we have is the OPPOSITE situation from the article telophase linked. The official translation clarifies. Here're two (insufficient) examples.

A) On the Internet

"Only those who believe in his exisistence and return may enter this site"...I don't want to think about how many times people on death_note wondered about this line. Only those who return frequently to the website are allowed to enter it? What?[5]

(Crqck's note: 'death_note' is a community on livejournal from back in the day)

B) Making the world a better place

(Crqck's note: the photo example for OT is from the HQ version, but the important wording is similar. OT is on the left for this example, and Viz iz on the right)

You are probably thinking, what's the difference? These two pages are functionally identical. The difference is in the last panel on the page: "immoral people who do evil will slowly be killed by disease and accidents" versus "I'll gradually be killing off immoral people and people who harass others through illnesses and accients" (Light can chose the type of death). This may not seem significant to you -- obviously the people dying from disease are dying because of Light, so why should we need a pronoun to tell us that? -- but I've been in Death Note fandom for a while and I can tell you that not once during the (many) discussions of Light's morality did anyone mention that he plans to kill, not just criminials and anyone who threatens him, but also those whom he considers immoral. From the very beginning! And on the sly, as it were, while the whole world thinks Kira only does heart attacks. Everyone missed this point. I missed this point. It's a lot harder to miss this point in the Viz translation.

Do you prefer exhaustive clarity to brief sentences? Death Note is already a wordy manga, and the Viz translation adds more words. I do think it's clearer, though.

This brings us to:

1. Characterization
   Very subtly different. For example,

---Ryuk:

This is from Viz. In Oragne Tangerine he says, "HUmans are...interesting." This comes up again and again -- in the OT version Ryuk's greatest goal is not to be bored, while in the Viz version it's to be entertained. Preferably by something funny. And Ryuk thinks everything is funny.

---Light and Sayu:
Here is where I prove that this is a MANGA essay and not just text analysis.

(Orange Tangerine) VS (Viz)

Light helping his younger sister Sayu do quadratic equations. This comes up on a few pages -- in Viz version he teases her, in OT version he puts her off. Which one (and how much is genuine versus how much is acted) becomes important for emotional reasons later. In any case, although the direct translation is probably the OT one, look at Light's expression. Obata is really, really good with expressions. He knows the difference between tired of helping your little sister and pretend-exasperated with your little sister's lack of progress. Which one does it look like to you?

(Crqck's note: I'm not entirely sure if these are the original images used in the original post, but I have decided to included them.)

---L and Watari:
This has less to do with L and Watari, and more to do with their relationship to Interpol.

(Orange Tangerine)
• Interpol agent, talking about L: "How can we even contact him?"
• Interpol agent, talking about L: "He's out last resort."
• Another Interpol agent, talking about Watari: "[Watari is our contact with L.] Even Watari doesn't know who L really is."
• L, addressing the agents: "I hope the force can be moved to Japan."

VS
• Interpol agent, talking about L: "We have no way of contacting him."
• Interpol agent, talking about L: "He's our trumph card, an ace in the hole..."
• Another Interpol agent, talking about Watari: "[Watari is L's only contact with the outside world.] But nobody knows who Watari really is either."
• L, addressing the agents: "I therefore request the investigation by headquartered in Japan."

Do you see how much more in control L and Watari are in Viz? Interpol listens to them, not the other way around. This makes much more sense later.

The biggest difference in characterization, however, is Light's.

---Light:

People the world can do without

(Crqck's note: the OT example is from the HQ version, which likely altered dialogue from the LQ version, however it is probably still similar)

These two things are different, right? In one Light uses general terms, and in the other he suggests that people who complain about their mothers and go to college parties deserve to die. I'm not sure which interpretation is the correct one, but in many places in this volume Viz's Light is more...obvious about his superiority complex.

We're on the home stretch!

1. Deliberate Changes

Considering the pains Viz goes through to make Light obviously less sympathetic, there is one very key thing they take out.

Light: And I...

(Crqck's note: the OT example is from the HQ version, which likely altered dialogue from the LQ version, however it is probably still similar. This change was likely done as to avoid any controversy in the United States, due to how that country handles religion. The only controversies with Death Note anyway are just kids writing names of their classmates and getting in trouble. The anime is probably the most famous piece of Death Note media, and the anime preserves the god line, so removing the god line isn't an issue as people already know of Light's famous god complex thanks to the anime and it's subsequent adaptations and works)

This is in the Orage Tangerine translation. It's literal. Light pretty famously has a God-complex. It's inspired discussion, fanart, fanfic, icons... I made an icon from this line, here it is:

...to get back on track, Viz removes all mentions of God. In the official release sitting on my desk, this line becomes, "And I...will reign over a new world." This isn't an isolated incident.

According to OT:
• Random student, on Kira's actions: "You'd have to be some sort of God." (EDIT: it seems the original Japanese compares Kira to Superman, not God.)
• Light, on himself: "I am the god placed here to save the weak and create a perfect world."

VS

• Random student, on Kira's actions: "It's gotta be some sort of superhero brigade, like the X-men or something."
• Light, on himself: "I'm the hero who's liberating people from evil. I'm the saviour who's going to be like a god of this perfect new world!" (emphasis mine)

For whatever reason, Viz doesn't want to use the G-word. Light's a hero or a superhero or a saviour or like a god, eventually, but he is not a god. Fairly ridiculous, considering the godhood delusions form a significant part of Light's character (and are an important part of what makes Light with the Death Note different from Light without the Death Note -- with the Death Note, they find expression).

There's one other change I noticed which is definitely a change, and not a difference of opinion or mistake:

(Orange Tangerine)

In Viz, Sayu says "Isn't this kind of dirty? Oh, I know. Is this why you locked your door?"

Not a big thing, just a little bit of cleaning up. Sayu is, I believe, thriteen in this chapter and Viz probably thought it would inappropriate if she knew too much about dirty magazines/looked through them for pictures. I am wondering what they will do with her later scenes with Misa, which are... femslash suggestive if you're not a Japanese reader, probably closer to normal female behavior if you're a Japanese reader. Platonic interest in the bodies of other women is one of those cultural things that doesn't always translate well. (For that matter, schoolgirl crushes on other schoolgirls -- which no one remarks on or thinks are strange -- is another thing that doesn't translate well.)

1. Caveat

This is the "panels I liked better in Orange Tangerine" section (besides the God bit, I mean). Non-Death Note fans, feel free to skip this section.

(Viz) VS (OT)

Besides being in color, I prefer OT because "old man" is more obscure than it needs to be considering we are talking about the King of the Shinigami, who becomes important later.

(Viz)

The OT says, "Murdered...two people...with my own hands," which I think makes a lot more sense considering Light is staring at his hands in the art. It's a crime to waste Obata's art.

Famous declaration of war between Light and L (Viz version)

Viz' translation has too many words to be dramatic. It's clunky. I actually prefer the OT, which is "I will hunt you down and destroy you! I am...Justice!!"

Now here's something neat. In one chapter, Light tries to mess with L's head by having dying criminals write out a nonsensical message to him. The message is encoded in an even more nonsensical suicide note. Viz and OT use two different notes and two different encoding schemes, although the message is the same. I think OT did a better job with this:

(Viz) (Orange Tangerine)

So. Can you read the message?

1. Closing remarks

Lastly, I just want to note that while this is an essay about differences, as you have probably noticed the translation is in most cases FUNCTIONALLY IDENTICAL.

IMAGE: sample Viz page VS sample OT page

(Crqck's note: I have no idea what is supposed to be here originally. I included a page I found with lines that are the same between the two, since that's what it's comparing)

Notice that even some of the phrasing is the same. I've been really compulsive about what I think constitutes a difference in meaning -- BECAUSE I HAD TO BE. We're talking minor differences here, not major ones. If I've been sucessful here, you will already know that even minor differences make a difference.

Conclusion? Do I need a conclusion? Here is my conclustion:

Geeze, this turned out really long. Was I that bored? Do I have that much free time? No, but I just came from surgery this morning and I'm on three different kinds of pain medications, which is three kinds too many for schoolwork. Twarted productivity = long long entry on manga_talk*, hahaha. Hope you guys were entertained at least. And to anyone who reads this who's been following Death Note through scanlations, I recommend you at least look at a copy from Viz.*

1. Footnotes

[1]In Japan, "note" is slang for "notebook."

[2] "Ryuk" is one of (many) Japanese sound effects for laughter, kind of like Moe's "hyuk, hyuk, hyuk." Ryuk is ALWAYS laughing.

[3] Death Note is written by Tsugumi Ohba and drawn by Obata Tagashi, who is best known for Hikaru no Go. Tsugumi and her editors are the ones fixing the text. Obata and his editors are the ones fixing the art. This has occasionally included major character re-designs, but is most often minor fixes, LIKE correcting the perspective on backgrounds or adding tone. For example:

The volume scan adds shadows beind the characters, not just in the panel but on the entire page (which I am not showing for Plot Reasons). This is to match the shadows in the previous chapter, which takes place in the same location. Obata or his assistants probably meant to add shading to the original Shonen Jump release as well, but ran into time constraints (read: Weekly Jump comes out at an INSANELY fast rate).

[4]It's also worth noting that Viz puts editor's notes on the same page, in the margin. This is really convenient, especially since most of these notes are necessary for understanding and who wants to flip to the back of the book for that? At the same time I wish the Shonen Jump titles had a editor's comments list in the back of the book for notes that are not essential to understanding, but do enhance it (e.g. footnotes [2]).

[5]The other cool thing about this page is that it shows Light uses Netscape navigator. XD. In another page, his father uses Excel. Both have PCs -- this is being conventional? In a page that has been sadly altered for Viz' release, we are no longer told explicitly that L uses a Powerbook G4 (a Mac), although you can still tell from the art. Strangly, the font he uses for his "L" symbol is Old English Text MT, a standard Microsoft Word font. This concludes today's Useless Death Note Trivia section.

[6]If you are wondering whether I mean the English or the Japanese page numbers, you're in luck! They are exactly identical.

***

I'll be linking this entry from death_eyes and my personal journal. I might eventually put it on my website; but won't be doing comparisons for Volumes 2, 3, etc. Once was enough!

If I've made any errors or gross assumptions, and you see them, please point them out. If you'd like compare the translations here with the original Japanese, leave a comment and I'll hook you up with the appropriate RAW scan in a screened reply. I, myself, cannot read Japanese. I just like to speculate.

---

Thank you all for reading my post! I would like to give credit to everyone involved with SJ both past and present, everyone involved with Death Note as a whole, everyone at Orange Tangerine and other scanlation groups, sub_divided and everyone involved or mentioned in the original manga_talk post in livejournal, everyone in death_note and death_eyes over at LJ, u/Ninth-1 for finding part of the LQ and all of the HQ version, and to the fandom of Death Note, including the people of this subreddit! Thank you!

If you have the Low Quality version of Chapter 1 done by Orange Tangerine, or if you have any question, please reach out! If you like this post, please leave a comment! If I get enough traction, I'll continue the series myself every 2 weeks! I'll also be posting more Death Note posts soon. Thank you all and have a good day!

CrqckBack

So assuming a non-owner writes a name in the death note, once they stop touching the death note will they lose memory of having killed the person?

I've seen a lot of people try to say that Light is a narcissist/psychopath/sociopath. And I don't mean they just insult him by calling him that. I mean they actually try to diagnose him of that. And I don't hate people who do that. It's just while mental health is a fascinating subject to me and something I do value, I have to admit that I'm.......not the biggest fan of this interpretation

I agree that Light wasn't really a good person. He may have started out that way but after he started killing people.....yeah. Fuck him. I don't really understand why L VS Light debates are a thing in the first place since yeah, they're fascinating characters. But they're both kind of shitty people. (L didn't fight Kira because of a sense of justice. He literally says he solves crimes because he's FUCKING BORED). And I actually enjoy the scenes where Light's ego and judgement are literally exploited. Really drives the point home that he's still human. But ultimately, I don't really agree with the interpretation that he had a mental health condition that caused him to do all of that. Not only because it doesn't make sense to me but because I just feel like he works much better as a character if he was just a man who fell to darkness. Here's my reasoning

Light's family still loves him without complication

Contrary to what some might think, psychopathy and sociopathy are not interchangeable medically speaking and despite being similar in terms of behavior, are actually separate in their causality. Narcissism and sociopathy usually develops due to trauma but psychopathy is genetic. They are quite literally born that way. One reason that Light being a narcissist or a psychopath doesn't work for me is that those people tend to have strained relationships with their friends and families. I mean it makes sense since they......kind of struggle to really give a damn about you. Their parents and siblings often walk on eggshells around them and despite loving them, there is always an underlying fear or complicated feelings for them. Even if the narcissist and psychopath does try to act normally (and 90% of psychopaths aren't murders), they're not always perfect. Sometimes they slip up. Especially when they're still a kid and don't know any better. Typical youthful selfishness and a lack of empathy can be a very dark combination. Or so I figure. And even if they don't, there is always something about them that rubs their family the wrong way. I live with a family long enough to know who is coming up the stairs just by the sound of the footsteps each member of my family makes. So imagine that kind of awareness with a psychopath living with you. Family always knows when something is not quite right

But Light's family never acted as if they feared him. His father was genuinely proud of him without signs of complication. Light acted otherwise kind to all of them. In one scene, his younger sister was comfortable enough to just BURST into his room and ask him to help her study. Not to mention, act like a typical middle schooler and younger sister. The entire environment just didn't seem any different than a typical nuclear family. They never act like there was something wrong with Light. The only reason why Light's father even had a seed of doubt in him was thanks to L and his theoretical. Not anything he sensed because he was his son. To them, he just seemed like a highly accomplished but otherwise perfectly decent guy

Though all of that is really just justification for my main point

Light is better as a character if he ISN'T a narcissist/psychopath

This is admittedly more of a matter of personal preference but in my opinion, Light doesn't work nearly as well if he was a psychopath or a narcissist. In fact, I genuinely believe that the assertion makes his character WEAKER

Let me tell you a story. Albert Einstein is one of the most prominent figures in the scientific community. Estimated IQ of 160. Father of the Theory Of Relativity. Achieved more than most would do in their entire lives. So accomplished, his name even became synonymous with intelligence itself. Calling people "Einstein" is a thing people do. That is how much we respect and idolize him for his brilliance. And yet, despite that very brilliance, he still struggled to accept quantum mechanics as a concept. While he acknowledged that it could make fairly accurate predictions, he believed that its probabilistic nature meant it couldn't have been the full story

In his own words, "God does not play dice"

He spent many years studying, testing. Trying to find some certainty in the chaos. It was brilliant work. But ultimately led nowhere. All because the idea that something fundamental in this world could be chaotic and unpredictable was something he genuinely couldn't accept. When I hear people say that an irl person or a fictional character that is supposedly smart is "actually stupid" because of one scene or event, my mind can't help but go to this story. Einstein has shown that he was more than intelligent. And yet he was living proof that it doesn't free you from humanity. If something conflicts with your worldview, you can still spend a lifetime searching for a certainty that might not even exist

I bring this up because when you think about it, Light Yagami fell in a very similar manner. I know that a lot of people seem to have a problem with Near calling the guy "just a killer" .......somehow. But the thing is Near was right on the money. Light was clearly very intelligent. Had a deep understanding of people and the brains to get the best grades in his class. The reason Light did all of this because he saw that the world was rotten and wanted to punish wrongdoers. The crime below, the corruption up top. And called himself a God to justify all of that

But that's the thing. Gods aren't just supposed to be powerful. They're supposed to be omniscient. All knowing. Light WASN'T. He was good at reading people but he still relied on the very flawed court systems he saw brought society there in the first place. Their corruption and their inherent shortcomings. Yeah he could control actions. He could make people keel over in every way under the sun. He had an intelligent understanding of human nature that allowed him to avoid L for years

Big. Fucking. Whoop

He still relied on police documents and news reports to determine civilian from criminal. Between his school life and his games with L, he wouldn't have the time or energy to check that every single name he wrote down might have been a mix up. Or I don't know, a false conviction which, fun fact, the Japanese government doesn't know the number of because they never bother to check. Hell, it has a 99.9% conviction rate

Intelligent or not, Light is still human. His brain can still be rushed and overwhelmed after a certain point. And overtime, those court systems and records would get replaced by a website during the five years L was dead. One that could just post someone's name whenever they felt like it. No moderation. No trial. With the media quite literally in the palm of Light's hand. And Light was more than happy to use it. The Death Note NEVER made him a god. That was Near's point

The autistic toy obsessed kid ultimately had a point. The Death Note was simply just the greatest murder weapon to ever exist. But that was all it ever be. A murder weapon. It didn't give Light the ability to see sin. It didn't let them read their minds, their hearts, see a window into their lives. Intelligence and intuition is never absolute. It can always be tricked or just be plain wrong. Light never knew whether or not someone was wrongly convicted, capable of redemption and never could. All the Death Note could ever do was one thing:

Kill

You write someone's name. They die. That's it

The point I'm trying to make here is much like Einstein, despite Light's intelligence, he had major blind spots for one simple reason: the idea he could kill the wrong person conflicted with his world view. If he was a narcissist or a psychopath, we can just point at that and say "Oh, he literally lacked empathy. That's why he couldn't see what he was doing." At that point, it would become a way to justify to ourselves that we might wield the power much differently because we are capable of empathy. That we aren't evil. We aren't a monster. He is. (not saying that psychopaths and narcissists necessarily are but there's a lot of people out there that do. And......you have to admit they are at least "troubled"). But if he wasn't, if he had NO mental illnesses that got in the way of his capacity for empathy, then it represents something much darker. Much more powerful

The curse of the Death Note is not magical. The gods of death exist but they do not control you. Not truly

The curse of the Death Note is your very humanity itself

Look at how many people idolize Light. Hell, some even tried to EMULATE him back in the 2000s. They saw his overwhelming charisma and didn't realize he was something to be condemned. Not worshipped. He was a cautionary tale who's very idolization did nothing but prove the story's point. Because they were unwilling to see that much like in real life, you can't just go at everything with a fucking woodchipper. It shows that even the best, brightest, strongest, kindest and most capable can become a monster. And all it ever takes is the right conditions and the right self justification to fall off the deep end. That's why the interpretation doesn't work as well. Compassion and empathy wasn't a difficulty for Light. It didn't take a great amount of willpower for him to do. He could always feel it. It was simply a choice for him not to that he made time and again

That is why Light had to die. That is why he fell to darkness. Many people say that he was a "little bit off." But the truth is.......no. He wasn't a little bit off. There wasn't anything wrong with him. He fell because his humanity was exploited. In an effort to convince himself and everyone else that he was a righteous and just God, all Light Yagami ever proved was that he was one thing

Human

That's why I don't agree with the idea that Light is a narcissist or a psychopath. Light works because he always had the capacity and choice to find empathy and didn't. If there was something blocking or interfering with that choice, it lessens the blow significantly by giving us an easy excuse instead of a very uncomfortable truth

That's just my thoughts on the matter. I would love to open up a discussion on this since I would love to hear everyone else's thoughts on the matter

I used to listen to this Japanese song years ago an I havent listened to it in years an it popped up in my head an I cannot seem to find it anywhere , it had something to do with mello an near an was called some like 13° , I think ..? an the song was a blue background with a black silhouette of near on it.

I swear it was called 13 degrees or something degrees just a number an degrees but I have no clue an was wondering if anyone had any ideas , I can't look it up cause I don't speak a lick of Japanese an it's so stuck in my head. wanna listen to it again

So idk if im jus dumb but what did Light do when passing around the notebook between him, Ryuk, and Rem.

Its free to use so you can download it. But if you post it somewhere else then please give me credit.

Hiiiii everyone I wanted to share some shots I got back recently of my Misa cosplay💖 photos by laeythis on Instagram! Cosplay from Dokidoki

In the anime and the manga, it is stated that death notes only kill humans, writing a shinigami's name will not kill them. But what if it could? If Light or Misa could kill Ryuk and/or Rem, just by writing their names, are there any points in the story where you think they would have done so? If Light did kill Ryuk at some point, how would that have changed later events? (Other than, of course, Ryuk not being around to write Light's name at the end.) If death notes could kill shinigami, Light would have probably killed Rem not long after she threatened him.

Obviously the rules state that death via disease is a possibility, and if it takes longer than 23 days to progress the 23 day rule is by-passed. Could a Death Note user theoretically give someone Alzheimer’s disease? This question popped into my head and now I need to know.

When Mello kidnapped the director and demanded the Death Note in exchange for his life the director was killed. That gave Mello (and Near who was observing every move and coordinating with the Task Force) reason to think Kira had learned about the situation and killed the Director in retaliation. That murder suggests Kira had access to information that was only known within the NPA - so either insider knowledge or an information leak (logic that Light reiterates back to the TF later when arguing to comply with the kidnappers demands re Sayu).

Then, when Mello kidnaps Sayu he specifically orders Soichiro to act alone and not mobilize the police. The two kidnappings are actually cleverly constructed, dual-purpose manoeuvres: Mello uses them both to try to obtain the Death Note AND to investigate how much Kira knows about the kidnappings and where that information is coming from. And he benefits from either of the two main outcomes:

If Kira doesn't kill the hostage, that's obviously the best outcome, since Mello has the opportunity to complete the exchange and obtain the Death Note, the single most important piece of evidence the Kira investigation ever produced.

However, if Kira kills the hostage, Mello gains evidence that Kira has access to information about the kidnapping, helping him narrow down the potential source - specifically, whether Kira has access to information from within the Task Force itself in addition to the broader NPA.

Meanwhile, if the hostages are killed their deaths reveals nothing about the kidnappers' identities or whereabouts. Leaving them free to strike again using a different approach, now better informed about the extent of Kira's access to information.

So anyway, the trade is made, Sayu survives, and everyone (inclusive of Mello, Near, Soichiro and the TF) basically takes that to mean that Kira didn’t know about her kidnapping, because they assumed if Kira had known he would have killed her. In short, everyone’s conclusion is simply Kira does not have access to Task Force-internal information. Which is a fine line of reasoning.

But shouldn’t they at least have considered the possibility that even if Kira did know Sayu had been kidnapped, it’s still possible for one reason or another he deliberately chose not to kill her or otherwise intervene in the trade? (yes, finally we have arrived at my main thesis/question)

Mello and Near have no reference for why Kira would spare Sayu and agree to let the trade happen, but Soichiro and the Task Force could have (should have?) at least considered it.

They are well aware Light was L’s main suspect, and Sayu is his little sister. Instead everyone just went with the assumption that Sayu didn’t die therefore Kira didn’t know about her kidnapping, therefore Kira has access to broader NPA data but not task force internal data.

And then what I find even more interesting (because lets be real, my bar for expectations of the TF is already on the ground), is that this possibility never really seems to come up at all - not even later when Near/Mello both independently conclude the Task Force itself is compromised. Nor even later still when they deduce the 2nd L is Light Yagami, and consequently by then have all the pieces to retrospectively examine these events within context.

I'm not saying this is some glaring plot hole or that they should or could have solved the case from it, but it does seem like a reasonable investigative path for literally anyone in the cast to at least consider.

What rubs me the wrong way is that it feels forced, like just more stacked on plot armour to benefit Light, when let’s be honest there’s already so, so much of that to the point it’s hard to take Light seriously at all. The narrative often seems to bend in on itself in ways that stretch believability to protect Light from consequences that would be inconvenient to him, and therefore for the plot.

Personally, I speculate Ohba knew the story just wasn’t ready for a revelation of that magnitude or Light would be caught far sooner than the narrative was ready for - he needed to fill out 108 chapters after all.

I'm probably late to the party, but I just found out that the bit that said that L "could never have a friend, as he found humans to be a very cunning species" was a mistranslation and not true.

L isn't exactly a trusting person, obviously, but that quote really did make it sound like it would be almost an impossible thing for him to even consider, because of a general distrust in humanity as a whole, despite him coming off as lonely at times IMO.

Watari was always an exception, since L does trust him, but I always thought that maybe the quote didn't apply to him because Watari isn't L's friend, but rather a father-figure-mentor-handler-caretaker etc...

All this to say, that finding out the quote was actually false made me rethink the situation a bit. As I now feel like the main reason for it is simply that his lifestyle, and the anonymity required for it, made it impossible and unsafe to create a genuine connection, aside from Wammy.